Waterford mayors.

Finnbar01

Why do we have four Mayors?

I know we used to have just the one for Waterford city but only recent, the last few years, we ended up with four.

What laws were changed or brought in the allow for this?

Of course this happen all over Ireland not just in Waterford obviously.

fricatus

I wasn't aware we had four mayors... where did you hear/read this? Maybe if you can give a bit more context to the question, someone might know what you're referring to.

Wanderer2010

We currently only have one (Mr D'Arcy) but they are not elected as far as I know and its a competition between either Pat Hayes, Mary Roche, Hilary Quinlan or Seamus Ryan as to who gets to don the robes for a year, they are just figureheads anyway with no real authority. They can do good work in promoting the city but the dog on the street knows its just a casual agreement between the above mentioned people as to who does it for the year, pretty closed book. I think all mayoral processes are like that to an extent.

Smiley Burnett

Finnbar01 wrote: »

Why do we have four Mayors?

I know we used to have just the one for Waterford city but only recent, the last few years, we ended up with four.

What laws were changed or brought in the allow for this?

Of course this happen all over Ireland not just in Waterford obviously.

1--martin cullen introcuced legislation, under the title "better local government", which allowed councils (of any size) have either a mayor or a Cathaoirleach

2--former city corporations became city councils

3--waterford city council has 1 mayor (not four)

4--"better local government" created a system of local government which is now top-heavy with managers/directors

5--under any attempts at reform, these senior managers/directors have the full protection of the croke park agreement

6--local govt/civil service in Ireland must be the only country in the world where management and worker are members of the same union!!!

7---those at the bottom of the rung in the civil service/local govt have yet to wake up to this fact

mike65

Joke position.

Finnbar01

fricatus wrote: »

I wasn't aware we had four mayors... where did you hear/read this? Maybe if you can give a bit more context to the question, someone might know what you're referring to.

I mean for Waterford City and County.

We have a mayor for Waterford City, Lismore, Tramore and Dungravan.

Finnbar01

Smiley Burnett wrote: »

1--martin cullen introcuced legislation, under the title "better local government", which allowed councils (of any size) have either a mayor or a Cathaoirleach

2--former city corporations became city councils

3--waterford city council has 1 mayor (not four)

4--"better local government" created a system of local government which is now top-heavy with managers/directors

5--under any attempts at reform, these senior managers/directors have the full protection of the croke park agreement

6--local govt/civil service in Ireland must be the only country in the world where management and worker are members of the same union!!!

7---those at the bottom of the rung in the civil service/local govt have yet to wake up to this fact

Thanks for the response just want to clarify something with you. Are you sure it was Martin Cullen and not the Late Seamus Brennan who introduced the new legislation?

Smiley Burnett

Finnbar01 wrote: »

Thanks for the response just want to clarify something with you. Are you sure it was Martin Cullen and not the Late Seamus Brennan who introduced the new legislation?

Yes, you are correct...Legislation was brought in just prior to Cullen taking over Evironment...Most of the changes under the new legislation took place whilst he was Minister, hence my mistake....(Cullen was responsible for Planning and Development Act 2002)....NOW THAT'S SOME PIECE OF LEGISLATION!!

looksee

The mayor does all sorts of civic duties. Who is going to present awards, represent Waterford, receive visiting dignitaries etc. Its a small scale version of the President, and while I know people will say he is a waste of money too, you do need people to do ceremonial stuff.

People are not necessarily being polite to him, they are respecting the city and the people in it.

I wonder how many of the people who say the shouldn't exist would also settle for not having an award ceremony for our olympic winners, not having any sort of ceremony for a wedding, etc? It oils the wheels of society and helps us be civilised.

Finnbar01

looksee wrote: »

The mayor does all sorts of civic duties. Who is going to present awards, represent Waterford, receive visiting dignitaries etc. Its a small scale version of the President, and while I know people will say he is a waste of money too, you do need people to do ceremonial stuff.

People are not necessarily being polite to him, they are respecting the city and the people in it.

I wonder how many of the people who say the shouldn't exist would also settle for not having an award ceremony for our olympic winners, not having any sort of ceremony for a wedding, etc? It oils the wheels of society and helps us be civilised.

I can understand why we need a mayor for Waterford but why a mayor for Lismore which only has a population of around 1250? And these new mayors only came in within the last ten years. Tramore, Dungarvan and Lismore got on pretty fine before then.

Psychedelic

Finnbar01 wrote: »

I mean for Waterford City and County.

We have a mayor for Waterford City, Lismore, Tramore and Dungravan.

There is also a mayor for Co. Waterford.

Finnbar01

Psychedelic wrote: »

There is also a mayor for Co. Waterford.

So that's five overall. Where is office for the mayor of County Waterford based?

looksee

Yes, I agree about the individual towns, one for the county should be enough.

Psychedelic

Finnbar01 wrote: »

So that's five overall. Where is office for the mayor of County Waterford based?

In the Waterford Co. Council offices in Dungarvan.

Finnbar01

Psychedelic wrote: »

In the Waterford Co. Council offices in Dungarvan.

Ok thanks, where is the office for the Dungravan Mayor?

fricatus

looksee wrote: »

Yes, I agree about the individual towns, one for the county should be enough.

In everywhere else in the world, a mayor is either the head of the council or the honorary first citizen (figurehead) of a city or town. It doesn't necessarily have to be a big city. Plenty of small villages in France for example have their own "Maire", who will usually work in a voluntary capacity and have very little power, whereas the Maire de Paris would be a major political post (which for example Jacques Chirac held at one point).

Ireland is the only place I'm aware of that has the title "mayor" for a county. I would have thought something like "governor" would have been a better title.

Psychedelic

Finnbar01 wrote: »

Ok thanks, where is the office for the Dungravan Mayor?

I'd say in Dungarvan Town Council offices, which I presume are in the Civic Offices building where the Co. Council offices are also based.

Deise Tom

Smiley Burnett wrote: »

1--martin cullen introcuced legislation, under the title "better local government", which allowed councils (of any size) have either a mayor or a Cathaoirleach

2--former city corporations became city councils

3--waterford city council has 1 mayor (not four)

4--"better local government" created a system of local government which is now top-heavy with managers/directors

5--under any attempts at reform, these senior managers/directors have the full protection of the croke park agreement

6--local govt/civil service in Ireland must be the only country in the world where management and worker are members of the same union!!!

7---those at the bottom of the rung in the civil service/local govt have yet to wake up to this fact

I think the word OR is very important. Who was it that made the final call as to whether places like Co. Waterford, Dungarvan, Lismore and Tramore should have a Mayor or a Cathaoirleach. Was it Martin Cullen as you claim or Seamus Brennan as someone else suggested or did the councillors in each town and county vote to have a Mayor of a Cathaoirleach. I know at times on here i try and take the p!ss especially if i know someone is blinded by what some people say or cant see what others say when it comes to politics etc, but i genuinelly dont know the answer to this but would be interested to know who did make the call.

Smiley Burnett

Deise Tom wrote: »

I think the word OR is very important. Who was it that made the final call as to whether places like Co. Waterford, Dungarvan, Lismore and Tramore should have a Mayor or a Cathaoirleach. Was it Martin Cullen as you claim or Seamus Brennan as someone else suggested or did the councillors in each town and county vote to have a Mayor of a Cathaoirleach. I know at times on here i try and take the p!ss especially if i know someone is blinded by what some people say or cant see what others say when it comes to politics etc, but i genuinelly dont know the answer to this but would be interested to know who did make the call.

The legislation allowed the councils themselves decide as to wether the chairman was known as Mayor or Cathoirleach...Prior to this legislation only a City had a Mayor/Lord Mayor....My own view is that Cities should have a Mayor and that Co Councils should be led by a Cathaoirleach...

Deise Tom

Smiley Burnett wrote: »

The legislation allowed the councils themselves decide as to wether the chairman was known as Mayor or Cathoirleach...Prior to this legislation only a City had a Mayor/Lord Mayor....My own view is that Cities should have a Mayor and that Co Councils should be led by a Cathaoirleach...

Thanks. I was not sure if it was the Councillors themselves that made the call or maybe say the County/Town Managers and maybe the various direcotors for different services. If memory serves me right, was it done in the latter days of the council elected between 1999 and 2004. Just jogging my memory as well, was it Kieran O'Ryan or Ollie Wilkinson was the first Mayor of the County.

Finnbar01

So I guess that's settled. We have five mayors overall.

Now, why do we need five mayors, with all the trimmings and trappings costing us taxpayers a fortune?

Smiley Burnett

Finnbar01 wrote: »

So I guess that's settled. We have five mayors overall.

Now, why do we need five mayors, with all the trimmings and trappings costing us taxpayers a fortune?

what "trimmings" and "trappings" do you refer to that supposedly cost so much??

Smiley Burnett

Deise Tom wrote: »

Thanks. I was not sure if it was the Councillors themselves that made the call or maybe say the County/Town Managers and maybe the various direcotors for different services. If memory serves me right, was it done in the latter days of the council elected between 1999 and 2004. Just jogging my memory as well, was it Kieran O'Ryan or Ollie Wilkinson was the first Mayor of the County.

Ollie was first Mayor. The name change took place his during term which commenced in June 2001

Finnbar01

Smiley Burnett wrote: »

what "trimmings" and "trappings" do you refer to that supposedly cost so much??

The costs associated with running their office.

Deise Tom

Finnbar01 wrote: »

The costs associated with running their office.

I may be wrong in this but would the costs be not the same if he/she was a Cathaoirleach or a Mayor.

Smiley Burnett

Finnbar01 wrote: »

The costs associated with running their office.

of course there are costs involved, but this notion that local reps cost "a fortune" as you put it, is nonsense...

Local Authorities spend LESS THAN 1% of their budget on their elected members.....

That's why I believe that this whole notion of merging local authorities and abolishing Town Councils is actually unnecessary......

If the public believe that abolishing Town Councils will save "a fortune", then they are in for a rude awakening....

Finnbar01

Smiley Burnett wrote: »

of course there are costs involved, but this notion that local reps cost "a fortune" as you put it, is nonsense...

Local Authorities spend LESS THAN 1% of their budget on their elected members.....

That's why I believe that this whole notion of merging local authorities and abolishing Town Councils is actually unnecessary......

If the public believe that abolishing Town Councils will save "a fortune", then they are in for a rude awakening....

Do you know what the exact budget figure is?