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McDonald's Planning Permission - Blacklion Manor

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    #212
    MyPerfectCousin
    Registered Users Posts: 741 ✭✭✭MyPerfectCousin


    mango salsa wrote: »
    It's not quite the same - the fast food joints are not directly in front of pres. Loreto moved it's school location.

    You can see chippers from the grounds or gates of both schools. "In view."

    But again my point is that the objection here is to McDonalds, not to fast food. People would not be jumping into this thread ready to storm the barricades of the humble planner's office in Wicklow if it was Macari or Eddie Rockets.


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    #213
    LifeBeginsAt40
    Closed Accounts Posts: 328 ✭✭LifeBeginsAt40


    MyPerfectCousin wrote: »
    You can see chippers from the grounds or gates of both schools. "In view."

    But again my point is that the objection here is to McDonalds, not to fast food. People would not be jumping into this thread ready to storm the barricades of the humble planner's office in Wicklow if it was Macari or Eddie Rockets.

    Please don't assume you know how I would react. Everyone can ASSuME.

    You are very wrong to judge me, please don't.


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    #214
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    MyPerfectCousin wrote: »
    You can see chippers from the grounds or gates of both schools. "In view."

    But again my point is that the objection here is to McDonalds, not to fast food. People would not be jumping into this thread ready to storm the barricades of the humble planner's office in Wicklow if it was Macari or Eddie Rockets.

    It's not really the same thing at all. They are not directly in front of the school gates and no you can't see a chippers from pres

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #215
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    matt-dublin wrote: »
    lets not forget that the majority of secondary schools offer chips on their canteen menus.

    Do they?

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #216
    matt-dublin
    Registered Users Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭matt-dublin


    mango salsa wrote: »
    Do they?
    yes. they're cheap and easy to make


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    #217
    LifeBeginsAt40
    Closed Accounts Posts: 328 ✭✭LifeBeginsAt40


    matt-dublin wrote: »
    yes. they're cheap and easy to make

    We need joined up thinking here. McDonald's alone is not the sole case of childhood obesity, but sitting back and doing nothing is mindless.

    If we don't fight each cause one by one, Ireland will continue climbing up the childhood obesity scale.

    Just watch Operation Transformation on RTE.


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    #218
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    matt-dublin wrote: »
    yes.

    I didn't know this - have you evidence - a report or something?

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #219
    MyPerfectCousin
    Registered Users Posts: 741 ✭✭✭MyPerfectCousin


    LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »
    Please don't assume you know how I would react. Everyone can ASSuME.

    You are very wrong to judge me, please don't.

    Don't be so defensive. I wasn't talking about anyone in particular. Just stating my opinion based my experience of seeing this same phenomenon in other communities where people draw the line at McDonalds while welcoming other fast food options that don't have the same cultural baggage. There's chippers very close to schools where Greystones kids go and zero objections to them. I don't doubt your personal zeal and dedication.


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    #220
    matt-dublin
    Registered Users Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭matt-dublin


    i went to school in CBC monkstown and we had them.

    I had friends in Loretto Bray, Loretto Foxrock, Pres Bray, Loretto Dalkey, Rathdown, Muchross, Teresians, Blackrock and rockford.

    They were all able to get chips in their canteen tuck shops.


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    #221
    LifeBeginsAt40
    Closed Accounts Posts: 328 ✭✭LifeBeginsAt40


    MyPerfectCousin wrote: »
    Don't be so defensive. I wasn't talking about anyone in particular. Just stating my opinion based my experience of seeing this same phenomenon in other communities where people draw the line at McDonalds while welcoming other fast food options that don't have the same cultural baggage. There's chippers very close to schools where Greystones kids go and zero objections to them. I don't doubt your personal zeal and dedication.

    I will be defensive, as you clearly stated that people would not object if the application was by another fast food outlet.

    I can assure you that many of us would object no matter who the fast food business was.
    I don't make assumptions over your views, so please, once again, do not assume in public you know how I feel.

    Moving on....and keeping it civil.


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    #222
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    matt-dublin wrote: »
    i went to school in CBC monkstown and we had them.

    I had friends in Loretto Bray, Loretto Foxrock, Pres Bray, Loretto Dalkey, Rathdown, Muchross, Teresians, Blackrock and rockford.

    They were all able to get chips in their canteen tuck shops.

    That's not a majority of schools in Ireland. I was asking because you stated it as a fact with no basis really. Pres Bray got rid of theirs.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #223
    atlantean
    Registered Users Posts: 556 ✭✭✭atlantean


    There are many issues here - location, kids, traffic, etc. but I would ask does Greystones actually need another fast food outlet in the first place? There is a lot of choice and competition in the Greystones already when it comes to eating out or take away. Most are small local businesses trying to survive in the current economic climate which is not easy. These small businesses don't have the buying power that McDonald's do and so will be at a disadvantage should McDonald's move into the area.

    The two businesses that spring to mind that would be most hit are probably Pinetos and Jokers, both of whom have been in Greystones for a long time. To use the argument that a new McDonalds would create employment for the area may very well be short sighted should either Pinetos or Jokers be hit and have to make people redundant or worse case scenario, close altogether.

    I know my choice would be to go to Jokers or Pinetos any day as I don't particularly like McDonalds food. For a start you can't even get chips in McDonalds - they only have those horrible crap fries!!!! It would be a shame to see any of these established local businesses go because a multinational franchise decides to muscle in on their area.

    I hope McDonalds don't get planning permission in this case.


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    #224
    LEIN
    Registered Users Posts: 9,936 ✭✭✭LEIN


    LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »
    We need joined up thinking here. McDonald's alone is not the sole case of childhood obesity, but sitting back and doing nothing is mindless.

    If we don't fight each cause one by one, Ireland will continue climbing up the childhood obesity scale.

    Just watch Operation Transformation on RTE.

    That is for a different thread on a different forum, it's not a Greystones specific issue.


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    #225
    The Bishop Basher
    Registered Users Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭The Bishop Basher


    LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »
    I will be defensive, as you clearly stated that people would not object if the application was by another fast food outlet.

    I can assure you that many of us would object no matter who the fast food business was.

    So can you answer the question I asked yesterday but was ingnored.

    What are you doing about the cheap school meals for sale in the current fast food outlets in greystones ?


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    #226
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users Posts: 45,853 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    LifeBeginsAt40 wrote: »
    I will be defensive, as you clearly stated that people would not object if the application was by another fast food outlet.

    I can assure you that many of us would object no matter who the fast food business was.
    I don't make assumptions over your views, so please, once again, do not assume in public you know how I feel.

    Moving on....and keeping it civil.

    If Little Ceasars was still in opperation in basically the same location, would you have objected to the planning permission for the school?

    Give people are giving out about the kids seeing McDonalds - where exactly is it looking to be put? My reading of the planning application reads that it would be going where blacklion stores is (North East part of the development) but as they are looking to repurpose a sports/leisure area I would assume it is where Curves is? If it is where Curves is, it would be facing out on to the main road and on the blindside of the building from the school, so not viewable.


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    #227
    The Bishop Basher
    Registered Users Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭The Bishop Basher


    Nobody batted an eyelid when Little Ceaser's set up there.

    Speaks volumes...


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    #228
    The Durutti Column
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 274 ✭✭The Durutti Column


    Mitch Connor wrote: »
    If Little Ceasars was still in opperation in basically the same location, would you have objected to the planning permission for the school?

    Give people are giving out about the kids seeing McDonalds - where exactly is it looking to be put? My reading of the planning application reads that it would be going where blacklion stores is (North East part of the development) but as they are looking to repurpose a sports/leisure area I would assume it is where Curves is? If it is where Curves is, it would be facing out on to the main road and on the blindside of the building from the school, so not viewable.

    Take a wee trip to WCC HQ in Wicklow and look at the plans there. That will answer your query.

    My understanding, from the phrasing of the application, is that it will be sited on the present green area in the corner by the traffic lights and X-roads. After all, it's a drive-through. How would you drive through the existing building?


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    #229
    The Durutti Column
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 274 ✭✭The Durutti Column


    Anyhow, it ain't gonna happen. Just watch.

    And if I'm wrong, I will publicly and ceremonially eat my woolly winter hat in a McD's 'bun' with McD's ketchup and mustard on. While driving through.


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    #230
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,465 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    The Durutti Column wrote: »
    My understanding, from the phrasing of the application, is that it will be sited on the present green area in the corner by the traffic lights and X-roads. After all, it's a drive-through. How would you drive through the existing building?
    IMO if that's the case, then it should get thrown out immediately, nothing to do with all the spurious child obesity stuff that's occupied the last 200+ posts. Right on the corner of a busy traffic light controlled junction is no place for a drive through anything, fast-food restaurant or otherwise.


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    #231
    matt-dublin
    Registered Users Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭matt-dublin


    The Durutti Column wrote: »
    Anyhow, it ain't gonna happen. Just watch.

    And if I'm wrong, I will publicly and ceremonially eat my woolly winter hat in a McD's 'bun' with McD's ketchup and mustard on. While driving through.

    how do you work that out? based on the moanings of less than 100 people? Do you think you're the first time a big company has had plpanning issues in this country?

    its nothing that a small donation to a local charity/team etc won't resolve. It happend in every planning authority in every town in the country.


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    #232
    The Durutti Column
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 274 ✭✭The Durutti Column


    Originally Posted by The Durutti Column
    My understanding, from the phrasing of the application, is that it will be sited on the present green area in the corner by the traffic lights and X-roads. After all, it's a drive-through. How would you drive through the existing building?
    Alun wrote: »
    IMO if that's the case, then it should get thrown out immediately, nothing to do with all the spurious child obesity stuff that's occupied the last 200+ posts. Right on the corner of a busy traffic light controlled junction is no place for a drive through anything, fast-food restaurant or otherwise.

    Right, Alun. I did point out these factors in an earlier post, but all these ranters here seemed to have no interest.

    It is an insane location for such a thing.
    • First, it's a dead end with only one entrance and exit from the R761.
    • Second, the traffic is already considerable at this X-roads and the additional traffic may exceed its design capacity.
    • Third, the car park is even now very often full. 41 extra spaces would not cater for the influx.
    • Fourth, adding to the road traffic will make it more dangerous for children attending THREE schools close by (when the secondary is built).

    Then there is the question of noise, nuisance and potential anti-social behaviour being visited on residents of Blacklion Manor, Redford Park, Rathdown Park, and Blacklion itself. Not a small consideration if you live near there.


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    #233
    The Durutti Column
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 274 ✭✭The Durutti Column


    http://www.greystonesguide.ie/polls/


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    #234
    red_bairn
    Registered Users Posts: 2,343 ✭✭✭red_bairn


    The Durutti Column wrote: »
    Right, Alun. I did point out these factors in an earlier post, but all these ranters here seemed to have no interest.

    It is an insane location for such a thing.
    • First, it's a dead end with only one entrance and exit from the R761.
    • Second, the traffic is already considerable at this X-roads and the additional traffic may exceed its design capacity.
    • Third, the car park is even now very often full. 41 extra spaces would not cater for the influx.
    • Fourth, adding to the road traffic will make it more dangerous for children attending THREE schools close by (when the secondary is built).

    Then there is the question of noise, nuisance and potential anti-social behaviour being visited on residents of Blacklion Manor, Redford Park, Rathdown Park, and Blacklion itself. Not a small consideration if you live near there.

    I'm not gonna lie, but my opinion has slightly swayed towards a YES for the building to go up but the items you've listed above would be reasons that I'd say NO.

    When driving up to the main lights one day, I thought to myself, why isn't there a slip road up into that shopping area? I now realise why they've not done so and I'd rather they have the building in an area where they have plenty of space.


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    #235
    matt-dublin
    Registered Users Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭matt-dublin


    your arguement proves they will be busy. those points will end up being some form of conditions on the plaanning permission


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    #236
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users Posts: 45,853 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    The Durutti Column wrote: »
    Take a wee trip to WCC HQ in Wicklow and look at the plans there. That will answer your query.

    My understanding, from the phrasing of the application, is that it will be sited on the present green area in the corner by the traffic lights and X-roads. After all, it's a drive-through. How would you drive through the existing building?

    The planning application states it is to "replace the permitted leisure and fitness and fitness centre". Is there planning permission provided for a fitness centre on the green area? My reading would say it is taking over the leisure/fitness area already taken by Curves rather than a new build.

    It says it can be reviewed on the wicklow.ie planning site, but I can't find it there yet - I would assume a map would be included on that if/when it is put up.

    http://www.greystonesguide.ie/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/McD-planning-permission.jpg


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    #237
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    It normally takes the planning authority a couple of weeks to both validate the application and then to scan them so that they are visible online.


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    #238
    The Bishop Basher
    Registered Users Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭The Bishop Basher


    The Durutti Column wrote: »
    Right, Alun. I did point out these factors in an earlier post, but all these ranters here seemed to have no interest.


    It is an insane location for such a thing.
    • First, it's a dead end with only one entrance and exit from the R761.
    • Second, the traffic is already considerable at this X-roads and the additional traffic may exceed its design capacity.
    • Third, the car park is even now very often full. 41 extra spaces would not cater for the influx.
    • Fourth, adding to the road traffic will make it more dangerous for children attending THREE schools close by (when the secondary is built).
    Have you actually seen the plans or are you making assumptions ?

    The Durutti Column wrote: »
    Then there is the question of noise, nuisance and potential anti-social behaviour being visited on residents of Blacklion Manor, Redford Park, Rathdown Park, and Blacklion itself. Not a small consideration if you live near there.

    Ok this is getting beyond riduculous. I live in Blacklion and neither myself nor my wife have any concerns of this nature. Having discussed it in passing with a couple of my neighbours they have zero concerns also. The traffic in Blacklion has increased significantly in recent years however this is down to new estates being built and this enterprise will have little or no effect on that.

    Can we please keep this to sensible arguments and less of the hysteria being posted by some of the anti McDonald's brigade on here.


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    #239
    red_bairn
    Registered Users Posts: 2,343 ✭✭✭red_bairn


    Swanner wrote: »
    [/LIST]Have you actually seen the plans or are you making assumptions ?

    I don't think many people have and most are bringing out the torches. :D
    Swanner wrote: »
    Ok this is getting beyond riduculous. I live in Blacklion and neither myself nor my wife have any concerns of this nature.

    Whereabouts are you? Are you on the R761 or in the Blacklion Manor area?


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    #240
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Folks please do not use aggressive language such as calling people ranters or hysterical

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #241
    The Bishop Basher
    Registered Users Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭The Bishop Basher


    red_bairn wrote: »
    Whereabouts are you? Are you on the R761 or in the Blacklion Manor area?

    I'm a 2 minute walk from Blacklion Manor and believe me, I have felt the effects of the increased traffic as would anyone driving down the main street. It has got more and more difficult for me to get in and out of my drive in the mornings and evenings. Lidl had no effect and this won't either.

    I do think the current junction would need to be looked at if it was to go ahead but as I haven't seen the plans i'm not jumping to any conclusions.


This discussion has been closed.
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