Feb 9th Protest - will you be joining?

Madam_X

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Why have it on a saturday? why not have it midweek when it will have more of an effect and see how many actually care as much as they claim instead of using it as an excuse for not going shopping with the wife on a saturday.

Maximum number of people not being at work. Well actually that's probably Sunday.
I don't care if it doesn't achieve anything - nothing wrong with demonstrating how people feel; and people need to be seen to be doing so, otherwise they'll just look complacent and resigned. Not doing anything at all is an even less palatable alternative.

Shinners taking part in the march doesn't mean they represent me or vice versa. All kinds will be at it. Saying people who attend will somehow be tarnished because of the presence of SF is silly and a cop-out.

Am Chile

Stained Class wrote: »

If you lie down with dogs, you'll get up with fleas.

Gwan down to march down with the Shinners & all the assorted Tramps this country can throw up & support with hardworking taxpayers money.

Go Cattle. Go !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Whist whist, giddiup now.,.

Because of people with attitudes like yourself who labels anyone with a dissenting voice and chooses to air their dissent via protest tramps are one of the reasons the country is where it is-you know for all the shinner bashing , last time I checked it wasn,t the shinners who got the country into a mess nor was it the shinners who brought the Imf here.

WakeUp

bluewolf wrote: »

Yeah, sitting around giving out is going to magic jobs out of thin air

No

Thats the spirit lets do nothing lets continue to be walked all over sure we are used to being fcked left right and center.

This country is being screwed wrongly we are being slowly bled to death and people have the neck to talk down or make snidey comments against people who are actually prepared to get off their arses and make a stand for our people and our country. There will be plenty of people that arent shinners or lefties including myslef or whatever terms people care to call them who will be making their voices heard. We need more than protest. We need a non-violent revolution the Republic needs to be overhauled what we have now isnt a Republic anymore how could it be. Time to get off our knees and fcking do something about it anyone going out to make their voices heard at these protests I salute you. Judging by some of the comments on this thread fighting Irish my bollix.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkp7tkeu22I

starviewadams

Been to a few of these,including the first one after Ireland was bailed out which had tonnes of international media etc at it,and a massive turnout which didn't make a blind bit of difference in the long run.All they are are places for trade unions to shout hot air,and considering I'm not a member of one,I couldn't be arsed freezing my balls off and wasting one of my days off.

KyussBishop

Doc Ruby wrote: »

Here's what yourself and the Untied Alliance aren't getting. The status quo, dire as it is, is still preferable to the North Korea-like situation those yahoos would leave us in.

No amount of calling people sheep is going to make them sign up for that.

Ireland is not your personal army.

What yahoo's? I'm not arguing in favour of the United Alliance, or North-Korea style policies.

There isn't a dichotomy between maintaining the current status quo, and going full-on totalitarian like North Korea; there are perfectly reasonable policies that can be undertaken at an EU level, which can wipe out the interest payments on our debt, and can fund widescale investment programs, without many really big changes in EU configuration (these policies don't even require the issuance of new money, just restructuring bond issuance at the EU).

Pete M.

There's definitely an element of marching us all to the top of the hill and then marching us back down, but fcuk it, I'll still be there. And the next one as well.

Am Chile

Fulton Crown wrote: »

Protest marches ? ...nah ! Not me pilgrim.

Packed with leftie trouble makers

Duffle coated crusties

Skangers in track suits...those saggy grey ones (so suitable for the Irish complexion).

Arse holes with whistles and loud hailers....urging people to chant slogans.

Ming Flanigan / Claire Daly / Mick Wallace.

Nah compadre ...not for me ...gotta clean the brake dust from my alloys.....:cool:

Online video put together with ordinary working people giving their own reasons why they will be protesting, my oh my just look at all those skangers,crusties and leftie trouble makers- (Sarcasm ):):):o:rolleyes:

http://vimeo.com/58711943

KyussBishop

starlings wrote: »

If I heard a constructive, feasible solution to the debt crisis, I would get behind it. The onus is really on the protest to make a coherent argument - then the public can join, or not, depending on their agreement with the message.

I have been on protests, but only those with a clear message about an issue, e.g. the X Case, U.S. troops in Shannon, but I never argued with people to join me. It's a sorry day when we're arguing about going on the protest because the protest doesn't have a valid argument of its own.

Well, I disagree with a lot of the details of, for instance, ICTU's arguments behind the protest, but the general argument of 'jobs not debt' is pretty much a good, succinct summary of what is needed to end the crisis.

The EU can, in short order, reduce the burden of our debts by centralizing debts; we would still pay our debts, but we would not be paying punitive interest rates on the debt.

The EU can also setup a proper centralized investment program with 'Eurobonds', which could be used to directly fund job creation programs all over the EU.


These two policies are only the start of what could (and should) be done, and these don't even involve a complicated restructuring of the EU, because much of the legal/political institutions are already in place for providing this.


Of course, there are far more things which can and should be done, such as some forms of public/private debt relief, and other more powerful policies for funding job creation; the above are just (in my view) two of the most immediate and important stepping stones towards recovery and these other policies.

mockingjay

68 lost souls wrote: »

NO!

A protest of any sort is a waste of resources, we are in debt there is no way a protest of any sort will change that. If people organising the protests put that effort into organising startups or taking advantage of the budget benefits for research and design then we could maybe do something about the debt.

Guarda budgets are being cut and spending Money on policing these needless protests could have been spent to keep stations open.

Many many more reasons I disagree with protesting. Suck it up, get on with it and start getting ourselves out of debt rather than complaining about it.

Y

Don't agree with this at all, people power should prevail, this Government is watching the protesters throughout Europe and saying 'sure our lads don't mind at all - we'll push them a bit further' & further they go - when anyone stands up against them in force (pensioners) they back down. I think it's time we began to show them enough is enough, however the rest of the country is waiting for Dublin to rise, and if it all goes wrong, they'll say 'louts' but they won't get on the buses and support us. Enda needs a wake up call because he has no idea what's going on on the street & he'll push and push - and half of Dublin are waiting for the other half to rise and see how it goes, if its successful they'll be cheering them, if it bombs & the guards are called they'll be sitting watching the telly saying ooh I'm glad I didn't get involved! So Enda will keep pushing cause we'll keep on sitting on the fence - in poverty! Don't annoy me, history in a circle again, free state me nelly... As they led the leaders of the Rising down Thomas Street they were bombed with vegetables, and they're celebrating 100 years now -

Am Chile

Celtic Tiger to Celtic Tories would seem an apt way of summing up the story of Ireland in recent times. From poster child of free-market globalisation everywhere from Hungary to Honduras, the UK's nearest neighbour is now enforcing the most savage cuts in public-sector pay, child benefits and social welfare payments of any EU government. Such is the level of misery being endured by the increasingly bewildered citizens of this little republic that even Brian Lenihan, the

man

principally responsible for
inflicting it, has publicly acknowledged that fellow Europeans are "amazed at our capacity to take pain". The finance minister added, slightly boastfully: "In France there would be riots if you tried to do this."

http://www.presseurop.eu/en/content/article/171171-land-spivs-and-speculators

That comment alone from the late Brian Lenihan speaks a lot volumes about how the establishment views us all-we are viewed as quiet good boys and girls who will put up and shut up no matter what austerity measures they inflict on the nation,Brian Lenihan was 100 % correct in his comment other people in other EU countries wouldn,t quietly put up with the ongoing austerity measures like a lot of people here are.

NIMAN

No.

Zebra3

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

FFS you're taking about backbenchers who realistically have no real say in gov policy. Would you like someone protesting outside your house because your boss dictates unpopular decisions?

If you only knew how much work and hours most TDs put in you would be surprised. It isn't the people in the system that's the problem,its the system.

If you want to protest at them go to their constituency offices, or better still contact your local TD and see what they can do for whatever problem you have. I guarantee they'll at least try and help. Roaring slogans and abuse will get you no where.

Who said anything about roaring abuse? :rolleyes:

If a TD thinks they're gonna lose their beloved seat with people protesting outside, then they'll actually start putting pressure on ministers.

That's how the system works.

And I wouldn't be surprised at how much TDs work (although what qualifies as work may be debatable) though that has nothing to do with what we're discussing.

The HorsesMouth

Zebra3 wrote: »

Who said anything about roaring abuse? :rolleyes:

If a TD thinks they're gonna lose their beloved seat with people protesting outside, then they'll actually start putting pressure on ministers.

That's how the system works.

And I wouldn't be surprised at how much TDs work (although what qualifies as work may be
debatable) though that has nothing to do with what we're discussing.

We were talking about people wanting to protest outside the homes TDs. And yeah roaring abuse or whatever other way you want to put it has always been part of protests.

I have no problem with protesting. In fact, I think that its very powerful tool when used correctly (oaps case).

I'm simply saying that doing it outside the home of a TD is wrong. Someone mentioned that because our houses are under threat that theirs should also be. Which in my opinion is ridiculous.

Fulton Crown

Pete M. wrote: »

There's definitely an element of marching us all to the top of the hill and then marching us back down, but fcuk it, I'll still be there. And the next one as well.

Good man ! There's a support rally for the Quinns up in Belturbet this week end.

Big crowds expected ....bucket collection to help them fight the cute hoor bankers an solicitors down in Dublin.

Belturbet....... just go up via Ballyconnell past a huge gated mansion and a palatial hotel an golf course...it's just a few miles beyond that

Simple folks really.....deserve support.......:cool:

Furious_George

Fulton Crown wrote: »

No need for "studies" Sherlock...the dogs in the street know that there is a certain class of person who have no desire to work,are very well versed in how to extract the max from the Irish social welfare system.

Face reality my friend and quit the semantics......

Yes and every society has them. During the boom years unemployment was at approx 4%. It is widely accepted by economists that this rate is extremely low and in fact the natural rate of unemployment in Ireland should be more like 7-8%. That is the rate of employment that the economy can support when output is at its potential level. Therefore there are more people who want to work than there is work to go around, even during normal economic times.

I see the benefit in protesting the payment of the promissory notes. Firstly, if enough people turn up and protest, it sends a very strong message to the government that a large portion of the electorate are not happy with the current situation. Secondly, it shows the European leaders that the Irish taxpayers are not happy being burdened with private banking debt. We have been very quiet recently and maybe its time to let the European Commission and the ECB know how we feel.

This is a separate issue to austerity necessary for fiscal correction and I believe people would be more willing to take the pain of austerity if they knew we weren't handing over billions every year to pay off private banking debts.

tayto lover

Fulton Crown wrote: »

"A large number of people in Europe are under the impression that Irish people are happy with the cuts imposed on them ect." ?

Have you a study that backs this up my friend ?

Are Happy with the cuts......are you for real compadre ?

Now I know what's wrong with you.
You think the Government is you're friend too.
Wake up and smell the coffee.
They are using you to keep them in comfort. Not everyone is you're friend.

tayto lover

Stained Class wrote: »

If you lie down with dogs, you'll get up with fleas.

Gwan down to march down with the Shinners & all the assorted Tramps this country can throw up & support with hardworking taxpayers money.

Go Cattle. Go !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Whist whist, giddiup now.,.

I have little time for the Shinners but a lot less time for the FG party and their shills. You can't get any lower than those who sell out their own people for a little praise from a German politician. Best boy in the class indeed.

rolliepoley

The only way this goverment is going to listen to the people is if there was an uproar, so lets face it they wont because there is'nt going to be one, there is too many ( i dont want to get up off me arse and do something about it ) in this country and no marches is going to stop anything, unless as i said there needs to be an uproar.If everybody new there was going to be something happening rather than standing around listening to gobbledygook you would get people willing to stand up, actions speak louder than words.

Madam_X

It's a complex issue with a number of facets. It's not ALL the government's fault - there is a lot of whingers with a massively inflated sense of entitlement (and I'm not just talking about TDs). But that doesn't change the fact that many ordinary people have been screwed over, so I really can't understand condemnation of this march.

starlings

Madam_X wrote: »

It's a complex issue with a number of facets. It's not ALL the government's fault - there is a lot of whingers with a massively inflated sense of entitlement (and I'm not just talking about TDs). But that doesn't change the fact that many ordinary people have been screwed over, so I really can't understand condemnation of this march.

I don't condemn the march - not at all - but I am exasperated by what amounts to a call to arms without a clear target and tactics. Lots of people want to express their anger, and that's fair enough, but it's just too noisy for me. I'd rather kick a wall repeatedly, then go back to reading and thinking about how to deal with the problem. That might be called "doing nothing" about it, but I don't see how marching and shouting slogans at the government - and at each other - is any more effective.

IrishExpat

No, I'm saving my energy for the Easter Rising 2.0 at the 1916 Centenary.

What we need is an absolute reset.

Madam_X

starlings wrote: »

I don't condemn the march - not at all - but I am exasperated by what amounts to a call to arms without a clear target and tactics. Lots of people want to express their anger, and that's fair enough, but it's just too noisy for me. I'd rather kick a wall repeatedly, then go back to reading and thinking about how to deal with the problem. That might be called "doing nothing" about it, but I don't see how marching and shouting slogans at the government - and at each other - is any more effective.

Visibility of people's discontent is important though. That's about all I think it will do, but it's better than not, IMO.

starlings

Madam_X wrote: »

Visibility of people's discontent is important though. That's about all I think it will do, but it's better than not, IMO.

Quite. Visible, palpable and, hopefully, sensible.

hmmm

Madam_X wrote: »

Visibility of people's discontent is important though. That's about all I think it will do, but it's better than not, IMO.

Being angry is not a policy.

This will be trade unionists, random angry people and the usual socialist hangers on. Angry speeches will be given by union leaders earning 100k a year each. More speeches will be given by people feeding off the public trough. At the end everyone will go home to their nice houses, and complain about their "extreme poverty" while sipping a nice Bordeaux.

WakeUp

hmmm wrote: »

Being angry is not a policy.

This will be trade unionists, random angry people and the usual socialist hangers on. Angry speeches will be given by union leaders earning 100k a year each. More speeches will be given by people feeding off the public trough. At the end everyone will go home to their nice houses, and complain about their "extreme poverty" while sipping a nice Bordeaux.

What planet do you live on? what a ridiculous comment do you understand what is happening? do you or any of the people on this thread on their snidey horses understand what is going on and whats at stake? or are you all FG supporters trying to keep people calm. Anger is a gift when channeled and used correctly it has the power to change things when used properly. People going home to sip a nice Bordeaux lol er yeah ok.

homerjay2005

Madam_X wrote: »

It's a complex issue with a number of facets. It's not ALL the government's fault - there is a lot of whingers with a massively inflated sense of entitlement (and I'm not just talking about TDs). But that doesn't change the fact that many ordinary people have been screwed over, so I really can't understand condemnation of this march.

i wonder how many marching will be over paid-unionised workers who have been bleeding the state dry for years.

if a march was started to cut our spending on social welfare and invest the money in job creation instead, would you support it?

Dont call me Shirley

Tough call, I've been thinking I really should be doing something to protest but I don't like the fact that this is organized by the ICTU.

I think they've played their our current economic crises by pushing for crippling public service debt. I'd hate to think my part in demonstrating public discontent might be used to strengthen their hand in wage negotiations for privileged overpaid public servants/quangos/public funded 'not-for-profits'.

WakeUp

Fulton Crown wrote: »

Well said pal......and absolutely true.

The sad fact is these these are the "alternatives".

Bang of crusties and sharp faced skangers / shinners at these affaires is disgusting

Actually no. What is disgusting your attitude and people who subscribe to the same line of thought as you small minded and "stereotyping". We are not talking about alternatives we are talking about standing up to the people who are screwing our people wrongly. What is it about that, that you and your ilk cant get through your head?...

jank

The Irish public is like the boy who cried wolf. Moan about everything and then the serious stuff gets through unnoticed. What is the aim of the protest. What is the objective. If they are just a means to be angry it's a waste of time. Better off organising at the polls.

tayto lover

homerjay2005 wrote: »

i wonder how many marching will be over paid-unionised workers who have been bleeding the state dry for years.

if a march was started to cut our spending on social welfare and invest the money in job creation instead, would you support it?

You need to look back into your History and see why the Unions were founded in the first place. There is none where I work but I really wish there was.
If the Unions were never formed your conditions of employment would not be anywhere near as good as they are now.
Be careful what you wish for.
I know there are Union leaders who are screwing their members but that is besides the point at the moment.

WakeUp

jank wrote: »

The Irish public is like the boy who cried wolf. Moan about everything and then the serious stuff gets through unnoticed. What is the aim of the protest. What is the objective. If hey are just a means to be angry it's a waste of time. Better off organising at the polls.

Hows life treating you in Sydney? are you aware of the suffering of people back home? people keep asking what the objective is?? are you lot paying attention or just being obtuse on purpose? The Irish people dont moan about everything we are being wrongly screwed. This battle isnt just about out generations its about future generations why should they have to suffer too.

rolliepoley

They can march in this country till the cows come home and it still wont redeem anything and the simple answer is that there is no comradery, all for one and one for all, instead what we have is every man for himself whitch will never ever work.

jank

WakeUp wrote: »

Hows life treating you in Sydney? are you aware of the suffering of people back home? people keep asking what the objective is?? are you lot paying attention or just being obtuse on purpose? The Irish people dont moan about everything we are being wrongly screwed. This battle isnt just about out generations its about future generations why should they have to suffer too.

What suffering? I was back twice the last year. Plenty of eating and drinking never mind shopping to be had by all. That's what I saw anyway. People would swear that Ireland was like Germany in 1945. Ireland is still one of the richest countries in the world. What we can't afford anymore though ism one of the highest paid public sectors in the world. Unions have too much power in Ireland.

WakeUp

Stained Class wrote: »

This doesn't help much.

Nor does calling people like me lazy and apothetic.

People like me work hard, pay taxes & are too hard pressed to take a day off to run along side Shinners & Skangers.

I don't spend my days sitting by the fire eating crisps y'know.

Shame on you. People with your attitude is whats wrong with this country and is a barrier to us uniting as one cohesive unit and affecting change in my opinion of course. So anyone who protests is either a skanger or a shinner? yeah ok whatever what a stupid ill thought out comment to make.

WakeUp

jank wrote: »

What suffering? I was back twice the last year. Plenty of eating and drinking never mind shopping to be had by all. That's what I saw anyway. People would swear that Ireland was like Germany in 1945. Ireland is still one of the richest countries in the world. What we can't afford anymore though ism one of the highest paid public sectors in the world. Unions have too much power in Ireland.

Ah well youve been back twice, on holiday , what suffering?? is that a serious comment or do you live in a bubble. "Thats what I saw anyway" well thats that isnt it **** must be rosey and just grand. You talk of "we" yet live in Australia and are obviously oblivious to the hardships being foisted upon, wrongly, to the average man and woman on the street.

WakeUp

WakeUp wrote: »

Shame on you. People with your attitude is whats wrong with this country.

Here I thought it was the bankers, jayz

Cancel the protest lads, we've found the culprit

WakeUp

WallyGUFC wrote: »

We're all economists in here it seems. I'd love to see people here try to run the country. Protesting won't make a blind bit of difference apart from wasting Garda man hours and inconveniencing people going about their daily business i.e. it will achieve nothing.

Nonsense. Go read a history book and I think you will find that people power and getting out on the streets as brought about change since the dawn of time.

franktheplank

homerjay2005 wrote: »

if a march was started to cut our spending on social welfare and invest the money in job creation instead, would you support it?

I think that if you look at the figures you'd see there's actually huge room for cutting spending in the Dept of Social Protection without cutting welfare payments.

Before I start, I'm currently unemployed (through no fault of my own), I'm doing a springboard course and am confident to be back to work soon (having spent many years paying taxes). I find the 158 euros I live on (after rent) to be very hard to get by on, especially when I have to meet the costs of attending college.

The total budget for the dept of social protection is approx 20 billion, which is rightly seen as a huge burden on public finances. What's often overlooked is that just 4 billion of this goes to unemployment payments (and this at a time of particularly high unemployment). A lot goes on pensions, a lot goes on disability/lone parents payments. But by my estimates about 6-8 billion goes in some form to 'public servants'.

Aside from the half a billion spent yearly directly administering welfare payments, what's often overlooked is that this dept funds an awful lot of quango like 'not-for-profit' organizations. FAS is the one that's most well known, but there are a huge amount of training, anti-discrimination, community, advocacy groups etc that are funded under the guise of our welfare budget.

Most of these groups will have well paid CEO's, mgmt, professional administrators, advocates, community workers etc. In essence we have a 'poverty industry' in this country. While a small amount of this might be necessary to retrain people etc an awful lot of it has no real justification or proof of worth, other than to provide employment for middle-class professionals.

Aside from my own experiences, I know a good few unemployed people and I've never heard anyone praise or speak positively of the work done by these groups. A lot of their work is considered interference or just a nuisance by the people their supposedly working to advocate for/re-integrate to the workplace, protect from disadvantage, or whatever other nonsense you're having

My two cent's if something has to be cut, cut this!

WakeUp

bluewolf wrote: »

Here I thought it was the bankers, jayz

Cancel the protest lads, we've found the culprit

Well if it was up to people like you we would continue to be walked all over with no end in sight. I believe its simmering under the surface and eventually people will stand up. The question people like you and others on their snidey horses need to ask yourself is are you gona stand with us or against us.

WakeUp

68 lost souls wrote: »

NO!

A protest of any sort is a waste of resources, we are in debt there is no way a protest of any sort will change that. If people organising the protests put that effort into organising startups or taking advantage of the budget benefits for research and design then we could maybe do something about the debt.

Guarda budgets are being cut and spending Money on policing these needless protests could have been spent to keep stations open.

Many many more reasons I disagree with protesting. Suck it up, get on with it and start getting ourselves out of debt rather than complaining about it.

How do you know a protest or standing up to the people raping our country and people wont change things. Do you have a crystal ball? consult it much?

jank

WakeUp wrote: »

Ah well youve been back twice, on holiday , what suffering?? is that a serious comment or do you live in a bubble. "Thats what I saw anyway" well thats that isnt it **** must be rosey and just grand. You talk of "we" yet live in Australia and are obviously oblivious to the hardships being foisted upon, wrongly, to the average man and woman on the street.

Again how do you define hardship? Want to see hardship? Go to Africa. Was there as well last year. I can tell you right now which place had the better standard of living for he average man/woman.

By all means have your protest, it's a free country and all but it's a general waste of time if there are no clear objectives or goals to be achieved. It's more of a " sure lets do something" , " it will make me feel better".

bnt

Debt is not a problem in itself. It's just a number. But debt has costs attached, and anyone who lends you money expects to get paid for doing so. If you can borrow cheaply - great! But if you don't pay off your debts in time, and try to borrow more, expect to pay a lot for the privilege.

Ireland is in the latter situation, and I have no idea what a protest will do to change the economic situation. It's not the same in the USA, where the Federal Govt. can still borrow at low rates.

hatrickpatrick

68 lost souls wrote: »

NO!

A protest of any sort is a waste of resources, we are in debt there is no way a protest of any sort will change that. If people organising the protests put that effort into organising startups or taking advantage of the budget benefits for research and design then we could maybe do something about the debt.

Guarda budgets are being cut and spending Money on policing these needless protests could have been spent to keep stations open.

Many many more reasons I disagree with protesting. Suck it up, get on with it and start getting ourselves out of debt rather than complaining about it.

Why SHOULD we put up with paying bank debt? National debt sure, but bank investors can go f*ck themselves if they think they'll be taking money out of my pocket to pay for their own mistakes made through their own mind boggling stupidity. Not my problem and not yours.
Just because a corrupt former government saddled us all with that debt in order to protect their golfing buddies doesn't make it morally justified. Why should we accept it without a fight? Can you give one genuine reason why I should just bend over instead of making it as hard for them as possible?

To paraphrase the general from Matrix Revolutions: "I'm going to say this as simply as I can. If it's our time to die, it's our time. All I ask is, IF we have to give these bastards our lives.... WE GIVE 'EM HELL BEFORE WE DO."

If they're going to take our money, their lives are going to be made an absolute f*cking misery while they're at it. I honestly don't see why anyone opposes that. They have no right to it and rolling over is not going to help ANYONE.

ilovesleep

I'm holding some mixed bags really.

I can see that we have a deficit. The country not taking in enough money & that deficit has to close because money & lending is dry & the markets where the government borrow from were/are closed off from us. So the government has gone the route of austerity for this. Which is counterproductive because it takes money out from local economies & this leads to unemployment which adds to the governments spending &a lower tax take & then deficit is slow to close if at all. So it leads us around in circles.

Then there's the governments method to close this deficit - ie raising taxes, &cutting spending as a whole has been limited. There's many problems in Ireland & 1 is the governments spending. Raising taxes might help at raising revenue but it will do fcuk all in relation to the deficit. Spending should be matched to GNP.

I could go on & on here but I think I'll leave it for now & come back to it later. But yeah I think I'll go protesting next week.

WakeUp

jank wrote: »

Again how do you define hardship? Want to see hardship? Go to Africa. Was there as well last year. I can tell you right now which place had the better standard of living for he average man/woman.

By all means have your protest, it's a free country and all but it's a general waste of time if there are no clear objectives or goals to be achieved. It's more of a " sure lets do something" , " it will make me feel better".

Well Im glad its ok with you from the comfort of Australia that we can get out and protest if we so choose. I know all about the hardships of Africa though not wanting to sound crass it isnt the issue. The issue is our people our country not Africa. The objective is quite clear. Reduce the debt we have been wrongly saddled with its all very simple really.

hatrickpatrick

ilovesleep wrote: »

I'm holding some mixed bags really.

I can see that we have a deficit. The country not taking in enough money and that deficit has to close because money and lending is dry and the markets where the government borrow from were/are closed off from us. So the government has gone the route of austerity for this. Which is counterproductive because it takes money out from local economies and this leads to unemployment which adds to the governments spending and a lower tax take and then deficit is slow to close if at all. So it leads us around in circles.

Then there's is the governments method to close this deficit - ie raising taxes, and cutting spending as a whole has been limited. The problem is spending and raising taxes might help at raising revenue but it will do fcuk all in relation to the deficit.

And I go on and on here but I think I'll leave it for now and come back to it later. But yeah I think I'll go protesting next week.

None of that is in any way related to this protest, this protest is specifically and solely directed against bank debt. It's not about the deficit, general debt levels, austerity etc.

It's about a guy walking into a bookie, backing the wrong horse, and then mugging everyone else in the shop to recover the money he lost on the horse. That's literally what this is all about. Nothing more.

dvpower

WakeUp wrote: »

What planet do you live on? [...]

WakeUp wrote: »

[...] What is it about that, that you and your ilk cant get through your head?...

WakeUp wrote: »

Shame on you. People with your attitude is whats wrong with this country [...]

WakeUp wrote: »

Well if it was up to people like you [...]

Are you always this angry?

WakeUp

dvpower wrote: »

Are you always this angry?

Dont confuse anger with wanting to see change. Weve dont the whole be good Europeans suck it up and do what we are told and all its done has got us nowhere and being thrown back in our faces. Are you always so indifferent to your country and people being raped wrongly by a foreign entity??

Madam_X

rolliepoley wrote: »

They can march in this country till the cows come home and it still wont redeem anything and the simple answer is that there is no comradery, all for one and one for all, instead what we have is every man for himself whitch will never ever work.

Do you not see the irony of that statement?

Yes Jank, it's true Ireland is overall a grand country to live in in terms of quality of life, but that's not all there is to it. The economy is still screwed. The future still looks bleak. Ordinary people are paying for their mistakes during the boom, now it's only fair the powerful elites do so too. It is indeed a two-way street, but only one group seems to be having to clean up the mess.

jank

WakeUp wrote: »

Well Im glad its ok with you from the comfort of Australia that we can get out and protest if we so choose. I know all about the hardships of Africa though not wanting to sound crass it isnt the issue. The issue is our people our country not Africa. The objective is quite clear. Reduce the debt we have been wrongly saddled with its all very simple really.

If the issue then is not Africa are you going to protest the foreign aid it gets every year? A few billion to be saved there! Or is it more of " we hate the banks" make the times boomer again, please"

Australia rewards those who want to work yet three are still the same type of lefty socialst looneys here complaining about this or that. Very amusing really. People would rather camp out in martins place protesting against the Australian federal reserve instead of making a living. Hey it's a free country but seriously stop kidding use that you have some altruistic higher cause.