Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Super-di-dooper-thread 12/13

yabadabado

Maybe he didn't give some players a chance because they weren't good enough. Not like Rodwell has lit up City this year but Everton got a good fee for him.

Mr Whirly

Kharrell wrote: »

I totally agree that Everton should be doing more to blood in young players but if they aren't good enough what can he do?

A lot of people think that the under 21's side has some very promising players but they were not given a chance. They're flying in this new under 21's league this season. Hopefully we'll find out with the new manager.

Mr Whirly

yabadabado wrote: »

Maybe he didn't give some players a chance because they weren't good enough. Not like Rodwell has lit up City this year but Everton got a good fee for him.

City started Rodwell until he got injured. He's been pretty much injured for most of the season.

You might be right and they might not be good enough. Lots of people in the know don't think that's the case though.

Kharrell

Mr Whirly wrote: »

A lot of people think that the under 21's side has some very promising players but they were not given a chance. They're flying in this new under 21's league this season. Hopefully we'll find out with the new manager.

But its different being good enough for the under 21's and the Premier League. You only have to look at how well the likes of Chelsea and us do at younger levels and how many of those players make the huge step up

Kharrell

Mr Whirly wrote: »

City started Rodwell until he got injured. He's been pretty much injured for most of the season.

You might be right and they might not be good enough. Lots of people in the know don't think that's the case though.

Rodwell has been injured pretty much his whole career. He has the potential to be something special if you can keep him fit

Mr Whirly

Kharrell wrote: »

But its different being good enough for the under 21's and the Premier League. You only have to look at how well the likes of Chelsea and us do at younger levels and how many of those players make the huge step up

Yeah that's fair enough. I think utd have had a great policy of bringing youth players through and giving them a chance. I'm just sceptical that Moyes will continue that policy, only time will tell though.

Kharrell

Mr Whirly wrote: »

Yeah that's fair enough. I think utd have had a great policy of bringing youth players through and giving them a chance. I'm just sceptical that Moyes will continue that policy, only time will tell though.

Well when you look at how many he has produced at Everton the signs don't look good but i would like to think we have better youth at United. Daehli, Powell, Januzaj, M. Keane etc

Mr Whirly

Kharrell wrote: »

Well when you look at how many he has produced at Everton the signs don't look good but i would like to think we have better youth at United. Daehli, Powell, Januzaj, M. Keane etc

Lets hope you get a look at them before they're 25.

Necronomicon

I've only had fleeting access to the news since the announcement is made.

Is it known at this stage how the back-room staff roster will change, if at all?

Pro. F

NotorietyH wrote: »

Interesting article in the Guardian on Moyes' tactics.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2013/may/09/david-moyes-tactics-manchester-united-everton

Good article. I agree with the conclusions that his style has been reactive and direct. I hope that with better players he ends up emphasising possession more, but he is just as likely to become more conservative when he finds himself managing in the higher profile games.

yabadabado

Mr Whirly wrote: »

City started Rodwell until he got injured. He's been pretty much injured for most of the season.

You might be right and they might not be good enough. Lots of people in the know don't think that's the case though.

he started 2 of of 5 games before he was injured.He has been injured most of his career and until that improves it hard make a judgement on him.
The majority of players don't make an impact at a club until they are 21/22 unless they are an exceptional talent,Moyes did OK with the youth he had but it will be interesting to see how he does at United.I think its more exciting how he did with the players he bought in for good value when they were young and developed them into EPL players,that is similar to the United model the past ten years .

DM_7

Why would any manager pick teenagers ahead of superior and more experienced players?

Teenagers that get into senior sides that have quality senior players available are always exceptional talents.

Rodwell had over 100 games for Everton before his 21st Birthday.

Barkley was sent on loan to get experience then got some game time when he came back this season. That is text book.

Moyes knows how to develop players. If that is a guy bought cheap and in need of a lot of development like Coleman, an expensive signing like Fellaini he knows what he is doing or a stand out young player like Rodwell/Rooney.

The progression of guys like Baines, Arteta, Jagielka, Lescott, Pienaar, Osman, Cahill points to a man that has an eye for talent and recognises potential.

Cantona's Collars

Here's the playlist for the music before Sunday's game as part of the party for Ferguson.



A few friends of mine are heading over,it's gonna be a memorable day.I've a program ordered with one of them.

Kerrydude1981

zerks wrote: »

Here's the playlist for the music before Sunday's game as part of the party for Ferguson.



A few friends of mine are heading over,it's gonna be a memorable day.I've a program ordered with one of them.

Probably head to the pub myself,me and lads having one last bozze up,fair play to SAF he has been the cause of a many bozze up and unreal hangovers

Mr Whirly

DM-ICE wrote: »

Why would any manager pick teenagers ahead of superior and more experienced players?

Teenagers that get into senior sides that have quality senior players available are always exceptional talents.

Rodwell had over 100 games for Everton before his 21st Birthday.

Barkley was sent on loan to get experience then got some game time when he came back this season. That is text book.

Moyes knows how to develop players. If that is a guy bought cheap and in need of a lot of development like Coleman, an expensive signing like Fellaini he knows what he is doing or a stand out young player like Rodwell/Rooney.

The progression of guys like Baines, Arteta, Jagielka, Lescott, Pienaar, Osman, Cahill points to a man that has an eye for talent and recognises potential.

My point being that Rodwell and Barkley have been kept out of the squad by inferior players.

I never disputed the fact that he can buy a player and get them performing. There was lots of talk before my original post about Moyes developing youth. It doesn't happen is what I'm saying.

As an example, I don't think Phil Jones would have played 29 games last season if Moyes was in charge.

Cantona's Collars

Kerrydude1981 wrote: »

Probably head to the pub myself,me and lads having one last bozze up,fair play to SAF he has been the cause of a many bozze up and unreal hangovers

Many's a Champions League tie turned into a lock-in and a very long night,work used to be a blur the next day.
Have to go to a Communion on Sunday but the main bit will be over before 4pm so I'm heading to the pub,if anyone is offended - Fuck 'em!!

Pro. F

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

What is the debt now? £336 million is what a bit of searching has turned up.

With the £160 million coming in from AON and the new shirt deal coming up would it not be better just to clear all of the debt?

I don't understand why they don't start getting that debt down.

Don't forget that whenever you read or hear about a new sponsorship deal being £Xm that that figure is nearly always the total amount that will be paid over a number of years. Also, for the biggest deals (shirt sponsor and kit supplier that you are talking about) the new deal starting means the old deal finishing. So the difference between the two deals will usually be a few tens of millions more each year, not the entire amount of the deal being new money for the business. Costs also increase each year, mostly from rising players' wages, so that offsets it a bit too.

A few years ago the Glazers said that they wanted the debt because running a loss gave them a tax break, but that wasn't true - iirc the tax break was only something like £12m/y while interest repayments and charges were £40m/y or more. They will definitely want rid of the debt and iirc it falls due in 2016 anyway, so it has to be gone or refinanced by then. They've sold 10% of the club and continually grown sponsorship money, but it takes time to cover the total amount.

DM_7

Mr Whirly wrote: »

My point being that Rodwell and Barkley have been kept out of the squad by inferior players.

I never disputed the fact that he can buy a player and get them performing. There was lots of talk before my original post about Moyes developing youth. It doesn't happen is what I'm saying.

Inferior players? Neither Rodwell or Barkley were/are good enough as teenagers to be played ahead of the players Everton had/have in midfield.

He does Develop youth, he gives players that are good enough exposure to first team football early. They get starts in the right games and of course when senior players are unavailable. Brings them off the bench regularly. There is no better way to develop very young players.

Its also worth considering young men who are still developing physically need to be progressed slowly as they are still growing. Skill and ability do not always mean a young player should play a lot when all things are considered.

Backstreet Moyes

Mr Whirly wrote: »

My point being that Rodwell and Barkley have been kept out of the squad by inferior players.

I never disputed the fact that he can buy a player and get them performing. There was lots of talk before my original post about Moyes developing youth. It doesn't happen is what I'm saying.

As an example, I don't think Phil Jones would have played 29 games last season if Moyes was in charge.

Hold on Rodwell made plenty of appearances when fit. But please tell me who Barkley should be starting ahead of what a load of nonsense.

Backstreet Moyes

The only young players who are likely to feature next year are Zaha and Powell. I would prefer if Powell went out on loan. A few promising younsters around but they are a good bit away from the first team.

Cantona's Collars

yabadabado

Nuts102 wrote: »

Hold on Rodwell made plenty of appearances when fit. But please tell me who Barkley should be starting ahead of what a load of nonsense.

exactly.If they were good enough,they would get time,Didn't he give a 16 year old his start.

Mr Whirly

DM-ICE wrote: »

Inferior players? Neither Rodwell or Barkley were/are good enough as teenagers to be played ahead of the players Everton had/have in midfield.

He does Develop youth, he gives players that are good enough exposure to first team football early. They get starts in the right games and of course when senior players are unavailable. Brings them off the bench regularly. There is no better way to develop very young players.

Rodwell when fit should have started every game for Everton from the '09 season onwards when fit. This didn't happen.

I will be surprised if you see another Phil Jones emerge under him at such a young age.

DM_7

Nuts102 wrote: »

The only young players who are likely to feature next year are Zaha and Powell. I would prefer if Powell went out on loan. A few promising younsters around but they are a good bit away from the first team.

Zaha isnt a teenager so he will be fine under Moyes

Powell is fooked though :pac:

Mr Whirly

Nuts102 wrote: »

Hold on Rodwell made plenty of appearances when fit. But please tell me who Barkley should be starting ahead of what a load of nonsense.

He made late substitution appearances.

Barkley should be coming on instead of the likes of Thomas Hitzlsperger and Naismith. There was also times this season where Leon Osman was completely knackered but was consistently started as opposed to giving Barkley a chance.

Everton had a decent starting 11 this season but some should have been rested throughout the season. It never happened

The_Kew_Tour

Crazy stat

No non Glaswegian has won league title with United since 1911.

yabadabado

Mr Whirly wrote: »

Rodwell when fit should have started every game for Everton from the '09 season onwards when fit. This didn't happen.

I will be surprised if you see another Phil Jones emerge under him at such a young age.

Phil Jones cost United 16 million of course he was going to get games ,also United had no option but to play him such is the current midfield/injuries.I have no doubt if a similar player is bought by Moyes he will get plenty of games.

DM_7

Mr Whirly wrote: »

Rodwell when fit should have started every game for Everton from the '09 season onwards when fit. This didn't happen.

I will be surprised if you see another Phil Jones emerge under him at such a young age.

Rodwell when fit. The fact he suffered injuries proves he shouldn't have started every game even ignoring the quality senior players were ahead of him.

In case you didn't know United bought Jones and he only played so many games because Vidic, Smalling, Rio and Evans all suffered injuries of different degrees in the season. Look at how many injuries the lad had this year? Back and Knee trouble at 20 years old. Probably because he was playing more games than he would have in an ideal world last season.

GSPfan

Its kinda turned into the Everton and Manchester United super di dooper thread now.

Mr Whirly

GSPfan wrote: »

Its kinda turned into the Everton and Manchester United super di dooper thread now.

Ha. I'll **** off so. Good luck with Moysey anyway and for what it's worth Fellaini would be a brutal signing

Rayne Wooney

Could we get a better centre midfielder than Fellaini for 24 million?

yabadabado

Mr Whirly wrote: »

Ha. I'll **** off so. Good luck with Moysey anyway and for what it's worth Fellaini would be a brutal signing

Will gladly take him on a free.

GSPfan

Mr Whirly wrote: »

Ha. I'll **** off so. Good luck with Moysey anyway and for what it's worth Fellaini would be a brutal signing

Ah its alright. Its to be expected I suppose. Its been a weird week.

GSPfan

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Could we get a better centre midfielder than Fellaini for 24 million?

Jordan Henderson.

Giggsy11

Statement from Wayne Rooney

There’s a load of rubbish being written about me changing twitter bio saying I have deleted Manchester United from it.
I have never deleted Manchester United from the bio whatever the papers are saying because it was never on there.
All that happened was that I was asked by Nike to add @nikeuk to it – the same as many other sportspeople they sponsor.
Funny, no-one’s written about that though!
That change was made THREE weeks ago and yet people are talking about it as if its something that was put up yesterday..

..

Montroseee

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Could we get a better centre midfielder than Fellaini for 24 million?

Behrami, Belhanda and Camcho IMO would be better and could be got for less. Despite that, I would be delighted to sign Fellaini or a CM that will be starting 11 standard.

Cantona's Collars

Moyes first pre-season game is 13 July,hopefully we'll have all our business transfer wise sorted by then.

I see nobody has mentioned Strootman in a while.

Winston Payne

Montroseee wrote: »

Behrami, Belhanda and Camcho IMO would be better and could be got for less. Despite that, I would be delighted to sign Fellaini or a CM that will be starting 11 standard.

Belhanda is a CAM. Behrami isn't better, he's got a bit more energy maybe. I haven't seen enough of Camacho to pass judgement. Twenty four million for Fellaini is decent business given that he'd bring something we're lacking, he's versatile and experienced in the league.

Kerrydude1981

zerks wrote: »

Moyes first pre-season game is 13 July,hopefully we'll have all our business transfer wise sorted by then.

I see nobody has mentioned Strootman in a while.

Who is he????

Montroseee

Winston Payne wrote: »

Belhanda is a CAM. Behrami isn't better, he's got a bit more energy maybe. I haven't seen enough of Camacho to pass judgement. Twenty four million for Fellaini is decent business given that he'd bring something we're lacking, he's versatile and experienced in the league.

Belhanda has played a deeper role and very well at that. Anyone that has seen Malaga play regularly will agree with me on Camacho, been insanely good this season.

yabadabado

Montroseee wrote: »

Belhanda has played a deeper role and very well at that. Anyone that has seen Malaga play regularly will agree with me on Camacho, been insanely good this season.

Camacho is a good call,what I have seen of him he has looked impressive.

Timmyctc

Rooney Statement RE: the twitter lark

The_Kew_Tour

The question I want answered though is did he hand in transfer request?

The silence is still there.

Cantona's Collars

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

The question I want answered though is did he hand in transfer request?

The silence is still there.

Seems like he did,word is that he won't start on Sunday.

GSPfan

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

The question I want answered though is did he hand in transfer request?

The silence is still there.

I reckon thats part of the reason Fergie isn't doing any interviews. That will be one of the first questions.

Timmyctc

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

The question I want answered though is did he hand in transfer request?

The silence is still there.

A lot of footballers usually avoid referring to rumors in case it fuels more speculation also it would mean debunking every subsequent rumor from then on in otherwise people will use the one time he did openly discuss a rumor as a benchmark for the future. Nike might have asked him to clear that up as they wouldnt want to be getting their name stuck in the middle of the whole thing. That being said fwiw I'd say he did hand one in.

Montroseee

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

The question I want answered though is did he hand in transfer request?

The silence is still there.

Seems questionable now.

GSPfan

Just to be clear, the claim is he asked for a move. He apparently didn't hand in a transfer request. Not sure what the difference is.

onemorechance

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

The question I want answered though is did he hand in transfer request?

The silence is still there.

I think this has pretty much being confirmed as much as it's going to be.

BBC

BBC are usually reliable with their stories IMO.

It's likely something that was done partly out of frustration at his role in recent times and 2 years left on contract is usually the time contracts are discussed.

He might have been questioning if he wanted to extend it if his role was to continue as it has been, not playing in his preferred position or not playing at all.

Timmyctc

Maybe Fergie rejected it offhand because he knew he'd be leaving at the end of the season and with a new manager coming in Roo might change his tune?