Blade Runner becomes Blade Gunner **Mod Warning Read OP""

davet82

robinph wrote: »

He wouldn't be able to earn a living in Europe for running if he's skipped bail like that.

a net worth of $5,000,000 dollars, i think i'd just about survive on that :cool:

seamus

Manslaughter with a short and/or suspended sentence and he could continue running competitively. He's still got 6 - 10 years left in him.

The sheen is tarnished alright but sporting bodies wouldn't bar him from competing.

books4sale

robinph wrote: »

He wouldn't be able to earn a living in Europe for running if he's skipped bail like that.

Either way I think his career is finished anyway. No sponsership will touch him no matter how great he is, the guy is damaged goods. Sure didn't Nike drop him in the last few days.

The only income source left is the obligatory 'book deal'.

seamus

davet82 wrote: »

a net worth of $5,000,000 dollars, i think i'd just about survive on that :cool:

By the time you've bribed your way out of the country, bribed your way into a new country (between border guards and visas), then secured a new property and paid for security to protect you from mercenaries, you'd be surprised how little of the $5m you have left to live on for the rest of your life.

In many ways it's much easier for someone with little or no wealth to make this kind of jump since very few people are looking for you and you have nothing to lose by doing it. You can set up a business and keep a low profile indefinitely.

Rascasse

He'll find it hard to get a work visa anywhere with any sort of conviction, particularly one that carries jail time (suspended or not). And, as mentioned, it'll be tough to find sponsorship.

Even in SA it would be tough to have any sort of public profile with violence against women campaigns being such a big deal right now.

opinion guy

robinph wrote: »

If he was to make it to Europe, where he allegedly has access to further resources such as bank accounts and houses so making it a possible destination, I think he'd soon get sent back again. He wouldn't be able to earn a living in Europe for running if he's skipped bail like that.

The thing about a house in Italy wasn't true. The policeman stated it but it turned out he had just heard it was the case and didn't check :rolleyes: He got pulled up on that too by the defence - check the twitter feeds

Rightwing

i reckon the guy didnt mean to kill her, but shot thru the door in a rage. anyone else think this?

Seachmall

Rightwing wrote: »

i reckon the guy didnt mean to kill her, but shot thru the door in a rage. anyone else think this?

If anyone shoots at someone in a fit of rage I'd find it hard to believe they didn't intend to kill the person.

books4sale wrote: »

I just don't get the 'shoot first, ask questions later' brigade, there is something out of sorts with a fella who automatically jumps to the conclusion, - its an intruder, i'll pepper the chap with bullets.

Never once did he consider it might be a friend, family member or they're safety, there's clearly an arrogance about it.

He didn't "jump to the conclusion", he made a very logical assumption given what he believed to be true at the time. I guess he figured it was more likely an intruder climbing through his bedroom toilet window than the neightbours looking for a cup of milk.

The fact that he was wrong about his initial belief of his girlfriends location is unfortunate, but if he did look and did believe he saw her sleeping in bed the mistake is understandable given the stressfulness of the situation.

(Assuming he's telling the truth).

gramar

Rightwing wrote: »

i reckon the guy didnt mean to kill her, but shot thru the door in a rage. anyone else think this?

Personally I don't think so. They had a fight she ran into the bathroom and in a rage he shot her but knowing she was in there. I wasn't there but that's the opinion I've formed based on what I've read.

Waking up and thinking there are intruders in the bathroom and firing willy nilly just don't seem like the credible actions of a person.

trishasaffron

In terms of taking a view of the guy irrespective of whether he intended to murder his girlfriend or not, its enough for me that he shot through a door at an unknown figure. I understand that SA is a dangerous place but nevertheless that a person's first response is to shoot through a door says a lot about the person.

gitane007

Hmmmm, the only thing about the "they were having a massive barney" view is the difference between a cricket bat and a gun. It's been stated that he's known for a short temper in the past so i imagine shouting at someone through a locked door at 4 in the morning for ages would shorten that fuse a bit alright, but to go and get your gun first and shoot through the door, either to blow it open or to scare or kill his girlfriend, AND THEN decide to go for the bat to get through the door seems a bit weird. I would have thought that no matter how pissed off one got in that situation, the last thing you would get is your gun, specially if there's a nice bat inside that can do the trick. There was mention of iphones on the bathroom floor.........bit of a funny place for them in the middle of the night.....(unless she had one goin on the jacks with the earphones in , hence not hearing or responding to the shouts). A lot doesn't make sense in this but i do aggree as was said earlier.........to just ****ing shoot through a door that leads to a confined space, where the person is trapped anyways, intruder or no intruder is nuts and doesn't sound rational at all, no matter where you are in the world.

namloc1980

seamus wrote: »

He may have felt that the balcony was secure. If it hangs off the side of the building, then there's no feasibly way of climbing onto it without grappling hook or something.

The pictures of the house show the balcony was recessed and not the overhanging type.

Seachmall

trishasaffron wrote: »

that a person's first response is to shoot through a door says a lot about the person.

I think it says that people do stupid things in stressful situations, which isn't a surprise to anyone.

namloc1980

Seachmall wrote: »

I think it says that people do stupid things in stressful situations, which isn't a surprise to anyone.

He didn't check on the safety of his loved one, that's pretty stupid. He left his balcony door and bathroom window open all night despite having a fear of violent crime and being a previous victim of violence and burglaries, that was pretty stupid too. At best the guy was extremely reckless in his actions.

opinion guy

namloc1980 wrote: »

At best the guy was extremely reckless in his actions.

Nobody is denying that

Seachmall

namloc1980 wrote: »

He didn't check on the safety of his loved one, that's pretty stupid. He left his balcony door and bathroom window open all night despite having a fear of violent crime and being a previous victim of violence and burglaries, that was pretty stupid too. At best the guy was extremely reckless in his actions.

Definitely, if he didn't intend to kill her I'd see no problem with him being charged with involuntary manslaughter (or whatever the S.A. equivalent is [Culpable homicide?]).

namloc1980

Seachmall wrote: »

Definitely, if he didn't intend to kill her I'd see no problem with him being charged with involuntary manslaughter (or whatever the S.A. equivalent is [Culpable homicide?]).

Anyone know what the homicide types are in the SA legal system?

robinph

namloc1980 wrote: »

Anyone know what the homicide types are in the SA legal system?

Seems that they have "culpable homicide", but cant find a list of the other categories yet:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culpable_homicide#South_Africa

books4sale

Seachmall wrote: »

I think it says that people do stupid things in stressful situations, which isn't a surprise to anyone.

I agree

.....but at the same time, no matter how stressful or stupid people get, the vast majority of us don't pick up handguns to shoot wildly through a bathroom door, those are the actions of insanity.

He'd probably be better off pleading insanity, skip jail and head for the asylum altogether.

nc6000

trishasaffron wrote: »

In terms of taking a view of the guy irrespective of whether he intended to murder his girlfriend or not, its enough for me that he shot through a door at an unknown figure. I understand that SA is a dangerous place but nevertheless that a person's first response is to shoot through a door says a lot about the person.

Not trying to be funny but it's not like he could kick the door in which I suppose is what most people would do.

paddy147

The bullets were fired through the door from a high position,so he had his legs on him when he fired the shots.

Hes fcuked at this stage.

opinion guy

paddy147 wrote: »

The bullets were fired through the door from a high position,so he had his legs on him when he fired the shots.

Hes fcuked at this stage.

Where are you getting that information from ?

Seachmall

books4sale wrote: »

.....but at the same time, no matter how stressful or stupid people get, the vast majority of us don't pick up handguns to shoot wildly through a bathroom door, those are the actions of insanity.

We all get stupid. Give us a handgun and we're stupid people with handguns. Stupid people with handguns do stupid and dangerous things.

However, that's an arguments for gun control. It doesn't prove that this guy is anything but your average stupid, scared person with a handgun.

Da Shins Kelly

nc6000 wrote: »

Not trying to be funny but it's not like he could kick the door in which I suppose is what most people would do.

So the obvious alternative is to shoot through it?

The man is guilty of recklessness and ill-considered haste at best.

Rightwing

He smells guilty to me

gitane007

nc6000 wrote: »

Not trying to be funny but it's not like he could kick the door in which I suppose is what most people would do.

He had a cricket bat which eventually got used. No need for legs.

7 7 12

paddy147 wrote: »

The bullets were fired through the door from a high position,so he had his legs on him when he fired the shots.

Hes fcuked at this stage.

Have you submitted this hard-hitting evidence to the prosecution?

phoenix999

Seachmall wrote: »

If anyone shoots at someone in a fit of rage I'd find it hard to believe they didn't intend to kill the person.



He didn't "jump to the conclusion", he made a very logical assumption given what he believed to be true at the time. I guess he figured it was more likely an intruder climbing through his bedroom toilet window than the neightbours looking for a cup of milk.

The fact that he was wrong about his initial belief of his girlfriends location is unfortunate, but if he did look and did believe he saw her sleeping in bed the mistake is understandable given the stressfulness of the situation.

(Assuming he's telling the truth).

There's nothing logical about leaving your partner asleep while you go confront an intruder. 99% of people would wake them up or get them to a safe place. And who goes to confront a burglar with no legs on? His version makes no sense whatsoever.

Seachmall

phoenix999 wrote: »

There's nothing logical about leaving your partner asleep while you go confront an intruder.

I never said it was, I said his assumption that it was an intruder was logical based on what he believed to be true at the time.*

99% of people would wake them up or get them to a safe place.

162% wouldn't.

And who goes to confront a burglar with no legs on?

Perhaps a man with no legs and limited time to respond?




*Assuming he's telling the truth.

phoenix999

Seachmall wrote: »

I never said it was, I said his assumption that it was an intruder was logical based on what he believed to be true at the time.162% wouldn't.Perhaps a man with no legs and limited time to respond?

Of course, potential murderer walking around nearby room, and you let your wife sleep away. Only an idiot wouldn't think of the welfare of his family first.

LizT

phoenix999 wrote: »

Of course, potential murderer walking around nearby room, and you let your wife sleep away. Only an idiot wouldn't think of the welfare of his family first.

He'd probably argue that the reason he shot the "intruder" was to protect her.

Seachmall

phoenix999 wrote: »

Of course, potential murderer walking around nearby room, and you let your wife sleep away. Only an idiot wouldn't think of the welfare of his family first.

Did you miss the "people do stupid things in stressful situations" bit?

The fact of the matter is most of us have absolutely no idea how we'd react in a situation like that because most of us haven't experienced a situation like that.

But the idea that you'd act in an entirely rational and logical manner is absurd.

phoenix999

LizT wrote: »

He'd probably argue that the reason he shot the "intruder" was to protect her.

The point I'm getting at is most of us under such situations will go straight to your partner to alert them. Then grab your gun. Two sets of eyes are better than one. Nobody would crawl along a floor to confront a burglar. His version is fantastical at best.

opinion guy

phoenix999 wrote: »

Of course, potential murderer walking around nearby room, and you let your wife sleep away. Only an idiot wouldn't think of the welfare of his family first.

He says that he shouted to her to call the police - in his version he did not let her sleep away.

I really wish people would pay attention here

opinion guy

phoenix999 wrote: »

Nobody would crawl along a floor to confront a burglar.

Eh....do you want to rethink that one there ?

petersburg2002

opinion guy wrote: »

He says that he shouted to her to call the police - in his version he did not let her sleep away.

I really wish people would pay attention here

How could he shout to someone that wasn't In the bed. And she hardly answered back. Sleeping away is right!

petersburg2002

Seachmall wrote: »

Did you miss the "people do stupid things in stressful situations" bit?

The fact of the matter is most of us have absolutely no idea how we'd react in a situation like that because most of us haven't experienced a situation like that.

But the idea that you'd act in an entirely rational and logical manner is absurd.

Phoenix is right. Nobody leaves there partner to be murdered in the bed. You would go and wake them.

Seachmall

petersburg2002 wrote: »

Phoenix is right. Nobody leaves there partner to be murdered in the bed. You would go and wake them.

And my response,

Seachmall wrote: »

Did you miss the "people do stupid things in stressful situations" bit?

The fact of the matter is most of us have absolutely no idea how we'd react in a situation like that because most of us haven't experienced a situation like that.

But the idea that you'd act in an entirely rational and logical manner is absurd.

LizT

petersburg2002 wrote: »

Phoenix is right. Nobody leaves there partner to be murdered in the bed. You would go and wake them.

Just to be pedantic...

If his version of events is true (which I doubt), he thought he was protecting her. He thought the intruder was in the bathroom so he was placing himself in between her and the intruder.

petersburg2002

Seachmall wrote: »

And my response,

You said 162% people wouldn't wake a loved one. Panic or not, most of my friends would always wake the OH. It's almost a natural instinct.

Seachmall

petersburg2002 wrote: »

You said 162% people wouldn't wake a loved one.

The 162% thing was a comment to the irrelevance of your statistic.

Panic or not, most of my friends would always wake the OH. It's almost a natural instinct.

And my response to that,

Seachmall wrote: »

Did you miss the "people do stupid things in stressful situations" bit?

The fact of the matter is most of us have absolutely no idea how we'd react in a situation like that because most of us haven't experienced a situation like that.

But the idea that you'd act in an entirely rational and logical manner is absurd.

petersburg2002

Seachmall wrote: »

The 162% thing was a comment to the irrelevance of your statistic.



And my response to that,

It wasn't my statistic. We will have to agree to disagree. But his story seems to be pure fiction.

BattleCorp

Reports say that the bathroom door was locked. Why would she lock the bathroom door if she got up in the middle of the night and Pistorius was fast asleep in the bed?

My missus wouldn't lock the bathroom door in the middle of the night.

Innocent until proven guilty but things aren't exactly looking rosy for Mr Pistorius.

Seachmall

petersburg2002 wrote: »

It wasn't my statistic.

Apologies.

LizT

BattleCorp wrote: »

Reports say that the bathroom door was locked. Why would she lock the bathroom door if she got up in the middle of the night and Pistorius was fast asleep in the bed?

My missus wouldn't lock the bathroom door in the middle of the night.

Innocent until proven guilty but things aren't exactly looking rosy for Mr Pistorius.

Been said already but it's just instinct. I lock the door out of habit 99.9% of the time.

opinion guy

petersburg2002 wrote: »

How could he shout to someone that wasn't In the bed. And she hardly answered back. Sleeping away is right!

He can shout to someone he thinks is in the bed though can't he ?

petersburg2002 wrote: »

You said 162% people wouldn't wake a loved one. Panic or not, most of my friends would always wake the OH. It's almost a natural instinct.

How do you know ? Have you been in that situation ?

BattleCorp wrote: »

Reports say that the bathroom door was locked. Why would she lock the bathroom door if she got up in the middle of the night and Pistorius was fast asleep in the bed?

My missus wouldn't lock the bathroom door in the middle of the night.

Innocent until proven guilty but things aren't exactly looking rosy for Mr Pistorius.

FACT - all women will behave the same as your missus in all situations. :rolleyes:

Funnily enough - I was in a hotel over the weekend and went to take a dump - I went to lock the door so that opinion gal could not walk in on me accidentally - even though she saw me going in there and I had said I was going in. The reason I remember this is because there was no lock on the door and I thought it was weird - who wants their partner to walk in on them taking a piss/dump ? (Hell now that I think about it I will lock a bathroom door even if I am in a house on my own usually)

Oh and he wasn't asleep in bed he was out on the balcony apparently

Chucky the tree

BattleCorp wrote: »

Reports say that the bathroom door was locked. Why would she lock the bathroom door if she got up in the middle of the night and Pistorius was fast asleep in the bed?

My missus wouldn't lock the bathroom door in the middle of the night.

Innocent until proven guilty but things aren't exactly looking rosy for Mr Pistorius.

It can be a fairly instinctive thing for a lot of people. Seems stranger in the middle of an argument where you are so afraid you escape to the bathroom, lock the door and then decide to take a piss.

Bacchus

BattleCorp wrote: »

Reports say that the bathroom door was locked. Why would she lock the bathroom door if she got up in the middle of the night and Pistorius was fast asleep in the bed?

My missus wouldn't lock the bathroom door in the middle of the night.

Innocent until proven guilty but things aren't exactly looking rosy for Mr Pistorius.

I know the thread is getting rather large but this has been discussed. 2 potentially reasonable possibilities...
1. She was going to the toilet. Maybe she is a person who likes to lock the door when going to the toilet. Not unheard of.
2. When she heard Pistorius shouting about an intruder in the apartment she locked the door in panic.

Innocent until proven guilty indeed but the prosecution are royally mucking up their case by basically trying to build a murder charge on what looks quite likely to be a manslaughter/accidental death charge. The defense tore down two key points this morning
1. The witness who heard a couple fighting was 600m away from the apartment and isn't sure where the sounds were coming from. Could have been anyone.
2. The bloody bat was not used on Reeva. There were no defensive injuries on her and no indication that the bat was used on her. Pistorius's account of the bat holds up.

Got to say also, I saw on Sky News (at around 6pm) that they were still reporting that there were steroids found in the apartment. There weren't any steroids found, just some herbal remedy. They were also report that a woman heard the couple fighting right up to the gun shots. I thought the defense debunked that this morning given that the woman was too far away to hear if there was an argument or not.

MadsL

davet82 wrote: »

The legs thing is gonna make or break the case. Police say bullets were traveling downwards at a height that contradicts oscar's height. He says he shot with no legs on so lets see what the forensic guys come up with (and i hope to god they are better than SA police!!)

They had better be, and have answers to the following.

1. She had an empty bladder consistent with having just peed.
2. Was the concentration of urine in the toilet bowl such that she had peed and not flushed.
3. If she had flushed, then OP must have heard that. What intruder takes a piss in your house and flushes at 4am.
4. Ergo, he knew it was Reeva.

Finally, please explain why you did not have a panic button on your expensive alarm system Mr Pistorius. If you do, why did you not hit it?

(I have a panic button, and it is a silent alarm direct to the cops)

AudreyHepburn

books4sale wrote: »

I agree

.....but at the same time, no matter how stressful or stupid people get, the vast majority of us don't pick up handguns to shoot wildly through a bathroom door, those are the actions of insanity.

He'd probably be better off pleading insanity, skip jail and head for the asylum altogether.

You're probably right but then most of us here were not brought up a country where you can't walk down the street wearing jewellery for fear of being mugged or stop your car at lights for too long because you might be shot for it. A co-worker of mine from Jo'berg even has friends who have bars across the bedroom door for safety.

If we had who knows how we'd react to hearing some-one move around the house late night, particularly if we'd just woken up in pitch darkness and were a bit disorientated.

And never underestimate the power of fear and stress on a person.