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Socket over Sink

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  • 03-03-2013 6:17pm
    #1
    senorwipesalot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,458 ✭✭✭


    Lads,my sister just extended her kitchen and the sparks installed a double socket directly over the sink.
    OK,the sink and pipework are bonded and the kitchen sockets are on an rcbo but surely if its not illegal its at least bad practice.

    A link to the regulation on sockets over sinks would be helpful.

    I cant find a definitive answer.
    Thanks


«1

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    #2
    hufpc8w3adnk65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,158 ✭✭✭✭hufpc8w3adnk65


    A socket is not allowed ANYWHERE near a sink.i don't have etc rules too hand but normally at least 2 foot either side of sink AND draining board!so as a toaster kettle etc with a long lead cannot reach the sink!


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    #3
    hufpc8w3adnk65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,158 ✭✭✭✭hufpc8w3adnk65


    MrMac84 wrote: »
    A socket is not allowed ANYWHERE near a sink.i don't have etc rules too hand but normally at least 2 foot either side of sink AND draining board!so as a toaster kettle etc with a long lead cannot reach the sink!
    Done a quick google on my phone and found this on the Etci rules


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    #4
    cast_iron
    Registered Users Posts: 2,454 ✭✭✭cast_iron


    MrMac84 wrote: »
    Done a quick google on my phone and found this on the Etci rules
    So your own google disproves your first answer:confused:

    They are allowed, but common sense would say not to put them there is what that ETCI answer says.

    So, not illegal but not great practice either.


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    #5
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    senorwipesalot wrote: »
    Lads,my sister just extended her kitchen and the sparks installed a double socket directly over the sink.
    OK,the sink and pipework are bonded and the kitchen sockets are on an rcbo but surely if its not illegal its at least bad practice.

    A link to the regulation on sockets over sinks would be helpful.

    I cant find a definitive answer.
    Thanks

    The reason for bonding them would not really be to protect a person from electric shock from socket/appliance to sink, which is what the risk is with sockets right beside sinks.

    The fact they are bonded actually increases that risk, contrary to what could possibly be the initial assumption.


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    #6
    Solair
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,230 ✭✭✭Solair


    Probably a good idea to arrange to move the socket. It's not that big a deal but you'll probably need to re-tile.


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    #7
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Maybe a photo of the socket in question would be an idea. One persons idea of `right over the sink` might not match another`s.


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    #8
    senorwipesalot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,458 ✭✭✭senorwipesalot


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Maybe a photo of the socket in question would be an idea. One persons idea of `right over the sink` might not match another`s.

    I mean it ,its directly over the taps not draining board.
    (cant supply pic atm)


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    #9
    Andrew_Doran
    Registered Users Posts: 227 ✭✭Andrew_Doran


    554.3.4 says that you cannot put a standard British/Irish socket in a location where it may be subject to dripping or splashing by liquid.


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    #10
    senorwipesalot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,458 ✭✭✭senorwipesalot


    Andrew_Doran wrote: »
    554.3.4 says that you cannot put a standard British/Irish socket in a location where it may be subject to dripping or splashing by liquid.

    Thanks Andrew but I cant find this online.
    Links?


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    #11
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,858 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    senorwipesalot wrote: »
    Lads,my sister just extended her kitchen and the sparks installed a double socket directly over the sink.
    OK,the sink and pipework are bonded and the kitchen sockets are on an rcbo but surely if its not illegal its at least bad practice.

    A link to the regulation on sockets over sinks would be helpful.

    I cant find a definitive answer.
    Thanks


    The sparks is either 1 of 2 things.......


    1.Not a sparks at all.

    2.A retarded lazy useless idiot of a sparks.


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    #12
    Andrew_Doran
    Registered Users Posts: 227 ✭✭Andrew_Doran


    senorwipesalot wrote: »
    Thanks Andrew but I cant find this online.
    Links?

    It's in the wiring regs which costs the guts of €100 to buy or a trip to the national library to read. I can't post it word for word here but I'll PM you.


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    #13
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,593 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    senorwipesalot wrote: »
    Thanks Andrew but I cant find this online.
    Links?

    As Andrew said, it is on page 136 of ET:101

    Regardless of what the regulations state or do not state common sense must always apply.


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    #14
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    paddy147 wrote: »
    The sparks is either 1 of 2 things.......


    1.Not a sparks at all.

    2.A retarded lazy useless idiot of a sparks.

    Or...
    3. Was there before the sink was fitted, and the sink is in a different position now than planned.

    I dont think even frank spencer would fit a socket over the taps.


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    #15
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,858 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Or...
    3. Was there before the sink was fitted, and the sink is in a different position now than planned.

    I dont think even frank spencer would fit a socket over the taps.

    Well the OP says that the sparks installed it directly over the kitchen sink.....


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    #16
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    paddy147 wrote: »
    Well the OP says that the sparks installed it directly over the kitchen sink.....

    Well maybe the sparks wired the kitchen after it was completely fitted out then, while the OP was supervising.

    Although I would consider the remote possibility that the sink position was changed a little, or not clearly known, before condemning people.

    I wired a house recently. All sockets were fitted before any fitting out happened. Cooker was changed in position a bit, so a socket was almost centre above the hob. What would you have made of that paddy?


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    #17
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,858 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Well maybe the sparks wired the kitchen after it was completely fitted out then, while the OP was supervising.

    Although I would consider the remote possibility that the sink position was changed a little, or not clearly known, before condemning people.

    I wired a house recently. All sockets were fitted before any fitting out happened. Cooker was changed in position a bit, so a socket was almost centre above the hob. What would you have made of that paddy?


    I would think that any sparks with a bit of cop on and intelligence would make the client aware of a socket being in the wrong location (over a sink)and then move it.....as it would be against the rules to leave it there.


    Surely a decent/propper sparks has an obligation to do that much?????



    The OP has posted that the sparks installed the double socket over the sink...so thats what Im reading and replying to...with regards my posts.


    The sparks either isnt a sparks at all

    OR

    He is the laziest and most dumb assed/idiot of a sparks.


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    #18
    Ilik Urgee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,430 ✭✭✭Ilik Urgee


    Can I ask OP who installed first? Kitchen fitter or electrician?

    I'll reserve judgement on the sparks til then


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    #19
    frankmul
    Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭frankmul


    Ilik Urgee wrote: »
    Can I ask OP who installed first? Kitchen fitter or electrician?

    I'll reserve judgement on the sparks til then

    I can see Paddy147's point but we have see threads before where the spark has been blame for the positioning of sockets and it not been their fault. It is easy blame the sparks when they are not there.
    I think we should do as Ilik Urgee says, wait for more information.


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    #20
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Ilik Urgee wrote: »
    Can I ask OP who installed first? Kitchen fitter or electrician?

    I'll reserve judgement on the sparks til then

    Isnt it obvious, paddy said the op said the sink was there first. Therefor there can not be any other possibility.


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    #21
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,858 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Isnt it obvious, paddy said the op said the sink was there first. Therefor there can not be any other possibility.


    All I did was read the Opening Post from the OP and looked at what he posted.

    I then replied to it.:)


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    #22
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    paddy147 wrote: »
    I would think that any sparks with a bit of cop on and intelligence would make the client aware of a socket being in the wrong location (over a sink)and then move it.....as it would be against the rules to leave it there.

    Anyone with cop on and intelligence would consider all possibilities, not just one based on a possible assumption by the OP.

    The socket could have been fitted above the taps afterwards. Then that would be idiotic alright. And you can then tell me how you knew all along, if that is somehow proven to be the case.

    But its idiotic enough to encourage the consideration of other possibilities in my view, besides a single view based on the OP who probably only seen the finished job.


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    #23
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    paddy147 wrote: »
    All I did was read the Opening Post from the OP and looked at what he posted.

    I then replied to it.:)
    You condemned the electrician. That`s different than answering a question based on another persons observation.

    You would have had a right laugh when the owner of the house I did recently, told you "look where the electrician put the socket, right over the hob, obviously an idiot"

    He might even be right about the idiot bit:D, but wrong about me fitting the socket over the cooker hob


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    #24
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,858 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Anyone with cop on and intelligence would consider all possibilities, not just one based on a possible assumption by the OP.

    The socket could have been fitted above the taps afterwards. Then that would be idiotic alright. And you can then tell me how you knew all along, if that is somehow proven to be the case.

    But its idiotic enough to encourage the consideration of other possibilities in my view, besides a single view based on the OP who probably only seen the finished job.


    Robbie...Im not telling you anything,or going to come back and tell you anything either in the future.

    I merely read the OPs opening post.

    The OP stated a specific thing,and I replied to it.


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    #25
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,858 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    Bruthal wrote: »
    You condemned the electrician. That`s different than answering a question based on another persons observation.

    You would have had a right laugh when the owner of the house I did recently, told you "look where the electrician put the socket, right over the hob, obviously an idiot"

    He might even be right about the idiot bit:D, but wrong about me fitting the socket over the cooker hob


    The OP posted a very specific post,and I replied to that specific post.

    Im getting out of this now Robbie,as you seem to want to make something else out of this now,and you are doubting the OP too.




    Enjoy your day/evening.

    Regards


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    #26
    senorwipesalot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,458 ✭✭✭senorwipesalot


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Well maybe the sparks wired the kitchen after it was completely fitted out then, while the OP was supervising.

    Although I would consider the remote possibility that the sink position was changed a little, or not clearly known, before condemning people.
    ?

    Where did I say I was supervising?
    Just to clarify lads, im told the pipework was run in first under a screeded floor,so that governed the position of sink.
    Secondly,I gather , the walls were chased and cables and wavins and boxes installed.

    Im a sparks myself and was consulted when job was finished.(too late).
    Its not a such a big deal for me move the offending sockets as its not tiled yet.

    Apparently yer man is a qualifed spark:confused:


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    #27
    .G.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    I'm with Robbie on this one,been on many jobs were the "plan" has been changed after the wiring was done and nobody bothered to tell us and been on other jobs where the plan only existed in the customers head and was subject to frequent changes with apparently little heed paid to the impact on work already carried out.

    Need more info on who did what first before anyone is in a position to question the sparks sanity.

    That said we churned out an awful lot of sparks during the boom and I'm pretty certain that the quality of their abilities was not always what it should have been!


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    #28
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    paddy147 wrote: »
    Im getting out of this now Robbie,as you seem to want to make something else out of this now,and you are doubting the OP too.
    I doubted nothing really, I simply had the opinion that the OP possibly only seen the finished job, which was later indicated below ....
    senorwipesalot wrote: »
    Just to clarify lads, im told the pipework was run in first under a screeded floor,so that governed the position of sink.

    Im a sparks myself and was consulted when job was finished.(too late).

    paddy147 wrote: »
    Robbie...Im not telling you anything,
    Thats ok paddy, although I dont think you were telling me anything, its a public forum.
    or going to come back and tell you anything either in the future.
    Good luck so.


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    #29
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    senorwipesalot wrote: »
    Where did I say I was supervising?

    You didnt, that was the point I was making, that you probably only seen the finished job.


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    #30
    senorwipesalot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,458 ✭✭✭senorwipesalot


    Bruthal wrote: »
    You didnt, that was the point I was making, that you probably only seen the finished job.

    In that case i misinterpereted your post.

    Thanks for all the replys lads.


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    #31
    cast_iron
    Registered Users Posts: 2,454 ✭✭✭cast_iron


    senorwipesalot wrote: »
    Just to clarify lads, im told the pipework was run in first under a screeded floor,so that governed the position of sink.
    Secondly,I gather , the walls were chased and cables and wavins and boxes installed.
    A more important question is who told the sparks to put it there and was he made aware there was a sink going right under it?

    It may have been marked for him to go there or a drawing may have indicated it without any reference to a sink. The pipe-work should have given reason for concern if it was there first, in fairness, but who knows? He may have thought it was for gas/dishwasher/whatever.


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