Garda bitten by HIV man.....Assault causing harm....Attempted murder more like

Scanlas The 2nd

Celticfire wrote: »

Do bleeding gums count?
I would doubt that a drug addict would be over concerned with oral hygiene.

If bleeding gums contain blood then yes it counts.

Odysseus

imom922 wrote: »

A Firefighter i know was bitten on the arm while on Ambulance duty by a scumbag who was Hep/Hiv positive. The lad couldnt kiss his wife or kids untill he got the all clear, it went to court the scumbag was fined and warned about future behaviour. Well wrong.

He would be able to kiss his kids, whoever told him that should not be working with people. As to the relationship side of things, do you not think people who are HIV+ do not have sex? All he need to do was be careful and not take risks.

My name is URL

My name is URL wrote: »

A female Garda was stabbed with a syringe in a Drogheda pub a few weeks ago and has to wait 6 months for an AIDS test result. The person responsible is only going to be charged with assault too... mind boggling.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/woman-garda-stabbed-with-cattle-needle-in-bar-3339937.html

What should they be charged with?

Celticfire

Odysseus wrote: »

He would be able to kiss his kids, whoever told him that should not be working with people. As to the relationship side of things, do you not think people who are HIV+ do not have sex? All he need to do was be careful and not take risks.

Perhaps he had a psychological barrier to kissing his kids and having sex with his wife. As a Paramedic he'd be aware of how HIV is transmitted but the last thing on his mind that shift going to work was that he was going to be possibly infected with HIV on purpose by someone .

I'm sure HIV+ people have sex after they have come to terms with the infection but I's also be sure that it would take a good while to feel comfortable having sex with someone you love as there's always going to be a risk involved. Condoms do break.

If something like that happened to me I'm sure I'd wait 6 months and avoid any risks no matter how small to my loved ones.

mattjack

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

If bleeding gums contain blood then yes it counts.

I think some of the enzymes in saliva may restrict or inhibit HIV reducing the risk from bleeding gums.
Even if you think about how much blood are you going to lose through bleeding gums.

demanufactured

Ads by Google wrote: »

That's horrible.. Two lads were caught in Hanoi last year for putting hiv infected syringes in random seats with a note saying "welcome to the club".

Anyone who tries to spread it like this lad biting the guard should be murdered

FYP

Ken.

Any bastard with hiv bit me would never bother anyone again. I'd remove the bastards teeth with my boot.

Odysseus

Celticfire wrote: »

Perhaps he had a psychological barrier to kissing his kids and having sex with his wife. As a Paramedic he'd be aware of how HIV is transmitted but the last thing on his mind that shift going to work was that he was going to be possibly infected with HIV on purpose by someone .

I'm sure HIV+ people have sex after they have come to terms with the infection but I's also be sure that it would take a good while to feel comfortable having sex with someone you love as there's always going to be a risk involved. Condoms do break.

If something like that happened to me I'm sure I'd wait 6 months and avoid any risks no matter how small to my loved ones.

If it was psychological, in my opinion I would see that as an issue to be explored if one of my clients who was either awaiting test results or was HIV+.


Now everyone is different and believe me, I have had to wait those six months due to a neddle stick injury; but I was able to continue my relationship in a physical sense; and that is in now way taking anything away from the trauma involved.

Whilst I waiting on my results it was an insight into how life could be for me if the result came back positive.

This is why people need to engage in therapy while awaiting results, they can address those psych issues that will arise.

Mr. Loverman

bullvine wrote: »

Honestly, its time to start outsourcing this scum to the Far East

<

---

Beijing

No thanks.

My name is URL

Deleted User wrote: »

What should they be charged with?

Assault causing serious harm would sound about right.

That can carry a life sentence and would act as a greater deterrent to such carry on than a fine or a few months in jail would.

The guy intentionally carried a syringe into a crowded pub and stuck into a random person.

Grayson

imom922 wrote: »

A Firefighter i know was bitten on the arm while on Ambulance duty by a scumbag who was Hep/Hiv positive. The lad couldnt kiss his wife or kids untill he got the all clear, it went to court the scumbag was fined and warned about future behaviour. Well wrong.

The chances of a man getting HIV by having unprotected sex with someone is about 1 in 2000. It's something like 1 in 1000 for a woman.

Chances of getting HIV from a bite is extremely remote.

Chances of getting HIV from a kiss is so minimal I could set up a kissing both and operate daily for a year and never get it. Both people would have to have bleeding gums and there would have to transmission of fluid. So, if two people with chronic gum disease French each other, there's a very, very, very small chance of transmission.

Either the guy or his doctor are both idiots. Or as Odyessus says, the guy has some kind of psychological issues.

But stories like this only help to increase the myths surrounding HIV.

HIV is so incredibly hard to get, even with a risky lifestyle (that doesn't mean precautions shouldn't be taken when engaging in risky behaviour).

And in the first world, it's even harder to transmit. part of the medication that people who are HIV take prevents transmission. So there's a minimal chance even with unprotected sex that it could be transmitted. It's gotten to the stage where some doctors are advising their patients that they can start having unprotected sex with their partners in an effort to conceive since the disease is so unlikely to be transmitted.

And even if someone happens to contract the disease, it's far from a death sentence. If you were diagnosed tomorrow, you would still lead a long healthy life.

I'm not saying there aren't serious consequences that can affect your lifestyle. Just that it's not the horrific plague we al think it is. people in their 30's grew up with so much aids education (and it was more harmful then) that it's a boogeyman for us.

Grayson

My name is URL wrote: »

Assault causing serious harm would sound about right.

That can carry a life sentence and would act as a greater deterrent to such carry on than a fine or a few months in jail would.

The guy intentionally carried a syringe into a crowded pub and stuck into a random person.

That's messed up.

saiint

Grayson wrote: »

The chances of a man getting HIV by having unprotected sex with someone is about 1 in 2000. It's something like 1 in 1000 for a woman.

Chances of getting HIV from a bite is extremely remote.

Chances of getting HIV from a kiss is so minimal I could set up a kissing both and operate daily for a year and never get it. Both people would have to have bleeding gums and there would have to transmission of fluid. So, if two people with chronic gum disease French each other, there's a very, very, very small chance of transmission.

Either the guy or his doctor are both idiots. Or as Odyessus says, the guy has some kind of psychological issues.

But stories like this only help to increase the myths surrounding HIV.

HIV is so incredibly hard to get, even with a risky lifestyle (that doesn't mean precautions shouldn't be taken when engaging in risky behaviour).

And in the first world, it's even harder to transmit. part of the medication that people who are HIV take prevents transmission. So there's a minimal chance even with unprotected sex that it could be transmitted. It's gotten to the stage where some doctors are advising their patients that they can start having unprotected sex with their partners in an effort to conceive since the disease is so unlikely to be transmitted.

And even if someone happens to contract the disease, it's far from a death sentence. If you were diagnosed tomorrow, you would still lead a long healthy life.

I'm not saying there aren't serious consequences that can affect your lifestyle. Just that it's not the horrific plague we al think it is. people in their 30's grew up with so much aids education (and it was more harmful then) that it's a boogeyman for us.

thats true
and eventually we will become immune to the HIV disease
not our generation not the next generation but in a few hundred generations from now, the body will eventually reject the disease , like evolution basicly , we will evolve to fight the disease , but of course by that time we will all be long dead an their will be another disease were fighting against

mickydoomsux

Any attempt on the life of any emergency personnel should carry the death penalty.

Cut the liberal bull**** and clean the scum off the streets. What good will this 'person' that bit the guard every do for society? We'll pay for him through taxes until his miserable existence ceases. Why not speed that up a bit.

bleg

Someone I know got held up in a pharmacy and got pricked with a needle. A lot lot worse. Again 6 months wait on antiretrovirals to see whether she had increased titres, thankfully she didn't. Quite a lot of armed robberies in pharmacies these days.

Grayson

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Any attempt on the life of any emergency personnel should carry the death penalty.

Cut the liberal bull**** and clean the scum off the streets. What good will this 'person' that bit the guard every do for society? We'll pay for him through taxes until his miserable existence ceases. Why not speed that up a bit.

I hate to tell you this, but there are loads of countries with the death penalty. They don't have reduced incidences of crime. The death penalty is not a deterrent. And you might say that it reduces repeat offending, but even if it did, it doesn't reduce the overall amount of crime. Plus when you add in the cost of housing someone on death row along with the legal costs of all the appeals, it actually costs the state more than life imprisonment.

The only thing the death penalty does is make people like you feel better. It doesn't actually make the world any better.

Now, if you have a constructive suggestion, something that would actually help people and prevent crime, I'm all for hearing it.

For what it matters, I'm all in favour of attacks against first responders being classified differently. First responders should know we have their backs. But saying we should kill anyone who attacks them at all, that's just stupid.

keith16

libnation wrote: »

Calm down people. First of all that's a bit unfair of the article to say the Garda was embarrassed to go to the clinic. That's some awful attitude of the article's author to have towards a place that aims to help people!?

Second of all Dublin is not the dodgiest place in the world

Third of all the broken man in this story (the criminal) is already a liability. He hardly sounds like a stand up guy so he's not likely going to be thinking 'oh when I assault this Garda I better refrain from biting!'

Fourth of all HIV is not a death sentence. Granted it would be costly to the Garda and make his life very difficult (made even more difficult by people's attitudes in this thread).

Yes, let's calm down shall we. But lets not belittle the incident either.

Bit of a leap for you to say he was embarrassed to go the clinic, read it again.

Also, if he did contract HIV, what kind of reaction do you think you get from him if you said, "ah don't worry garda, it's not an immediate death sentence per se, your life will just be very difficult from now on, chin up eh! And don't you worry, we'll make that assault charge stick!"

Do you honestly think that because the cop wasn't killed that assault is the appropriate charge here? That scumbag knew full well what he was doing.

Grayson

keith16 wrote: »

Yes, let's calm down shall we. But lets not belittle the incident either.

Bit of a leap for you to say he was embarrassed to go the clinic, read it again.

Also, if he did contract HIV, what kind of reaction do you think you get from him if you said, "ah don't worry garda, it's not an immediate death sentence per se, your life will just be very difficult from now on, chin up eh! And don't you worry, we'll make that assault charge stick!"

Do you honestly think that because the cop wasn't killed that assault is the appropriate charge here? That scumbag knew full well what he was doing.

HIV is not a death sentence, so it shouldn't be treated as attempted murder.

It should be classed as an assault. And if skin was broken, then it is the highest left of assault as far as I know. It's very hard to transmit HIV by biting. If you google it, you'll see that the Centre for Disease control have only ever recorded some very rare isolated cases.

The garda would have been in more danger if the guy attacked him with a knife, a hurley or even a kitchen ladle.

The biggest issue is the stress that the garda went through for 6 months wondering. That is covered under the victim impact statement. But the physical lethality/harm level of the attack was minimal.

That means that if it's classified as a serious assault, because of the victim impact statement, the judge can sentence for longer.

mickydoomsux

Grayson wrote: »

I hate to tell you this, but there are loads of countries with the death penalty. They don't have reduced incidences of crime. The death penalty is not a deterrent. And you might say that it reduces repeat offending, but even if it did, it doesn't reduce the overall amount of crime. Plus when you add in the cost of housing someone on death row along with the legal costs of all the appeals, it actually costs the state more than life imprisonment.

The only thing the death penalty does is make people like you feel better. It doesn't actually make the world any better.

Now, if you have a constructive suggestion, something that would actually help people and prevent crime, I'm all for hearing it.

For what it matters, I'm all in favour of attacks against first responders being classified differently. First responders should know we have their backs. But saying we should kill anyone who attacks them at all, that's just stupid.

Ah shure, lets stick with the cup of tea and a chat with a social worker model so.

Heavens forbid we do anything meaningful with these double figure convictions animals until they kill or seriously injure someone. Then we can tut tut and give them a 7 year sentence with the final 2 years suspended because they 'had a hard upbringing'.

'Justice' in this country is circling the bowl. We need to have these piles of walking feces utterly terrified to end up back in prison because it is a truly horrendous fate. There's your deterrent.

Failing that, end their completely worthless lives.

Potential-Monke

Just for the people saying that the chances of infection are miniscule, and giving the figures: there is still a chance. Yes, it's a slim chance, but it's still a chance.

I had to go through the 6 months waiting for a blood to blood injury, and it had a detrimental effect on my then relationship. I was told i could still kiss, and make love if i wanted, as the chances were so low. But it's always in the back of your head. What if I am that one in a x-million chance?

It's a horrible, horrible experience to go through, not helped by the fact that if the attackers medical history is unknown (especially if a known drug/needle user), there is no law to force a test on their side. It's 6 months of uncertainty, 6 months of fear, and 6 months of torture.

There is specific law relating to needle or pour attacks, Section 6 of the Non-Fatal Offences Against the Person Act 1997. Someone who does it can face up to 10 years in jail. Someone who intentionally does it can face up to life.

But, there is no specific law for bite attacks, and as such it falls under Section 3 of the same Act, that is Assault Causing Harm. But, there should be specific law for it, or to put it into the same Section 6 as Needle/Pour assaults.

Lone Stone

I do believe Hiv with current medication is non transferable.
edit: i dont think that was the case back in 2008, still a scummy c**t.

southsiderosie

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Ah shure, lets stick with the cup of tea and a chat with a social worker model so.

Heavens forbid we do anything meaningful with these double figure convictions animals until they kill or seriously injure someone. Then we can tut tut and give them a 7 year sentence with the final 2 years suspended because they 'had a hard upbringing'.

'Justice' in this country is circling the bowl. We need to have these piles of walking feces utterly terrified to end up back in prison because it is a truly horrendous fate. There's your deterrent.

Failing that, end their completely worthless lives.

If tough sentencing, bad prison conditions, and the death penalty were deterrents to crime, the U.S. would be a trouble-free paradise.

Rubber_Soul

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Ah shure, lets stick with the cup of tea and a chat with a social worker model so.

Heavens forbid we do anything meaningful with these double figure convictions animals until they kill or seriously injure someone. Then we can tut tut and give them a 7 year sentence with the final 2 years suspended because they 'had a hard upbringing'.

'Justice' in this country is circling the bowl. We need to have these piles of walking feces utterly terrified to end up back in prison because it is a truly horrendous fate. There's your deterrent.

Failing that, end their completely worthless lives.

Why is there only ever two options, death or hugs, with people like you?

hardCopy

HMV staff must be getting really desperate with their jobs hanging in the balance.

Mr. Loverman

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Just for the people saying that the chances of infection are miniscule, and giving the figures: there is still a chance. Yes, it's a slim chance, but it's still a chance.

I agree, but I wonder are you more likely to die from a random punch to the face than a HIV bite.

Grayson

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

I agree, but I wonder are you more likely to die from a random punch to the face than a HIV bite.

well, according to the CDC there have only even been a couple of reported cases so I'd believe a regular punch would be worse.

Drakares

Should be definitely charged with attempted murder. Scumbag

bullvine

He'd still have to live with it for the rest of his life if he had contracted it, even if the chance are very slim, it may not be a death sentence as it was 20 years ago but its a life sentence. It would affect his general well being and also his relationship with a partner and starting a family.

Annasopra

Drakares wrote: »

Should be definitely charged with attempted murder. Scumbag

How is it attempted murder?

Drakares

mango salsa wrote: »

How is it attempted murder?

The scrote had HIV, knowing full well that biting the garda could give him the disease.

HIV paves the way to all sorts of cancers and horrific deaths and gives victims a lower life expectancy and quality of life.

That is why it's attempted murder.

Derv 21

UCDVet wrote: »

Anyone know the odds of catching HIV from being bitten by someone who has it?

Well I cant tell you what the odds are of catching it off all HIV people, as e so niave to Hveryone has diferent levels.I can reassure you though the gentle man in question there only is 4% chance of catching it.I am this gentlemans fiance.I have a 6 month old HEALTHY baby girl from him.If I thought MY life or my childrens live's were at risk I would not have let it be.People are narrow minded & niave when it comes to HIV. The garda in question that night were violent toward's Noel & pushed him to the ground.The garda's finger was in hiss mouth.As He was pushed to the ground he bit the officer BY ACCIDENT. Maybe if the garda had not been so rough this incident would not have taking place!

Boombastic

Derv 21 wrote: »

.....................The garda's finger was in hiss mouth.As He was pushed to the ground he bit the officer BY ACCIDENT. Maybe if the garda had not been so rough this incident would not have taking place!

:pac::pac::pac:

efb

The ignorance when it comes to HIV/AIDS are astounding.
My sympathies with the policeman but Indo drumming up hysteria shocker.

Oranage2

I just hope the gard gave him a good kicking, pure scum, glad the gard was alright.

ballsymchugh

Derv 21 wrote: »

Well I cant tell you what the odds are of catching it off all HIV people, as e so niave to Hveryone has diferent levels.I can reassure you though the gentle man in question there only is 4% chance of catching it.I am this gentlemans fiance.I have a 6 month old HEALTHY baby girl from him.If I thought MY life or my childrens live's were at risk I would not have let it be.People are narrow minded & niave when it comes to HIV. The garda in question that night were violent toward's Noel & pushed him to the ground.The garda's finger was in hiss mouth.As He was pushed to the ground he bit the officer BY ACCIDENT. Maybe if the garda had not been so rough this incident would not have taking place!

dammit, there's popcorn all over the place, and the worms are getting away.
i think i should just sit down and pay attention!

Derv 21

Drakares wrote: »

The scrote had HIV, knowing full well that biting the garda could give him the disease.

HIV paves the way to all sorts of cancers and horrific deaths and gives victims a lower life expectancy and quality of life.

That is why it's attempted murder.

I feel I must ask you the question?? Were you there during this alleged 'tempted murder' as you put it took place?? No! Well let me inform you & educate you on facts & truth.This 'Scrote' Your word's is my fiance.He did not set out to bite the garda intentionally.The 3 garda used force on him to which was uncalled for.Garda brutality you may call it.During this altercation the garda had hiss hand in my fiance's mouth,Causing Noel 2 bite down by accident.This 'Scrote' is a gentleman helps other's living with hiv live their lives from day 2 day.People need to get more educated when it comes to hiv.Dont be so narrow minded.We have a healthy baby & planning to have more.Dont alway's believe what you read.Two side's to every story.Garda just looking 4 a big pay out from the state

Boombastic

Derv 21 wrote: »

............Garda brutality you may call it.During this altercation the garda had hiss hand in my fiance's mouth,Causing Noel 2 bite down by accident....

:pac::pac:

Derv 21

kraggy wrote: »

I think what the garda's superior meant in testimony about him being embarrassed was in reference to being seen by fellow patients, not the staff.

Thank you at last some one with an open mind.You are correct also in saying 'the garda was embarrassed by fellow patient's.A bit cliche dont you think? In hiss duty of work is he not suppose to treat all as equal??. This garda was just looking 4 a big pay out from the state.Noel did not set out to bite the garda.The chance's of catching HIV off this gentle man is 4% I know this for fact.People's narrow minds toward's others with hiv anger's me.There is so much more to this story.

Derv 21

Oranage2 wrote: »

I just hope the gard gave him a good kicking, pure scum, glad the gard was alright.

REALLY?? It's because of the force used against this gentle man the garda got bitten.3 garda on 1 man using force causing an altercation,Someone was bound to get hurt.If the garda had used the tactic's in which he was thought in college to take a man down,He would not have got bitten.How did the garda's hand end up in hiss mouth in the first place?? He did not set out to bite him.It was an accident!! GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT! A good kicking? So it's ok for the garda to be violent,Just because they have the power? You uneducated idiot

Boombastic

Derv 21 wrote: »

REALLY?? It's because of the force used against this gentle man the garda got bitten.3 garda on 1 man using force causing an altercation,Someone was bound to get hurt.If the garda had used the tactic's in which he was thought in college to take a man down,He would not have got bitten.How did the garda's hand end up in hiss mouth in the first place?? He did not set out to bite him.It was an accident!! GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT! A good kicking? So it's ok for the garda to be violent,Just because they have the power? You uneducated idiot

Why were the Gardai there in the first place if this man is so gentle? From the report in the independent


'She called the gardai who arrived shortly before Winterlich returned with the boy. When he tried to go into the bedroom to confront her, gardai restrained him because they were concerned for the child's safety'




If the child wasn't there I'd say it was a waste of taxpayers money:rolleyes: The Gardai seem to have been the only ones concerned about this poor child

Oranage2

Derv 21 wrote: »

Thank you at last some one with an open mind.You are correct also in saying 'the garda was embarrassed by fellow patient's.A bit cliche dont you think? In hiss duty of work is he not suppose to treat all as equal??. This garda was just looking 4 a big pay out from the state.Noel did not set out to bite the garda.The chance's of catching HIV off this gentle man is 4% I know this for fact.People's narrow minds toward's others with hiv anger's me.There is so much more to this story.

That what the internet deadly for, tell us hiss side of the story so we know all the facts.

Derv 21

mango salsa wrote: »

How is it attempted murder?

How is it attempted murder? Very serious statement to make when you dont know the full facts

Derv 21

Boombastic wrote: »

Why were the Gardai there in the first place if this man is so gentle? From the report in the independent


'She called the gardai who arrived shortly before Winterlich returned with the boy. When he tried to go into the bedroom to confront her, gardai restrained him because they were concerned for the child's safety'




If the child wasn't there I'd say it was a waste of taxpayers money:rolleyes: The Gardai seem to have been the only ones concerned about this poor child

There was no fear of the child.'Not mine btw' It was a domestic that got out of hand.I agree waste of taxpayer's money.The lady that called the garda in the first place Mother of the chid.Is mentally not well.There was no need for them to be there in the first place.Yess GENTLEMAN he was caring 4 hiss 2 year old son 4 a week.Just mother had aone of her breakdown's.That's not the topic here.It's about Garda brutallity & an accident that took place & paper's get it wrong.

Boombastic

Derv 21 wrote: »

There was no fear of the child.'Not mine btw' It was a domestic that got out of hand.I agree waste of taxpayer's money.The lady that called the garda in the first place Mother of the chid.Is mentally not well.There was no need for them to be there in the first place.Yess GENTLEMAN he was caring 4 hiss 2 year old son 4 a week.Just mother had aone of her breakdown's.That's not the topic here.It's about Garda brutallity & an accident that took place & paper's get it wrong.

It's not about Garda brutality, that's you putting a spin on it and with 51 previous convictions, I am sure he is well used to dealing with the Gardai. Also the prosecution heard the facts and rejected it was an accident.

What bit did the papers get wrong? I don't believe they are always right by the way.

Derv 21

S. De Sousa wrote: »

It's not just the biting, it's the biting knowing full well the risk he was posing doing it. Lowest of the low.

Do you know this chap on a personal note?? It was an accident!! Get the FACTS FIRST!

Oranage2

Derv 21 wrote: »

Do you know this chap on a personal note?? It was an accident!! Get the FACTS FIRST!

If it was an accident then why did he plead guilty?

Biting someone full well you know there is a chance it'll spread isn't that gentlemany.

Just admit it that noel isn't a very nice person.

Derv 21

Celticfire wrote: »

Do bleeding gums count?
I would doubt that a drug addict would be over concerned with oral hygiene.

Dont be so niave & make stupid comments like that.You uneducated idiot.He has a high standard when it comes to personal hygiene.:eek: fool

Celticfire

Derv 21 wrote: »

Dont be so niave & make stupid comments like that.You uneducated idiot.He has a high standard when it comes to personal hygiene.:eek: fool

Must resist temptation...........

Big Nasty

Derv 21 wrote: »

Dont be so niave & make stupid comments like that.You uneducated idiot.He has a high standard when it comes to personal hygiene.:eek: fool

Sound, yeah.

BTW how did he get the AIDS in the first place?

The Maverick

Derv 21 wrote: »

Dont be so niave & make stupid comments like that.You uneducated idiot.He has a high standard when it comes to personal hygiene.:eek: fool

Hi Noel! What sentence do you think you'll get in March? Knowing this country, it will probably be only a year and you'll be out in half of that. That'll leave you with plenty of time to do drugs, get involved in domestic disputes in front of your own child and assault gardaí.