Xbox One - General Discussion (NO DISCUSSION REGARDING PS4 - MOD WARNING Post 6903)

CiDeRmAn

I'm not sure what sort of gamer a "core gamer" is.
I'm wondering is it the person who plays little other than military shooters online with their mates?
Is it someone with a broad gaming preference, not tied to one genre?

I am an avid gamer.
I have a rather large collection of both hardware and software.
I play games of almost every genre, barring one or two.

And almost everything about the Xbox One fills me with dread, at worst, and M'eh, at best.

It seems to offer little in terms of new kinds of games I can play.

It offers a lot in terms of proscribing how I am permitted to play them, even after I have paid for them.

And that latter point is terrible, but I could forgive it if there was something that really blew my mind, speaking of the former point.

And the same goes, broadly, for the PS4.

I think now is the time for another hardware manufacturer to strike.
Not sure how but I want a machine that is not trying to rebuild the tech in my living room.
I want a games machine that gives me the best gaming experiences.

Over previous generations this was the MD, the Snes, the PS, PS2 and 360, but now, in this coming generation?
There is little of exclusives, it all seems like, well, just more of what I'm already playing.

I think I'll give this generation a year until the companies see what works and what doesn't, they iron out the bugs in both hardware and software, not to mention firmware, and give us the console they really envisioned, just a year later, maybe autumn 2014, or maybe I'll just stick to the 360, PS3 and WiiU for a while, not to mention the 3DS, Ipad and Vita.

COYVB

bk wrote: »

Harder to say but I think the US market will end up a draw between them, which would be a fall for MS from the current generation

There are a lot of worried people in the NA market right now regarding how this will perform

CiDeRmAn

grizzly wrote: »

Any word on how long Microsoft will support Live on the 360 for?

Good question, because when that goes bang so will any support for your purchases, and when your volatile 360 goes bang and you pick up another, you can kiss goodbye at any hope of recovering your purchases.
Unless they do something nice, which is not really the business these people are in.

Stone Deaf 4evr

FutureGuy wrote: »

The general cosensus among the average joe is that One is fap material.

indeed, I watched the live show with my wife ( I found it a bit meh, but herself was blown away, she was comparing it to films like minority report and iron man.) I suppose when you're unversed in the tech, this stuff seems like magic alright.

Meesared

grizzly wrote: »

Any word on how long Microsoft will support Live on the 360 for?

It was working on the original Xbox up till 2010, 4.5 years after the 360 launch. Given the popularity of the 360 I wouldn't be surprised for it to last longer than the original Xbox

Stone Deaf 4evr

yeah, the installed user base is massive, plenty of life left in that old dog yet. If I pick up the xbox one, the 360 is being moved to another room for the skyplayer & netflix alone.

bk

WolfForager wrote: »

I'm not so sure. Companies like MS have massive market research resources and I'm sure they know what they're doing. They must have identified a gap in the market and at launch they'll focus their considerably sized marketing budget at that market.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. Sometimes market research can tell you what you want to hear rather then what you need to hear.

From what I'm reading over on the game sites, MS management are shocked and in disarray from the very negative feedback from the public. Which would indicate they weren't expecting this.

I really don't see this TV feature selling this device to anyone. No one is going to pay $400 to $500 for a glorified remote that only works half the time. It is just a gimmick. Goggle TV already does the same and more (better search functionality) for $100 and no one is interested in it.

As for the question about casual people reading the articles in the regular press and running out to buy it based on that, it doesn't work that way.

Casual people don't buy a €400 gaming consoles on release. Hard core gamers do. Casual gamers and consumers then mostly get introduced to the tech by going around to their hard core gaming friends house and trying it out there. Then when the price drops to €300 they might consider getting one for themselves.

News of the gimmicky nature and unreliability of the TV functionality will get out very quickly from the early adopters.

To be honest, if MS did this feature 5 years ago, it might have been interesting, but today the future of TV is Netflick / RTE Player type services.

I'm much more interested in the new Kinect, it is actually pretty amazing technology. I can even read your heart beat!

I think this could appeal much more to the casual audience. They should have put much more focus on Kinect and shown off next generation exercise, dance, karakoe and party type games, I think it would have gone down much better with casual gamers.

bk

You know that it is interesting to note that the PS3 had actually much better TV support and integration in the UK and Ireland then the One will!

You could actually buy a freeview / saorview tuner that plugged into the PS3 giving you a full TV EPG and you could actually record directly to the PS3's hard drive!

It was actually a pretty excellent device, not that many people ended up buying it.

sink

For sky+ boxes at least, they won't require HDMI-CEC as Sky have already an iPad app that allows full control over LAN, they could just implement the same protocols on XB1 and use the HDMI as a dumb video pipe.

Pushtrak

bk wrote: »

I think this could appeal much more to the casual audience. They should have put much more focus on Kinect and shown off next generation exercise, dance, karakoe and party type games, I think it would have gone down much better with casual gamers.

Expect that at E3.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-05-23-microsoft-registers-kinect-one-and-kinect-fitness-domains

Along with proper games (in case anyone nearly had a fit :P)

Ryuji_w

Pushtrak wrote: »

I couldn't care whether people assess a console as "games + media" or "media + games." What I care is the caliber and quantity of games. People seem to think the very fact something has an extra feature, it takes away from other features. No, this isn't a rope that is in a two way tie, or focused more one way or the other. There are two ropes, to pursue the metaphor*.


Ropes suck as an metaphor, but I didn't want to think about it for 10 minutes to come up with something better.

i'm try to articulate my point if i can
see pic attached for context

basically that's what i see they are both gonna have games and media,
only ps4 is closer to games than media for me at the moment
xbone is closer to media than games
i'm a gamer i want whatever one focuses on games it's okay to have the extra media stuff but the ultimate focus should be on games for me personally

microsoft's attutide is far right with games as an extra for me
Ps4's attitude is far left with media as an extra for me

this could all change at E3 but for me microsoft would have to get rid of mandatory kinect and 24hr check-up before i even consider getting it
while sony would have to basically do what microsoft are doing now at E3 to alienate me
in which case it's pc gaming and wii U for exclusives

MrVestek

bk wrote: »

You know that it is interesting to note that the PS3 had actually much better TV support and integration in the UK and Ireland then the One will!

You could actually buy a freeview / saorview tuner that plugged into the PS3 giving you a full TV EPG and you could actually record directly to the PS3's hard drive!

It was actually a pretty excellent device, not that many people ended up buying it.

I made a similar point to my Facebook friends that were raving about the Xbox One there the other day.

'Hey who here remembers the time when everybody rushed out to buy the DVR addon for the PS3?'

Everyone was like 'what?!'

Which was exactly my point.

Pushtrak

Ryuji_w wrote: »

basically that's what i see they are both gonna have games and media,
only ps4 is closer to games than media for me at the moment
xbone is closer to media than games
i'm a gamer i want whatever one focuses on games it's okay to have the extra media stuff but the ultimate focus should be on games for me personally

You were expecting to see a fully featured games show at the reveal, was it? See, I went in to this with my expectations muted. I had read either this article, or another source that said the same thing: http://www.joystiq.com/2013/05/17/greenberg-teases-xbox-reveal-says-e3-is-all-about-the-games/

The only thing that was really given away at the reveal was that there will be 15 exclusives, 8 of which are going to be new IPs. Now, we don't know the quality of those titles yet, but I think your illustration isn't a fair representation of the facts.

NotorietyH

bk wrote: »

Casual people don't buy a €400 gaming consoles on release. Hard core gamers do. Casual gamers and consumers then mostly get introduced to the tech by going around to their hard core gaming friends house and trying it out there. Then when the price drops to €300 they might consider getting one for themselves.

I said something similar in another thread. I think Microsoft may have overlooked just who influences the purchases of entertainment products in a household. I think they're looked at the entertainment usage of the 360 now, with half of people using it to stream Netflix etc. but this was after they had a massive install base. People had bought a console for games and ended up using it as a media centre. It wasn't the parents who decided to buy a 360, it was the kids asking for it and the parents found a second use for it.

Maybe their market research has indicated otherwise, but I think its a risky move. If they alienate early adopters, the average gamer age is around 30 now I think, so they won't necessarily be influencing parents, but still they might struggle to get the more casual people on board. My parents always ask my recommendation for a new entertainment device and it's often me buying one for them. My nephews too would be influenced by me a bit I think. Of course, it could be like the Wii, where voice and gesture control replaces motion control as that magic-like hook for people. I don't know though, the latest SMART TVs are coming with gesture controls and already have netflix and the like built in. I got an older model a few weeks back and have media-streaming, netflix, and everything I need in terms of an all in one box built in in my TV, and that's going to be become more the norm. I very rarely watch live TV these days, except for sports, and I use my iPad to browse the net, probably with much more ease than having an app snapped to the side of the screen.

I think Microsoft maybe trying to find a solution to a problem that no one really thinks exists, and I think it's a bit of a misnomer calling it an all in one box, implying it's the only one you'll ever need when you'll still need your cable or satellite box. The people who care most about streaming probably already have at least one device that can do it too so there's no real impetus for them to get one. Between my PS3, 360, TV, AppleTV and PC I've well covered, and never find it frustrating, as if I want to stream something I'll just use whichever device I'm using at the time.

It's a weird one, because I've a nagging feeling that it's going to be successful, despite being largely redundant. I think Microsoft are in a way trying to do an Apple, like with the iPad, answer a question no one asked but suddenly make you want it more than anything. They might be able to pull it off.

EDIT: Being able to record programmes is a massive thing too, if the XOne doesn't record, then it's really shooting itself in the foot, as pretty much everyone records stuff rather than watching it live these days.

bk

sink wrote: »

For sky+ boxes at least, they won't require HDMI-CEC as Sky have already an iPad app that allows full control over LAN, they could just implement the same protocols on XB1 and use the HDMI as a dumb video pipe.

The problem with that is that it isn't an industry standard code.

So MS would need to go write code to interact with the different protocols of every set top box in the world!

And this is assuming Sky actually want to allow them to do this. Remember what I posted earlier, Sky want to be at the center of your entertainment world, not pushed to the side.

Also control over LAN tends to be slow and laggy in reacting to the users input.

I know all this might look awesome in a tightly controlled demo. But when it gets out there in the real world and you put it in front of your girlfirend/wife, trust me it better work rock solid I'll you'll end up sleeping on the sofa by the end of the week.

Ryuji_w

Pushtrak wrote: »

You were expecting to see a fully featured games show at the reveal, was it? See, I went in to this with my expectations muted. I had read either this article, or another source that said the same thing: http://www.joystiq.com/2013/05/17/greenberg-teases-xbox-reveal-says-e3-is-all-about-the-games/

The only thing that was really given away at the reveal was that there will be 15 exclusives, 8 of which are going to be new IPs. Now, we don't know the quality of those titles yet, but I think your illustration isn't a fair representation of the facts.

ehh did i ever say a full games reveal i didn't watch it, i missed it, came on after to absolute uproar on gamefaqs, neogaf, twitter and youtube with microsoft dodging questions left, right and center with thier twitter saying one thing then thier vp saying another in interviews as i said in another post i would have been fine with a 5 min gameplay( could have consisted of Cod, Fifa,Forza and some Qantum break) trailer showcasing the power of the new system at the end of the reveal.

yeah 15 new exclusives how many are kinect plus as i said it could all change at E3 they could have a savage line-up but i can see myself waiting at least a year before getting either anyway cause i've a backlog of games on 360 i want to play

Ryuji_w

Xbox One Pros:

• Extremely fast switching between tasks (TV, movies, skype, etc.)
• Kinect seems much improved with 1080p quality and more accurate tracking
• ESPN partnership
• 300,000 servers for Xbox Live, according to Microsoft this will allow for "living and persistent worlds" (MMOs, anyone?)
• Controller seems mostly the same except with improved d-pad
• Compatible with Smartglass
• Constant low power state
• Download games while you play
• Capture and editing software (very lightly touched upon during the event)
• Kinect voice commands (useful for when you're holding something, such as food)
• Triggers have feedback
  Xbox One Cons:
• Used games fees (Lots of conflicting info at the moment; policies not finalized)
• Requires a connection to the internet once every 24 hours
• Significantly less powerful than PS4 (Source 1, Source 2)
• Kinect is apparently required to use the console
• No Backwards compatibility
• Most likely going to have to pay to play online
• Microsoft will not allow indie devs to self publish (for XBLA, if XBLIG is carried over this will be possible, also, Microsoft is apparently working on a plan to allow ALL creators to "be a part of the future of Xbox One")
• Microsoft has not talked about how or if services like their TV, Music, and other services will work outside of the US, as there are usually complications involved with that kind of thing
• Kinect voice commands could possibly used by others to troll or other shenanigans
• 5 gb ram available to devs
  PS4 Pros:
• You can play games/demos while they are downloading
• Pressing a button puts the console into "low power mode" and when pressed again pick up right where you left off
• Share button lets you capture footage and upload it (dedicated capture/compression)
• Ability to stream games to friends
• 8gb GDDR5 Ram (7gb available to devs)
• Dualshock controller seems larger and the triggers/analog sticks seem improved (touchpad added, but I don't know if I consider that a pro or con)
• Sony lets indie devs self-publish games, making it easy to get on the store
• Cross-play with Vita
• Compatible with PS Move
• Download games in the background
• GPU 50% faster than Xbox
• Mobile app that will tie in with PS account
  PS4 Cons:
• No backwards compatibility
• It's been hinted that publishers might be able to choose to block used games

found on reddit, nice list

Headshot

A PS4 con, ****ing social gaming crap

GottaGetGatt

I wonder will they increase party chat size?.Was this even touched in the PS4 reveal?.In game voip was supposed to be crap for battlefield on the PS3.

PhlegmyMoses

Voice commands used to troll? WTF?

Meesared

Yeah apparently that's not gonna be the case, since the new Kinect will be able to tell where you are, and where the voice is coming from, and if they aren't matching, it ignores it.

stevenmu

bk wrote: »

To be honest, if MS did this feature 5 years ago, it might have been interesting, but today the future of TV is Netflick / RTE Player type services.

I suspect that all the TV functionality was planned at the time when it looked like Google TV could be a huge success, and Microsoft felt like they had to compete with that.

I agree that the future of TV seems to be with digital VoD services. There have been rumours for a few years that MS have been working on their own service. I'm a little surprised that it didn't arrive with the Xbox One.

PhlegmyMoses

Meesared wrote: »

Yeah apparently that's not gonna be the case, since the new Kinect will be able to tell where you are, and where the voice is coming from, and if they aren't matching, it ignores it.

Yeah, but how is it a con? That's a bizarrely negative way of looking at things. Ooh, I don't want that because my mate is a bit of a dickhead.

A con for PS4 is that the controller still looks inferior to the Xbox controller. Will have to try it out so I'll reserve judgement.

What way are Sony doing their cross party chat?

NotorietyH

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Voice commands used to troll? WTF?

Shout Xbox Off over your headset in the middle of a game of COD and anyone who has the game chat running through their TV speakers will have their Xbox shut off.

People with Kinects connected to their 360 kept getting cut off from the live stream of the reveal as their kinect responding to the commands that were being given in the presentation. When ever the guy in the presentation said "Xbox go home," they were cut from the stream and dumped back to the home screen. Massive potential for trolling. Just cover up the mic on your Kinect and go wild.

EDIT: Didn't see the above response, hopefully it is something they've recognised and fixed.

Meesared

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Yeah, but how is it a con? That's a bizarrely negative way of looking at things. Ooh, I don't want that because my mate is a bit of a dickhead.

A con for PS4 is that the controller still looks inferior to the Xbox controller. Will have to try it out so I'll reserve judgement.

What way are Sony doing their cross party chat?

Sony have been very coy on multiplayer features, it would be a bizarre omission if it was left out again

PhlegmyMoses

NotorietyH wrote: »

Shout Xbox Off over your headset in the middle of a game of COD and anyone who has the game chat running through their TV speakers will have their Xbox shut off.

People with Kinects connected to their 360 kept getting cut off from the live stream of the reveal as their kinect responding to the commands that were being given in the presentation. When ever the guy in the presentation said "Xbox go home," they were cut from the stream and dumped back to the home screen. Massive potential for trolling. Just cover up the mic on your Kinect and go wild.

EDIT: Didn't see the above response, hopefully it is something they've recognised and fixed.

Meh, I play online through a headset. Even if they hadn't fixed it, they'd want to have some loud and clear voice to carry from headset speakers.

PhlegmyMoses

Meesared wrote: »

Sony have been very coy on multiplayer features, it would be a bizarre omission if it was left out again

Agreed. That right there is something that would make me sway one way or the other. It's an important facet of my online gaming experience.

ahnowbrowncow

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Agreed. That right there is something that would make me sway one way or the other. It's an important facet of my online gaming experience.

PS4 has cross party chat

http://www.ps4nexus.com/ps4-will-support-cross-game-chat/

PhlegmyMoses

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

PS4 has cross party chat

http://www.ps4nexus.com/ps4-will-support-cross-game-chat/

Be interesting to see how this will be done. I remember thinking I wanted to see this at the Sony reveal.

COYVB

Our Xbox One unit arrived today!

http://i.imgur.com/zlUK6sD.jpg