Northern Protestants.

Thomas_I

SoulandForm wrote: »

No because in Northern Ireland people usually just go with tribal thinking without seriously thinking about- when I started thinking seriously about it I dropped unionism; dropping something from your childhood that you passively accepted is not exactly doing an 180 degree turn.

That´s a simple explanation and for once I´d accept it, although I suppose that it had more to do than just the dropping of a childhood perception. For most people it demands something initially to switch sides. Well, that´s a personal matter and if you don´t like to tell it, it´s no issue anymore for this debate.

Going out from what you´ve said, it tells me about why you´re very eager to advocate for a UI. What doesn´t fits into that - in my considerations of your posts - is your even reluctant support of parties which are situated on the far-left. If you think that they´d have the right answers to the future, then I´m absolutely in disagreement.

I can´t understand why people like you, Happyman42 and Crooked Jack, to mention those which I´ve been most exchanging opinions, are not prepared to debate the idea of an UI on precisely examples. We´re all on here debating this in a theoretical manner and I can´t see what and where the obstacle is to get it going. I can imagine that it might be because of some interference from the usual posters to bring such an thread down the drain.

I´ve expressed some of my thoughts in a reply to Happyman42. Well these thoughts were more in general and based mainly on how the current RoI is constituted. Either he didn´t took it as to be worthy to debate it further, or he´s just not inclined to take part in such "theoretical things". Eitherway, I don´t force anybody to express his thoughts. It´s just a pity that we all here are wandering in some general terms and rather focus on the negative sides of either republicanism or loyalism.

There is still too much distrust and bickering and this brings nothing of benefits to each side. But I see that for having a rational and reasonable exchange of thoughts, some level of trust is the minimum that needs to be provided.

As I said, I don´t know much about the background of the Unionists and Loyalists. My views on the topic are, I admit, based on the views common to republicans and nationalists. My pattern for a UI starts on the foundations of the current Republic of Ireland which I regard as the state on which a new and united Ireland can be built upon. It is a functioning democracy and stable. If you´d start from zero, it would be just more complicated, more expensive and above all it would take much more time to get that new stated settled than the other way round. I´m more for reformation and by this integration of NI in this UI, not in favour of an revolutionary overhaul of both current states.

Thomas_I

Bertie Woot wrote: »

The old Protestant-Unionist-Loyalist notion of supremacy is outdated, a fallacy, and no longer relevant. The people who congregate at the 11th July bonfires, tanked up on booze, and sing songs cursing the tea-eggs and burn the Irish tricolour and an effigy of the pope are some of the most socially disadvantaged, backward, inward looking, marginalised and uneducated people on the planet. I should know. I was one of them.

Let's see if any of our Southern brethren read this and finally realise that I, someone who comes from the Protestant-Unionist-Loyalist community in Northern Ireland, am much more of an Irish Republican than most Southern Irishmen who have posted in this thread thus far, and who seem to have completely abandoned the aspiration of Irish unification and national self determination, if indeed they ever held that aspiration.

That explaines something. Same neck of the woods as SoulandForm it seems, just a bit more eager.

Bertie Woot

SoulandForm wrote: »

Sadly though its numbers are declining and have declined radically the Orange Order retains a grip on a lot of Unionist politicians who are members of it. There is sectarianism on the other side as well and a large part of the reason Northern Ireland has and always had the lowest wages in the UK is that ruling class have used and continue to use sectarian division to divide people and keep them from focusing on what unites them. The whole of the "Celtic fringe" has suffered because of the Union- Wales for instance should be one of the richest countries in Europe but instead its one of the poorest- but Northern Ireland has suffered in particular. When partition happened NI was way ahead of the south and now its very much behind it.

My belief has always been that partition should never have been allowed to happen. It should have been an all or nothing situation in 1921, with Ireland gaining full 32 county independence or remaining part of the Union and a British colony.

All partition did was fuel sectarian suspicion, paranoia and create the conditions where Unionists discriminated in an attempt to contain the Nationalist minority who they regarded as "the enemy within".

But isn't it ironic that post GFA many young Nationalist Catholics in NI are now embracing the Northern Irish identity, Southern Catholics have expressly stated that they don't want a united Ireland as it's an outdated romantic notion and would cost too much, and a minority of people from within the Unionist community like you and myself are not only prepared to abandon Unionism and embrace the validity of the concept of Irish unification, but actively work towards that goal?

Times certainly have changed on this island, when Irish Republicanism is being abandoned by the Catholics and embraced by the Prods. Perhaps we are regressing to the age of Tone and the United Irishmen of Catholic, Protestant and Dissenter, with changing times, political realisations, some soul searching and changing allegiances.

I lived through the IRA's onslaught as a Unionist Protestant of Northern Ireland and typically viewed Irish Republicans as the enemy, and ironically, it makes me sad in 2013 to read so many rejectionist views on Irish unification coming from Irish Catholics in the ROI. It's astonishing that the Irish have completely given up all hope of Irish unification, and view it as not only unrealistic, but unwelcome and/or unobtainable.

Oh ye of little faith ..

SoulandForm

Thomas_I wrote: »

That´s a simple explanation and for once I´d accept it, although I suppose that it had more to do than just the dropping of a childhood perception. For most people it demands something initially to switch sides. Well, that´s a personal matter and if you don´t like to tell it, it´s no issue anymore for this debate.

Going out from what you´ve said, it tells me about why you´re very eager to advocate for a UI. What doesn´t fits into that - in my considerations of your posts - is your even reluctant support of parties which are situated on the far-left. If you think that they´d have the right answers to the future, then I´m absolutely in disagreement.
.

Its very simple- I went to University in Wales, became friends with people in Plaid Cymru, saw that they were right about there and started thinking seriously about home. As a Protestant living in the south I have not encountered much sectarianism at all, and the minor stuff Ive encountered has not been bitter and hate filled.

Thomas_I

SoulandForm wrote: »

Its very simple- I went to University in Wales, became friends with people in Plaid Cymru, saw that they were right about there and started thinking seriously about home. As a Protestant living in the south I have not encountered much sectarianism at all, and the minor stuff Ive encountered has not been bitter and hate filled.

Plaid Cymru is the equivalent to the SNP in Scotland (so far I recall that Welsh political organization by its right name) and there are also some people out there who advocate some "federation of the Celtic nations", which lists Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Cornwall and not to forget the Isle of Man. What they all have in common is their opposition towards England and the English. Some of your statements about Wales might be right, considering that it has always been in the shadow of England.

So you´ve been befriended with Welsh separatists. They of course have their own views and dislike towards the English. Well, it´s no question why because they "forged" the UK and dominated it. The irony in all that is that today by all that devolution from the UK government, England is the only country within the UK without her own Parliament or Assembly. This is justified simply by the fact that Westminster is the Parliament of England after all. I don´t see it that way, because Westminster is the Parliament of the UK. Well, that´s another matter.

guinnessdrinker

Bertie Woot wrote: »

I lived through the IRA's onslaught as a Unionist Protestant of Northern Ireland and typically viewed Irish Republicans as the enemy, and ironically, it makes me sad in 2013 to read so many rejectionist views on Irish unification coming from Irish Catholics in the ROI. It's astonishing that the Irish have completely given up all hope of Irish unification, and view it as not only unrealistic, but unwelcome and/or unobtainable.

Oh ye of little faith ..

I don't think you should base your views on what people say on an internet forum. I have never seen any concrete evidence that the Irish have completely given up all hope of Irish unification, I would say the opposite is the case and I guess the majority would have aspirations of a united Ireland. All the major parties in the republic aspire to Irish unification at least and Enda Kenny who could hardly be described as a die hard republican recently said that a united Ireland was inevitable.

I like to think of the positive things that people from a unionist background could bring to a united Ireland. For sure they would have a large presence in a new Irish parliament and in all likelihood due to the number of seats they would likely win, there would be a good possibility of them being in power as part of a coalition government.

awec

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Thomas_I

Bertie Woot wrote: »

... It's astonishing that the Irish have completely given up all hope of Irish unification, and view it as not only unrealistic, but unwelcome and/or unobtainable.

Oh ye of little faith ..

To me it is not astonishing at all, it´s the result from decades of partition and the more decades of partition are to come, the less the interest for unification within the RoI might be in the future.

SoulandForm

Thomas_I wrote: »

Plaid Cymru is the equivalent to the SNP in Scotland (so far I recall that Welsh political organization by its right name) and there are also some people out there who advocate some "federation of the Celtic nations", which lists Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Cornwall and not to forget the Isle of Man. What they all have in common is their opposition towards England and the English. Some of your statements about Wales might be right, considering that it has always been in the shadow of England.

No it is not. Plaid Cymru is solidly Republican- its leader for instance referred to the English queen as Mrs Windsor. It is solidly anti-militarist and anti-Imperialist too. It is also far more left wing than the SNP. I would also be very sympathetic to the idea of a federation of Celtic nations not forgetting Brittany.

SoulandForm

Thomas_I wrote: »

To me it is not astonishing at all, it´s the result from decades of partition and the more decades of partition are to come, the less the interest for unification within the RoI might be in the future.

I think there is a class factor involved. In my experience of Dublin the more working class the more likely you are to be Republican or pro-UI.

"Only the Irish working class remain as the incorruptible inheritors of the fight for freedom in Ireland."

James Connolly.

Thomas_I

SoulandForm wrote: »

No it is not. Plaid Cymru is solidly Republican- its leader for instance referred to the English queen as Mrs Windsor. It is solidly anti-militarist and anti-Imperialist too. It is also far more left wing than the SNP. I would also be very sympathetic to the idea of a federation of Celtic nations not forgetting Brittany.

I meant that assessment in regards towards their aims for the independence of their country, not their political section (re right / left wing).

Brittany, don´t you think you´re going a bit too far? The French wouldn´t be "amused".:D

I haven´t been that much interested in Wales, aside from some general things. So thanks for your post on that.

awec

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SoulandForm

Thomas_I wrote: »

I meant that assessment in regards towards their aims for the independence of their country, not their political section (re right / left wing).

Brittany, don´t you think you´re going a bit too far? The French wouldn´t be "amused".:D

I haven´t been that much interested in Wales, aside from some general things. So thanks for your post on that.

Brittany isnt France. I speak Welsh and I can get the drift of a Breton conversation.

Thomas_I

SoulandForm wrote: »

I think there is a class factor involved. In my experience of Dublin the more working class the more likely you are to be Republican or pro-UI.

"Only the Irish working class remain as the incorruptible inheritors of the fight for freedom in Ireland."

James Connolly.

That was a hundred years ago and what is left of that Irish working class in these days? Most of the people Connolly was referring to are now employed in the service section, less in manufacturing.

Thomas_I

SoulandForm wrote: »

Brittany isnt France. I speak Welsh and I can get the drift of a Breton conversation.

That´s your advantage then. I don´t speak or understand any Celtic language.

SoulandForm

Thomas_I wrote: »

That´s your advantage then. I don´t speak or understand any Celtic language.

Im learning Irish at the moment. Dont you have to learn Irish in school in the south?

Happyman42

awec wrote: »

What absolute rubbish. You just make it up as you go along ffs.

NI hasn't failed.

Are you telling me that every county in Ireland bar Dublin is a failure? Do you think any other county would be as developed as it is without tax subsidies from Dublin tax payers? After all, apparently NI needs subsidised which qualifies it as a failure, surely the same applies to all these other counties which are unfortunate failures. Perhaps we should merge Kerry into Cork, that will beyond all doubt make it not a failure. I don't need to give a reason why, I am just going to state that it will.

"NI has failed" is utter tripe. Baseless nonsense spouted in an ever more desperate attempt to reason for a UI.

"Britain will not be up for maintaining the union". Have you a shred of evidence to back that up?! A shred. Or, as I suspect, is this another "fact" pulled from Happyman42's large book of "things I want to be true but they aren't really"?

What rewards do you see in a UI? You also bleat on about this apparent disadvantage of border areas. You have failed multiple times to explain how exactly they are disadvantaged despite being asked. Are you going to sit there and tell me that business owners in the likes of Newry are going to turn round and say they suffer because of the border?

The only blissful ignorance displayed on this thread is from you. The amount of blatant falsehoods you spout is outrageous.

Steady on Awec, last time I looked this is an 'opinion forum'.

N.I. has failed because it's continued existence has been the cradle for diviseiveness of such a scale that it frequently leads to murderous violence. No amount of talking, powersharing etc is going to or has stopped that.
Your analogy to counties on the Republic is self serving tosh and you know it, Cork or Kerry have no similarity to the adinistration of NI. Ignore the many elephants in the room if it helps you keep your head in the sand about the cause of divisiveness and violence in OUR society. And it is OUR society however partitionist you want to be. (*awaits the 'if only the dissidents would f off bleating)
As I say, sooner or later the discussion of a way forward will have to be had, it remains to be seen who wants to hold on to the old ideologies or who wants to embrace a future without violence and sectarianism. Stop 'making up' the illusion that NI is 'like' or comparable to anywhere else...it isn't.

The day the British signed the GFA was the day they 'gave up' on the Union. Face the facts, there is no allegiance to NI in the heart of British people or government, they couldn't care less, witness their reaction to the recent violence.
Britian's government is moving on, it is quietly ashamed of their history on this island and are up for and willing for any reconcilatory gesture they can indulge with the Irish Government.(Mrs Winsdor's visit etc etc) It's as plain as the nose on your face. That is my opinion, you are welcome to give yours.
The reward of a UI is the prospect of peace on this island, that won't be immediate but it will be possible, it is impossible now because of the failure of NI.

Thomas_I

SoulandForm wrote: »

Im learning Irish at the moment. Dont you have to learn Irish in school in the south?

No, I was neither born nor did I went to School in Ireland (neither part of it). I´m not even Irish myself (not that I won´t to be, I´m simply neither Irish nor British). I´ve just some interests in Ireland, that´s all. I´m awful sorry if you have or had been misguided in thinking that I would be an Irishman, but nobody asked me whether I am and so, I saw no reason to tell. Now that you´ve asked me about the learning of the Irish language, I´m honest enough to tell you the truth, because I´m no liar.

Now I got to go and if you can accept or even tolerate to having some conversations about Ireland with an Non-Irish person, then we could continue that tomorrow.

Again, seriously, there was no offence intended from my side.

gallag

Happyman42 wrote: »

Steady on Awec, last time I looked this is an 'opinion forum'.

N.I. has failed because it's continued existence has been the cradle for diviseiveness of such a scale that it frequently leads to murderous violence. No amount of talking, powersharing etc is going to or has stopped that.
Your analogy to counties on the Republic is self serving tosh and you know it, Cork or Kerry have no similarity to the adinistration of NI. Ignore the many elephants in the room if it helps you keep your head in the sand about the cause of divisiveness and violence in OUR society. And it is OUR society however partitionist you want to be. (*awaits the 'if only the dissidents would f off bleating)
As I say, sooner or later the discussion of a way forward will have to be had, it remains to be seen who wants to hold on to the old ideologies or who wants to embrace a future without violence and sectarianism. Stop 'making up' the illusion that NI is 'like' or comparable to anywhere else...it isn't.

The day the British signed the GFA was the day they 'gave up' on the Union. Face the facts, there is no allegiance to NI in the heart of British people or government, they couldn't care less, witness their reaction to the recent violence.
Britian's government is moving on, it is quietly ashamed of their history on this island and are up for and willing for any reconcilatory gesture they can indulge with the Irish Government.(Mrs Winsdor's visit etc etc) It's as plain as the nose on your face. That is my opinion, you are welcome to give yours.
The reward of a UI is the prospect of peace on this island, that won't be immediate but it will be possible, it is impossible now because of the failure of NI.

So has Ireland failed? Needing bail outs including loans from the UK, unable to sustain its self, mabey time to end this failed project and reform?

awec

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SoulandForm

Thomas_I wrote: »

No, I was neither born nor did I went to School in Ireland (neither part of it). I´m not even Irish myself (not that I won´t to be, I´m simply neither Irish nor British). I´ve just some interests in Ireland, that´s all. I´m awful sorry if you have or had been misguided in thinking that I would be an Irishman, but nobody asked me whether I am and so, I saw no reason to tell. Now that you´ve asked me about the learning of the Irish language, I´m honest enough to tell you the truth, because I´m no liar.

Now I got to go and if you can accept or even tolerate to having some conversations about Ireland with an Non-Irish person, then we could continue that tomorrow.

Again, seriously, there was no offence intended from my side.

No need to be sorry. If I didnt know you werent Irish I wouldnt have made the tea egg reference. I presumed that you were from the Republic of Ireland.

Happyman42

gallag wrote: »

So has Ireland failed? Needing bail outs including loans from the UK, unable to sustain its self, mabey time to end this failed project and reform?

Yes, I'm all for a new republic.
I am not indulging in a game of 'Oh look you're as bad' :rolleyes:

SoulandForm

awec wrote: »

What elephant in the room? Has NI failed? Absolutely not IMO. People in NI are relatively well off. There has been a huge boom in the catholic middle class, you will be hard pressed to find any of those for example to argue that they are living a failure.

No they are not, at least by western European standards. There is a shocking level of poverty across the sectarian divide.

awec

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SoulandForm

awec wrote: »

What elephant in the room? Has NI failed? Absolutely not IMO. People in NI are relatively well off. There has been a huge boom in the catholic middle class, you will be hard pressed to find any of those for example to argue that they are living a failure.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/northern-ireland-now-the-poor-man-of-europe-28641169.html#ixzz1TToNKFCM

Also the Republic of Ireland is higher on the UN's human development scale than the UK and Northern Ireland is one of the most messed up areas of the UK.

awec

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gallag

SoulandForm wrote: »

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/northern-ireland-now-the-poor-man-of-europe-28641169.html#ixzz1TToNKFCM

Also the Republic of Ireland is higher on the UN's human development scale than the UK and Northern Ireland is one of the most messed up areas of the UK.

Must be why all the British people are moving to ireland for a better life?

SoulandForm

awec wrote: »

:pac:

That is a very narrow focused view of it. People living in poverty are poor. Shock.

I could turn around and counter this with the fact that the ROI is financially fcuked and the UK isn't, but again that'd be a very narrow view to take.

But, lets hypothetically go down this road. Do you feel the ROI is placed to fund NI to reduce the amount of "poor" people?

Are you sure the UK isnt? Wealth in the UK is concentrated in southern England.

The UK seems very much to have a vested interest in keeping everywhere else poor. Once free from the yoke of London who keeps NI afloat by providing civil service jobs that keep it dependent and people can start channelling their energies more productively who knows what the future holds?

SoulandForm

gallag wrote: »

Must be why all the British people are moving to ireland for a better life?

There is a much better life in the Republic than Northern Ireland.

Happyman42

It's not economic poverty that is the problem, it's the poverty of living that has always been the problem. How many generations of those we see on the streets over a flag do you want?

awec

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awec

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awec

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SoulandForm

awec wrote: »

Have you ever lived in Northern Ireland?

Yes. The first 18 years of life- but Ive only been back for Christmases.

SoulandForm

Happyman42 wrote: »

It's not economic poverty that is the problem, it's the poverty of living that has always been the problem. How many generations of those we see on the streets over a flag do you want?

Also the dignity of being free. Not being a colony is something people take for granted in the south far to much.

Happyman42

awec wrote: »

and paying ludicrous prices

:rolleyes:

What do have that a southener doesn't in terms of stuff? Is your diet, better?, are your cars, better? are your holidays, better?
Tell us, itemise what you have that a southener can't have because of these lucicrous prices?
It is a nonsense reason to say that because some things are cheaper that people are wholly better off. You live in a sectarian and violent society, and it won't improve, the threat of regression will always be there.

gallag

SoulandForm wrote: »

There is a much better life in the Republic than Northern Ireland.

How? What are you basing this on? Also, why is irelands biggest export people?

SoulandForm

Happyman42 wrote: »

:rolleyes:

What do have that a southener doesn't in terms of stuff? Is your diet, better?, are your cars, better? are your holidays, better?
Tell us, itemise what you have that a southener can't have because of these lucicrous prices?
It is a nonsense reason to say that because some things are cheaper that people are wholly better off. You live in a sectarian and violent society, and it won't improve, the threat of regression will always be there.

I think he said that he lived in the south.

Things are cheaper in the north but people have less money so it balances out.

Happyman42

SoulandForm wrote: »

I think he said that he lived in the south.

Well, I missed that.
Replace with, 'What does a Northener have....'

SoulandForm

gallag wrote: »

How? What are you basing this on?

No sectarian nonsense for one. People generally enjoy a better standard of living. Much more relaxed.

awec

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SoulandForm

awec wrote: »

Where abouts in the north?

I was born in Belfast but moved to Antrim when I was four.

awec

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SoulandForm

awec wrote: »

Financially though, people are better off up home. I've never met anyone who would be worse off personally.

I would still argue that NI is not a failure or a sectarian goldfish bowl. There are a mouthy minority who hog the headlines with their bile, but the vast majority of people are pretty normal.

Certain people, upper middle class and upper class, maybe better off in Northern Ireland. I dont think ordinary people are.

PSF, which celebrates the PIRA, and the DUP are the largest parties in Northern Ireland. There is no getting away from that. People are pretty normal most of the time, they are still caught up in a situation that is abnormal though.

I dont know what your religious background is but pride is an Ulster trait that has done the place a lot of harm- from both sides (the PIRA carrying on their armed struggle way past the point that it was obvious it wasnt going to work is an example of that, but also the Unionist play pretend that "our wee country" is fine and dandy).

Happyman42

awec wrote: »

Antrim. Sorry to hear that. :P

Nah, in all seriousness I can see where you are coming from. Certainly down here it's much more relaxed, there is no tribal bollocks.

Financially though, people are better off up home. I've never met anyone who would be worse off personally.

I would still argue that NI is not a failure or a sectarian goldfish bowl. There are a mouthy minority who hog the headlines with their bile, but the vast majority of people are pretty normal.

I live on the border and I ain't seeing any sizable rush North for the weekly shop etc, local supermarket is expanding into a building twice it's size, Lidl have just bought a site etc. There are of course, many things that are cheaper in the North, but that has always been the way and is always in a state of flux.
I also get to see a lot of houses and people from both sides as I go about my daily business and there is zero difference in living standrds from what I can see, NHS is not what it used to be and the only way the recieved budget from Whitehall is going, is down.
What I do see is an abscence of the 'old issues' in the south, people spend their brain's energy on other things, they don't have to make judgements about what side somebody is on or where they go, or what they say, as a routine part of the everyday. That makes for a much more relaxed social life and is what makes southern society 'normal'.
You are deluding yourself if you think the price of a car will be a detterent to that apiration for most people.
If the offer is right (and one day it will) then they will jump at it. Just remains to be seen which Unionist party will swallow hard and jump as well to try and steal a march on their rival. Just like the GFA.

awec

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gallag

SoulandForm wrote: »

People generally enjoy a better standard of living. Much more relaxed.

Have you any evidence of this or is it just your opinion? How for example would my circumstances improve by changing to the irish government? I know yous recently pushed a lot of your financial problems onto your children to get some breathing space on your uncontrolled spending and massive debts, I fail to see how I would be better off?

junder

SoulandForm wrote: »

Also the dignity of being free. Not being a colony is something people take for granted in the south far to much.

I am free think you very much, you however don't seem to free. You have that stereotypical tunnel vision of a convert. I Actully know a few Protestants republicans from my community, don't agree with them but at least they don't forget where thier from and can atleast still have empathy for thier community and don't feel the need to run them down to prove how Irish they are. Have met plaid cymra as well and found them unimpressive some thing reflected in thier election results certainly nothing within thier ideology that marks them different from any other nationalist party and include the bnp in that statement to

p1akuw47h5r3it

guinnessdrinker wrote: »

I don't think you should base your views on what people say on an internet forum. I have never seen any concrete evidence that the Irish have completely given up all hope of Irish unification, I would say the opposite is the case and I guess the majority would have aspirations of a united Ireland. All the major parties in the republic aspire to Irish unification at least and Enda Kenny who could hardly be described as a die hard republican recently said that a united Ireland was inevitable.

I like to think of the positive things that people from a unionist background could bring to a united Ireland. For sure they would have a large presence in a new Irish parliament and in all likelihood due to the number of seats they would likely win, there would be a good possibility of them being in power as part of a coalition government.

I wouldn't disagree. Where I'm coming from is not that I don't want an unified Ireland, I just see the downsides vastly outweighing the positives.

Imo, the only positive is really to say that Ireland is united. There is no economic benefit, social benefit etc. as far as I can see. I think a lot of others both sides of the border believe the same (or simply don't care) and thus would not vote for a United Ireland.

Chuck Stone

Bertie Woot wrote: »

it makes me sad in 2013 to read so many rejectionist views on Irish unification coming from Irish Catholics in the ROI.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that the opinions you encounter on boards.ie are proportionately representative to the general population. In my exp there's far more support for a UI and acceptance of the Republican narrative on the troubles than the impression you'd form from reading these threads.