why are there no J D Wetherspoon pubs in ROI?

Irish Halo

homerjay2005 wrote: »

completely agree here, but its not only them thats driving up the prices - the government take in about 40% on every keg and landlords/insurance companies make a fortune off pubs also.

the overheads on pubs are huge, hence the high price.

I think that was the point Wetherspoon's are not exempt from all that and are charging lower prices

awec

Larbre34 wrote: »

I was in the Blackrock Wetherspoons (Three Tun) myself on Saturday evening and it was packed out. A good many had come off the train from the match in Lansdowne Road.

I was there with 4 others and we had trouble getting a table for a good hour, but there is a serious issue with that - the bar is not a bar in the traditional sense, it is just an ordering counter with no stools, so you can't use it if all the tables are busy, as everyone in the place has to come and order all food and drink at it, so you find yourself squeezing into nooks and crannies.

The beer is comedy cheap and the food is varied and average quality for pub grub and also very cheap.

But, as my group were discussing, there is something lacking about it. It feels more like a family restaurant than a pub. The lighting is all wrong for evening time. The bar feels more like a check-in at an airport than a bar. And despite the huge range of beer supposedly available, most of it was out of stock due to a "busy night" on the Friday - you would have thought they'd be up to speed with consumption patterns by now.

After it all we decided it would be fine for a quick stop off or a meal with the kids in tow but that we wouldnt meet for a whole night out in it again, despite the savings. Although for the the very price concious and younger crowd its definitely providing a worry for the local competition.

The atmosphere is like a café that happens to sell booze. That's what Wetherspoons aim for.

anncoates

I wish people would stop saying it's 'not to Irish tastes', as if smelly toilets, extortionately priced drink and a few aul lads at the bar with betting slips is somehow the de rigeur Irish drinking experience.

And drink cannot be too cheap. The Irish market is crying out for price competition and people's consumption of drink is their responsibility or that of the pub.

Some of the arguments against JDW in this country are almost scripted by Diageo and VFI.

awec

anncoates wrote: »

I wish people would stop saying it's 'not to Irish tastes', as if smelly toilets, extortionately priced drink and a few aul lads at the bar with betting slips is somehow the de rigeur Irish drinking experience.

And drink cannot be too cheap. The Irish market is crying out for price competition and people's consumption of drink is their responsibility or that of the pub.

Some of the arguments against JDW in this country are almost scripted by Diageo and VFI.

There is no reason they can't sell cheap drink and have a bit of character about the place.

Why do so many people think the two are mutually exclusive? Selling cheap booze does not require that the place be bland.

o1s1n

Larbre34 wrote: »

The bar feels more like a check-in at an airport than a bar.
.

Funny you say that, as the only Wetherspoons I've been in was at a UK airport and I thought the exact same thing.

Actually I thought the place was a 'family bar/resteraunt' version of a Weatherspoons as it was in an airport and that the standard non airport ones are like pubs.

Seems I was wrong! :eek:

Muahahaha

Weatherspoons is never going to be for everyone and nor do they aim to be. They're primarily a food pub, they want to see most of their customers eat because there isn't an awful lot of profit in €2.95 pints of Heineken. In the same way that supermarkets are being accused of selling beer too cheaply to get people in the door Weatherspoons are doing the exact same thing here, which is great for the consumer IMO.

A successful Weatherspoons chain in Ireland will be good for the consumer overall. Even if you would never consider going to one if they establish themselves in Ireland and are seen to be successful doing so whilst paying all the overheads and taxes that every other pub in Ireland has to then they will have shown up the VFI & LVA as the bunch of rip off merchants that they are and that's no bad thing IMO.

Larbre34

Yeah in fairness their pricing model makes sense for themselves. If they sell a pint at 2.95, they only pay 1.15 or so in excise, whereas Jack O'Rourke's down the street pay close to €2 excise on a €5 pint. However Im sure Wetherspoons get Tesco like discounts for ordering stock for almost 1,100 premises centrally. There isn't an Irish pub or chain that could compete with that

homerjay2005

Irish Halo wrote: »

I think that was the point Wetherspoon's are not exempt from all that and are charging lower prices

they have a huge chain in the UK and can absorb certain costs. for instance, they probably have deals with suppliers across Ireland and the UK to bulk buy their products which means their overheads can be cheaper.

i would assume also that they as a group write off a certain % of their profits every year in buying new premises so essentially the new investment in blackrock is operating with their rent/mortgage seperating to their operating costs which gives them a huge advantage. their business model obviously works, its similair to the Dealz organisation - get people in the door spending money and you do this by having everything really really cheap.

mariaalice

I would like to see them get established in Ireland as a bit of computation never did anyone any harm.

anncoates

awec wrote: »

There is no reason they can't sell cheap drink and have a bit of character about the place.

What does 'character' even mean outside a vague, subjective judgement.

JDW aren't aiming for the old school boozer model here although the assertion that all their pubs in the UK are like airport lounges is wrong.

Basically they're not liked by many people here because of some weird nationalist dialectic: JDW (Bland, Brits, Chain, Bad) vs Pub (Irish, Unique, "character", Good).

This country desperately needs more players in the market that can break the monopoly here and it's a pity we don't see it fr what it is: choice, rather than an affront to a certain type of pub beloved to the Irish market, which incidentally I love, don't get me wrong.

The epithets of bland are bizarre too: as if the auld lad boozer here isn't in itself a rigid stereotype.

And even if it is a pub that just caters for people having a few beers at lunch or dinner before heading out: good enough. It doesn't have to be some Brendan Behan theme boozer to qualify as sufficiently Irish.

cloud493

How much is the food in there? Out of interest.

Beefy78

o1s1n wrote: »

Funny you say that, as the only Wetherspoons I've been in was at a UK airport and I thought the exact same thing.

Actually I thought the place was a 'family bar/resteraunt' version of a Weatherspoons as it was in an airport and that the standard non airport ones are like pubs.

Seems I was wrong! :eek:

There's no such thing as a standard Wetherspoons. There's huge variety across the brand based on which building they're in. There's many which are very 'pub' like and many which are not.

Larbre34

mariaalice wrote: »

I would like to see them get established in Ireland as a bit of computation never did anyone any harm.

You know what they say, 2+2=5

Lucena

Beefy78 wrote: »

There's no such thing as a standard Wetherspoons. There's huge variety across the bland based on which building they're in. There's many which are very 'pub' like and many which are not.

FYP;)

Irish Halo

Larbre34 wrote: »

However Im sure Wetherspoons get Tesco like discounts for ordering stock for almost 1,100 premises centrally. There isn't an Irish pub or chain that could compete with that

homerjay2005 wrote: »

they have a huge chain in the UK and can absorb certain costs. for instance, they probably have deals with suppliers across Ireland and the UK to bulk buy their products which means their overheads can be cheaper.

Are they doing that? It seems like a good idea but are they buying in the UK and shipping to Ireland? (This was definitely the problem with Diageo, that they were not allowed) Is that "wrong"? If they have obtained better rates from Irish suppliers how can they do it but not others? They only have one pub there are other Irish chains with more than that on the island.

I'm not a massive fan of Wetherspoons, there are better, and worse, pubs in the UK, but I think they will bring some competition to the Irish market and other publicans may benefit if they can get Diageo to back down in the long run on their prices.

dd972

Funny how this thread I initiated keeps popping up like the Loch Ness Monster !

Any word on how the 40 Foot W/Spoon in Dun Laoghaire's coming on ?


....16th December on their website, just checked.

suicide_circus

anncoates wrote: »

What does 'character' even mean outside a vague, subjective judgement.

JDW aren't aiming for the old school boozer model here although the assertion that all their pubs in the UK are like airport lounges is wrong.

Basically they're not liked by many people here because of some weird nationalist dialectic: JDW (Bland, Brits, Chain, Bad) vs Pub (Irish, Unique, "character", Good).

This country desperately needs more players in the market that can break the monopoly here and it's a pity we don't see it fr what it is: choice, rather than an affront to a certain type of pub beloved to the Irish market, which incidentally I love, don't get me wrong.

The epithets of bland are bizarre too: as if the auld lad boozer here isn't in itself a rigid stereotype.

And even if it is a pub that just caters for people having a few beers at lunch or dinner before heading out: good enough. It doesn't have to be some Brendan Behan theme boozer to qualify as sufficiently Irish.

The majority of irish pubs are actually pretty grim places to spend an afternoon.

drumswan

suicide_circus wrote: »

The majority of irish pubs are actually pretty grim places to spend an afternoon.

Theres also more variation in the JDW chain than there is in generic Irish pubs

awec

drumswan wrote: »

Theres also more variation in the JDW chain than there is in generic Irish pubs

Rubbish.

Ok, not everyone wants originality etc and that's fair enough, but the idea that they are more varied than other pubs is bollocks. Wetherspoons is a brand, you instantly recognise that as soon as you walk into any Wetherspoons pub the same way that McDonalds all look the same style inside. Minor variations of the same theme.

suicide_circus

awec wrote: »

Rubbish.

Ok, not everyone wants originality etc and that's fair enough, but the idea that they are more varied than other pubs is bollocks. Wetherspoons is a brand, you instantly recognise that as soon as you walk into any Wetherspoons pub the same way that McDonalds all look the same style inside. Minor variations of the same theme.

But the idea that all irish pubs are all these one off gems of character and a thousand welcomes is nonsense. Most irish pubs are drab and smell of piss.

awec

suicide_circus wrote: »

But the idea that all irish pubs are all these one off gems of character and a thousand welcomes is nonsense. Most irish pubs are drab and smell of piss.

Nobody is saying that they are all gems though?

mariaalice

awec wrote: »

Rubbish.

Ok, not everyone wants originality etc and that's fair enough, but the idea that they are more varied than other pubs is bollocks. Wetherspoons is a brand, you instantly recognise that as soon as you walk into any Wetherspoons pub the same way that McDonalds all look the same style inside. Minor variations of the same theme.

I have been in Weatherspoons in the UK and some of them are more pub(ish) that others, it depends on what the original pub they took over was like, but it is the same type of offerings in all the pubs.

Alun

You'd imagine that after 72 pages, the posters here would have figured out how to spell Wetherspoons, wouldn't you?

mariaalice

Alun wrote: »

You'd imagine that after 72 pages, the posters here would have figured out how to spell Wetherspoons, wouldn't you?

I have never made any secret of the fact that I cant spell, does it really matter that much I know its irritating but it is such a minor point.

Larbre34

Larbre34 wrote: »

Yeah in fairness their pricing model makes sense for themselves. If they sell a pint at 2.95, they only pay 1.15 or so in excise, whereas Jack O'Rourke's down the street pay close to €2 excise on a €5 pint. However Im sure Wetherspoons get Tesco like discounts for ordering stock for almost 1,100 premises centrally. There isn't an Irish pub or chain that could compete with that

How's that? Excise isn't a percentage, it's on the amount sold.

thesandeman

[Deleted User] wrote: »

How's that? Excise isn't a percentage, it's on the amount sold.

Think he's getting it mixed up with VAT.

Satriale

Alun wrote: »

You'd imagine that after 72 pages, the posters here would have figured out how to spell Wetherspoons, wouldn't you?

You'd imagine that after 12 years on boards a poster would have read the rules.

Vincent Vega

Alun wrote: »

You'd imagine that after 72 pages, the posters here would have figured out how to spell Wetherspoons, wouldn't you?

72?!?

You'd imagine after 12 years the posters here would have figured out how to 'Show 40 Posts Per Page'

:pac:

Baneblade

Deleted User wrote: »

How's that? Excise isn't a percentage, it's on the amount sold.

excise is paid by the brewers on what they produce.

Vincent Vega

dd972 wrote: »

Funny how this thread I initiated keeps popping up like the Loch Ness Monster !

Any word on how the 40 Foot W/Spoon in Dun Laoghaire's coming on ?


....16th December on their website, just checked.

https://www.facebook.com/thefortyfoot

Should be interesting to see how this affects Dun Laoghaire nightlife and what type of regulars it draws.