The elusive research masters

--LOS--

Ok it is seeming impossible to find a research masters, I have gone the route of emailing lecturers in colleges all across the UK and Ireland to see if there's any going in their school. The resounding response seems to be that funding in my area of study (astronomy) is pretty bad at present. I'm signed up to a few mailing lists like RAS where I get notification if there's any postgrad stuff available, but all that seems to be out there is phd positions which I am not in a position to apply for, I don't have the grades. I am not in a position where I can fund my own research either. It is seeming so impossible, there are none advertised to apply for in the first place and potential supervisors are not really open to offering a research masters due to funding. From what I've seen, most people seem to be lucky enough to be able to pursue postgrad study with their supervisor from undergrad. There was little opportunity for me in that regard, my supervisor does not take on postgrads and there was only one other member of staff working in that area in my college, there was one position available with her which naturally went to the undergrad that she supervised.

At this point I'm not sure what to do, I was set on doing a research masters as I want to eventually pursue a phd. Often when I examine course details of taught masters in my area, I'm seeing a lot of stuff that I've already done at undergrad level, I'm not sure if a taught masters is going to benefit me as much as a research masters when applying for a phd. I'm open to travelling anywhere to pursue study, I'm not confined to Ireland/uk, I'm just a bit lost as to how to go about getting what I want at this point. Any feedback is appreciated, is anyone here doing a research masters and how did you get it?

djpbarry

--LOS-- wrote: »

Ok it is seeming impossible to find a research masters, I have gone the route of emailing lecturers in colleges all across the UK and Ireland to see if there's any going in their school. The resounding response seems to be that funding in my area of study (astronomy) is pretty bad at present.

I think they might be more receptive to inquiries about PhD positions – I know that the schools of Physics & Astronomy at Nottingham and Southampton have vacancies for PhD students at present (no idea how many).

--LOS-- wrote: »

I'm signed up to a few mailing lists like RAS where I get notification if there's any postgrad stuff available, but all that seems to be out there is phd positions which I am not in a position to apply for, I don't have the grades.

What did you get in your degree?

--LOS-- wrote: »

It is seeming so impossible, there are none advertised to apply for in the first place and potential supervisors are not really open to offering a research masters due to funding.

I work in a different field, but I can’t think of any group leaders I know who will entertain the idea of taking on an MPhil student – it’s either a PhD or nothing. That said, you often start out, officially, as an MPhil student and then transfer to the doctorate register after a year or two. The flipside of that is that, if things don’t work out, you can always right up your research early as a masters.

--LOS-- wrote: »

From what I've seen, most people seem to be lucky enough to be able to pursue postgrad study with their supervisor from undergrad.

Do you mean generally or in the field of astronomy? Because generally speaking, that is definitely not the case.

--LOS-- wrote: »

At this point I'm not sure what to do, I was set on doing a research masters as I want to eventually pursue a phd. Often when I examine course details of taught masters in my area, I'm seeing a lot of stuff that I've already done at undergrad level, I'm not sure if a taught masters is going to benefit me as much as a research masters when applying for a phd...

An MSc is an option – they can be beneficial when applying for PhDs. However, you could also look for research assistant positions. This would give you hands-on experience in a lab/research environment, which would be gold dust on your CV if it’s a PhD position you’re after.

Another option is to look for jobs in the aerospace industry – they will often work on astronomically-related projects. For example, a friend of mine works here:
http://www.sstl.co.uk

--LOS--

I posted here and kinda forgot about it sorry

djpbarry wrote: »

I think they might be more receptive to inquiries about PhD positions – I know that the schools of Physics & Astronomy at Nottingham and Southampton have vacancies for PhD students at present (no idea how many).

Oh I know that, but like I said I'm not qualified for those positions with my grades, I definitely have enquired about phds.

djpbarry wrote: »

What did you get in your degree?

2.2. Unfortunately I had a horrible time in college, suffered with depression and was going through really awful, awful circumstances. So those grades are not a true reflection at all, I know I'm well capable of doing a phd.

djpbarry wrote: »

I work in a different field, but I can’t think of any group leaders I know who will entertain the idea of taking on an MPhil student – it’s either a PhD or nothing. That said, you often start out, officially, as an MPhil student and then transfer to the doctorate register after a year or two. The flipside of that is that, if things don’t work out, you can always right up your research early as a masters.

I'm aware of all that but if you don't qualify for a phd, the next option imo is a research masters because it really demonstrates that you are capable of pursuing a phd.

djpbarry wrote: »

Do you mean generally or in the field of astronomy? Because generally speaking, that is definitely not the case.

No I don't mean in the area of astronomy (I did physics and astronomy) but I have seen a lot of that tbh, for instance there was a 2 year research masters going in my school which I had inquired about but it was all sewn up to someone in particular, I wasn't even allowed the chance to submit an application to even be considered.

djpbarry wrote: »

An MSc is an option – they can be beneficial when applying for PhDs. However, you could also look for research assistant positions. This would give you hands-on experience in a lab/research environment, which would be gold dust on your CV if it’s a PhD position you’re after.

Another option is to look for jobs in the aerospace industry – they will often work on astronomically-related projects. For example, a friend of mine works here:
http://www.sstl.co.uk

[/quote]

Firstly MSc can be taught or research so I dunno why you keep calling it Mphil. Research assistant positions are even harder to come by Working in the aerospace industry is not something I want to do, I'm not into the engineering side of things. It's been a long, hard time in college, I'm not going to settle for doing something that I don't want to do.

innad

Whether a research masters degree is a MSc or MPhil just depends on the host institution as far as I know.
To be honest if you are set on a PhD, then you will probably need to consider a taught masters in a relevant area. While the content might be similar to what you covered for your undergrad, it will allow you to get the grades you need, and shows that you are capable of pursuing your subject at a postgrad level. Most taught masters involve a dissertation anyway. I am aware that there will be differences between taught and research masters dissertations, but at the end of the day a dissertation is a dissertation, and you can find taught courses with a strong research focus. A taught masters will also provide you with useful contacts and shows that you are serious about your chosen area. It is usually possible to pursue them on a part-time basis, which is a great if you don't have the luxury of being a full-time, self-funded student.

djpbarry

--LOS-- wrote: »

2.2. Unfortunately I had a horrible time in college, suffered with depression and was going through really awful, awful circumstances.

It happens - it's not the end of the world.

--LOS-- wrote: »

I'm aware of all that but if you don't qualify for a phd, the next option imo is a research masters because it really demonstrates that you are capable of pursuing a phd.

The only thing that demonstrates you're capable of doing a PhD is doing a PhD! But as innad says above, plenty of people go into PhD's on the back of a taught masters.

--LOS-- wrote: »

No I don't mean in the area of astronomy (I did physics and astronomy) but I have seen a lot of that tbh, for instance there was a 2 year research masters going in my school which I had inquired about but it was all sewn up to someone in particular, I wasn't even allowed the chance to submit an application to even be considered.

In my experience, the overwhelming majority of people do not do their PhDs in the same institutes in which they did their undergrad. Sure, it happens, but what you are describing above is rare in my opinion.

--LOS-- wrote: »

Firstly MSc can be taught or research so I dunno why you keep calling it Mphil. Research assistant positions are even harder to come by Working in the aerospace industry is not something I want to do, I'm not into the engineering side of things. It's been a long, hard time in college, I'm not going to settle for doing something that I don't want to do.

Right, well you've pretty much ruled out everything at this stage - I'm not sure what else you expect people to suggest?

--LOS--

innad wrote: »

Whether a research masters degree is a MSc or MPhil just depends on the host institution as far as I know.
To be honest if you are set on a PhD, then you will probably need to consider a taught masters in a relevant area. While the content might be similar to what you covered for your undergrad, it will allow you to get the grades you need, and shows that you are capable of pursuing your subject at a postgrad level. Most taught masters involve a dissertation anyway. I am aware that there will be differences between taught and research masters dissertations, but at the end of the day a dissertation is a dissertation, and you can find taught courses with a strong research focus. A taught masters will also provide you with useful contacts and shows that you are serious about your chosen area. It is usually possible to pursue them on a part-time basis, which is a great if you don't have the luxury of being a full-time, self-funded student.

Ye that's very true actually, it would give me a chance to redeem myself, I'd actually have paper proof that I can get those grades. I definitely am looking into taught masters now too, it's a huge financial commitment when I have to pay for it myself so I really just want to make sure I'm heading down the right path.

djpbarry wrote: »

It happens - it's not the end of the world.
The only thing that demonstrates you're capable of doing a PhD is doing a PhD! But as innad says above, plenty of people go into PhD's on the back of a taught masters.
In my experience, the overwhelming majority of people do not do their PhDs in the same institutes in which they did their undergrad. Sure, it happens, but what you are describing above is rare in my opinion.
Right, well you've pretty much ruled out everything at this stage - I'm not sure what else you expect people to suggest?

Nah I'm not ruling out anything, I'm commited to this, I've spent a long time in college already due to being off under extenuating circumstances and the like so it's definitely not something I'm unsure of. I will have to figure out a way to pay for a masters but in the mean time does anyone think there's anything I can be doing to kinda show I'm doing something or to even have something to show I can get good grades? I've thought about doing a GRE in physics before, or maybe something programming related since it's often the main tool used in research in that area.

djpbarry

--LOS-- wrote: »

... does anyone think there's anything I can be doing to kinda show I'm doing something or to even have something to show I can get good grades? I've thought about doing a GRE in physics before, or maybe something programming related since it's often the main tool used in research in that area.

If you don’t know how to program then definitely start learning. Plenty of online material to help with that. Also wouldn’t do any harm to try and keep abreast of developments in your field of interest, so far as is possible.

Probably also a good idea to indentify group leaders you’d like to work for and get in contact with them – they will offer you more field-specific advice.

innad

--LOS-- wrote: »

Ye that's very true actually, it would give me a chance to redeem myself, I'd actually have paper proof that I can get those grades. I definitely am looking into taught masters now too, it's a huge financial commitment when I have to pay for it myself so I really just want to make sure I'm heading down the right path.

It is a big financial commitment, but for me it has been so worth it. It can be useful to look at where students from taught masters courses go after they graduate to get an idea of whether or not it's the right course for you. In my case they seem to go into Research Assistant positions and/or PhD's, which is exactly what I hope to do once I'm finished, so fingers crossed!

Best of luck with your quest anyway, I'm sure you will figure it out, it just might take a little time to get to exactly where you want to be.