Can a teacher ban a student from class?

bobbyss

Does anyone know if a teacher can ban a student from a class on a permanent/semi-permanent basis for: being abusive, using vulgar language, constant disruptive behaviour etc etc? Even if this is contrary to the principal's wish? If a teacher can do this, where is it specifically written down that this can be done?
Cheers

DylanII

bobbyss wrote: »

Does anyone know if a teacher can ban a student from a class on a permanent/semi-permanent basis for: being abusive, using vulgar language, constant disruptive behaviour etc etc? Even if this is contrary to the principal's wish? If a teacher can do this, where is it specifically written down that this can be done?
Cheers

I would think so. If a teacher feels threatened by a student then they should be allowed to refuse to be left with them.

A teacher has the same rights as everyone else and they do not have to put up with abuse from students.

TheBody

In cases like this, people should be reflecting on the students behaviour. No teacher would take an action like this for no reason. Don't forget, there are 30 odd students in the class that are looking for an education. One disruptive student can have a serious negative effect on the learning of others.

brownacid

bobbyss wrote: »

Does anyone know if a teacher can ban a student from a class on a permanent/semi-permanent basis for: being abusive, using vulgar language, constant disruptive behaviour etc etc? Even if this is contrary to the principal's wish? If a teacher can do this, where is it specifically written down that this can be done?
Cheers

Has your little "Darling" been stopped from participating in class? Instead of trying to find out if the teacher can or can't do this, how about you address your child's discipline/respect problems. Maybe arrange to meet with the teacher with your child and see where the problem lies.

It is grossly unfair to everyone else in the class if the child in question is disruptive or disrepectful.

delta_bravo

It would be an interesting legal case between a child's right to education and a teacher's right to a safe workplace. It is interesting you say the principal wants the kid in there. If you are the parent I suggest you organise a meeting with the teacher and principal and get your child to write a grovelling letter of apology to the teacher for their behaviour and a written agreement to behave properly. If they don't agree to the latter you are wasting your time.

byhookorbycrook

The Board of management have a duty of care to its teachers,so under that,yes, the teacher can refuse to take a child.
"However it is the Board of Management that carries the legal duty of care for school employees and it is the Board’s responsibility to ensure that high standards and best practice are applied to all aspects of safety."

http://www.asti.ie/?id=287

bobbyss

Thanks byhookorbycrook.

It may be, as I suspected, a BoM issue but interesting to get intelligent, mature views, of which Brownacid should take note.

solas111

I would think that only the Board of Management of the school could ban a pupil on a permanent or semi-permanent basis. If there is a Parent’s Committee, it would be their function to represent the interests of the parents and pupil and argue their case with the school.

Can’t see any teacher throwing someone out of a class without good reason. If a pupil is being “abusive, using vulgar language, constant disruptive behaviour etc etc” and I was the teacher I would be sending for the parents and asking them to do their duty towards their child. Respect has to start in the home - An rud a tchí leanbh, ghní leanbh.

Powerhouse

bobbyss wrote: »

where is it specifically written down that this can be done?

This 'defence' always takes me back to a particular student who didn't like to be hassled to take his books out of his bag in class and argued his right to not do so on the basis that it did not specifically state anywhere that this was a requirement in school.

In that case, as in this one, it is almost so self-evidently a requirement that a student behaves in class that it is silly to try to hide behind the possibility that the entire gamut of potential circumstances cannot be specifically legislated for in the school rules.

The problem for the student is that all the other students in the class also have a right to an education and it is highly arguable that at a certain point the teacher has a duty to try to exclude the student who is denying everyone the right to have a productive class.

Of course if only the student were conscious of their reponsibility to conduct themselves in the first place they would not now be scrambling for loopholes.

To address your question specifically, can you point out where in the regulations it states that a teacher has to accept a student in their class irrespective of circumstances? I think you'll probably find that there are no absolutes in such situations, hence the lack of specific leglislation.

But you can be certain of one thing - it is not a decision a teacher would ever take lightly so the behaviour must have been very poor and/or very constant.

byhookorbycrook

solas111 wrote: »

I would think that only the Board of Management of the school could ban a pupil on a permanent or semi-permanent basis. If there is a Parent’s Committee, it would be their function to represent the interests of the parents and pupil and argue their case with the school.

.

Errrrrr, no it wouldn't,that's not within their remit.

doc_17

"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Or the one"

The only issue with not allowing them into yours particular classroom would be where do they go or that time? It would more than likely have to be cleared and arrange with a principal/deputy.

spurious

If I as a professional decide that somebody's ill-reared, out of control darling is a health and safety concern to me or the 20+ other children in the room I am responsible for, there is not a chance that individual is getting in my room.

If management or parents want to push it, let them push it and let unions, parents councils, DES, ministers, local papers hear EXACTLY what some darlings subject teachers and classmates to.

I am sick and tired of the landslide of standards of behaviour in our schools. If that makes me unsuitable to teach, or a 'bad teacher', great, retire me off early.

Kristopherus

bobbyss wrote: »

Thanks byhookorbycrook.

It may be, as I suspected, a BoM issue but interesting to get intelligent, mature views, of which Brownacid should take note.

Well, you should start with yourself. Is the disruptive pupil yours? If so, therin lies the root of the problem. Sort out your side before going after the teacher.You have responsibilities too.

chippers

Kristopherus wrote: »

Well, you should start with yourself. Is the disruptive pupil yours? If so, therin lies the root of the problem. Sort out your side before going after the teacher.You have responsibilities too.

In fairness the OP just asked a question - quite an interesting question from both a parents and a teachers point of view. They didn't mention anything about their little 'darling' as the other post puts it.

flatbackfour

spurious wrote: »

If I as a professional decide that somebody's ill-reared, out of control darling is a health and safety concern to me or the 20+ other children in the room I am responsible for, there is not a chance that individual is getting in my room.

If management or parents want to push it, let them push it and let unions, parents councils, DES, ministers, local papers hear EXACTLY what some darlings subject teachers and classmates to.

I am sick and tired of the landslide of standards of behaviour in our schools. If that makes me unsuitable to teach, or a 'bad teacher', great, retire me off early.

Well said. Very well said.

Mardy Bum

bobbyss wrote: »

Thanks byhookorbycrook.

It may be, as I suspected, a BoM issue but interesting to get intelligent, mature views, of which Brownacid should take note.

Brownacid made an inference which may be warranted or unwarranted. Indeed you may not be a parent at all. However he/she is just echoing the views which many teachers hold regarding students being enabled by parents. Now if brownacids inference was incorrect well then it is a mistake. However if the post does match your circumstances I would have a good long think about it.

Lockedout

Im not clear here-is this a question by a parent or teacher?? I would argue that an abusive student is a health hazard, (if the level of abuse /disruption is high enough), and like all health hazards must be dealt with by management. That would not always mean permanent exclusion from a class but steps must be taken.
Unfortunately, NEWB and other authorities only issue useless discipline guidelines these days rather than seriously addressing the issue. What most schools need is a principal to show leadership and decide if a student is so disruptive he or she should be expelled or make their lives so difficult they want to leave-that's after all reasonable steps have been taken. Most principals hate the expulsion process-too much work for them and they don't have to teach the student involved. Sad but true. Some also have disappeared up their bums and are all for inclusion- at all costs..

Lockedout

bobbyss wrote: »

Does anyone know if a teacher can ban a student from a class on a permanent/semi-permanent basis for: being abusive, using vulgar language, constant disruptive behaviour etc etc? Even if this is contrary to the principal's wish? If a teacher can do this, where is it specifically written down that this can be done?
Cheers

If the exclusion is contrary to the Principal's wish then there is a dispute between teacher and Principal and the teacher would want to be in talks with his/her union or making a case on health/safety grounds.

byhookorbycrook

Expulsion is nigh on impossible as all rights seem to have shifted too far to the side of a troublemaker, versus the rights of the rest of the school community.