Moving doggie from inside to outside

tatabubbly

Hey everyone!

I have a lovely scoundral of a jack russell cross, her name is Rusty and she's 2!

Me and my OH are moving house in two weeks time. Currently our dog is inside and generally sleeps in her crate in our room (cos its our oh's mums house).
Our new house has a fabulous well enclosed 6ft fence around the garden outside. He's said that the dog is fine but it can't be an inside dog, has to be outside..
So the outside has a nice shed in it that we were going to let the dog stay in.

First of all, is there anything we can do to make this transition easier for our dog?

Second, what is the best bedding to use in this situation? I was thinking of putting her crate in there for her, good idea or not?

I'd love someones opinion on this cos we want to make the move as stress free for her as we can! We love her to bits but we cant find any other pet friendly places to the same standard.

Sigma Force

It's a shame more landlords aren't dog friendly, and that a few bad dog owners give the rest a bad name when it comes to renting. Using the crate is a good idea, I know JRTs are tough little dogs but they have short hair so might feel the cold so something like Vet bed would really help, you can get snuggle safe heat pads from zooplus which are also nice to have.
The crate will build up condensation on the bottom very quickly so you might have to change the bedding in it daily but to make the dog more settled using the crate to start with might help.
Eventually you could get a little kennel (with no door) for the dog places within the shed for extra comfort so the dog has a little den that won't build up with condensation..wood is still better than the plastic igloo or other types of kennels (have tried them all and wood wins out every time unless a dog is a major chewer).

Does the landlord not want the dog in the house at all even during the day? If so you might have issues as time goes on with the dog being lonley, barking and stressed. If the landlord says it's ok to have the dog inside during the day then he's going to be none the wiser at night. Or maybe consider having it in the contract that you will cover any costs if the dog does any damage that way the dog can live indoors.

With so many houses to rent it's such a shame more landlords aren't flexible. To be honest the dog might be lonley and bark and then have neighbours complaining if the dog isn't allowed in the house during the day or night.

tatabubbly

She usually is outside during the day with her toys so she is used to being outside on her own.. I was going to go and call into the neighbours on either side and just let them know that we moved our dog and it could take her a while to settle for us.

Landlord doesn't want her anywhere in the house at all. In fact he wouldn't negotiate on the rental price because of the dog. However, the house is perfect for me and my OH in every other way and letting it go wasnt an option.

She's well walked and we've planned to be outside all spring and summer with her and in the autumn and winter we plan to sneak her into the utility room at that time if we can.

TooManyDogs

I would suggest putting a kennel inside the kennel or else well covering the crate because otherwise it's a lot of space for the dog to try and heat with body heat alone. Like Sigma Force said condensation could be a problem for the crate but you could pop it up on a pallet so there's a little air current under it. I know my jackers would freeze if I put them in a shed without either a small space to snuggle up in or a heater. Although they are tough little dogs they would have slept in the stables and burrowed under the hay so their coats aren't great for very long periods in the cold

carav10

Not normal for me to say this :-) but while I understand your predicament, I wouldn't be taking a house where you have a dog, and a landlord that doesn't want a dog full stop next to or near the house. It spells trouble from the start. As well as the fact, if the dog has been used to being inside all of its life so far at nights, it's not fair to suddenly move it to being a completely outside dog especially at this time of year. It hasn't had the chance to get used to the outdoor temperatures naturally and it's the wrong time of year IMO to be trying to get it used to living outside 24hrs. Dogs who live outside usually get used to it with the changing seasons so gradually adjust as the months go on although as you say she is outside during the day so this does help with the move.

Please don't read me wrong, I've no problem with dogs living outside, but not being suddenly moved outside at night at this time of year. And you'll always be stressed thinking the landlord is watching you like hawks to be sure the dog isn't inside! But only you can make the decision. The advise above is all good to make the transition as easy as possible but if I were you, I'd be starting now while you're still in the oh's mother's house and start moving her outside so she's not suddenly finding herself outside at the new house which will be unfamiliar to her.

Best of luck with the move. As someone above says, it's a shame landlord's are so pet unfriendly as there's nothing wrong with allowing her in at least the kitchen overnight!

tatabubbly

carav10 wrote: »

Not normal for me to say this :-) but while I understand your predicament, I wouldn't be taking a house where you have a dog, and a landlord that doesn't want a dog full stop next to or near the house. It spells trouble from the start. As well as the fact, if the dog has been used to being inside all of its life so far at nights, it's not fair to suddenly move it to being a completely outside dog especially at this time of year. It hasn't had the chance to get used to the outdoor temperatures naturally and it's the wrong time of year IMO to be trying to get it used to living outside 24hrs. Dogs who live outside usually get used to it with the changing seasons so gradually adjust as the months go on although as you say she is outside during the day so this does help with the move.

Please don't read me wrong, I've no problem with dogs living outside, but not being suddenly moved outside at night at this time of year. And you'll always be stressed thinking the landlord is watching you like hawks to be sure the dog isn't inside! But only you can make the decision. The advise above is all good to make the transition as easy as possible but if I were you, I'd be starting now while you're still in the oh's mother's house and start moving her outside so she's not suddenly finding herself outside at the new house which will be unfamiliar to her.

Best of luck with the move. As someone above says, it's a shame landlord's are so pet unfriendly as there's nothing wrong with allowing her in at least the kitchen overnight!

I'd love to find a pet friendly house but this is literally the only niggly thing that bugs us about the house. We don't have many options in the place we live to be really picky when it comes to choosing a house..There is a utility room that we are thinking of keeping her in, with her bed in the shed outside for when she's out during the day. I'm thinking of getting vet bedding for her outside and the heat pads suggested.

I hear what your saying about moving her outside. Her comfort is paramount to me but we don't really have much wiggle room. I think seeing as we are paying for her to be with us, we can keep her in the utility room without much hassle...

ShaShaBear

What I would be wary of is that when/if the landlord inspects the property, any niggly thing will likely be blamed on the dog, whether you have her inside or not. Scratches in the floor from you moving the furniture, scratches on the back door from her looking to get in when it starts to rain, a funny odor in the house which is not dog-related...

A landlord that hates dogs so much that he refuses to have it in the house but will let it be outside is one you will struggle to get a deposit back from. Assuming he doesn't give you the boot mid-tenancy and retain your deposit because of some damage the dog "did".

Stheno

ShaShaBear wrote: »

What I would be wary of is that when/if the landlord inspects the property, any niggly thing will likely be blamed on the dog, whether you have her inside or not. Scratches in the floor from you moving the furniture, scratches on the back door from her looking to get in when it starts to rain, a funny odor in the house which is not dog-related...

A landlord that hates dogs so much that he refuses to have it in the house but will let it be outside is one you will struggle to get a deposit back from. Assuming he doesn't give you the boot mid-tenancy and retain your deposit because of some damage the dog "did".

I agree I just can't see this ending well to be honest.

Also I think a dog who is used to sleeping in the same room as it's owners will have a hard time adapting to being outside pretty much all of the time

Whispered

That's not a small "niggly" thing at all. It would be a deal breaker for a lot of dog owners.

We were renting with 2 cats years ago. The landlord was apparently fine with it. Until she decided that she changed her mind and didn't want them anymore. No reason given, no hassle had been caused. We were good quiet tenants, clean, always paid on time. One day she sent a letter saying that the cats had to be left outside all the time. Considering they were indoor all the time with their litter tray on the balcony, this was not an option and we almost ended up homeless because of it! If a landlord is not 100% on board you run the risk of having to get rid of the dog or having to find a new home on the whim of your LL. It happened to us.

I don't think the dog will settle easily and it's the worst possible time of year to start her sleeping outside. She's likely to bark and upset your new neighbours and by extension your landlord, who will then probably think himself justified in not wanting the dog in the house in the first place. It will be a tricky one.

We don't know your circumstances at all and maybe you're in a position where you absolutely have to move as soon as possible. In that case I can imagine how stressed you must be thinking of having to put your dog out like that. If there is any way you can hold off until something comes up which is suitable for your lifestyle as a whole I'd bet you'd all be a whole lot better off in the long run.

andreac

I couldnt imagine not having my dog in the house all the time with me. In all fairness, theres only so much time you can spend outside yourself, so realisticly, you arent going to be outside much and the dog will be outside a lot on its own. I think its very unfair to do this to the dog when its used to sleeping in your room. Plus, this is a terrible time of year to ask a dog to change to outside living when its not used to it. The temps have dropped dramtically this week and are set to continue. February and March are usually the coldest months as well.

westies4ever

just my tuppence; not being allowed the dogs inside would be a total deal breaker for me as well, no matter how perfect the house was otherwise.

I just wouldnt be happy and Id be stressing about them barking outside and being cold and lonely. Id be looking elsewhere for sure.

Id rather a less than perfect house and having my dogs on the sofa with me like they're used to.

macmurchu

I don't think it'll be too much of an issue, dogs are meant to live outside. A kennel for shelter or a little spot in the shed with a lined basket will do the trick.

tatabubbly

Rusty slept downstairs last night so beginning to get her into a routine that way.

I understand the coldest months of the year are here and would do whatever it takes to ensure that she is kept warn and happy outside.

On the house front, I'm going to chat to the letting agency again today. The previous tenents had a dog so I'm going to do a bit of investigation. At the moment, where we live, its not a matter of getting a new house. This house was literally the only one fit for us humans to living in and will let us have the dog there at all.


I'm not sure how much damage you guys think the dog would do inside, we did live in a rental property with her before and we never had a problem?

Rusty spends a lot of her day at the moment outside and is quite content.. She usually comes in during the evening time and goes for her walk. We have lots of toys/kongs for her when she's outside.

DBB

macmurchu wrote: »

dogs are meant to live outside.

Upon what do you base this statement? I'm not looking for a personal opinion here, but looking for some good evidence or research to support this statement, please.

maggiepip

If you had kids and the landlord wouldnt accept them in the property would you still take this "ideal" house? A dog should be treated like a family member and not an object who comes second to a shiney new house.

The solution to your problem is to hold off and you will find another house who accepts dogs OP.

westies4ever

macmurchu wrote: »

I don't think it'll be too much of an issue, dogs are meant to live outside. A kennel for shelter or a little spot in the shed with a lined basket will do the trick.

and this is your one and only contribution to the animal & pet forum? :rolleyes:

carav10

tatabubbly wrote: »

I'm not sure how much damage you guys think the dog would do inside, we did live in a rental property with her before and we never had a problem?

Apart from early puppy potential damage, no dog who's well trained and well exercised & has plenty chew toys should cause any damage inside the house.

My first pup, I lost a few socks, strap of a laptop bag, a bit of the kitchen corner stripped off (fairy liquid rubbed on once solved that one) but that was pretty good overall.
The second, I've lost the edge of one curtain (thought she was chewing her toy...) but it can't be seen so doesn't matter too much & could be hemmed in again, but otherwise nothing else.

When I hear of people whose dogs are chewing furniture etc, then that's mismanagement and poor containment.

The only thing I find inside the house is make sure you've a good hoover!

tatabubbly

maggiepip wrote: »

If you had kids and the landlord wouldnt accept them in the property would you still take this "ideal" house? A dog should be treated like a family member and not an object who comes second to a shiney new house.

The solution to your problem is to hold off and you will find another house who accepts dogs OP.

Thats a bit harsh. Listen, I love my dog to pieces but, god, I'll get some hammering for saying this on here, but my dog isn't my child, its my dog.

My mum has always had her dogs outside and we've never had any problems. Rusty has been out in the kennel outside with my mums other doggies and has always had a whale of a time as far as I know!

I'm only asking advice so I can build her the best kennel that I can for our situation. In terms of putting her outside now, me and my OH have decided on keeping her in the utility room at night until the weather perks up again. It'll give her a good chance to climatise to the weather that way.

My dog has always been happy, playing outside with her toys and keeping herself occupied so in terms of my doggie being "lonely, cold and barking", I wouldn't let this happen, I love her to bits.

maggiepip

The indoor/outdoor dog debate I feel sometimes gets taken too literally. Its not so much the fact that the dog is outdoors (provided it has warm shelter that is) - its the isolation and exclusion and loneliness a dog suffers from spending 24/7 outside. It is an unnatural way for a social/pack animal to live - and an unnatural existence for a dog is a lonely boring life. I dont agree with any dog being outside 24/7, but if they must they should at least have another dog for company.

You cannot possibly spend very much time with a dog outdoors - ok you will spend some time, but the majority of the time you will be indoors cooking, cleaning, on the phone watching tv , reading, studying etc. etc etc........your dog will be excluded from family life - and Im sorry but as much as you dont want to believe it your dog will be lonely.

I dont consider my other post was harsh at all. You want this accommodation and your dog therefore must live outside. I have 3 dogs and they are full and complete members of our family and treated as such. If we had to move to a rented house and our only option was to get a house which wasnt top of the list but accepted dogs we wouldnt even have to think about it we would be moving into the house which wasnt quite as nice as the other with all our dogs. We would never even consider a house where the landlord said the dogs must live outside. Daft have many pet friendly properties on their books. While it can be a more limited there is a fair amount of decent rented houses out there that will accept dogs, it just might take a little more time to find.

tatabubbly

maggiepip wrote: »

Its not so much the fact that the dog is outdoors (provided it has warm shelter that is) - its the isolation and exclusion and loneliness a dog suffers from spending 24/7 outside.

It wouldn't be our intention to leave her alone outside 24/7

maggiepip wrote: »

I dont agree with any dog being outside 24/7, but if they must they should at least have another dog for company.

At least here we can agree, my mum regularly takes my doggie during the day with her other dogs, so in terms of socialisation that shouldn't be a problem. We can even have my mums min jack x to come and keep her company, which will be great fun for my misses!

maggiepip wrote: »

I dont consider my other post was harsh at all. You want this accommodation and your dog therefore must live outside. I have 3 dogs and they are full and complete members of our family and treated as such. If we had to move to a rented house and our only option was to get a house which wasnt top of the list but accepted dogs we wouldnt even have to think about it we would be moving into the house which wasnt quite as nice as the other with all our dogs. We would never even consider a house where the landlord said the dogs must live outside. Daft have many pet friendly properties on their books. While it can be a more limited there is a fair amount of decent rented houses out there that will accept dogs, it just might take a little more time to find.

Your very lucky that you don't have to consider this but I do.
I've decided on this house due to it's location, letting agent, standard etc and I'm asking for advice on how to best move my dog, causing her less stress. Sorry it's not what you want to hear, I love my dog, but I've also to consider my own welfare.

Knine

Its not an ideal house if they won't let your dog inside!

I rent and my landlord has no problem with the dogs being indoors so it is possible to find a landlord that allows indoor pets.

Have you tbought about offering a pet deposit in case of any pet related damage indoors?

macmurchu

westies4ever wrote: »

and this is your one and only contribution to the animal & pet forum? :rolleyes:

Yes, but also not far off my only post ever. Look, all I'm saying is that dogs lasted for how many hundreds of thousands of years before we brought them inside and they were grand. Don't get me wrong, I'm not an ignoramus. I have grown up with dogs my whole life, currently have 2 springer spaniels that I couldn't get to sit still inside if I tried but any day I had home from school sick they were inside with me. I'm simply saying that I wouldn't let where the dog sleeps determine what house I live in, they are very adaptable animals.

maggiepip

Yes macmurchu, then humans came along and domesticated them and by domestication basically changed their brain/dna to make them crave human company and to want co exist alongside humans in the way they do. Unfortunately a lot of people choose to ignore a domestic dogs need for human companionship and by banishing it outside so deprives a pack/social animal of a life it longs for. Domestication and breeding also changed their coats - so there are breeds of dogs which actually cant physically handle living outdoors.

macmurchu

DBB wrote: »

Upon what do you base this statement? I'm not looking for a personal opinion here, but looking for some good evidence or research to support this statement, please.

Just the fact that dogs were out and about around the same time as we began to exist. It wasn't like they became domesticated once we humans figured out we could kick them out of their centrally heated houses and they only got to stay as part of a deal that meant they wouldn't attack us.

I'm having a laugh people, chill out

maggiepip

macmurchu wrote: »

Just the fact that dogs were out and about around the same time as we began to exist. It wasn't like they became domesticated once we humans figured out we could kick them out of their centrally heated houses and they only got to stay as part of a deal that meant they wouldn't attack us.

I'm having a laugh people, chill out

westies4ever

macmurchu wrote: »

I'm having a laugh people, chill out

After Hours is this way >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

ISDW

macmurchu wrote: »

Just the fact that dogs were out and about around the same time as we began to exist. It wasn't like they became domesticated once we humans figured out we could kick them out of their centrally heated houses and they only got to stay as part of a deal that meant they wouldn't attack us.

I'm having a laugh people, chill out

No evidence to back up your statement then, and what you've just posted doesn't make sense. Maybe do some research into how humans and canines came to co-exist the way we do, might surprise you.

Have you ever heard the expression - 2/3/4 dog night?

tatabubbly

Okay well, yeah... This has been helpful to solve my problem.

Well we're going to see how things pan out with the house but we've decided after talking to a dog behaviour trainer that our dog will be fine outside with adequate heating and bedding. She will also have a coat etc for days when its raining.

DBB

tatabubbly wrote: »

Well we're going to see how things pan out with the house but we've decided after talking to a dog behaviour trainer that our dog will be fine outside with adequate heating and bedding. She will also have a coat etc for days when its raining.

Does this "behaviour trainer" say it's okay to keep your dog outside on a permanent basis? What qualifications does this "behaviour trainer" have? Because I can tell you now, if they told you that, they have no qualifications, and therefore, their advice should be taken with a pinch of salt.

Macmurchu, pity you couldn't back up your claim, but then again, I knew you couldn't. Your reply to me makes no sense whatsoever.
It has been stated above, and this is the absolute clincher, the dog being warm enough is one thing. Social isolation is quite another, and is conveniently overlooked by anyone who tries to justify keeping their dog outside. Ah sure, won't a warm kennel and a Kong Toy do him? No. No it won't.

Living inside is not a new thing for dogs: a friend of mine has an ancient manuscript about sighthounds, in which the author states that dogs are best kept inside, indeed goes as far to say they should share their master's bed.. this manuscript is 4000+ years old! For the record, the same manuscript describes using food rewards to train dogs new skills!

Over the years, working dogs might not have lived in the house, but they did spend almost all of their day herding, hunting, rooting etc etc. In other words, they were always doing what they were bred to do, and invariably spending huge amounts of time with their human in the process. You can't argue too much with this scenario, as long as the dog has a comfortable, warm place to rest. And these dogs always needed their rest at the end of a long, fulfilling day.

But this has not translated into modern urban life: we expect our dogs to live outside still, but alone for hours on end, in a back garden, with nothing much to do.

The number of lonely, bored, miserable dogs living in Ireland as a result is tragic, and a national disgrace. And it is a national disgrace: dog owners in the UK, Norway, Sweden etc are appalled at how we Irish think it's acceptable to keep our dogs outside like this. To keep a social animal socially isolated for more than a few hours at a time on a regular basis is unkind, it affects the animal's welfare, and can often result in behavioural problems as a result.

ShaShaBear

I just hope for your sake OP that the landlord doesn't notice huge stratches in the utility room door when she decides she's terrified in this new surrounding and wants comfort. I also hope he doesn't realise this means you went against your terms of lease and give you an eviction notice if you don't get rid of the dog. And I seriously, seriously hope you don't get rid of the dog.

tatabubbly

DBB wrote: »

Does this "behaviour trainer" say it's okay to keep your dog outside on a permanent basis? What qualifications does this "behaviour trainer" have? Because I can tell you now, if they told you that, they have no qualifications, and therefore, their advice should be taken with a pinch of salt.

*Sigh* I don't even know how to reply to that. OF COURSE I asked the trainer what sort of stimulation the dog will need outside, how to best socialise her and how to prevent the dog from becoming isolated. I've used this trainer before, she's absolutely brilliant and has been around for a long time. She has given me specific advice which I will take and apply to my situation.

I'm a bit disheartened by this thread. I feel like a monster for even suggesting it on this.

I've decided to keep this open for anyone else who wants to look into this topic but I won't be posting here again.

Thanks for everyones help.