How will you choose between MS & Sony's new consoles?

Pushtrak

COYVB wrote: »

They can't both do it first

They could. I don't think I'm being donning a tin foil hat when I suggest that both Microsoft and Sony know more about what the other is doing than the regular guy on the street. I'm sure there are developers who are working on both systems who let certain things leak. If one of the two were going in this direction, I don't think it unreasonable to figure the other would know about it. I'm welcome to people with a contrary view though. Do many of ye hold a contrary view though?

NTMK

Pushtrak wrote: »

They could. I don't think I'm being donning a tin foil hat when I suggest that both Microsoft and Sony know more about what the other is doing than the regular guy on the street. I'm sure there are developers who are working on both systems who let certain things leak. If one of the two were going in this direction, I don't think it unreasonable to figure the other would know about it. I'm welcome to people with a contrary view though. Do many of ye hold a contrary view though?

big Developers could push sony/ms to include such tech under threat of not having their games on the system

If activision/EA decided to push for this i couldn't see Ms/sony risk losing COD/fifa as it as console exclusives would sell consoles

that would probably be the only way this would happen

COYVB

Pushtrak wrote: »

They could. I don't think I'm being donning a tin foil hat when I suggest that both Microsoft and Sony know more about what the other is doing than the regular guy on the street. I'm sure there are developers who are working on both systems who let certain things leak. If one of the two were going in this direction, I don't think it unreasonable to figure the other would know about it. I'm welcome to people with a contrary view though. Do many of ye hold a contrary view though?

I mean they both can't announce it first. The OP that whoever announces it first will see people running to the other one, while either none would do it or both would. My point was they can't both announce it first.

Varik

COYVB wrote: »

I mean they both can't announce it first. The OP that whoever announces it first will see people running to the other one, while either none would do it or both would. My point was they can't both announce it first.

News doesn't travel all that fast or last all that long, if it's done before launch then a delay between both announcements would not hurt the first one much.

COYVB

Varik wrote: »

News doesn't travel all that fast or last all that long, if it's done before launch then a delay between both announcements would not hurt the first one much.

Let's say MS launch on November 22nd, which they probably will, and Sony launch on Feb 14th, which they probably won't. Everyone will know whether or not MS have anti second hand games on their system before Nov 22nd, while Sony could well have it on theirs, but say absolutely nothing until after Xmas, negatively affecting Xbox sales

F1ngers

I'd say neither console will block second hand games, however such a move is only an update away.

COYVB

F1ngers wrote: »

I'd say neither console will block second hand games, however such a move is only an update away.

Good point. Wouldn't do to alienate all those people before you launch when you can wait 6/12/18/24 months and then pull the trigger - assuming you set the wheels in motion right at the beginning

danthefan

That would be really unfair imo, they'd have to give warning before doing that. Stores would still be trading in 2nd hand games and be left with loads of useless stock, people could go buy a game, arrive home and find the game doesn't work, etc.

Otacon

danthefan wrote: »

That would be really unfair imo, they'd have to give warning before doing that. Stores would still be trading in 2nd hand games and be left with loads of useless stock, people could go buy a game, arrive home and find the game doesn't work, etc.

If they do this, I doubt they would just turn second-hand games into frisbees. What will happen is you will need to buy a 'game pass', basically like the online pass but it unlocks the entire game. It will obviously cost money and Sony and Microsoft can choose their price for it.

Sarn

NTMK wrote: »

big Developers could push sony/ms to include such tech under threat of not having their games on the system

If activision/EA decided to push for this i couldn't see Ms/sony risk losing COD/fifa as it as console exclusives would sell consoles

that would probably be the only way this would happen

I think that's a good point. MS and Sony could leave it up to each publisher on how they want to restrict a game. They offer the tools, but if EA wants to lock down a cross-platform game then off they go. The anger will be directed at the publisher, the same problem will hit all systems, problem solved.

Varik

danthefan wrote: »

That would be really unfair imo, they'd have to give warning before doing that. Stores would still be trading in 2nd hand games and be left with loads of useless stock, people could go buy a game, arrive home and find the game doesn't work, etc.

If they did add it afterwards then only the newer games would have it all the launch games would be fine.

tok9

The main thing I find worrying about this is not being able to play a game years after it's released when it's no longer being stocked.

I have no issue if you have to pay for a code to unlock it. Sure, it's annoying but it'd be far more annoying if older games basically became unplayable because they were locked to one persons account.

Pushtrak

tok9 wrote: »

The main thing I find worrying about this is not being able to play a game years after it's released when it's no longer being stocked.

I really don't think you have to worry about this. I'm sure even in the worst case scenario of them following something like this, the online pass would become a game pass. They'd have to give a game a couple of uses first of all, so people who would being games over to friends houses would still be able to do so. I can't see them not allowing for this. And also, just about any protection a system offers can be hacked. Look how easily other systems have been hacked. A workaround would be found, and instead of a revenue stream, you'd have lots of people flock to the workaround to play the game second hand.

Retr0gamer

I doubt either console will block used games considering the recent law change in Europe with regards to this and the fact that it's currently being tested in a law suit against valve.

ancapailldorcha

Retr0gamer wrote: »

I doubt either console will block used games considering the recent law change in Europe with regards to this and the fact that it's currently being tested in a law suit against valve.

Going to watch this with great interest. Surely the best way to combat second hand games isn't to ban them, but to revamp the PSN/Xbox live stores by taking a few leaves out of Valve's book. I've no interest in buying physical games for PC anymore as the Steam prices are usually very reasonable and I can download it to any machine and if I get burgled then it's just a matter of redownloading them. Some games even have auto cloud backup.
If I can get the cash together, I think I'm going to try for a PC for the next gen. Sony and Microsoft just don't deserve to be in business anymore.

Varik

Retr0gamer wrote: »

I doubt either console will block used games considering the recent law change in Europe with regards to this and the fact that it's currently being tested in a law suit against valve.

No law was changed or created, the judge declared how the current law applied and it was for a case where the software was not entangled with any third party service or where the software was tied together; the suit with valve will clear some of this up.

But I can think of one legal and common addition that they could add to the EULA for any of the so far unreleased games, a right of first refusal. For something like a digital game from their servers where they have complete control it would be even more limiting that in any of the other cases where it's found.

Pushtrak

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Going to watch this with great interest. Surely the best way to combat second hand games isn't to ban them, but to revamp the PSN/Xbox live stores by taking a few leaves out of Valve's book.

Are you suggesting going fully digital distribution? Or the digital distribution being such that it markets games at a reasonable price in comparison to retail? You most likely mean the latter, but just would be good to get confirmation on what you meant exactly here.

ancapailldorcha

Pushtrak wrote: »

Are you suggesting going fully digital distribution? Or the digital distribution being such that it markets games at a reasonable price in comparison to retail? You most likely mean the latter, but just would be good to get confirmation on what you meant exactly here.

I wasn't suggesting purely digital distribution but with High Stores closing at the rate they are I'm of the opinion that physical media's days are numbered. In any case, the PSN's prices could definitely do with being revised. I've seen sales from time to time but it's nowhere near as good as ones on Steam, GOG, etc. I definitely would not discard physical media now, just improve the digital service and offer incentives to buy games new instead of screwing people who do that with day one DLC.
Incentivisation is better than coercion.

Pushtrak

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I wasn't suggesting purely digital distribution but with High Stores closing at the rate they are I'm of the opinion that physical media's days are numbered. In any case, the PSN's prices could definitely do with being revised. I've seen sales from time to time but it's nowhere near as good as ones on Steam, GOG, etc. I definitely would not discard physical media now, just improve the digital service and offer incentives to buy games new instead of screwing people who do that with day one DLC.
Incentivisation is better than coercion.

Good prices on their digital download platform isn't going to make them friends to the retailers. A big consideration will be how much storage space will be offered by next gen consoles.

People with crappy download speeds or who can't connect to XBL/PSN for whatever reason would have no choice but to go retail anyway. That would describe my current situation, but when the next gen come out I expect that story will be different. Will be moving during the summer or before the end of it, anyway.

The Steambox will be providing motivation for good prices, though I'm sure.

ancapailldorcha

At home it's a 3 dongle so I know what you mean. Sony's a business at the end of the day and third party retailers have just about reached the end of their usefulness. The only concern is a lack of competition. On PC there's Steam, GMG, GOG, Origin, and others but Sony and Microsoft aren't about to allow alternatives to SEN and Xbox Live.

TheDoc

Considering my consoles gather dust underneath my PC, I'm not even sure if I will invest in this generation of consoles, most likely not even the Steambox as cool as it looks.

Will hold off until atleast six months after launch. New consoles typically have poor game selection and developers arnt harnessing the new console power. Nevermind the teething problems that come with all new consoles that inevitably require recall

Josey Wales

Now that the PlayStation Meeting is out of the way I am totally on board with buying a PS4 day one. Microsoft have some way to go to make me change my mind. I like the fact that they seem to be going all out on the tech side and said all the right things about trying to appease developers.

Pushtrak

Josey Wales wrote: »

Now that the PlayStation Meeting is out of the way I am totally on board with buying a PS4 day one.

Really? Obviously the games impressed you more than me. Don't get me wrong, they impressed me a lot more than I thought they would. The system architecture is very impressive and they've made some very sensible choices with the way they've built it. Gone is the cell processor which was a nightmare for devs to develop for, and gone is the 512 MB split memory, they've gone with unified memory which is a smart approach. And 8 GB GDDR5? Great stuff. Will be interesting to see what comes of their pricing talk of games too. So, yes, they look good.

Except... When it comes to games. They haven't showed off much yet. The best two things there were Watch Dogs which is going to be multiplat and The Witness which will be a timed exclusive. What is it that makes you want to buy it day one?

Microsoft have some way to go to make me change my mind.

What they'll have to do is show some quality stuff that'll be exclusive. They have a lot to compete with in terms of hardware. I think the nextbox will likely be weaker in terms of specs, so we'll have to see what games they'll have to offer.

I like the fact that they seem to be going all out on the tech side and said all the right things about trying to appease developers.

As do I but again, the day one buy, well I'm curious what games or if it was just this that convinced you.

NTMK

Pushtrak wrote: »

What they'll have to do is show some quality stuff that'll be exclusive. They have a lot to compete with in terms of hardware. I think the nextbox will likely be weaker in terms of specs, so we'll have to see what games they'll have to offer.

As do I but again, the day one buy, well I'm curious what games or if it was just this that convinced you.

MS' console is almost identical spec wise drr3 the only difference atm and that can and probably will change? Ms will probably up specs now that sonys are pretty much locked down

tok9

Sony would have to do something seriously stupid for me not to get a PS4. I'm not sure if I'll get it at launch or wait, it depends on the launch games and what will be coming soon after but I will get it.

There is no way it'll be priced as badly as the ps3 was. They've already confirmed an internet connection isn't necessary and used games will work.

The Vita streaming PS4 (I've a vita) was something I was very happy with but most importantly, even though we didn't see many exclusives, we know there will be.

I am interested in seeing what microsoft have to offer now as I've never had an xbox.

I've never really seen the point in getting one. The main reason for most seems to be that there friends have it and the controller. Most of my friends who have an xbox are very casual gamers and while I like the controller, I still prefer the dualshock but I've no issue using either.

They need a few exclusive games to get me interested.

Right now, I'm most likely to get a PS4 and further down the road get a Wii U when it comes down in price.

Pushtrak

tok9 wrote: »

There is no way it'll be priced as badly as the ps3 was. They've already confirmed an internet connection isn't necessary and used games will work.

Pricing? I wouldn't want to guess, but GDDR5 memory isn't going to be cheap. As for the internet connection, such a claim was highly dubious. Too many people just wouldn't be able to play on the system. Heck, even PC games are rare in the use of online being needed to play games, so no way would a system operate on that principle. I don't get why it was taken as so plausible.

I've never really seen the point in getting one. The main reason for most seems to be that there friends have it and the controller. Most of my friends who have an xbox are very casual gamers and while I like the controller, I still prefer the dualshock but I've no issue using either.

What? You looked up what games were exclusive to it and didn't find any you were interested in?

Varik

Pushtrak wrote: »

Except... When it comes to games. They haven't showed off much yet. The best two things there were Watch Dogs which is going to be multiplat and The Witness which will be a timed exclusive. What is it that makes you want to buy it day one?

As do I but again, the day one buy, well I'm curious what games or if it was just this that convinced you.

They didn't show a huge amount of games but I'm already a Killzone and Infamous fan (not so much of the announcement and the accompanying crazy paranoia).

Only thing that would put me off now is price, everything else looks great.

tok9

Pushtrak wrote: »

Pricing?

I'd be absolutely shocked if they priced it as badly as the PS3 and if they do I definitely won't be getting one at launch.

What? You looked up what games were exclusive to it and didn't find any you were interested in?[/QUOTE]

I haven't properly looked to be honest but no I can't think of anything on it that particularly interests me. I'll just have a quick google to see if I can find a list.

From memory the only game that interested me was Alan Wake.

GTR63

Wasn`t blown away the last night(no interest in Move or Vita & the IP`s were the tip of a next gen iceberg) & i`m kinda already dreading Microsofts one which I know will have a multicultural family of 6 playing the kinect acting impressed as I die inside. More interested in what 3rd parties will be offering me like the Withcher III, Cyberpunk & Watch_Dogs.

tok9

Just had a look at the wiki page regarding exclusives and there isn't any that interest me.

If I had an xbox I'd get halo but I'm not that bothered about it.

I'm more likely to get a PC as it looks like some exclusives move to PC after a while.