People's Front of Judea

yore

Apologies for trying to ape Scofflaws McDowell-tabloid-headline attention-drawing method, but I didn't notice any thread about the SP split from the ULA.

The PFJ reference is tongue in cheek, but partly close enough to the bone which is why it might rub people up the wrong way slightly. Do people here think that most of the left wing "movements" are destined to splinter and fracture like this? Personally I think that a lot of the people who rise to the tops of their respective "movements" are even more driven by a lust for power than any other from across the political spectrum.

Often I think they just pick a niche area where they have less competition or where they can play populist cards to the lowest common denominator in order to effect their personal rise to power. Big fish, small pond type of thing. Inevitably this will lead to a scenario where they don't want to share power. "It's my way, under my rules and I'm the boss or I don't want to play anymore".

Does anyone agree with me?

What now for the ULA? Will they re-brand as the "LA"?

Despite the attention seeking headline, it's not really a discussion of their politics or the rights or wrongs thereof, just whether people think there could ever be a serious far left coherent movement that would last for long enough to ever do anything? Obviously, this can't be mutually exclusive to their policies in the sense that they can use their policies as the reasons to splinter rather than compromise, but the question is more on whether that compromise will ever be a realistic possibility. Are the personalities and egos too big?

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2013/0127/breaking8.html

goose2005

Any fringe movement is likely to attract a larger proportion of oddballs than a mainstream party - for example, the far right in the UK is also very fractious (wikipedia lists Blood and Honour, British Freedom Party, British National Party ,British People's Party, Casuals United, Christian Council of Britain, Combat 18 ,England First Party, English Defence League, International Third Position, League of Saint George, National Front, National Socialist Movement, Nationalist Alliance, November 9th Society, Racial Volunteer Force, Redwatch, Stop Islamisation of Europe) A broad-church left party like Die Linke in Germany would have a decent chance of effecting real change in Ireland, but Irish Labour are too conservative and apathetic for that.

yore

goose2005 wrote: »

Any fringe movement is likely to attract a larger proportion of oddballs than a mainstream party - for example, the far right in the UK is also very fractious (wikipedia lists Blood and Honour, British Freedom Party, British National Party ,British People's Party, Casuals United, Christian Council of Britain, Combat 18 ,England First Party, English Defence League, International Third Position, League of Saint George, National Front, National Socialist Movement, Nationalist Alliance, November 9th Society, Racial Volunteer Force, Redwatch, Stop Islamisation of Europe) A broad-church left party like Die Linke in Germany would have a decent chance of effecting real change in Ireland, but Irish Labour are too conservative and apathetic for that.

That's a crazy long list of UK groups. Most are probably just attempts at a public front to self-justify intolerance and bigotry.

I guess my point as that every few years these groupings come together to herald a new dawn, only to disintegrate and implode a few years later. Then the cycle continues with a new band of cheerleaders or else old cheerleaders with short memories.

And not mentioning anything in specific, innocent til proven guilty etc, but seeing as how some rumours came to notice since my post, it'd be interesting to see what would happen if one of their number was convicted of a reasonably serious offence. Would the other two remaining TDs try to push him/her out? Principles and "new politics" and all that jazz. I guess we might find out in a week or two when this becomes a non-hypothetical situation one way or the other.


.......And then there were two? Unlikely?

Victor

I think it was nesf described them as the Socialist / Workers Party - as in 3 parties (SWP, SP, WP) in 1 name.

goose2005

Victor wrote: »

I think it was nesf described them as the Socialist / Workers Party - as in 3 parties (SWP, SP, WP) in 1 name.

Not really, the WP is republican and linked to the Official IRA. SWP and SP are very similar though, I think it's mostly that SWP don't like Higgins.

nesf

Victor wrote: »

I think it was nesf described them as the Socialist / Workers Party - as in 3 parties (SWP, SP, WP) in 1 name.

Did I?

FTA69

The Workers' Party were never in the ULA.

Boulevardier

Never, ever let trots get involved. They are the amoebas of politics. Irish trots really do bear out the maxim that the first item on the agenda in any Irish political group is the split.

Victor

nesf wrote: »

Did I?

It was some poll a long time ago. EDIT: Found! http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=53155886

FTA69 wrote: »

The Workers' Party were never in the ULA.

That's the problem with factions - lack of identity and recognition from the public.

nesf

Victor wrote: »

It was some poll a long time ago. EDIT: Found! http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=53155886

That was me lumping the two parties under the same heading because of a lack of option spaces when setting up polls.