Has the FA Cup gone downhill in your eyes?

dd972

I personally find the FA Cup 3rd to 5th rounds akin to those International weekends that have a nothing happening vibe, for instance Wigan fans would take Premiership survival over an FA Cup triumph as a no brainer.

Fair play to the smaller clubs who get their moments of glory and 15 minutes of fame, it's still a valid competition in that sense.

But as regards it's kudos it's comparable now to the cup competitions in Italy or Germany.

Leiva

no.

It's a fantastic competition with history and glory and needs to be shown more respect by the "big" clubs.

Augmerson

Absolutely not. FA Cup is very special, to me anyway. The upsets....like Newcastle going out to Brighton, that's what I love.

scudzilla

Sure it's gone downhill over the last 10yrs, ever since 4th place was more profitable.

I remember 3rd round draw day was almost as big as the games themselves, now i only seem to bother looking at the draw when i remember, which is usually a few days later.

How can they bring the F.A. Cup back to it's old glories? This is what i'd do.

1. Winners, and winners only, get the 4th Champions league spot.
2. Semi Finals are NOT played at Wembley
3. All games are played at 3pm on the Saturday, apart from 1 Sunday afternoon game

Lumbo

I'd prefer my team to win the FA Cup than come 4th in the league.

The_Kew_Tour

Afraid to say it has yes. Nothing like what I used to feel in 90's about it. Dont get me wrong still rather win FA Cup, but just not same.

Pity.

livinginkorea

Leiva wrote: »

no.

It's a fantastic competition with history and glory and needs to be shown more respect by the "big" clubs.

Ya agree. Think some of the big clubs are in two ways about it. The want to give experience to their younger players but suddenly they are doing well then the regulars come in. Also, they want to give there regulars time to rest too but don't want to annoy their fans.

Francie Barrett

Honestly, it's a waste of time. I would prefer my team (Liverpool) to prioritise the league first, then Europe, and only after that, the FA Cup.

AgileMyth

Lumbo wrote: »

I'd prefer my team to win the FA Cup than come 4th in the league.

I find it strange that anybody wouldn't.

GavRedKing

scudzilla wrote: »

Sure it's gone downhill over the last 10yrs, ever since 4th place was more profitable.

I remember 3rd round draw day was almost as big as the games themselves, now i only seem to bother looking at the draw when i remember, which is usually a few days later.

How can they bring the F.A. Cup back to it's old glories? This is what i'd do.

1. Winners, and winners only, get the 4th Champions league spot.
2. Semi Finals are NOT played at Wembley
3. All games are played at 3pm on the Saturday, apart from 1 Sunday afternoon game

Cant agree more with Number 2.

It takes away from the glory of the final. The neutral ground Semi's are the way to go IMO.

kryogen

Yep, for me it is certainly lost a lot of the magic it had.

CL qualification is the holy grail for the bigger teams these days

redzerdrog

love the cup and the whole day of the cup final.

its sad that teams would prefer to qualify for a competition they havent got a hope in hell of winning rather than win the fa cup

dd972

AgileMyth wrote: »

I find it strange that anybody wouldn't.

Interesting, if I was an Arsenal fan I'd take 4th in the EPL and a FAC humiliation over a sunny day in May parading the FA Cup.

Depends what club's fans you talk to tbh.

PhlegmyMoses

Anybody who says that it hasn't lost its shine is lying. Maybe they still enjoy it as much themselves but as a whole, it would be a lie to say that it had the same prestige as it did 25 years ago.

I enjoy it but I'd much prefer to be watching my team get three points in the bag and our rivals dropping points than watching them go through to the 4th round of the FA cup on a given weekend.

redzerdrog

dd972 wrote: »

Interesting, if I was an Arsenal fan I'd take 4th in the EPL and a FAC humiliation over a sunny day in May parading the FA Cup.

I'd imagine Arsenal fans in particular should want to win the fa cup as it is so long since they last won a trophy. Am sure there are local lads in their early 20s that would love that day out in the sun paradfing a trophy

Iang87

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Honestly, it's a waste of time. I would prefer my team (Liverpool) to prioritise the league first, then Europe, and only after that, the FA Cup.

really? naturally its league first but not at the expense of the cup. I'm also a liverpool fan and come May if we have a crack at 4th or the FA cup i'll take the cup just ask wenger how many fourths you can lift over your head and march around the field with.


I'm not starting any anti united crap but since they didnt take part in 2000 to go on what was effectively a holiday the big clubs seem to find it more and more acceptable to field weakened sides. Also not having wembley for years didnt help and I wont even start on this semi final crap at wembley

kryogen

Effectively a holiday that the FA pressured them to go on to support a championship bid

Richard Hillman

Its the mid to lower ranked team in the PL not giving it a go that peeves me. They are spoofing as a football club if they have little interest in winning something or at least get to the final.

efb

The FA shot the FA Cup dead the day they gave Und a bye to appease FIFA (Nothing to do with Man Yoo)

CL Qualification > FA Cup

PhlegmyMoses

Iang87 wrote: »

really? naturally its league first but not at the expense of the cup. I'm also a liverpool fan and come May if we have a crack at 4th or the FA cup i'll take the cup just ask wenger how many fourths you can lift over your head and march around the field with.


I'm not starting any anti united crap but since they didnt take part in 2000 to go on what was effectively a holiday the big clubs seem to find it more and more acceptable to field weakened sides. Also not having wembley for years didnt help and I wont even start on this semi final crap at wembley

I'd just like to point out that United were pretty much forced to do this by the FA.

But it's far more than that. Money has changed everything. The better you do in the league, the more money you get. may get relegated? **** the cup, we can't sell that trophy to pay our debts if we end up in the Championship. Making a push up the league? **** the cup, if we get 4th we'll be in the CL and we'll have more money to buy players and pay our debt.

The cup isn't dead but it's not what it was.

5starpool

Of course it has, and it is all to do with money. Clubs that have a chance (or are certain of) of getting top 4 have more interest in ensuring that than winning the FA Cup and most of the rest of the PL teams and top championship teams are more interested in staying in or getting to the PL than winning the Cup.

Even from a personal point of view, while I still want Liverpool to win and compete to win the FA Cup, it doesn't have the same meaning to me personally as it did 20+ years ago when it was the highlight of the season nearly, regardless of who was in the final. That is probably equal parts football over saturation and differing interests I guess, but it's still not quite the same.

Last May though on cup final day I wouldn't have believed my own post probably

BhoscaCapall

If the EPL wasn't such a joke league where mediocrity was rewarded with massive sums of money then stuff like domestic cups and the Europa would be much better. Instead you get 7 or 8 teams whose only aim is to ensure there are 3 worse teams than them that season.

Corholio

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Its the mid to lower ranked team in the PL not giving it a go that peeves me. They are spoofing as a football club if they have little interest in winning something or at least get to the final.

Lower ranked teams have more at risk than the big teams IMO. Relegation can sometimes destroy clubs, why would teams who played a load of games over christmas take the FA cup very seriously when they'd have a lot more important games. With more money in the game now, status is much more important and relegation can be much more hurtful.

efb

Football is a business, FA CUP is like Woolworths

Mr.Nice Guy

Debates like this show how warped the mentality is in modern day football. The point of football - and all sports - should be to win. Win things. Win cups. Win medals. Win adulation. Win a place in history and a cherished spot in the hearts of those you represent. It is a ****ed up sport when you have managers - and fans for that matter - patting themselves on the back for finishing FOURTH.

When people talk about 'clubs want to get to fourth place more' what they are really referring to are the men in suits at the club. Why do they want it? For the money it brings. The supporters however, for the most part, want silverware and I'm pretty sure most football players want that too. Imagine when these players are retired, old and grey and reflect on their careers with their grandkids:

Kid: 'How many medals did you win when you played football, granddad?'

Old man: 'Well none, sonny. But my team made it to fourth place in the league twice and one year we got to play in the Champions League.'

Kid: 'Oh. Do you have a medal from the Champions League?'

Old man: 'Well, no. But the club I work for made a good few million pounds that year.'

This is all finance. Balancing books. It saddens me that rather than challenge this warped view of the game, you will in fact see many football fans actually endorsing it.

I'm no cheerleader for Kenny Dalglish but I think the man had a point when he talked up the fact he won a League Cup for his club. He boosted the club's trophy haul. Instead of acknowledging that though you had the media men and their associates dismissing it because they had not come near fourth - which is failure anyway, just a richer form of failure.

Of course the big media moguls are among those at the forefront of financing this warped view of the sport so no wonder they perpetuate these views but it's depressing that so many of the Sky generation actually swallow this hook, line and sinker.

Corholio

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Debates like this show how warped the mentality is in modern day football. The point of football - and all sports - should be to win. Win things. Win cups. Win medals. Win adulation. Win a place in history and a cherished spot in the hearts of those you represent. It is a ****ed up sport when you have managers - and fans for that matter - patting themselves on the back for finishing FOURTH.

When people talk about 'clubs want to get to fourth place more' what they are really referring to are the men in suits at the club. Why do they want it? For the money it brings. The supporters however, for the most part, want silverware and I'm pretty sure most football players want that too. Imagine when these players are retired, old and grey and reflect on their careers with their grandkids:

Kid: 'How many medals did you win when you played football, granddad?'

Old man: 'Well none, sonny. But my team made it to fourth place in the league twice and one year we got to play in the Champions League.'

Kid: 'Oh. Do you have a medal from the Champions League?'

Old man: 'Well, no. But the club I work for made a good few million pounds that year.'

This is all finance. Balancing books. It saddens me that rather than challenge this warped view of the game, you will in fact see many football fans actually endorsing it.

I'm no cheerleader for Kenny Dalglish but I think the man had a point when he talked up the fact he won a League Cup for his club. He boosted the club's trophy haul. Instead of acknowledging that though you had the media men and their associates dismissing it because they had not come near fourth - which is failure anyway, just a richer form of failure.

Of course the big media moguls are among those at the forefront of financing this warped view of the sport so no wonder they perpetuate these views but it's depressing that so many of the Sky generation actually swallow this hook, line and sinker.

I agree with what your saying, but the FA cup is only what the clubs who play in it make it. If bigger teams are playing reserve teams, then it has gone downhill. But yes, I think silverware should be the ultimate aim too, however modern football isn't really like that anymore. It's about status and what money you can get from that status.

scudzilla

I made 3 point to make the cup better earlier, even if they did just 1 (Winners ONLY get CL qualification instead of 4th place premiership) that would put life back into a great cup

And nobody go saying that it'd demean the CL by having cup winners in it, they already did that when they let 4th place go in

kryogen

Yep, if the cup was allotted a CL place it would improve it significantly

Diabhal Beag

We need Paul Daniels to bring back the magic (providing he gets out of his current sticky situation).

Winston Payne

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Debates like this show how warped the mentality is in modern day football. The point of football - and all sports - should be to win. Win things. Win cups. Win medals. Win adulation. Win a place in history and a cherished spot in the hearts of those you represent. It is a ****ed up sport when you have managers - and fans for that matter - patting themselves on the back for finishing FOURTH.

When people talk about 'clubs want to get to fourth place more' what they are really referring to are the men in suits at the club. Why do they want it? For the money it brings. The supporters however, for the most part, want silverware and I'm pretty sure most football players want that too. Imagine when these players are retired, old and grey and reflect on their careers with their grandkids:

Kid: 'How many medals did you win when you played football, granddad?'

Old man: 'Well none, sonny. But my team made it to fourth place in the league twice and one year we got to play in the Champions League.'

Kid: 'Oh. Do you have a medal from the Champions League?'

Old man: 'Well, no. But the club I work for made a good few million pounds that year.'

This is all finance. Balancing books. It saddens me that rather than challenge this warped view of the game, you will in fact see many football fans actually endorsing it.

I'm no cheerleader for Kenny Dalglish but I think the man had a point when he talked up the fact he won a League Cup for his club. He boosted the club's trophy haul. Instead of acknowledging that though you had the media men and their associates dismissing it because they had not come near fourth - which is failure anyway, just a richer form of failure.

Of course the big media moguls are among those at the forefront of financing this warped view of the sport so no wonder they perpetuate these views but it's depressing that so many of the Sky generation actually swallow this hook, line and sinker.

We don't have much choice. The clubs don't value it, so it's standing is reduced. I'd love the FA Cup to be what it was again and I've just turned 25. It was still something when I was younger. But those days are gone and they're not coming back unless the game undergoes a financial crash. Not sure I'm wishing for that to happen anytime soon. It's sad, but it's just the way things are, and pretty inevitable.

Will I Amnt

Used to love the FA Cup, not so much anymore. It's nice to win it all the same, especially as part of a double or treble but I'm never too fussed about being knocked out of it.

cson

Giving the winners of the Cup a CL place is a nonsense in my eyes. You can get lucky in the Cup, you don't get lucky in a 38 game league season, you finish where you deserve to finish there.

As for smaller EPL clubs giving it a crack; look at Portsmouth now. The supporters are lucky to have a club, for one day in the sun? I wonder do they think it was worth it. And that's a genuine question.

To Alcohol

It's ran it's course at this stage. It's a real sign of how money has ruined the professional game. 25 years ago a run in the cup was huge because of the glory and exposure it brought to your club. Now it's a hindrance to the bigger clubs making as much money as possible. There's also also less and less shocks as the money has created too big a gulf between the top teams and the smaller teams.

prettyboy81

Tough one this but while the competition still capture's the magic in the latter stages. The earlier rounds don't have any spark except for the David v Goliath match ups like Luton beaten Wolves, Mansfield v Liverpool.

Don't think there is any real solution to alter this feeling towards the competition.

kryogen

cson wrote: »

Giving the winners of the Cup a CL place is a nonsense in my eyes. You can get lucky in the Cup, you don't get lucky in a 38 game league season, you finish where you deserve to finish there.

As for smaller EPL clubs giving it a crack; look at Portsmouth now. The supporters are lucky to have a club, for one day in the sun? I wonder do they think it was worth it. And that's a genuine question.

Its no more nonsense then having a team that finishes 4th in its domestic league competing in a competition called the Champions League tbh

cson

kryogen wrote: »

Its no more nonsense then having a team that finishes 4th in its domestic league competing in a competition called the Champions League tbh

Well you can't argue that its not a better competition for it. Best teams in Europe compete in it as a result. Name is a misnomer, the status of it as the premier club cup competition in the world is not.

AdamD

Well you can tell who the Liverpool and Arsenal fans are.

5starpool

cambo2008 wrote: »

Used to love the FA Cup, not so much anymore. It's nice to win it all the same, especially as part of a double or treble but I'm never too fussed about being knocked out of it.

AdamD wrote: »

Well you can tell who the Liverpool and Arsenal fans are.

And you can tell who the spoilt-by-success utd fans are too.

efb

kryogen wrote: »

Its no more nonsense then having a team that finishes 4th in its domestic league competing in a competition called the Champions League tbh

but not 2nd

Will I Amnt

5starpool wrote: »

And you can tell who the spoilt-by-success utd fans are too.

Awwwhh. Jealous??

monkeysnapper

I reakon they should have a reward for what ever team win the fa cup. They can have what ever player they want from any team in pl , so for example if Cardiff city win, they can take Rvp from united . Briiiiiiliant idea ,

monkeysnapper

monkeysnapper wrote: »

I reakon they should have a reward for what ever team win the fa cup. They can have what ever player they want from any team in pl , so for example if Cardiff city win, they can take Rvp from united . Briiiiiiliant idea ,

Good idea. Sounds like a runner.

5starpool

cambo2008 wrote: »

Awwwhh. Jealous??

Regardless of how successful or otherwise Liverpool are I will always consider them more than 'nice to win', but obviously the cups are the height of what can be achieved at the moment and in the foreseeable.

callaway92

monkeysnapper wrote: »

I reakon they should have a reward for what ever team win the fa cup. They can have what ever player they want from any team in pl , so for example if Cardiff city win, they can take Rvp from united . Briiiiiiliant idea ,

Will I Amnt

5starpool wrote: »

Regardless of how successful or otherwise Liverpool are I will always consider them more than 'nice to win', but obviously the cups are the height of what can be achieved at the moment and in the foreseeable.

Well that's the difference in where both clubs are. If Liverpool had the success of United over the last 20 years you might feel differently, in fact I'm sure you would. It's all about priorities. Ours is the league and do as well as possible in the Champions League.
I want United to win everything they are involved in but some matter far more than others to me.

Rekop dog

It has lost a lot of its magic and I think people would be lying to themselves if they didn't agree, an unfortunate victim of the modern state of football. As soon as teams started prioritizing other (more financially lucrative) competitions it was the beginning of the end of it being a really credible competition, one that used to be world famous for its competitiveness and prestige. There's a rather cold feeling watching it now, particularly in the early round as OP mentioned, media still try to build it up as something special but it seems false and they're just going through the motions rather than being genuinely excited about it.

Iang87

I cant get over the attitude of some fans. Why do you follow your team if you dont want your team to win trophies. Christ Sky really has done serious damage to football in the past 10 years, pity really.

As for the FA forcing united to pull out Fergie is well enough able to stand up for everything else but isn't with that, come off it lads ye cant have it every way.

thebaz

as someone who grew up loving the FA Cup , it has gone downhill fast since about '97 - the advances of the Premier league and Champions league , have neutered its glamour - regularly don't even watch cup final - then again lately struggle to even watch EPL or champions league football, prefer atmosphere of local LOI or even the Championship in England - can't relate to players earning over 20 K a week

Corholio

Iang87 wrote: »

I cant get over the attitude of some fans. Why do you follow your team if you dont want your team to win trophies. Christ Sky really has done serious damage to football in the past 10 years, pity really.

As for the FA forcing united to pull out Fergie is well enough able to stand up for everything else but isn't with that, come off it lads ye cant have it every way.

I'm pretty sure you won't find anyone saying they don't want their team to win it, so yeah nice exaggeration. It's priorities, from a team qualifying for the Champions league to an Airtricity team blooding younger players in an EA sports cup match. The FA cup has fallen down the priorities for teams these days, it's not the attitude of fans. it's just the way it is.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Why would any club take an FA Cup over a top 4 finish?? Madness. A top 4 finish gives you the ability to test yourself on the world's premier soccer stage. It provides a huge income. It allows the club to attract better players and it also gives your club more stature outside of the country.

Giving a CL place to the winners would be wrong imo, it wouldn't do anything to to change the mindset of MCFC, MUFC and CFC towards whilst it would allow clubs a shot at Europe who perhaps don't deserve it.

The only way to improve the competition imo, and I don't like saying this, would be to give the rights to Sky. As someone pointed out in the OT thread recently, look at what they have done for darts, I can only only imagine what they would do go the FA Cup. Their advertising is simply second to none in the television industry.