McDonald's Planning Permission - Blacklion Manor

LEIN

LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »

Nope, I wasn't here then. I think the already established cafes in Greystones will see a reduction in foot fall. McDonald's has bulk buying power and therefore can and DO offer their coffee, soft drinks, fries and other convenience food at cheap prices.

Local take-aways can not compete with that. McDonald's creates low paying work, at the expense of established businesses.

This will only increase competition imo.

Looking at the other thread, coffee is too expensive in Greystones anyway!!

LifeBeginsAt40

DD9090 wrote: »

This will only increase competition imo.

Looking at the other thread, coffee is too expensive in Greystones anyway!!

I do hope this is true. I don't want to see any business close. I'm just a concerned parent and resident of Greystones that thinks this was not the best choice of location due primarily to the immediate proximity of a primary school.

Reading the replies to my posts, perhaps I am not on the same wavelength of other parents in the area.

AJAYC

Can't wait for McDs in Greystones, great location too, with minimal traffic chaos, not sure why people target them over other take-aways. The standards of hygiene are exceptional as is the speed of service & the food is consistently good plus Ronald McDonald house near Crumlin Hospital is one of the best charity facilities in the country. It's a plus for the town.

prettygurrly

er...can I just point out that McDonalds is the ONLY fast food restaurant that has put the calorie content of their food in plain view and have changed the menu to ensure fresh fruit and salad is available. I don't see a local chipper selling that sort of variety...

I agree that having the McDonalds right outside the school would provide "easy access" but how about you parent your child and tell them that if they want a happy meal then they have the burger and fruit instead of fries. They also offer low sugar drinks to protect teeth. In fact, if kids understand that McDonalds is a treat and also eat healthily then surely it's going to be less of a taboo and therefore they might actually benefit from having the McDonalds outside the school. There's no big secret.

The next point I'd make is that someone said that the kids that walk home would have to "resist" going in...err when I was in primary school the most money I had available to me was about a pound a week to spend on sweets in the local shop...since when did 10 year olds have a fiver to spend on a happy meal? If your kids have that sort of finance you are giving them TOO MUCH MONEY!

Comparing McDonalds to a lapdancing club is ridiculous.

Finally, increased traffic? I think the increase in estates in the area are the bigger problem in that respect than a fast food restaurant...more local jobs would ensure less commuting traffic which is the much bigger concern in the Greystones and surrounding area.

skydish79

quikquest wrote: »

Its creating jobs, something that is needed in the area. Also if their is going to be so much rubbish strewn around - it will create more jobs for cleaning it up.

Maybe their is no need to another McDonalds a few Km's away, but obviously if they are opening one they think there is. Like I said, its creating jobs.

Are these jobs for nurses, doctors and consultants that people will need as a result of eating their crap?

prettygurrly

if people want to eat bad stuff all the time they will, regardless of a McDonalds nearby.

LifeBeginsAt40

AJAYC wrote: »

Can't wait for McDs in Greystones, great location too, with minimal traffic chaos, not sure why people target them over other take-aways. The standards of hygiene are exceptional as is the speed of service & the food is consistently good plus Ronald McDonald house near Crumlin Hospital is one of the best charity facilities in the country. It's a plus for the town.

I'd have the same objections to ANY major fast-food chain opening a store adjacent to the gates of a primary school.

I'm not questioning the amount of money the likes of McDonald's, Tesco's put into the community. I'm questioning why McDonald's chooses to build a fast-food outlet outside a primary school, adjacent to an existing cafe.

Why not on the R774, out of town?

McDonald's know their target market is young families and children, I can only guess this is why the Blacklion Manor location was chosen.

McD's will have primary schools and a proposed secondary school right on their boundary. As a parent trying to raise 2 children with a healthy balanced diet I find this "pester power-marketing" by McD's irresponsible.

LifeBeginsAt40

McDonald's calories - http://nutrition.mcdonalds.com/getnutrition/nutritionfacts.pdf

I'm sorry, but this is NOT healthy eating by any stretch of the imagination.

Just one example from the list: Big Mac® 7.6 oz (215 g) 550 calories.

Yes they do indeed publish their calorific values for all their food, doesn't make it healthy does it?
A Big Mac is 51% of your daily recommended saturated fat intake, and 40% of your sodium (salt) intake. That's WITHOUT fries, coffee, apple pies, sauce etc.

It really is not healthy food in any way shape or form.

Annasopra

quikquest wrote: »

It seems you need to worry about affairs that effect you directly.

A McDonalds won't effect you personally unless you work in Pebbles and cross the road and have a child in the school.

Sorry but this is quite patronising and rude. If somebody is worried about something or objects to something it really isn't your place to tell them what they should and shouldn't worry about

pixbyjohn

"LifeBeginsAt40 Do you want me to ask the MODS to delete the thread and we can all pretend it never happened?"
No no not at all. Apologies if I sounded a bit harsh. I understand where you are coming from but there are so many things we could complain and object to. Near me there is a creche and the number of mornings that I have been almost run down with Mums rushing in their cars to get their precious passengers to creche on time is frightening. Look at the carparking outside of schools in the afternoons. Can I blame the Creche or the Schools for this? Come on, everyone must take responsibility for their own and childrens actions.

LifeBeginsAt40

pixbyjohn wrote: »

"LifeBeginsAt40 Do you want me to ask the MODS to delete the thread and we can all pretend it never happened?"
No no not at all. Apologies if I sounded a bit harsh. I understand where you are coming from but there are so many things we could complain and object to. Near me there is a creche and the number of mornings that I have been almost run down with Mums rushing in their cars to get their precious passengers to creche on time is frightening. Look at the carparking outside of schools in the afternoons. Can I blame the Creche or the Schools for this? Come on, everyone must take responsibility for their own and childrens actions.

Totally agree John (I walk to / from school - but another topic). There are no hard feelings towards anyone on Boards and thanks for replying.

Please accept my apologies for being harsh too.

Heisenberg1

mango salsa wrote: »

I'm all for nanny state regulation and preventing obesity couldn't agree with you more LBA40.

Completely disagree with this idea that everyone is only responsible for themselves. Obesity is a serious public health issue and we should be actively educating and informing young children about healthy food options

Children's Healthy eating is the sole responsibility of the parents and nobody else. If parents let there children eat crap from McDonald's all the time the children's health will suffer in the long term.

LifeBeginsAt40

mango salsa wrote: »

Sorry but this is quite patronising and rude. If somebody is worried about something or objects to something it really isn't your place to tell them what they should and shouldn't worry about

As I mentioned in reply, it does concern me directly on several issues.

Heisenberg1

LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »

I'd have the same objections to ANY major fast-food chain opening a store adjacent to the gates of a primary school.

I'm not questioning the amount of money the likes of McDonald's, Tesco's put into the community. I'm questioning why McDonald's chooses to build a fast-food outlet outside a primary school, adjacent to an existing cafe.

Why not on the R774, out of town?

McDonald's know their target market is young families and children, I can only guess this is why the Blacklion Manor location was chosen.

McD's will have primary schools and a proposed secondary school right on their boundary. As a parent trying to raise 2 children with a healthy balanced diet I find this "pester power-marketing" by McD's irresponsible.

Don't eat there then. I think you will finds its a decision you make and not the marketing that has you in there eating.

Annasopra

Heisenberg1 wrote: »

Children's Healthy eating is the sole responsibility of the parents and nobody else. If parents let there children eat crap from McDonald's all the time the children's health will suffer in the long term.

I totally totally disagree with this. The state also has responsibility through education, public healthcare and through in this case responsible planning

LifeBeginsAt40

Don't eat there then. I think you will finds its a decision you make and not the marketing that has you in there eating.

McDonald's (with their child friendly mascot) promotes the idea in young children of it being cool and acceptable to eat burgers, chicken nuggets and chips as a main meal or a snack.

Adults can make the choice to be obese or not. Instilling the idea into a young child's head that McDonald's is a healthy or "cool" choice is crazy.

As adults we make our choices based on knowledge and understanding, children cannot make those choices. We as adults have to make them on their behalf.

McDonald's, Burger King, KFC all market their food at a generation that has yet to consider the real health issues concerned with a bad diet.

Yes, our children are still at an age where they cannot eat in McD's (or similar) on their own, however there will come a time when we do not have absolute control over their choices and when parents aren't there, peer pressure becomes a very powerful force indeed.

This is why I object to fast-food outlets being located next to schools. For me the location IS an issue. Not the job creation or indeed the facility, the location outside a primary school is ill advised.

prettygurrly

LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »

McDonald's calories - http://nutrition.mcdonalds.com/getnutrition/nutritionfacts.pdf

I'm sorry, but this is NOT healthy eating by any stretch of the imagination.

Just one example from the list: Big Mac® 7.6 oz (215 g) 550 calories.

Yes they do indeed publish their calorific values for all their food, doesn't make it healthy does it?
A Big Mac is 51% of your daily recommended saturated fat intake, and 40% of your sodium (salt) intake. That's WITHOUT fries, coffee, apple pies, sauce etc.

It really is not healthy food in any way shape or form.

I didn't say that their burgers are healthy, I said they have healthy options such as fruit and salad and low sugar drinks to protect teeth.

Kids don't eat big macs so your point isn't actually fair.

At least they have told you that their big mac has 550 calories so you, as an adult, can decide to have one AS A TREAT. I can't understand why people are treating this as if McDs are holding a gun to everyone's head...."you must eat our burgers because we have opened a shop"...if that was the case then we'd never get into the McDonalds in Drogheda as there's 40000 people catered by that outlet. It's never particularly busy by the way and well within the walk home for THOUSANDS of kids.

(I grew up near Greystones and my parents still live there by the way)

Maudi

LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »

Noticed a planning application dated 18th Jan 2013 for a McDonald's Burger Restaurant at Blacklion Manor / Lidl, Greystones.

Interested in views of local residents, as the area is mainly residential plus would be directly adjacent to the existing Educate Together / Irish primary schools and the new school also planned.

Is building a McDonald's directly in-front of a school complex not in total opposition to promoting healthy eating? Not to mention the amount of litter that WILL end up strewn along the mainly residential roads.

I for one, will be voicing my objections to the planning regulators. Bray already has an established McDonald's, is there a need for another one only a few kms away?

only a gob****e and someone who probably is a tad lacking in parenting skills would answer yes if asked 'is outside a childrens school the ideal place for a fast food outlet?

LifeBeginsAt40

It's the targeting of school children that I have an issue with, plain and simple. This is not a discussion about adults using McDonald's, it's a post about the location of a fast food restaurant who market an unhealthy product.

If all we want in Greystones is a Drive-Thru McDonald's then build it on a dual-carriageway away from a dense residential area and 2 primary schools. McDonald's want to be at Blacklion Manor because they want to target children at an early age, in clear view and 60 second walk. Plain and simple.

We as responsible parents should be asking the question, is that acceptable when the medical facts on a balanced diet are clear to see.

There is hope yet, though this was refused on the zoning of the land > http://buckplanning.blogspot.ie/2011/02/bord-pleanala-turns-down-plan-for.html

Annasopra

I was in America in 2008 canvassing lots of really poor areas for Obama. It was completely obvious to me that McDs specifically targeted the poor areas. In this case they are targeting schools and I would agree with LBA40.

Heisenberg1

LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »

McDonald's (with their child friendly mascot) promotes the idea in young children of it being cool and acceptable to eat burgers, chicken nuggets and chips as a main meal or a snack.

Adults can make the choice to be obese or not. Instilling the idea into a young child's head that McDonald's is a healthy or "cool" choice is crazy.

As adults we make our choices based on knowledge and understanding, children cannot make those choices. We as adults have to make them on their behalf.

McDonald's, Burger King, KFC all market their food at a generation that has yet to consider the real health issues concerned with a bad diet.

Yes, our children are still at an age where they cannot eat in McD's (or similar) on their own, however there will come a time when we do not have absolute control over their choices and when parents aren't there, peer pressure becomes a very powerful force indeed.

This is why I object to fast-food outlets being located next to schools. For me the location IS an issue. Not the job creation or indeed the facility, the location outside a primary school is ill advised.

Yes as adults we make our own choices. My point is that parents with

children using the its all Ronald's fault that my child is overweight is nonsense

and that they need to educate there own kids. And not give into the

marketing pressure which I think is utter nonsense.

Heisenberg1

mango salsa wrote: »

I was in America in 2008 canvassing lots of really poor areas for Obama. It was completely obvious to me that McDs specifically targeted the poor areas. In this case they are targeting schools and I would agree with LBA40.

Whenever I here the people come out with the old chestnut "It's cheap and

where on a budget is again nonsense. You go buy a Happy meal then go to a

place like O Briens cafe and you can get soup and sandwhich for the same price

if not cheaper.

LifeBeginsAt40

Heisenberg1 wrote: »

Yes as adults we make our own choices. My point is that parents with

children using the its all Ronald's fault that my child is overweight is nonsense

and that they need to educate there own kids. And not give into the

marketing pressure which I think is utter nonsense.

The stark facts are.....the marketing at young children does work. Ask any child who Ronald McDonald is and THEY all know the answer. A parent that "bans" their child from fast-food outlets is in for a hard time as a parent, why should I have that added pressure every morning at the school gates?

Responsible parents should not sit back and allow McDonald's to build outlets at the entrance to primary schools.

Other locales are now putting into place planning rules that specifically ban fast-food outlets from being sited next to schools. There are many pieces of the jigsaw when it comes to educating people about healthy living.

The location of fast-food outlets is just one piece. At the moment my children do not see a McDonald's every day of the week, but if this development goes ahead hundreds of young children EVERY DAY will see fast-food advertising. A non stop "brainwashing" if you wish. It's not acceptable.

Jimjay

I eat in pebbles all the time. Mainly their full Irish and I notice most in there are eating breakfast too. They do not publish the calorie content in pebbles but I imagine a large proportion of their meals have the same calories as McDonald's.

I also notice the chippers in greystones are full of school kids on a daily basis.

I don't see why a planning should be turned down because the food they want to sell is unhealthy if, like everything else, you eat too much of it and don't exercise regularly.

I also notice the McDonald's in bray is also next to a school. I wish they wouldn't build them next to schools as when I want a McDonald's I can't find a parking space as every kid at the school is taken and picked up in a separate car from outside the school gates. Parents don't want their kids eating crap but they won't park a few streets away from the school to give their kids a healthy walk every day ;-)

Heisenberg1

LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »

The stark facts are.....the marketing at young children does work. Ask any child who Ronald McDonald is and THEY all know the answer. A parent that "bans" their child from fast-food outlets is in for a hard time as a parent, why should I have that added pressure every morning at the school gates?

Responsible parents should not sit back and allow McDonald's to build outlets at the entrance to primary schools.

Other locales are now putting into place planning rules that specifically ban fast-food outlets from being sited next to schools. There are many pieces of the jigsaw when it comes to educating people about healthy living.

The location of fast-food outlets is just one piece. At the moment my children do not see a McDonald's every day of the week, but if this development goes ahead hundreds of young children EVERY DAY will see fast-food advertising. A non stop "brainwashing" if you wish. It's not acceptable.

As a parent myself I just don't get the added pressure form the children bit

after all we are the parent's. I think it's lazy on the parents part.

LifeBeginsAt40

So, taking the argument a step further, should we sit back and allow McDonald's to build next to schools in any Irish town?

I take on-board totally the arguments over parents being responsible for their own children's diets, one of the reasons we have children of a healthy weight. I also think we have a duty of care to not allow our children to be subjected to "targeted marketing" by an outlet that does have a majority unhealthy product.

We have very strict laws on smoking advertising with regards to children, saturated fat is another killer too.
You have to be of a certain age to legally smoke and drink. You do not, however have to be of a certain age to eat saturated fat and high salt foods.

So we as responsible parents, need to mitigate these risks.

LifeBeginsAt40

I wasn't comparing the quality of food in Pebbles, I was stating that the location of a major fast-food chain on their very doorstep could possibly affect business. As others have said it might boost their business.

The point being....Pebbles are not a major fast-food outlet that have over many years "brainwashed/targeted" young children into thinking eating burgers and chips is a healthy meal. My children are blissfully unaware of Pebbles (though I enjoy the venue) but are sadly very aware of McDonald's.

quikquest

skydish79 wrote: »

Are these jobs for nurses, doctors and consultants that people will need as a result of eating their crap?

Yes actually if you want to include them. At the end of the day, it is up to a parent to control their kids. If a parent can control what their child i eating, and the child ends up in hospital - its the parents fault. Not the fault of a fast food restaurant outside a school. If a parent can't take responsibility or control their children - thats another issue. If my child ended up in hospital because he got obese i WOULD NOT BLAME McDonalds or any other fast food restaurant. I would blame myself for not taking the lead and raising my child to know what is good for them and what is not.

mango salsa wrote: »

Sorry but this is quite patronising and rude. If somebody is worried about something or objects to something it really isn't your place to tell them what they should and shouldn't worry about

I never said said it is my place - ReRead I said it "seems to me" which is my personal opinion. I could take the view that it isn't really your place to tell me what my opinion should or shouldn't be but i'm not going to be petty.

Can I just clarify here - I am not taking a personal attack on the OP just we have different views on this subject and all I am trying to say to him is to relax and think of the good - and please understand that when something is written in text format it can be taken up wrongly (I have previously said this by using brakets on other comments)

The OP understands I am not being rude I am sure as he said he is looking for views and not taking it personally

quikquest

LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »

So, taking the argument a step further, should we sit back and allow McDonald's to build next to schools in any Irish town?

I take on-board totally the arguments over parents being responsible for their own children's diets, one of the reasons we have children of a healthy weight. I also think we have a duty of care to not allow our children to be subjected to "targeted marketing" by an outlet that does have a majority unhealthy product.

We have very strict laws on smoking advertising with regards to children, saturated fat is another killer too.
You have to be of a certain age to legally smoke and drink. You do not, however have to be of a certain age to eat saturated fat and high salt foods.

So we as responsible parents, need to mitigate these risks.

You hit the nail on the head when you said "We as responsible parents need to mitigate these risks" - but I feel you are barking up the wrong tree complaining about the McDonalds to the council about NEW JOBS

You can't hide children from McDonalds, Porn, Cigs, etc.. But this is where parent raising comes in to play and when a child wants a McD you say no - and the child UNDERSTANDS no means no and that's it. So even if the child is seeing it daily the child UNDERSTANDS its not good for you, its not a daily food source etc.... but you can't blame MCD for opening a restaurant even if its outside a school

(I am not targetting this at the OP so please don't take me up wrong)

Jimjay

As far as I know McDonald's havnt had any advertising aimed at kids for years and Ronald McDonald no longer exists.

Maybe it should be that they would not be allowed to advertise their toys or kids meals in the windows. The only reason I have known kids want a McDonald's is they want another toy with their meal. They must have had one before to know about it?