Reports that Pope is going to resign...

Nodin

ironingbored wrote: »

Holy ****balls Batman!!



http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/feb/23/cardinal-keith-o-brien-accused-inappropriate

In a third statement, "Priest B" claims that he was starting his ministry in the 1980s when he was invited to spend a week "getting to know" O'Brien at the archbishop's residence. His statement alleges that he found himself dealing with what he describes as unwanted behaviour by the cardinal after a late-night drinking session.

'You're a fine young Priest. I want ye to co-celebrate a funeral mass with me'
'O Bishop, I'm honoured. When is the event?'
'As soon as ye come over here and I bury the baldy fella'
'Bishop!!! I'm not that kind of Priest'

Zillah

That's all a bit vague, isn't it? "He got drunk and kept insisting that I invest in a time-share with him! I just felt so uncomfortable!"

robindch

Mr O'Brien resigns to spend more time with his bible:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21572724

Sarky

I'm going to need more popcorn. Can barely keep up with all the catholic shenanigans lately.

PopePalpatine

And to believe that Cardinal Brady still has the cheek to carry on. :mad:

darjeeling

robindch wrote: »

Mr O'Brien resigns to spend more time with his bible:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21572724

O'Brien pops up saying that Catholics should think about having married priests, and that the cardinals should elect a pope from Africa or Asia. A few days later the media get hold of the sexual harassment reports. Coincidence, or dirty politicking? I bet the Vatican is a proper vipers' nest come conclave time.

Penn

PopePalpatine wrote: »

And to believe that Cardinal Brady still has the cheek to carry on. :mad:

Not just carry on, but will also have in say in electing the new Pope.

Because after all, he's such a good judge of character...

PopePalpatine

darjeeling wrote: »

O'Brien pops up saying that Catholics should think about having married priests, and that the cardinals should elect a pope from Africa or Asia. A few days later the media get hold of the sexual harassment reports. Coincidence, or dirty politicking? I bet the Vatican is a proper vipers' nest come conclave time.

When there's not a gay orgy going on. :pac:

Sarky

If it gets any sillier there'll be reports of people dressed in white hoodies leaping about the Vatican rooftops and stabbing folks in the neck.

robindch

darjeeling wrote: »

A few days later the media get hold of the sexual harassment reports. Coincidence, or dirty politicking?

Hard to say. The Vatican indicated that the harassment report was handed in before Ratzinger resigned. Then O'Brien resigned a few days later, but without either side making it public, no doubt to avoid having it look any stranger than it already is.

Makes me wonder if O'Brien delivered his "Priests should be married" paean since he knew he was dead meat anyway.

darjeeling wrote: »

I bet the Vatican is a proper vipers' nest come conclave time.

Bruce Schneier on the Papal Election is worth reading:

http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2005/04/hacking_the_pap_1.html

The conclave uses one very secure voting protocol. Which is amusing in itself, since if the Holy Spirit were really moving the cardinals to choose, then surely the choice would be immediate and unanimous? They could even use a simpler protocol like, well, the Holy Spirit's chosen man just ponying up to the balcony, to the unanimous applause of his fellow-Cardinals seated just behind him.

There must be a reason why this doesn't happen.

darjeeling

robindch wrote: »

Hard to say. The Vatican indicated that the harassment report was handed in before Ratzinger resigned. Then O'Brien resigned a few days later, but without either side making it public, no doubt to avoid having it look any stranger than it already is.

It does all look very suspicious.

Three current & one ex-priest coming forward at the same time to tell their stories requires coordination to start with. And then things progress from their telling the Vatican to the story coming out in the press.

We don't know how much jockeying for power was going on even before the Pope's announcement. Were people planning for the succession anyway? Or was the shock resignation not a total surprise to everyone?

If only RTDH were here with his anagramming and photoshop skills. Diurnal Sloth, we miss you.

recedite

The Wiki entry is not entirely plausible...

O'Brien initially intended to take part in the 2013 conclave to elect the successor to Pope Benedict XVI, but he cancelled his participation due to his resignation in February that year..........
On 25 February 2013, it was announced that O'Brien had resigned as Archbishop and would not participate in the forthcoming conclave

wiki

...well it seems he had already tendered his resignation as archbishop, due to his imminent 75th birthday. This is an entirely foreseeable event, so there would be no reason to suddenly cancel his participation in the conclave vote because of it.
Currently, AFAIK, he is still a cardinal, and under the age of 80, and therefore he is eligible to vote at the conclave.

Somebody has scared the bejasus out of him. Making public those allegations (which were submitted in secrecy to the Vatican by his accusers) could be just the start of what they could do to destroy him, if he should be unwise enough to make that trip to Rome.

So what has he done to deserve this?
1.He has been outspoken against gay marriage.
2.He has been involved in homosexual behaviour, and out of wedlock too
3.He advocated choosing the next pope from" the developing world." 4.He said there was nothing in the bible or in Christianity to say women should not be priests.
We know that numerous gagging orders were placed on Irish priests in the last few years by the Ratzinger administration, for the last mentioned "offence" so this seems to be the most likely reason for his downfall, IMO.

recedite

robindch wrote: »

Hard to say. The Vatican indicated that the harassment report was handed in before Ratzinger resigned. Then O'Brien resigned a few days later, but without either side making it public

I think the original resignation was age related, and would not have taken effect for another few weeks. There would have been no need to give any other reason for his resignation to the public.

nagirrac

Sounds to me that they are preparing the way for an ultra conservative candidate and want to weed ot any opposition. Confirmation of how insanely out of touch they are as if they go this route he could well be the last pope.

Nodin

nagirrac wrote: »

Sounds to me that they are preparing the way for an ultra conservative candidate and want to weed ot any opposition. Confirmation of how insanely out of touch they are as if they go this route he could well be the last pope.

As they've been selected by either Benny or JPII, I don't think theres going to be much risk of them going for an avowed liberal.

Nodin

PopePalpatine wrote: »

When there's not a gay orgy going on. :pac:

That's an awful slur. It's not all sex.



There's parading in your best robes round the piazza, making grand entrances through big double doors in the vatican, having a chat with the nice swiss guardsmen, practicing looking serene and holy, watching the soaps, hair, facials and manicure, game of cards with a few of the old crew from back in the seminary.....

Bannasidhe

Nodin wrote: »

That's an awful slur. It's not all sex.



There's parading in your best robes round the piazza, making grand entrances through big double doors in the vatican, having a chat with the nice swiss guardsmen, practicing looking serene and holy, watching the soaps, hair, facials and manicure, game of cards with a few of the old crew from back in the seminary.....

and no women.

Nodin

Bannasidhe wrote: »

and no women.

Jaysus no. These are men of the cloth, equipped with gods seal of approval - the langer.

robindch

Bannasidhe wrote: »

and no women.

I think you'll find they're making the tea, arranging the flowers and cleaning away the dirty dishes.

Would you deny them the privilege of helping out as nature intended?

Hotblack Desiato

Can I be the only person who, every time I hear the word 'conclave', thinks the word 'klanklave' ? :eek:

Bannasidhe

robindch wrote: »

I think you'll find they're making the tea, arranging the flowers and cleaning away the dirty dishes.

Would you deny them the privilege of helping out as nature intended?

oh those arn't women - those are Nuns.

darjeeling

darjeeling wrote: »

It does all look very suspicious. [...]

It now seems that the four men brought foward their revelations specifically to stop O'Brien from taking part in the election, but that they'd intended going public shortly anyway.

Still, it's definitely one of the more intriguing elections. Up for grabs is the chance to be an absolute monarch with bragging rights to a billion souls. Yet there are no official candidates, and there's no open campaigning. And everything is done with such ridiculous theatricality as to make the Oscars look tame. It would be fascinating to know what really goes on behind the scenes: who's lobbying for whom and for what reward; who's out to stitch up their nemeses, and whether they're feeding the press with stories to do so.

Nodin

robindch wrote: »

I think you'll find they're making the tea, arranging the flowers and cleaning away the dirty dishes.

Would you deny them the privilege of helping out as nature intended?

They're showing their true nature by demonstrating their traits - "Listening, welcoming, humility, faithfulness, praise and waiting." So yes, making the tay.

Peregrinus

ninja900 wrote: »

Can I be the only person who, every time I hear the word 'conclave', thinks the word 'klanklave' ? :eek:

Well, given that we're now up to 375 posts and you're the only person who's mentioned it - apparently, yes, you can.

Brian Shanahan

recedite wrote: »

The Wiki entry is not entirely plausible... wiki

...well it seems he had already tendered his resignation as archbishop, due to his imminent 75th birthday. This is an entirely foreseeable event, so there would be no reason to suddenly cancel his participation in the conclave vote because of it.
Currently, AFAIK, he is still a cardinal, and under the age of 80, and therefore he is eligible to vote at the conclave.

Somebody has scared the bejasus out of him. Making public those allegations (which were submitted in secrecy to the Vatican by his accusers) could be just the start of what they could do to destroy him, if he should be unwise enough to make that trip to Rome.

So what has he done to deserve this?
1.He has been outspoken against gay marriage.
2.He has been involved in homosexual behaviour, and out of wedlock too
3.He advocated choosing the next pope from" the developing world." 4.He said there was nothing in the bible or in Christianity to say women should not be priests.
We know that numerous gagging orders were placed on Irish priests in the last few years by the Ratzinger administration, for the last mentioned "offence" so this seems to be the most likely reason for his downfall, IMO.

According to the Grauniad he's been reported as stating he was asked to "step down" by Il Papa. Now if a certain British Union of Fascists supporting organ were stating this I'd be sceptical of the report, but the Graun usually restricts its inaccuracies in news stories to spelling and grammar.

robindch

Conspiracy Theory 4: Vatican infighting.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21577917

Bannasidhe

robindch wrote: »

Conspiracy Theory 4: Vatican infighting.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21577917

I'm going to need a flow chart to keep track of all of this...

Hotblack Desiato

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21415639

Papal conclave: Runners and riders

Perhaps the BBC could have phrased that better. Or perhaps they phrased it perfectly :pac:

Penn

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0226/369654-vatican-details-pope-protocol-post-resignation/

Pope Benedict will keep the honorific title of "His Holiness" after he abdicates and will be known as "pope emeritus," the Vatican has said.
He will wear a "simple white cassock" and his ring of office as Pope will be destroyed according to Vatican tradition, a spokesman told a briefing.
Benedict will become the first Pope in some six centuries to resign instead of ruling for life.
Given the rarity of the occasion, Vatican officials had been holding discussions about what he will be called and how he will dress.
He will no longer wear his trademark red shoes once he steps down.

emeritus (i-MER-i-tuhs) adjective, plural emeriti; feminine emerita, plural emeritae

Retired but retaining an honorary title.

[From Latin emeritus (one who has served his time), past participle of emerere (to serve out one's term), from merere (to deserve, serve, earn).]

Sarky

Honarary pope?

SCHISM TIME! \o/

recedite

Here's a list of the papaphiles who want to be the next pope.
(Yes, you did read that wrongly; get yourself some reading glasses) :pac:
Its not a great article really, but you won't see that headline very often...

Papaphile of the Day

Peregrinus

recedite wrote: »

Here's a list of the papaphiles who want to be the next pope.
(Yes, you did read that wrongly; get yourself some reading glasses) :pac:

No, you wrote it wrongly!

It's papabile, an Italian word meaning a person who could plausibly be elected pope, not "papaphile", an English word meaning a person who loves popes, or who loves the pope.

recedite

Georg Ganswein Benedict XVI's personal secretary, Archbishop Georg Ganswein - the photogenic face seen in the background of a million photographs - will stay in this post. However, he will also keep up his role as head of the papal household for Benedict's successor. He will be the servant of two masters.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21585674


" And now my young padawan, say hello to my friend Gorgeous Georg, whom you may refer to only as Herr Ganswein. From now on, he will arrive here each morning at 8.30 am with your instructions for the day.... "

PopePalpatine

The Last Word just had a piece about Benny's resignation tomorrow, and mentioned that his ring would be destroyed. I died a little inside when they said it was done with a hammer rather than throwing it into Mt. Doom.

Stark

I visualised a massive orgy when I read that. Filthy mind...

Dades

PopePalpatine wrote: »

I died a little inside when they said it was done with a hammer rather than throwing it into Mt. Doom.

If Gimli couldn't break it with a Dwarven axe, I doubt a hammer is going to be much use.

Unless, it's belongs to a Norse god, of course...

ShooterSF

PopePalpatine wrote: »

The Last Word just had a piece about Benny's resignation tomorrow, and mentioned that his ring would be destroyed. I died a little inside when they said it was done with a hammer rather than throwing it into Mt. Doom.

Not with a hammer but by a hammer. MC Hammer to be precise. He's had to explore other means of money making these days.

Bannasidhe

ShooterSF wrote: »

Not with a hammer but by a hammer. MC Hammer to be precise. He's had to explore other means of money making these days.

He can touch dat?

Hotblack Desiato

Bannasidhe wrote: »

He can touch dat?

He got to pray just to make it today.

recedite

God fired him, it seems. The exact reasons haven't yet been disclosed.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/9890670/Pope-tells-faithful-God-called-him-to-quit.html

Tomk1

Benedict signed 'no-tweeting' order before stepping aside
http://www.breakingnews.ie/world/benedict-signed-no-tweeting-order-before-stepping-aside-586637.html

face automatic excommunication

Bet a few of them allmost died of shock, misreading as no "tween-ing" & automatic excommunication.
Priorities...Priorities.

robindch

A certain Msgr Charles Scicluna, reported to be the Vatican's "prosecutor" and their "anti-paedophilia official" between 1995 and 2012, says ok, Mahony might have made mistakes, but sure haven't we all, so look, let the man vote in the next conclave.

http://www.independent.com.mt/mobile/2013-02-21/news/cardinal-mahony-should-take-part-in-conclave-mgr-carmel-scicluna-930250754/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/vaticancityandholysee/9892254/Cardinals-who-hid-sex-abuse-have-right-to-vote-for-new-pope.html

Telegraph wrote:

Amid mounting criticism over the presence of such cardinals among the men who will choose a successor to Pope Benedict XVI, Monsignor Charles Scicluna said they had kept quiet "out of fear of scandal". Citing canon law, he said the cardinals "have the right and duty" to vote in the conclave.

"Wisdom is not (God)-given just to saints but also to sinners," said Scicluna, who was in charge of Vatican efforts to combat the scourge of predator priests before his promotion to auxiliary bishop of Malta in 2012. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone," he told the Italian daily La Stampa in an interview published Monday. But he added: "The real scandal is not to have reported the abuses. Perceptions have changed. Silence has become scandal. And the credit goes to (the pope)."

Support groups for victims of paedophile priests in the United States, Belgium and Ireland say Los Angeles Cardinal Roger Mahony as well as former Philadelphia Archbishop Justin Francis Rigali, Belgian Cardinal Godfried Danneels and Ireland's Sean Brady should be barred from voting because of their records in the scandals. A Vatican communications aide, Greg Burke, said in an interview published on Monday that the media "could try" to influence the conclave, adding that "some can be truly odious".

The Vatican's Secretariat of State – the government of the Catholic Church – took the unusual step on Saturday of issuing a statement condemning "completely false news stories" as an attempt to influence the secret conclave. "The negative effects of a work of imagination and approximation directly affect people's lives and reputations," Mr Burke told the Rome daily Il Messagero, adding: "People have suffered because of the documents stolen" in the so-called Vatileaks scandal.

"There are people who lost everything while some journalists profited immensely," he said. Benedict's butler Paolo Gabriele leaked secret papal memos to a journalist revealing a series of alleged fraud scandals in the Vatican and intrigues between rival groups of cardinals. The pope later pardoned Gabriele, who had been sentenced to 18 months in jail, but banished him from the Vatican.

The Black Oil

RTE's coverage seemed a bit excessive/deferential.

The Queen has a tummy bug, so that'll probably keep elements of the UK media occupied for a bit as the news cycle moves on.

Bannasidhe

The Black Oil wrote: »

RTE's coverage seemed a bit excessive/deferential.

The Queen has a tummy bug, so that'll probably keep elements of the UK media occupied for a bit as the news cycle moves on.

Well that explains a friend's FB status update - I thought vomiting 'Queenie' she was referring to was her cat and that she wasn't being terribly sympathetic to her poor pussy...

Hotblack Desiato

Monarchs don't vomit, one loses control of one's lunch.

Bannasidhe

VB turns his gaze on on the RCC's claims to be the church founded by Peter in his role as appointed successor to Jesus

There seemed to have been no appreciation on the part of Paul that Peter was head of the new church, certainly no deference. Indeed, it seems Peter himself had no appreciation of that either for, according to this account, he, Peter, deferred to instructions from another apostle, James, the brother of Jesus, who was regarded in Jerusalem as head of the new religion.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2013/0306/1224330829662.html

PopePalpatine

I always read his IT articles in his voice. :pac:

robindch

The gerontocracy has decided to install their new guy in time for the Irish rugby international in Rome next weekend.

Your correspondent will be there

http://www.thejournal.ie/conclave-to-begin-march-12-824253-Mar2013/

The Journal wrote:

CATHOLIC CARDINALS will begin their conclave to decide the next pope of the Roman Catholic Church next Tuesday, March 12.
The decision to begin the conclave on Tuesday was made at a meeting of the 115 voting-age Cardinals this afternoon.

The decision affirms the cardinals’ wishes to hold the conclave earlier than usual, in accordance in with one of the final acts of the previous pontiff.
Church law previously dictated that the conclave had to begin 15 days after the papacy became vacant, but one of Benedict XVI’s last acts in office was to change this so that the conclave could be held earlier if all of the voting cardinals were already in Rome.

Today’s vote follows days of meetings between cardinals which have actually doubled as informal pre-conclave talks on the problems of the church, and who might best address those problems if appointed to the papacy.

Bannasidhe

robindch wrote: »

The gerontocracy has decided to install their new guy in time for the Irish rugby international in Rome next weekend.

Your correspondent will be there

http://www.thejournal.ie/conclave-to-begin-march-12-824253-Mar2013/

gerontocracy - favourite new word!

Will the new guy be any good at place kicking?

Sarky

I recently signed up for an "adopt a cardinal" website, but found out later that they were actually deadly serious