JS Benefit & Self-employed

FewFew

My head is somewhat wrecked, so I come looking for advice.

Just finished a masters. Technically could have applied for social welfare in August (as many in my class did) but decided I could get by doing some freelancing, so registered as self-employed.
Between existing clients still assessing 2013 budgets and me winding down once-off work due to my thesis, I effectively haven't worked for the last two months.
It's going to take me at least two months to build business back up, so I've had no income for the last month and I'm looking at least three more without anything, so I applied for Job Seekers Benefit.

Wasn't sure I was entitled to anything as self-employed, but I worked full-time PAYE in 2011, so I have the credits there.

Various advice websites (citizensinfo etc.) said I didn't need to de-register as self-employed and was entitled to claim if my work hours had been significantly reduced.

Went into welfare office. At reception the lady checked, saw I had a full year of credits there and said I should be grand.

Filled in the forms and had my appointment. Now it seems I don't qualify for Job Seekers Benefit because I'm self-employed, and I have to go for the allowance and wait for an inspector to call out ("they might ring, or they might not" sounds a bit inefficient)


I'm a bit confused by it all. One day it didn't seem to matter because I had the credits and therefore entitled to JS Benefit (which doesn't seem means tested) and now today the self-employed thing is a big issue.

mp22

Would you have 104 stamps in total?

FewFew

mp22 wrote: »

Have a read here http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/social_welfare_payments/unemployed_people/self_employed_and_unemployment.html

Thanks, yeah, that's one of the sites I went through before applying.

However, if you worked as an employee in the last 4 years, you may have paid Class A PRSI and should apply to your Social Welfare Local Office for Jobseeker’s Benefit. Your Social Welfare Local Office will check their records to find out whether you have enough Class A contributions to get Jobseeker’s Benefit.

If you get Jobseeker’s Benefit you may continue to do some work. However, you must have lost at least one day of employment and as a result of this loss be unemployed for at least 3 days out of 6 days. Your earnings must also have been reduced because of the loss of employment.

They already acknowledged I have enough Class A PRSI credits to qualify. And they know my earnings and work days have been cut.

I'm still confused as to why they then said I don't qualify for Benefit because I'm self-employed.

FewFew

mp22 wrote: »

Would you have 104 stamps in total?

Not sure exactly, but I had a full year of full-time in 2011 and when she initially checked it she said there was no problem in that area.

mp22

To qualify for Jobseeker's Benefit, you must pay Class A, H or P PRSI contributions. Class A is the one paid by most private sector employees. Class H is paid by soldiers, reservists and temporary army nurses, who do not qualify for Jobseeker's Benefit until they have left the army. To qualify you need:

• At least 104 weeks PRSI paid since you first started work

This might be catching you where JSB is concerned


From here http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/social_welfare_payments/unemployed_people/jobseekers_benefit.html

eastbono

I agree with mp22 that its probably the total number or lack thereof of total contributions that is catching you.

FewFew

Don't think so, she threw it into the computer before giving me the forms and said I qualified for JSB.

So either they made the mistake initially or at the second meeting.

I've been in PAYE jobs for the last ten years, so I'd assume there's at least 104 there, and if not I had two full years in 2010 and 2011. It's only 2012 that would be missing.

I assume I can talk to this inspector person at greater length than my appointment this week, and I've nothing to hide in terms of income etc. as I was honest throughout the process.

It's annoying me now after looking at the citizensinfo and welfare dept websites again. The only difference I can see between Benefit and Allowance qualification is the credits, and I have them in spades.

All quite confusing. Never once had to say what I was doing last year, while people on either side of me were getting quizzed like crazy. When it comes to social welfare I feel like a complete n00b

eastbono

Fewcifur wrote: »

Don't think so, she threw it into the computer before giving me the forms and said I qualified for JSB.

So either they made the mistake initially or at the second meeting.

I've been in PAYE jobs for the last ten years, so I'd assume there's at least 104 there, and if not I had two full years in 2010 and 2011. It's only 2012 that would be missing.

I assume I can talk to this inspector person at greater length than my appointment this week, and I've nothing to hide in terms of income etc. as I was honest throughout the process.

It's annoying me now after looking at the citizensinfo and welfare dept websites again. The only difference I can see between Benefit and Allowance qualification is the credits, and I have them in spades.

All quite confusing. Never once had to say what I was doing last year, while people on either side of me were getting quizzed like crazy. When it comes to social welfare I feel like a complete n00b

It could be that your average weekly earnings were <€300 per week in 2011 which would mean that you would only get a graduated jsb payment but if you were deemed nil means for jsa then you would receive the full rate assuming you are > 25 years. If this is not the case then I dont know why they didnt open a casual jsb claim for you and you could hand in dockets every week saying when your worked and didnt work.

FewFew

Ah sure we'll see how it goes. My average for 2011 would have been above the 300. Dunno what's up.

Is it a case that they resort to an inspector if they don't believe you and need further examination? Was somewhat surprised that they didn't request bank statements or anything for the initial application.

Do these inspectors tend to give notification before calling out? The lady said they may or may not call in advance, but, I'm hardly meant to be waiting at home for the next two weeks?

eastbono

The only reason you are going to see an inspector is because you have a jsa claim which is means tested and any self employed person has to be seen by an inspector for jsa. The inspector will either call you in for an appointment and give you a list of stuff they need or call to your house. You can apply for supplementary welfare allowance through the community welfare officer while you are waiting for your claim to be processed. Tbh in your case I would apply for swa as depending on your area and workload in the area it could take some time for your jsa to be processed.

FewFew

eastbono wrote: »

The only reason you are going to see an inspector is because you have a jsa claim which is means tested and any self employed person has to be seen by an inspector for jsa. The inspector will either call you in for an appointment and give you a list of stuff they need or call to your house. You can apply for supplementary welfare allowance through the community welfare officer while you are waiting for your claim to be processed. Tbh in your case I would apply for swa as depending on your area and workload in the area it could take some time for your jsa to be processed.

Yeah, I got an appointment to go in next week, so that's ok. I think the vagueness of my last contact with them was the bit that sent me into a tizzy.

I'm honestly happy that they want to look at my accounts etc., I could easily have been a chancer.

Still somewhat confused by the change from JSB to JSA. My credits didn't disappear overnight, but I guess if there's the same conclusion then it's ok.

Thanks for everybody's help

schmanga

self employed people can get ja if they satisfy a means test. the conditions of being available and looking for full time work are set aside. farmers, taxi drivers, tradesmen, window cleaners, translators, and mechanics are common professions that are on ja. the same conditions always apply to jb, so if you were self employed you wouldn't necessarily meet the conditions of being available for or looking for full time work, whereas on ja they'd ignore it.

FewFew

Apologies for digging up a somewhat dead thread, but as an update:

Turns out all my woes and confusion were due to human error. Went in to check if I had earned enough credits for JSB and they confirmed I had, and then were baffled that I was put on JSA. 10 minutes later and I was on JSB. Guess 5th times a charm for me in the Welfare office. Anyhows, confusion over Phew!