The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2013

OAOB

Real disheartening to see the lack of fight in the lads, can win the ball when they want but when it matters they go missing. Pa gave as good a shift as he can but his limited physicality will always be exposed in tough championship games, better as an impact sub i think. Bonner looked slow, attitude as good as always but we saw him chasing the backs too much yesterday, they should be chasing him. Johno got some nice scores and put in a good stint but we didn't see him in the last quarter when we needed him most (tbf i don't think we targeted him enough in that period). Shane Bourke did nothing yesterday, first time he's not shown up for us but can't afford lads to have days off at this stage. Seamie was as frustrating as he always is, a luxury we can't afford at the moment. Noel is fantastic with ball in hand but he has to be given the ball, he won't win it. He's such a good talent that it'd be awful to have him on the bench but if we can't win the ball he's useless to us anyway.

Players and management need to learn from sunday, we can turn it around because we do have the players. Its the lack of hunger that has me worried

Alpha Dog 1

Alpha Dog 1 wrote: »

Lads, the half forward line is the second most important line on a team after the half back line.
Can't remember the last decent half forward line we have had. Probably have to go back to 2001 mark o leary and Dec Ryan.

What team has the best half forward line in Irehttp://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=85008943land and why?
What exactly does a modern half forward line need?

For me the centre forward is critical and needs to be a 6 foot + and very effective under the high ball, good vision, good passing skills and an ability to stop the centre back from hurling. A good centre forward can make an average wing forward look immense, ie mark o leary 2001.

Surely we have a player somewhere in the county who possesses such attributes and can make an impact at this level?

Look at Kilkenny over the years. At number 6 they've had Peter Barry, Brian Hogan and John Tennyson. Each of whom offered the other 2 intense
competition and lorded over every dropping ball that came their way. They were flanked by both Tommy Walsh and JJ and we need no reminder about their contributions

At number 11, Shefflin has been pretty much the lynchpin of their attacks under the dropping ball. Catching almost everything and are on the move before their feet would hit the ground and when they fail to catch they harass, smother and eventually force the opposition into errors.


Cork have had Niall McCarthy at number 11 who on top of his fielding ability he had aggression and tenacity. Timmy McCarthy for all his faults would try hard all day.

At the half back line you had Gardiner, Curran and Sean Óg who were excellent fielders and sticksmen.

The great teams win and lose games from these two areas. Now think of 2010 when we had both Gar Ryan and Bonnar on the flanks and when they failed to catch they were on top of Tommy and JJ immediately.

Our half forward line on top of been poor individual catchers, they don't operate enough as a unit. All 3 of them need to read the puck-outs as all too often when we do manage to catch that forward is isolated and bottled up immediately. No one next or near them to provide the option of a link up

Alpha Dog 1

Wasn't it 2010 where we dragged their half back line in to midfield and bypassed our half forward line completely and aimed the puck outs directly at our full forward line?

Maybe this should be looked at going forward. Either way big changes are needed at half forward. Limerick had a very defensive half forward line which seemed to work for them!

looder

Deleted User wrote: »

What about Foxy for midfield? Plays there for Eire Og Annacarthy. Very good little battler in the rucks in my opinion. Lacks a bit under the high ball though.

Gar i think is best suited to wing forward as if he is beaten to it he'll bottle his man up best as he can. Might be too loose for midfield. Think he was on the bench yesterday but he could well be projected into the starting line up next day.

Foxy also played Fitzgibbon Cup at midfield. He's definitely an option there and is probably better there than he would be stuck in corner back anyway.

Xenophile wrote: »

This year and maybe last year as well Eoin has been playing the man when he was not able to play the ball. I agree he would be a great comrade in any war. This is sport not war.........give youth a chance as many teams are doing right now...........it's not all about winning but playing the game in its true spirit. Rather than be hungry for success let's decide to win with honour.

Eoin has been one of our better players in the league. When he's playing we have a bit of bite about us. I'm far from Eoin's biggest fan and when it comes to club hurling I rarely have a good word to say about him but he's a leader and in my opinion he should be starting on this team. We've too many nice hurlers. Sometimes you need someone who's not afraid to hit a lad or get under somebody's skin and help the lads around him. Kelly is still an integral part of this panel and dare I say it that if he was starting and on the frees yesterday we'd be preparing for a Munster Final.

Alpha Dog 1 wrote: »

Wasn't it 2010 where we dragged their half back line in to midfield and bypassed our half forward line completely and aimed the puck outs directly at our full forward line?

Maybe this should be looked at going forward. Either way big changes are needed at half forward. Limerick had a very defensive half forward line which seemed to work for them!

Limerick's defensive half forward line and out 3 man midfield really crowded the middle yesterday which suited them down to the ground. Allen won the battle of wits hands down.

tonyduggan

tonyduggan wrote: »

ah here. its mostly about winning in fairness.

Hear hear. Very few would laud Kilkenny for merely playing in good spirit

Comordha

I agree with others about Kelly, think he brings a bit of grit to the forwards. Not sure if Corbett would have made a difference to that game. Forde was a loss I felt, he is competitive and fit and good in the air. John O Dwyer should probably start the next day. Tactics won the day for Limerick I felt. Shane McGrath is underperforming at midfield and not bulky enough for it, I wonder would Bergin be up to it or Woodlock? KK looked very weak under the high ball the last day against Offaly & Galway exposed that somewhat last year. I think that is the way to approach playing them, high ball into full forward line. The backline can't really be faulted or Brendan Maher. Callanan should have finished that attempt after Bonnar put it through to him on the ground, Kelly would definitely have finished it, Corbett probably would have too. Not sure Shane McGrath or Callanan can stay on the panel.

Red Crow

I think Lar would of made a difference but it's a moot point at this stage. A lot of lads need to up their game.

Will O'Shea have the balls to drop the under-performing captain?

ReacherCreature

Eli Manning wrote: »

Will O'Shea have the balls to drop the under-performing captain?

That would be a media catastrophe and I don't know would O' Shea want to risk it.

So much great knowledge and analysis coming out of here especially about the nice hurlers part. Callanan and McGrath can be class with a ball in their hands but they go missing. Loathe to say it as I'm a fan of his but Shane Bourke can be the same.

I don't normally agree with you tonyduggan but this is correct:

buggy bonner johno
bubbles lar forde/kelly.

shake it up a bit cos theres too many wasters out there im afraid

That lineup will fight on and score and hopefully win balls. Shake it up is necessary.

Someone was asking why a meltdown but it's obvious, the same problems have been there (fancy hurlers, lack of a decent half forward line) for a while now.

I was at the match and I'm still really bothered about it, credit due to Limerick as they were very, very good but we hurled only sporadically and it's still niggling me, more than the AI SF debacle against Kilkenny for some reason.

Right now, this team, sad to say doesn't have a whiff of winning Liam McCarthy.

Youngladathome

A couple of things that annoyed me at the match on Sunday. Noel McGrath in possession 40 or so metres from goal, looking around, then hitting a diagonal ball towards the corner flag for Seamie Callinan to run on to - in the league final v KK with less time on the ball he was scoring points from those distances: why the over-elaboration against Limerick? He hit those kind of balls on a number of occasions on Sunday - did he think they could play around with Limerick?
Another irritation at the game was our free-taking - Seamie Callinan started out as our free-taker and was erratic, which is unusual for him, normally he is reliable. Then Pa Bourke took a few. Then Noel McGrath. Then Conor O'Mahony. Not sure, maybe Eoin Kelly took one as well. Like our freetaking, so much of what players did on Sunday was riddled with uncertainty. Brendan Cummins mis-hitting a pass over Paudie's head into touch. Conor Mahony dwelling too long on a clearance and being hooked. Brendan Maher fumbling and losing a surprise pass from a line ball by Noel McGrath.
Our players just didn't seem to be fully focused and up for the game. This was clearly seen in our lackadaisical start. Strange, when you think that E.O'Shea had been referencing this game as their prime goal throughout the league campaign and after the league final defeat. Is this an indictment of O'Shea and the management team?
In spite of everything they managed to create the chances that might have won the game had they been taken. Seamie Callanan was the chief culprit spurning two goal chances. The first should have been whipped first time past Quaid. He did the difficult part for the second chance and fluffed the tap-in. I will be surprised if he starts another game- he's best coming off the bench into the half-forward line. Pa Bourke's goal chance was not as clear-cut - although he has often buried similar chances.
Buggy will probably have to be brought in to beef up the forwards. O'Shea's options in terms of athletic ball winning forwards who can also pressurize defenders are pretty much non-existent, I think. How to get quality ball to the forwards that he has got is the problem: the source of a lot of possession for our forwards in the past was Paudie Maher's ability to place balls in to them. Now every team is pressurizing him into hurried clearances. It was the same on Sunday.
Anyway, we're not a beaten docket yet - we're off on the scenic route again, where will it lead us? probably our first stop will be Portlaoise, Wexford Park or Semple, depending on the draw. Come on Tipp!

Davin Stand

Tipp have played 9 competitive games this year and have lost 5 of them. They lost to Clare in the Waterford Crystal Final, to Cork, Waterford and Kilkenny in the National league and to Limerick in the 1st Round of the Munster Championship. That is certainly not All Ireland winning form. Not yet a busted flush or beaten docket maybe, but not too far away from that either.

premierstone

Davin Stand wrote: »

Tipp have played 9 competitive games this year and have lost 5 of them. They lost to Clare in the Waterford Crystal Final, to Cork, Waterford and Kilkenny in the National league and to Limerick in the 1st Round of the Munster Championship. That is certainly not All Ireland winning form. Not yet a busted flush or beaten docket maybe, but not too far away from that either.

Being a bit disingenious with the stats there Davin, I mean if you are including the Waterford Crystal Final, surely you must include the QF and SF??

The Cork and Limerick defeats are the two most alarming ones, and if we can react to the Limerick one like we did to the Cork one then there are plenty of reasons for optomism.

Our backs are actually playing better than they have at any stage since 2010, obviously its from there upwards our problems begin, but there are plenty of reasons for optomism that I can see, and I certainly think we will have a major say in this years championship.

Davin Stand

The Waterford Crystal Final was played in Semple Stadium under lights and was a very competitive game, whereas many Waterford Crystal games are glrified challenge matches against college sides or very understrength county teams. I don't see any great reasons for optimism after losing 5 game in 3 or 4 months.

premierstone

Tipp lined out that night as follows - B Cummins; D Maher, P Curran, C O’Brien; J McLoughney, T Stapleton, S Hennessy; S McGrath, N McGrath; J Forde, E Kelly, P Maher; B O’Meara, S Bourke, S Callanan

Only 7 of those started on Sunday, is that not understrenght? And we were beaten by 8 points that night and only a couple of months later beat the same opposition by 11 points when we started 10 of last Sundays team.

I fully agree with you that all is not well and rosey but citing the Waterford Crystal as a reference point is well off the mark.

Davin Stand

Davin Stand wrote: »

Tipp have played 9 competitive games this year and have lost 5 of them. They lost to Clare in the Waterford Crystal Final, to Cork, Waterford and Kilkenny in the National league and to Limerick in the 1st Round of the Munster Championship. That is certainly not All Ireland winning form. Not yet a busted flush or beaten docket maybe, but not too far away from that either.

With the exception of analysing the National league final given the opposition that were involved, i think any other game is probably over analysing tbh but that's just my opinion. The league and WC cup are merely warm up tournaments which teams gradually build up momentum before entering the championship. You cant really make the comparison in form either given that winter games are played on heavier ground and there is a certain amount of holding back. OK granted we were woeful down in Cork the night but we looked jaded and besides the real objectives of the league is (1) Staying in division and (2) Getting in as many games as we possibly can and we achieved both of those. Objective 2 is same for Waterford Crystal, get in as many games as possible.

Ok i accept that there is some importance in the league final being a national final and while Tipp lost it, generally i was happy with the performance apart from the forwards who allowed themselves to be bullied and not for the first time either. Its been a pattern regardless of the importance of the occasion and we need to flip the bell curve around in this regard.

But overall its all about the Championship and after months of preparation in advance i thought Tipp were utterly toothless on Sunday. I felt the fans deserved alot more then what they witnessed which was naivety, lack of intensity, disorganisation and overall a repeat of this regressive pattern we have to endure in the years following an All Ireland win. Tipp fans are accused of fickleness but in my opinion we just wouldn't be human if we weren't concerned in the very least after Sunday.

Personally, in 2010, I felt Tipp were better then the performance on the banks of the Lee and were well and truly still in it, but this year.....i dunno i feel the panel needs a huge shake up. Lads who are only playing at 50% of their capability are almost in a comfort zone where they feel they are undroppable. They need more competition and i feel one of the failings of our panel for years is that the lads that are on the bench are not as strong as the their counterparts of Cork (last decade) or Kilkenny (last two decades). The 2010 final was the only occasion that the bench came to the fore.

I dont mean to keep referring to Kilkenny but being the standard bearers that they are, the likes of even Tommy Walsh is wary of potentially losing his place on the team the day of the match and that essentially is the difference. A little bit of me thinks that our lads believe their own hype and you could nearly see it in their body language. Also we are producing forwards who are not battle hardened enough. They are very light and small and are brushed off the ball far too easily.

Youngladathome

Davin Stand wrote: »

Tipp have played 9 competitive games this year and have lost 5 of them. They lost to Clare in the Waterford Crystal Final, to Cork, Waterford and Kilkenny in the National league and to Limerick in the 1st Round of the Munster Championship. That is certainly not All Ireland winning form. Not yet a busted flush or beaten docket maybe, but not too far away from that either.

It's interesting to compare E. O'Shea's progress so far in his first year as manager with L. Sheedy's in his first year.

At this stage in 2008, which was Sheedy's first year, wasn't it?, Tipp were League champions, heading towards a Munster title and defeat to Waterford in an AI semi-final.
So far, under E.O'Shea's management, Tipp have been beaten in a league final, knocked out of Munster and are heading into the uncertainty of the qualifiers.
I am not in any way knocking O'Shea - he was an integral part of Sheedy's selection team and takes a large part of the credit for the successes of the team they built.
He did stress when he took over that getting back to the top wouldn't be easy and would take a lot of work.
In 2008 Sheedy was rebuilding the Tipp team, bringing in new players, putting new life in the older ones, a process that came to fruition in 2010.
E.O'Shea, I suppose, is not rebuilding - he is trying to restore the confidence and belief of what is still Sheedy's team after a couple of demolition jobs executed on them by KK - and their branding after last August's semi-final as a dirty team that was a disgrace to hurling.
Maybe our expectations ran away with us in Tipperary when he was appointed manager. On Sunday you could almost see the confidence draining out of the forwards - and it takes a high level of confidence and self-belief to play the kind of game they are trying to play.

I believe O'Shea can turn it around for Tipp hurling - I just wonder, though, is he too much of the good cop in his relationship with the players, does he have to spend a lot of time massaging egos? And does he have a bad cop in the set-up who will kick ass when needed? Like now, maybe?

premierstone

Youngladathome wrote: »

It's interesting to compare E. O'Shea's progress so far in his first year as manager with L. Sheedy's in his first year.

And does he have a bad cop in the set-up who will kick ass when needed? Like now, maybe?

I understand the parellel you are making but lets be fair these are two completly diffeterent situations and it would be unfair on both men tbh.

He definitely has the bad cop I can tell you that, and having observed him in training last night he was indeed very vocal and the players were late coming out on to the field, plenty of raised voices could be heard, their was definitly a marked reaction afterwards and it was one of the better trainings I have observed, plenty of hard physical stuff too which was good to see.

Reginald P. DuM

So the dust has settled after Sunday and we have had time to discuss and think about what went wrong.... Emotions run high on this thread, which is only to be expected and applauded, we take our hurling very serious in Tipperary, but these emotive outbursts can cloud some peoples visions and tend to inspire rash comment and knee jerks, which ultimately is unhelpful in any debate.. Below are some thoughts of my own, they are not necessarily right, or wrong, but they are mine, and consequently valid as a season ticket holder.

Eamon O Shea is the right manager for this Tipperary team, while one or two of his judgement calls have been questionable there arent many Tipp people who could rightfully claim to be more entitled to the job at present. This is his first yr in earnest and management requires rapport with a team, which is not built over the course of one winter. There are numerous examples throughout sport where legendary managers took their time to achieve this. Results followed, as did iconic status, let him breathe in this job.

To the players. All fine and talented individuals, who without question make a great personal effort each yr to train and play for our pride and entertainment, they deserve our support. We hurl from the ditch after all. Before ye think I am soft on them, this does not entitle them to be immune from criticism. When running out the tunnel on any given Championship day a certain level of performance is expected and sadly this has not happened in a lot of lads cases since that fateful day in 2010. To some the effort required is not as taxing as it is to others, because certain lads love the attention that comes with being an inter county hurler, ego's thrive on it and this can result in a swanning around type of attitude that affects performance. I firmly belive disciplinary issues off the field has been a Tipp trait for many a yr, and O Shea is what I regard as the ideal man to control this to a manageable level. It will never be eradicated but thats down to human nature. The fact of the matter is we don't have the wealth of talent we would like, but certainly are capable of a lot better than we have witnessed in the last 2 yrs.

One of the most frustrating things is those players who we know to have oodles of talent yet constantly under perform in the heat of battle. Notably Noel and Seamie, blessed with a wealth of skill, but not often enough seem to produce. If KK are the bench mark, every advantage at our disposal needs to be used to topple them. As it was in 2010. We shouldnt rely on that day however to mould future endeavors. That day everything clicked, everything that could have went right did go right, it was like the snooker player getting his 147, the dart player his 9 darter, it happens, but is far more the occasional than the norm. In other words those who say in response to Sundays defeat look to what happened after Cork smashed us in 2010 are hopeless romantics, sure its possible but I wouldnt back it to happen again with counterfiet money. We can't afford to drop Noel McGrath I believe, yes theres convincing arguments for it, but clearly he needs to be mentored into achieving, O Shea can do this. As for Callinan my patience has run out, I think the management gave him the opportunity to be man of the match on Sunday, free taker, physical prowess and pace, none of which showed up.. He has to go from the first 15. There are younger players available, one of which was unlucky to succumb to a bug prior to Sunday who have to be given the chance to flourish this yr, with a view towards winning more than 1 All Ireland in a decade. The old brigade of Eoin, Brendan C and Lar, still have contributions to make, but should be in a supporting role, to assist in the transition. All three are legends in our game and we are lucky to have seen them work their magic. Time waits for no man alas. I was particularily dismayed to see Lar appearing on Sunday. I am not a doctor but its obvious he wasnt ready to play Munster hurling after being so cynically targeted that day in Nolan Park. O Shea clearly had ran out of options and took a gamble, it may have worked, but odds were against it. Reeked of desperation and is a major slight on those physically fit forwards who started the game.

Essentially our dilemma is in the 9 to 15 positions. Not enough guile, the will to punish yourself to win every ball, and support a man that has won it. Limerick wanted it more Sunday simple as that. Its all very well playng sexy open hurling but your more likely to be judged on how ya react in a dog fight. Limerick were always gonna be up for it. We stained our shorts in you know what. Whether the current training regime is placing more emphasis on gym work than hurling at the moment is possible but this is far from a logical reason for the lack of fight we saw. Certainly we will improve this yr, and perhaps won't be too far away but it was all too familiar Sunday, that demoralising feeling, and it's this man's reasonable estimation that further defeat this year is as inevitable as death itself. Not a nice conclusion. Thanks for reading, if you did.

Xenophile

Reginald P. DuM wrote: »

So the dust has settled after Sunday and we have had time to discuss and think about what went wrong.... Emotions run high on this thread, which is only to be expected and applauded, we take our hurling very serious in Tipperary, but these emotive outbursts can cloud some peoples visions and tend to inspire rash comment and knee jerks, which ultimately is unhelpful in any debate.. Below are some thoughts of my own, they are not necessarily right, or wrong, but they are mine, and consequently valid as a season ticket holder.

Eamon O Shea is the right manager for this Tipperary team, while one or two of his judgement calls have been questionable there arent many Tipp people who could rightfully claim to be more entitled to the job at present. This is his first yr in earnest and management requires rapport with a team, which is not built over the course of one winter. There are numerous examples throughout sport where legendary managers took their time to achieve this. Results followed, as did iconic status, let him breathe in this job.

To the players. All fine and talented individuals, who without question make a great personal effort each yr to train and play for our pride and entertainment, they deserve our support. We hurl from the ditch after all. Before ye think I am soft on them, this does not entitle them to be immune from criticism. When running out the tunnel on any given Championship day a certain level of performance is expected and sadly this has not happened in a lot of lads cases since that fateful day in 2010. To some the effort required is not as taxing as it is to others, because certain lads love the attention that comes with being an inter county hurler, ego's thrive on it and this can result in a swanning around type of attitude that affects performance. I firmly belive disciplinary issues off the field has been a Tipp trait for many a yr, and O Shea is what I regard as the ideal man to control this to a manageable level. It will never be eradicated but thats down to human nature. The fact of the matter is we don't have the wealth of talent we would like, but certainly are capable of a lot better than we have witnessed in the last 2 yrs.

One of the most frustrating things is those players who we know to have oodles of talent yet constantly under perform in the heat of battle. Notably Noel and Seamie, blessed with a wealth of skill, but not often enough seem to produce. If KK are the bench mark, every advantage at our disposal needs to be used to topple them. As it was in 2010. We shouldnt rely on that day however to mould future endeavors. That day everything clicked, everything that could have went right did go right, it was like the snooker player getting his 147, the dart player his 9 darter, it happens, but is far more the occasional than the norm. In other words those who say in response to Sundays defeat look to what happened after Cork smashed us in 2010 are hopeless romantics, sure its possible but I wouldnt back it to happen again with counterfiet money. We can't afford to drop Noel McGrath I believe, yes theres convincing arguments for it, but clearly he needs to be mentored into achieving, O Shea can do this. As for Callinan my patience has run out, I think the management gave him the opportunity to be man of the match on Sunday, free taker, physical prowess and pace, none of which showed up.. He has to go from the first 15. There are younger players available, one of which was unlucky to succumb to a bug prior to Sunday who have to be given the chance to flourish this yr, with a view towards winning more than 1 All Ireland in a decade. The old brigade of Eoin, Brendan C and Lar, still have contributions to make, but should be in a supporting role, to assist in the transition. All three are legends in our game and we are lucky to have seen them work their magic. Time waits for no man alas. I was particularily dismayed to see Lar appearing on Sunday. I am not a doctor but its obvious he wasnt ready to play Munster hurling after being so cynically targeted that day in Nolan Park. O Shea clearly had ran out of options and took a gamble, it may have worked, but odds were against it. Reeked of desperation and is a major slight on those physically fit forwards who started the game.

Essentially our dilemma is in the 9 to 15 positions. Not enough guile, the will to punish yourself to win every ball, and support a man that has won it. Limerick wanted it more Sunday simple as that. Its all very well playng sexy open hurling but your more likely to be judged on how ya react in a dog fight. Limerick were always gonna be up for it. We stained our shorts in you know what. Whether the current training regime is placing more emphasis on gym work than hurling at the moment is possible but this is far from a logical reason for the lack of fight we saw. Certainly we will improve this yr, and perhaps won't be too far away but it was all too familiar Sunday, that demoralising feeling, and it's this man's reasonable estimation that further defeat this year is as inevitable as death itself. Not a nice conclusion. Thanks for reading, if you did.

What a great post well worth reading. If I can pitch in my 10 cents worth here, Cummins still good enough to be our #1.

Xenophile

Believe that Michael Quinlivan and at least one other Clonmel Commercials player playing football in Boston at present. I say well done and good luck to them hope they can earn a few dollars to help them with their education in Ireland. It's a great experience to live outside the country for a time, broads the mind and helps young peoples development. Hope that Quinlivan will be back in top form and help Tipperary footballers get promotion in the league next season.

randd1

Davin Stand wrote: »

Tipp have played 9 competitive games this year and have lost 5 of them. They lost to Clare in the Waterford Crystal Final, to Cork, Waterford and Kilkenny in the National league and to Limerick in the 1st Round of the Munster Championship. That is certainly not All Ireland winning form. Not yet a busted flush or beaten docket maybe, but not too far away from that either.

A far more worrying statistic from a Tipp point of view would be that the last truly convincing performance that Tipp gave in the championship was in the 2011 Munster final. Since then:

2011 v Dublin - Won very unconvincingly.
2011 v Kilkenny - Lost and were clearly second best.
2012 v Limerick - Won, but could have lost if Limerick had decent subs or didn't run out of steam.
2012 v Cork - A good result with 14 men, but only won by a point and could easily have lost.
2012 v Waterford - A good 7 point win, but Waterford had goal chances.
2012 v Kilkenny - Worst championship defeat in over 100 years. Enough has been said about that.
2013 v Limerick - Out-fought, out-muscled and when it came down to it out-hurled.

In championship hurling that's called a pattern. And the 2011 Munster Final is a long while ago now.

looder

Carrick Swan vs Ballingarry Match Report can be seen here: http://carrickswan.gaa.ie/club-news-1/carrickswanvsballingarry-matchreport

looder

looder wrote: »

Carrick Swan vs Ballingarry Match Report can be seen here: http://carrickswan.gaa.ie/club-news-1/carrickswanvsballingarry-matchreport

Cheers. Sounded like a cracker looder

Tipperary animal lover

Jason forde scored 3pts from line balls in today's match against borrisleigh

Youngladathome

Below is an extract from Enda McEvoy's article in last Saturday's Examiner. This is his take on the dilemma facing Eamon O'Shea.

Eamon O’Shea.

After last August’s hideousness the minimum requirement for the Tipperary players on Sunday was to die for the county, for the jersey, for the supporters. In the event they just died. Two points in the last 20 minutes against Kilkenny in Croke Park, one point in the last 20 minutes here. More and more the Tipp forward line resembles a boating crew where everyone can row but only one of them ever does the rowing for an extra man. They’ll still make the All-Ireland quarter-final in their sleep. Yet the manager is faced with a plethora of questions. Can he stick with his utopia of a passing game or does the intrusion of reality now demand the imposition of more ball-winners up front? How many of his forwards, Bonner Maher apart, can he truly trust? If Eoin Kelly is to be employed, why not from the start? And should O’Shea go the whole hog and set about reconstructing the team with a view to winning the 2014 All-Ireland? After the senior and U21 triumphs of September 2010 Tipp stood poised as the new power in the land. The disappointing thing is not that they didn’t go on to emulate Kilkenny; it's that they’ve never come remotely close.

ormond lad

Tipperary Senior Hurling Championship Round 2 Draw
Mullinahone v Nenagh Eire Og
Moycarkey-Borris v Portroe
Borris-Ileigh v JK Brackens
Cappawhite v winners of Burgess or Carrick Davins
Templederry Kenyons v Ballingarry
Knockavilla-Donaskeigh Kickhams v Roscrea
Upperchurch-Drombane v Holycross-Ballycahill
Toomevara v Kilruane MacDonaghs

Seamus O’Riain Cup Draw
Thurles Sarsfields v Boherlahan-Dualla
Borrisokane v Golden-Kilfeacle
Cashel v losers of Burgess or Carrick Davins
Moneygall v Lorrha

Think Dates & Venues will be confirmed tomorrow

Any stand outs from both draws? Mullinahone Nenagh and Toome Kilruane stand out ties IMO

ReacherCreature

Apparently: Mullinahone scored 0-11 earlier. Eoin Kelly scored all eleven. Then he was sent off late in the game for a second yellow. Mullinahone still lost. Madness.

Lar Corbett was also sent off for Thurles. Nenagh beat them.

ReacherCreature

ReacherCreature wrote: »

Apparently: Mullinahone scored 0-11 earlier. Eoin Kelly scored all eleven. Then he was sent off late in the game for a second yellow. Mullinahone still lost. Madness.

Lar Corbett was also sent off for Thurles. Nenagh beat them.

Surely the shock of the day has to be the fact that Thurles Sarsfields, the Current county and Munster Champions, have been eliminated in June and are in the B championship for 2014.

On paper its not a bad Nenagh team but what the hell is going on with Sars and Lar at this stage you'd have to wonder?

A poor reflection on Mullinahone. They badly need those youngsters to start stepping up to the plate in the next few years or they will fall down the ladder. Now they face a Nenagh side high in confidence

ReacherCreature

Deleted User wrote: »

Surely the shock of the day has to be the fact that Thurles Sarsfields, the Current county and Munster Champions, have been eliminated in June and are in the B championship for 2014.

On paper its not a bad Nenagh team but what the hell is going on with Sars and Lar at this stage you'd have to wonder?

Definitely the shock of the day. Plus the last dispirited outing they had, AI club semi-final raised a lot of questions too, granted the other team were better on the day.

varberg

Sars must have been favourites for the munster club title, Are thurles out of the dan breen cup for 2014 now as well with the new structures or can they win it next year?

looder

varberg wrote: »

Sars must have been favourites for the munster club title, Are thurles out of the dan breen cup for 2014 now as well with the new structures or can they win it next year?

They can still win Dan Breen next year but they have to win the Mid I think.