Bobby Moore and Trevor Brooking, Overrated ?

dd972

Most people in the football world have a collective boner about these two football legends, I know the world was different in their hey day however if they were so good why didn't they play for any of the big successful clubs.

Fr Tod Umptious

dd972 wrote: »

Most people in the football world have a collective boner about these two football legends, I know the world was different in their hey day however if they were so good why didn't they play for any of the big successful clubs.

Odd thread

Are you using it in some odd way to attack West Ham ?

they were great in their day, Moore is obviously a legend for English fans because he captained them to a World Cup.

Also people did not go club hopping in their day like they do now.

Ken.

In their day football clubs owned you lock, stock and barrel. You couldn't move ever. Its like George Best or Ryan Giggs at international level. Best players of their respective era's but never played a major championship. If they could have move countries they would both have world cups and European championships.

5starpool

They can't be any good. Football only started in 1992 when sky invented it sure.

Kristopherus

Both are absolute legends. The played in the era long before Murdoch got his claws on English Football. Back in their day you got real value for money, not like today where were are overdosed by TV, and overpaid nancy boys:mad:

markie29

they really should have a classic edition of fifa so we could really tell if players from years gone by were actually any good.

Turtyturd

markie29 wrote: »

they really should have a classic edition of fifa so we could really tell if players from years gone by were actually any good.

But then you would just have people passing it to Puskas and running the length of the pitch and scoring.

tricky D

Heard a chat about Bobby Moore on last night's Off the Ball on NewsTalk. You should be able to get the podcast somewhere. The piece was at around 7:40pm, so 40 mins in.

In it, they said that players moved only when the clubs said so, as already mentioned. Moore also got chucked out of Upton Park for some ticket problem after he retired so treatment after career end wasn't like it is these days. Didn't listen to the whole thing, so there might be more nuggets in the podcast.

eagle eye

I was actually listening to Johnny Giles talking about this in newstalk either last night or the night before.

He said that Moore was an exceptional player but got bored and didn't try too hard sometimes but you could be guaranteed he would be the best player on the field in a big game.

I never seen Moore play but I remember Brooking and he was a superb footballer.

No chance that either could be overrated imo. Moore from all I've read and heard was at the same level as Baresi and McGrath and thats the very top of the game.

Brooking was a really hard working midfielder who could score. I'd compare him to some of the best in the world with the way he controlled the ball and could beat players. I'm not saying he was as good as Zidane but he had that type of grace on the ball and he was a very powerful big man too. I don't think he is overrated either, its just that people these days will look at where he played and what he won and question how good he was.

As said above it was different those times with players staying with the one club all their careers. In the case of Brooking he showed loyalty because big offers did come in for him.

roanoke

markie29 wrote: »

they really should have a classic edition of fifa so we could really tell if players from years gone by were actually any good.

5-star skill move
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLCZZAheNSU&t=0m44s

EdenHazard

Football looked terrible back then tbh.

Richard Hillman

EdenHazard wrote: »

Football looked terrible back then tbh.

I was watching the 1970 World Cup final a while ago. I know it was 100+ degree heat but jesus it was awful. You would see games with more intensity at your local astroturf pitch.

adox

To answer the OP - No.


Also lol at some of the kewl kids dissing football from way back when. The naive arrogance is hilarious.

EdenHazard

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I was watching the 1970 World Cup final a while ago. I know it was 100+ degree heat but jesus it was awful. You would see games with more intensity at your local astroturf pitch.

Terrible stuff. Ever see the keepers back then:eek: LMAO

roanoke

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I was watching the 1970 World Cup final a while ago. I know it was 100+ degree heat but jesus it was awful. You would see games with more intensity at your local astroturf pitch.

Same here. I saw the full game of England v Brazil. It was honestly one of the most boring games I've ever seen from any era.

Lumbo

EdenHazard wrote: »

Terrible stuff. Ever see the keepers back then:eek: LMAO

Hilarious

roanoke

adox wrote: »

To answer the OP - No.


Also lol at some of the kewl kids dissing football from way back when. The naive arrogance is hilarious.

You're the one sounding arrogant tbh, calling people 'naive kids' just because they don't fawn over the game from 30-40 years ago.

I'm one of those naive kids btw. I've been watching the game for about 25 years now. I can easily see that it has been improving era by era and I would never want to go back to the format or standard of the past. That even includes my own formative years in the late 80s and early 90s, which just like the 60s-70s was also far worse than what's on offer today.

chopperbyrne

roanoke wrote: »

You're the one sounding arrogant tbh, calling people 'naive kids' just because they don't fawn over the game from 30-40 years ago.

I'm one of those naive kids btw. I've been watching the game for about 25 years now. I can easily see that it has been improving era by era and I would never want to go back to the format or standard of the past. That even includes my own formative years in the late 80s and early 90s, which just like the 60s-70s was also far worse than what's on offer today.

ESPN Classic showed a lot of the early 70's total football Ajax team recently, including some European Cup semi-finals and finals and to be honest, though clearly skillful, their fitness levels and intensity was leagues behind today's standards.

They would be easily beaten by most Championship sides today.

Moore and Brooking are not overrated however and nor are that Ajax team. They're correctly rated for their time.

padd b1975

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I was watching the 1970 World Cup final a while ago. I know it was 100+ degree heat but jesus it was awful. You would see games with more intensity at your local astroturf pitch.

Sweet merciful Jesus.

Yeah that 1970 Brazil team was awful, terrible to watch

padd b1975

The Wimbledon of the '70s.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZkR5Wb2KQs

The_Kew_Tour

Football, rugby, GAA or basically any sport is miles different today then it was 40 odd years ago.

Guy:Incognito

Kristopherus wrote: »

Both are absolute legends. The played in the era long before Murdoch got his claws on English Football. Back in their day you got real value for money, not like today where were are overdosed by TV, and overpaid nancy boys:mad:

Yep, nothing shows the true glory side of football like peniless middle aged men selling football medals just to get by. ****ing Murdoch the absolute bastard giving guys a secure future.

Muff_Daddy

EdenHazard wrote: »

Football looked terrible back then tbh.

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I was watching the 1970 World Cup final a while ago. I know it was 100+ degree heat but jesus it was awful. You would see games with more intensity at your local astroturf pitch.

I really, really don't think I can be anywhere near a football forum where people have these sort of views.

Goodnight and god bless.

Jimmy Iovine

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I was watching the 1970 World Cup final a while ago. I know it was 100+ degree heat but jesus it was awful. You would see games with more intensity at your local astroturf pitch.

You were watching possibly the greatest team of all time and you think you'd see more intensity at your local astro pitch?

Really? Just take a second to register exactly what you said.

Really?

Seans_Username

Comparing fitness levels of different decades is ridiculous. For one, there are an incredible amount of sports scientists who work out fitness regimes to get the players in peak condition, this has only come about because of the money that is being pumped into the game.

And I severly doubt that ANY championship team - regardless of fitness level - could beat the likes Ajax or Brazil in their peak.

And people complaining about boring games in the 60s/70s, watch the majority of the games from the World Cup 2010 (bar Uruguay). I'd gladly watch paint dry over some of the ****e games I watched in that tournament.
Up to 1990 the world cup final never had less than 3 goals. Since then only 1 final has had 3 goals. So while the modern game might have better and fitter players, it's not like it has suddenly become exciting since Sky came about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnoz4NuYMU8

Jimmy Iovine

EdenHazard wrote: »

Terrible stuff. Ever see the keepers back then:eek: LMAO

Yea they were ****e weren't they. Expecially that Yashin chap from Russia. I know he's the only keeper to have ever won the Ballon d'Or. I know he was voted the best keeper of the century by FIFA. That means nothing though. The quality of the play was terrible back then.

He'd never make it in the game today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Vz5d2BY_-Q

dd972

dd972 wrote: »

Most people in the football world have a collective boner about these two football legends, I know the world was different in their hey day however if they were so good why didn't they play for any of the big successful clubs.

I havent seen them play live on tv or in the flesh but both are held in such high esteem by fans of that era and their peers for good reason

West Ham didnt just have players that won the world cup, they won the FA cup and CWC consecutively in 1964 and 65 with Moore, Peters and Hurst and 15 years later, the team with Brooking, Ray Stewart, Billy Bonds, John Lyall etc won the FA cup in 75 and 80.

Bobby Moore was made an offer by Spurs but as we werent in the age of Bosman rule and player power, West Ham decided they would keep him but werent prepared to pay him over the odds. Brooking was in the same boat.

dreamers75

padd b1975 wrote: »

The Wimbledon of the '70s.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZkR5Wb2KQs

thats the best goal ever tbh

EdenHazard

EdenHazard wrote: »

Terrible stuff. Ever see the keepers back then:eek: LMAO

If Arsenal had a goalkeeper anyway resembling big Pat Jennings today, who scored a goal from a kickout, who used to catch a wet ball with his massive bare hands from a corner, who used to have to fight his way out of the box, who could take a ball from a cross no problem despite being surrounded by attackers using every physical means possible , who risked being clattered with every ball he goes for.....if i could clone a man like Jennings for the Arsenal goal in the morning....i would definately do it and do you know what....he would walk onto the team. Bob Wilson wasnt half bad either. Your a Chelsea fan? You had Peter Bonnetti who was nicknamed the Cat. Im sorry to have been born too late to have witnessed a golden age in football. You can go on about the standards today but the 70s and 80s made the product what it is

padd b1975

padd b1975 wrote: »

The Wimbledon of the '70s.

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: Unbelievable comment! We have softies moaning now despite the standard of pitch and training methods. Football would be as big as carpet bowls bar what went before the modern day

padd b1975

Deleted User wrote: »

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: Unbelievable comment! We have softies moaning now despite the standard of pitch and training methods. Football would be as big as carpet bowls bar what went before the modern day

I was being sarcastic:o

padd b1975

padd b1975 wrote: »

I was being sarcastic:o

Sorry i didnt cop. The few beers i had was telling on me clearly

Richard Hillman

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

You were watching possibly the greatest team of all time and you think you'd see more intensity at your local astro pitch?

Really? Just take a second to register exactly what you said.

Really?

Watch the 1970 world cup final and then get back to me. Watch the full backs stroll 30-40 yards forward without anyone from opposition even thinking about closing them down.

A team from the 70s cant be the greatest of all time. They'd be destroyed in modern football. Its like comparing Mark Spitz to Michael Phelps.

The_Kew_Tour

I would rate Holland from 88, AC Milan from late 80 and 90's, Liverpool from 70-80's as very impressive sides.

Messi and Ronaldo would not have the same level of fitness they have now had they been around 30-40 years ago.

yabadabado

its a load of bollocks comparing players/teams from different era's.Fitness/sports science have evolved so much its not comparing like with like.Also the standard of pitches is on another level.But if the greatest players from the past were around today using modern facilities and technology I have no doubt they would be world class in this era as well.The best players would still shine through and some of them would be even better using today's standards .

Hammer Archer

I seriously hope it's just a coincidence that this thread was made pretty much bang on the 20 year anniversary of Bobby Moore's death.
Have a look at some of the tackles Bobby Moore made during the 1970 game against Brazil and come back to this thread.

smokedeels

who invented the skip?

losthorizon

Bobby Moore wasnt over rated Trevor Brooking was - end of story.

I dont know what he was like for West Ham but he was crap for us.

Captain Havoc

losthorizon wrote: »

Bobby Moore wasnt over rated Trevor Brooking was - end of story.

I dont know what he was like for West Ham but he was crap for us.

He was 37 and played twice.

Eirebear

This thread typifies this forum for me nowadays.
Lot's of people who know about "Stats" and a bunch of people who have never seen a football match that wasn't on Sky.

losthorizon

Captain Havoc wrote: »

He was 37 and played twice.

He got mixed up at one stage and took a shot at his own goal.

Unearthly

Why do people keep bashing Sky when they also praise the past, and the players and teams mentioned in this thread?

and why do people always feel the need to tell the forum they are leaving? Is that the internet equivalent to "I'm taking my ball and going home"?

odd people

gosplan

Of course they would have a hard time now but that's like saying Roger Bannister was sh1t because high-school athletes can do a four minute mile now.

This endless need to compare one footballer to another is totally retarded and clearly born out of people who's opinions of football come primarily from FIFA profiles and fantasy manager.

Players are good or OK or bad, sometimes even good players play bad and bad players play good - imagine that!!!

It's like that stupid thread the other day. If Neymar doesn't come to Europe, he won't come to Europe - why the fcuk does that create a problem for those who need to classify him in terms of a world ranking? What is it, you don't agree with his abilities in FIFA or you can't figure out if he's in your world 11 or not?

Moore was one of the best defenders around at the time. That's all. it doesn't matter if he was better than Ferdinand but worse than Vidic or more like Carragher than Agger. He is just another person to add to the group of 'very good defenders'.