Xbox One - General Discussion (NO DISCUSSION REGARDING PS4 - MOD WARNING Post 6903)

Blazer

ShiverinEskimo wrote: »

Not every aspect. As long at that left thumbstick is in the unnatural position it is, it will always be inferior no matter what else they do. Very stubborn of them.

completely agreed..that's my only real complaint about it.

Otacon

ShiverinEskimo wrote: »

Not every aspect. As long at that left thumbstick is in the unnatural position it is, it will always be inferior no matter what else they do. Very stubborn of them.

Have you held the DS4? As I said, I don't think you can judge it without doing so. Your opinion may not change but it has for a number of the people I know who have used it.

The angle you hold the DS4 is completely different to the DS3 because of the 'handles' (not sure what the word is to describe them) both thumbs naturally fall on the sticks now.

Anyway, whatever your preference ends up being, the difference between both has definitely narrowed.

ZiabR

Otacon wrote: »

Have you held the DS4? As I said, I don't think you can judge it without doing so. Your opinion may not change but it has for a number of the people I know who have used it.

The angle you hold the DS4 is completely different to the DS3 because of the 'handles' (not sure what the word is to describe them) both thumbs naturally fall on the sticks now.

Anyway, whatever your preference ends up being, the difference between both has definitely narrowed.

The sticks are still side by side, it is an unnatural position. Sony had the chance to change their controller design this Gen but choose not to. Stubborn.

I dont think the Xbox design is patented because the new MadCatz's M.O.J.O console follows the design.

jimbob_jones

I saw this last night and thought I would post it...

Microsoft has put up a kind of FAQ for Xbox One

http://www.xbox.com/en-ie/xbox-one/facts

Apologies if it's been posted already.

Cheers J.

Pushtrak

Otacon wrote: »

I have raised this point before but for many, seeing the internals of the PS4 would be like looking into a sow's ear. Most people would have no idea how the airflow was designed or how the heat would be re-distributed.

It's true. If most people were to look at the internals of say, the 360, most people would never be able to point to potential issues that could arise for instance. The more technical press though, might have a thing or two to say on the issue though.

ShiverinEskimo

Otacon wrote: »

both thumbs naturally fall on the sticks now.

Both thumbs shouldn't naturally fall on both sticks. The idea of the off-set thumbsticks is that your left hand is permanently using the sticks while your right hand switches between the buttons and the thumbstick.

If as you say the thumbsticks are now both in the ergonomic position (which I doubt) then the buttons you use often with your right hand will now be awkward instead.

Either way you look at it, symmetrical thumbsticks go against natural gameplay and this is widely accepted and apparently ignored by Sony.

ZiabR

ShiverinEskimo wrote: »

Both thumbs shouldn't naturally fall on both sticks. The idea of the off-set thumbsticks is that your left hand is permanently using the sticks while your right hand switches between the buttons and the thumbstick.

If as you say the thumbsticks are now both in the ergonomic position (which I doubt) then the buttons you use often with your right hand will now be awkward instead.

Either way you look at it, symmetrical thumbsticks go against natural gameplay and this is widely accepted and apparently ignored by Sony.

Exactly my point. Either way you look at it, they should have changed their design but were too stubborn to do so.

CatInABox

Pushtrak wrote: »

It's true. If most people were to look at the internals of say, the 360, most people would never be able to point to potential issues that could arise for instance. The more technical press though, might have a thing or two to say on the issue though.

Yes, I'd say that I'd be more au fait with the thermals of a device than the average person, as would anyone that's built gaming pc in the past, but even then, understanding the thermals of a gaming pc is vastly different to understanding the thermals of a purpose built consumer device.

In truth, even with pictures of the internals, until websites like Anandtech get the consoles onto their test bench, there's very little point in speculating about it.

In saying that though, speculating is fun. Like so: "I think the heat of a thousand suns will shoot out the back of the PS4, melting anyone who gets too close."

heebusjeebus

Microsoft showed the internals to allay fears of another RROD. Sony don't need to do this so they wont.

Pushtrak

CatInABox wrote: »

In saying that though, speculating is fun. Like so: "I think the heat of a thousand suns will shoot out the back of the PS4, melting anyone who gets too close."

Oh yeah? Well I speculate that if anyone has both the Xbox One and PS4 on at the same time it'll cause a thermonucleic event, killing everyone in the immediate blast radius and later, the beginning of the Zombie apocalypse amongst survivors.

Grayditch

My fingers must be all wrong, I find the DS3 fine. I just prefer the size and triggers of the 360 controller, and that you plug your headset in there. DS4 seems to have sorted that, which is good. Each to their own, I guess.

Grayditch

Pushtrak wrote: »

Oh yeah? Well I speculate that if anyone has both the Xbox One and PS4 on at the same time it'll cause a thermonucleic event, killing everyone in the immediate blast radius and later, the beginning of the Zombie apocalypse amongst survivors.

Xenji

Always found the Gamecube controller to be the most comfortable, you can see that Microsoft took some inspiration from it, especially having the analog sticks in nearly the exact same position.

Otacon

ShiverinEskimo wrote: »

Both thumbs shouldn't naturally fall on both sticks. The idea of the off-set thumbsticks is that your left hand is permanently using the sticks while your right hand switches between the buttons and the thumbstick.

If as you say the thumbsticks are now both in the ergonomic position (which I doubt) then the buttons you use often with your right hand will now be awkward instead.

Either way you look at it, symmetrical thumbsticks go against natural gameplay and this is widely accepted and apparently ignored by Sony.

Actually, almost every game I play now uses both analog sticks and shoulder buttons far more that the D-pad and face buttons. The Wii U Pro controller actually has a similar design but swaps the analog positions as the 'handles' have more of an angle.

Grayditch

I actually like that Wii Classic Controller, with the handles.

ShiverinEskimo

Otacon wrote: »

Actually, almost every game I play now uses both analog sticks and shoulder buttons far more that the D-pad and face buttons. The Wii U Pro controller actually has a similar design but swaps the analog positions as the 'handles' have more of an angle.

Well I'm playing GTA V at the minute and I do lots of running (Mashing A), getting in and out of cars (Y) and changing weapons while driving (X) and closing the mobile phone when I accidently bring it up (B).

Different games will definitely require more (Platforms, RTS, RPG) or less button use (FPS, Driving) but the fact remains the right thumb needs the option whereas the left thumb is almost exclusively used on the stick - hence the Dreamcast, Gamecube, Xbox design of having the offset sticks.

ZiabR

Otacon wrote: »

Actually, almost every game I play now uses both analog sticks and shoulder buttons far more that the D-pad and face buttons. The Wii U Pro controller actually has a similar design but swaps the analog positions as the 'handles' have more of an angle.

You must only play Racing Sims then? I dont know many games that dont make good use of the face buttons.

Otacon

logik wrote: »

You must only play Racing Sims then? I dont know many games that dont make good use of the face buttons.

Almost all FPSes use the sticks and triggers far more than the face buttons. Actually SE mentioned GTAV - I find that when I play TPSes where I control the camera and aiming via the right analog, I end up using them far more.

Anyway, personal perference will obviously be personal for each person. My original point was that the difference between the XBO controller and the DS4 is minimal compared to the 360 controller and DS3. Read any hands-on impressions regarding both for confirmation of that or try them both yourself.

FAILSAFE 00

heebusjeebus wrote: »

Microsoft showed the internals to allay fears of another RROD. Sony don't need to do this so they wont.

The fact is Microsoft have confidently given their console for review while Sony cowers away in a corner talking about how great the PS4 is on a paper sheet.

Newaglish

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

The fact is Microsoft have confidently given their console for review while Sony cowers away in a corner talking about how great the PS4 is on a paper sheet.

Yeah, the inside of the PS4 is actually hollow. It's all one big fake. Dunno how they afforded to pay off all the developers to not mention it.

heebusjeebus

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

The fact is Microsoft have confidently given their console for review while Sony cowers away in a corner talking about how great the PS4 is on a paper sheet.

When has Sony ever shown the guts of a device before release?

Grayditch

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

The fact is Microsoft have confidently given their console for review while Sony cowers away in a corner talking about how great the PS4 is on a paper sheet.

FAILSAFE 00

heebusjeebus wrote: »

When has Sony ever shown the guts of a device before release?

The PS3 was launched in 2005, things have changed a lot online since then.

Sony are saying how powerful the PS4 is and how small it is which is great.....
I wouldn't spend my money on a next gen console that has PS4 stats and an inbuilt psu without hearing what an expert says about how well it's cooling works. I am surprised at the amount of people who have blind fate.

Otacon

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

The PS3 was launched in 2005, things have changed a lot online since then.

Sony are saying how powerful the PS4 is and how small it is which is great.....
I wouldn't spend my money on a next gen console that has PS4 stats and an inbuilt psu without hearing what an expert says about how well it's cooling works. I am surprised at the amount of people who have blind fate.

It's not blind fate. Sony are a superb hardware developer, across multiple fields. Their products have never been overly criticised for hardware issues - it is almost always software that let's them down.

Pushtrak

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Sony are saying how powerful the PS4 is and how small it is which is great.....
I wouldn't spend my money on a next gen console that has PS4 stats and an inbuilt psu without hearing what an expert says about how well it's cooling works. I am surprised at the amount of people who have blind fate.

You are essentially (unintentionally) making a good case for why not buying day one would be a good thing. If it had some killer app, then that would mitigate it in the giviing motivation to risk it... I don't see that in the launch line up for either console, to be honest. I don't think the internals will really be the proof. Only one thing can really do that. Time.

heebusjeebus

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

The PS3 was launched in 2005, things have changed a lot online since then.

Sony are saying how powerful the PS4 is and how small it is which is great.....
I wouldn't spend my money on a next gen console that has PS4 stats and an inbuilt psu without hearing what an expert says about how well it's cooling works. I am surprised at the amount of people who have blind fate.

That's your opinion, and maybe an opinion that was formed by Microsofts RROD debacle.
For me, I'm interested in the lineup of games and the tech specs of the machine.

ShiverinEskimo

It is true, Sony are expert electronics manufacturers. MS had to learn fast and that's why we saw RROD when they tried to miniaturise.

I've little doubt the PS4 will be built exceptionally well. But I have little doubt the Xbox One will be either given the lessons learned from the 360.

Also just for the record - the grammar nazi inside me wants you both to know it's 'blind faith'.

FAILSAFE 00

Otacon wrote: »

It's not blind fate. Sony are a superb hardware developer, across multiple fields. Their products have never been overly criticised for hardware issues - it is almost always software that let's them down.

Actually Sony has had many issues as well as Microsoft. Sony had YLOD and Microsoft had RROD. There have been plenty of Sony products with hardware issues I can assure you. The Sony Vaio laptops come to mind, known globally for their overheating issues, I owned 3 for work over a 6 year period.

I am going off course here. I believe Sony should be commended for getting a next gen console down to that size with an in built psu but I would have needed to hear from experts regarding how it works before preordering it. Surely they can only gain from showing the internals. It makes me think they fear some criticism about the console which in-turn might effect preorders.

ZiabR

I cant see the new Xbox being any less than quality built. They cant afford for any mistakes this time around, after the issues with the 360.

Grayditch

I can't think of much hardware Microsoft has done outside of the 360 which has been bad quality wise. The Zune, was supposed to have been of good build quality, and the first Xbox which from first hand experience seemed to be a tough enough piece of kit. The RROD was indeed a disaster, I don't know how much of a disaster, though when it came to affecting sales. I mean I did buy another 2 over the years, and did some friends BUT some friends of mine refused to replace theirs, and got a PS3 instead of another 360. Is it possible that even helped sales, if some people are on their second/third? Maybe.

I could be wrong, but it feels like the RROD fiasco happened while Xbox still had the upper hand in the console sales. A high Xbox One failure rate however, would be a major disaster, considering the PS4 seems to be launching stronger than it.