Manchester United vs Real Madrid Match Thread. 5/3/2013 K.O 19.45

yermandan

Saganist wrote: »

Arbeloa knew exactly what he was doing. He seen Nani trying to control the ball coming over his head and jumped in to prevent him controlling it. I've watched it over and there is no doubt.

It was a poor decision from the ref, a simple free / yellow card and get on with it. Never a straight red.

After that decision the game was over as a contest, Modric being the main protagonist.

Would have loved to have seen seen the game pan out with 11v11.

Post that sums it all up IMO

Xavi6

Saganist wrote: »

Arbeloa knew exactly what he was doing. He seen Nani trying to control the ball coming over his head and jumped in to prevent him controlling it. I've watched it over and there is no doubt. .

Why do you make it sound like Arbeloa tried to get Nani sent off?

Brain Stroking

SantryRed wrote: »

To say at 11 v 11 you go through is downright outrageous. It could have still gone anyway.

Mourinho showed why he is such a good tactician tonight, he didn't even hesitate in going 3 at the back once Nani got sent off and bringing on Modric was the match winner. He gave them such control in the middle of the park and was directly involved in both goals.

Surprised Mourinho went back to 4 at the back after the second goal. United were there for the taking and to put it completely to bed. United can feel hard done by by the red card, incredibly stupid red card, idiotic by Nani to put his foot in that high, but it's a clear accident, yellow card and move on.

All of those tactical moves were obvious including the switch to 4 at the back.

Someone hit the nail on the head earlier: in Southern Europe such a challenge is more open to receiving a red card. In this part of the world a yellow and absolutely nothing more.

Accidental collisions are generally not punishable in football, there have been earlier examples cited like Diaby and Terry. Tonight's was a very harsh decision and cost United a chance to win a tie they were leading in.

Oh and some of the contributions on this thread are nothing more than pathetic point scoring. Wont be even reading future posts from some of you cretins.

Turtyturd

rarnes1 wrote: »

Plus intent has nothing to do with it if the ref thinks it's dangerous play

Wasn't that line thrown about for Kompany's red card last season....since people are comparing incidents with nothing in common.

@Niallo I agree Mourinho is all about the attention but he has done that walking off early thing before.

Saganist

Xavi6 wrote: »

Why do you make it sound like Arbeloa tried to get Nani sent off?

Not sent off, but he knew if he put his body there Nani would kick him.

Simples.

dfx-

My own opinion having gotten a chance to glance at the gif: some would give it, some won't. Tonight, he did. Probably a yellow 80 times out of 100..

This of course means that it will dominate discussion for the next week..

dfx-

dfx- wrote: »

My own opinion having gotten a chance to glance at the gif: some would give it, some won't. Tonight, he did. Probably a yellow 80 times out of 100..

This of course means that it will dominate discussion for the next week..

This

niallo27

SlickRic wrote: »

what?

he jumped in the air, stretching for a ball he was trying to control with the one foot.

you make it sound like a karate kick similar to Ryu or Ken in Street Fighter.

So you don't see anything wreckless in what nani did.

Essien

SlickRic wrote: »

i wanted Utd to get spanked.

what we got was actually more entertaining for a non-United fan.

but it was never, ever a red. Nani hasn't a fúcking clue where Arbeloa is, and also barely connects with him. there's no force, there's no follow through. he thought he was controlling the ball, then all of a sudden Arbeloa is winning the ball.

a red should never even have been in the equation. it was barely a yellow.

I don't think it was a red either, and I wouldn't like to see the same happen to a Chelsea player. Though I will say I can see the refs point, at least to the extent that I would say it wasn't a terrible decision on his part. It was on the poor side of marginal IMHO, and like I said, nowhere near as bad as it's being made out to be.

Its a risk you take when attempting what Nani did, and he got unlucky because the ref thought there was more force or malice in it that what there actually was. Obviously the implications are massive, but the decision is being blown waaay out of proportion.

Cienciano

SlickRic wrote: »

what?

he jumped in the air, stretching for a ball he was trying to control with the one foot.

you make it sound like a karate kick similar to Ryu or Ken in Street Fighter.

It doesn't matter a bit if he was "trying" to control the ball. He went studs into a player.

Quazzie

Saganist wrote: »

Not sent off, but he knew if he put his body there Nani would kick him.

Simples.

Or perhaps, and this might sound silly at first but bear with me, he knew he would win the ball, and guess what. He did.

Red Crow

dfx- wrote: »

My own opinion having gotten a chance to glance at the gif: some would give it, some won't. Tonight, he did. Probably a yellow 80 times out of 100..

This of course means that it will dominate discussion for the next week..

Probably a red 1 in every 10000 is more like it.

Not that I'd expect a balanced view from you anyway.

Saganist

niallo27 wrote: »

So you don't see anything wreckless in what nani did.

What ? Try to control the ball ? Heaven forbid.. :rolleyes:

theteal

harsh red but in no way an actual incorrect decision, that's the risk you take when you leave the ground like that - and I'm sure many of us in here would actually have done similar, it was there to be taken down. Modric utilised the extra space masterfully

a very entertaining night of soccer, the missus was even getting vocal, hard luck United

KingdomYid

Essien wrote: »

I don't think it was a red either, and I wouldn't like to see the same happen to a Chelsea player. Though I will say I can see the refs point, at least to the extent that I would say it wasn't a terrible decision on his part. It was on the poor side of marginal IMHO, and like I said, nowhere near as bad as it's being made out to be.

Its a risk you take when attempting what Nani did, and he got unlucky because the ref thought there was more force or malice in it that what there actually was. Obviously the implications are massive, but the decision is being blown waaay out of proportion.

This is my opinion on it too, would not say it was a red but is not as controversial as some are making out.

Essien

Does anyone have a gif of the disallowed goal? I'd love to see it again, I saw a replay at the time and thought it was very harsh.

Saganist

Quazzie wrote: »

Or perhaps, and this might sound silly at first but bear with me, he knew he would win the ball, and guess what. He did.

And Nani deserved a red for trying to control it ?

Seriously ?

SlickRic

i think it's a sad day when that is considered a red card.

you have to be very harsh to consider Nani reckless. it's arguable, but extremely harsh.

niallo27

We should be talking about a wonder strike from modric as well. Some bend on the ball.

fullstop

edgecutter wrote: »

It's a shame, but thats the way it fell. The ref gave everything to madrid and there was nothing united can do about.

Did he? I was sure they had a goal dis-allowed in the first half...

Handsome Bob wrote: »

I don't think Keano said it was a definite red. What he said was that Nani gave the ref a reason to send him off and rightly or wrongly, the ref obliged.

He did, he said it was a red and that it was the correct decision.

ceegee wrote: »

Cant recall anyone on here calling for a red prior to the ref showing it. Given the amount of time between the tackle and the card you'd expect someone to have called for it. Usually theres a page full of posts after a united player tackles someone at all dodgily.

Well I said it could be a red because of the way he seemed to kick out after the contact but I wasn't on boards at the time, so whatever you think I suppose.

Saganist wrote: »

Arbeloa knew exactly what he was doing. He seen Nani trying to control the ball coming over his head and jumped in to prevent him controlling it. I've watched it over and there is no doubt.

Sure what was he going to do? Stand back and admire him

Xavi6

Saganist wrote: »

Not sent off, but he knew if he put his body there Nani would kick him.

Simples.

Or he did what any defender should do in that situation and attacked the ball with only eyes for it.

You're trying to make something out of nothing as far as Arbeloa's actions are concerned.

Quazzie

Saganist wrote: »

And Nani deserved a red for trying to control it ?

Seriously ?

No, he deserved a red for dangerous play by the letter of the law.

Andersonisgod

btw aside from the red card, I thought it telling that after 2 legs Ronaldo, despite not being particularly brilliant in either game, scored twice (including the tie winning goal) while Man Utd's current main man Van Persie missed quite a lot of chances. If he scores the great chances he had at the Bernabeau then Man Utd probably go through tonight. Just interesting to think how Madrid got Ronaldo while Man Utd have settled for Van Persie as their star man, I'm not saying he isn't a very good player but I definitely don't think he is up there with the Ronaldo's, Messi's, Iniesta's or even Ibrahimovic.

nullzero

rarnes1 wrote: »

Nani did know where he was though, there's a replay showing that.

Plus intent has nothing to do with it if the ref thinks it's dangerous play

A better ref would have handled it differently. The guy wasn't in control of the game. He allowed the physio on for Nani when he should have known he wasn't injured as he had 'analysed' the incident to the point where he was going to send the player off. He allowed the physio on for the real keeper in injury time when he was clearly wasting time.
Against Bayern when Rafael got sent off and the game changed there could be no complaints. This incident was different. United should have been able to hang in but its conceivable that the games pattern would have remained similar without the red card and United would probably be celebrating a brilliant performance based on a huge effort from all eleven players over ninety minutes which never had the chance to happen.

On another note, I had to laugh at Roy Keane lecturing Gareth Southgate on what constitutes dangerous play. Keane; great player- contrary semi-psychotic person. He's a poor mans Eamo without the charisma or humor.

jaykay74

Andersonisgod wrote: »

btw aside from the red card, I thought it telling that after 2 legs Ronaldo, despite not being particularly brilliant in either game, scored twice (including the tie winning goal) while Man Utd's current main man Van Persie missed quite a lot of chances. If he scores the great chances he had at the Bernabeau then Man Utd probably go through tonight. Just interesting to think how Madrid got Ronaldo while Man Utd have settled for Van Persie as their star man, I'm not saying he isn't a very good player but I definitely don't think he is up there with the Ronaldo's, Messi's, Iniesta's or even Ibrahimovic.

You are missing an "s".

the Ronaldo's, Messi's, Iniesta's or even Ibrahimovic'S.

Essien

SlickRic wrote: »

i think it's a sad day when that is considered a red card.

you have to be very harsh to consider Nani reckless. it's arguable, but extremely harsh.

I think most people who are saying it's reckless, myself included, mean that if you're going to leap that high with your studs up at 5-6ft, you better be damn sure there's nobody around for you to run into. As far as I'm concerned, the fact that he was completely unaware of the player is almost as reckless as doing it whilst being aware of him. It comes down to your definition of reckless I suppose.

Will I Amnt

Andersonisgod wrote: »

btw aside from the red card, I thought it telling that after 2 legs Ronaldo, despite not being particularly brilliant in either game, scored twice (including the tie winning goal) while Man Utd's current main man Van Persie missed quite a lot of chances. If he scores the great chances he had at the Bernabeau then Man Utd probably go through tonight. Just interesting to think how Madrid got Ronaldo while Man Utd have settled for Van Persie as their star man, I'm not saying he isn't a very good player but I definitely don't think he is up there with the Ronaldo's, Messi's, Iniesta's or even Ibrahimovic.

Settled for van Persie??? Lof**kingL

Saganist

Xavi6 wrote: »

Or he did what any defender should do in that situation and attacked the ball with only eyes for it.

You're trying to make something out of nothing as far as Arbeloa's actions are concerned.

He had eyes for Nani more like. :rolleyes:

happyoutscan

Essien wrote: »

I think most people who are saying it's reckless, myself included, mean that if you're going to leap that high with your studs up at 5-6ft, you better be damn sure there's nobody around for you to run into. As far as I'm concerned, the fact that he was completely unaware of the player is almost as reckless as doing it whilst being aware of him. It comes down to your definition of reckless I suppose.

You've summed up perfectly how I feel about it.

Xavi6

Saganist wrote: »

He had eyes for Nani more like. :rolleyes:

So it was a stitch up from Arbeloa?

You're embarrassing yourself now

Will I Amnt

niallo27 wrote: »

If Arbeloa had jumped in the same was as nani in the incident you could compare them but he didn't so you can't compare the incidents.

I never said the incidents were the same. Some views have changed on the whole letter of the law thing is all I'm getting at, not surprising though...

Turtyturd

Saganist wrote: »

He had eyes for Nani more like. :rolleyes:

It's one thing to argue the red but to shift the blame onto Arbeloa is laughable.

Saganist

Quazzie wrote: »

No, he deserved a red for dangerous play by the letter of the law.

Trying to control the ball is dangerous play ?

Quazzie

Saganist wrote: »

Trying to control the ball is dangerous play ?

Ah I give up on you. Your posts are becoming embarrassing at this stage as has been previously pointed out.

niallo27

SlickRic wrote: »

i think it's a sad day when that is considered a red card.

you have to be very harsh to consider Nani reckless. it's arguable, but extremely harsh.

No one is saying it wasn't harsh it's just not the greatest injustice of all time some people are saying.

jaykay74

niallo27 wrote: »

No one is saying it wasn't harsh it's just not the greatest injustice of all time some people are saying.

Did someone really say that ? That'd be a daft thing to say. Maybe in a sporting context at a stretch but generally the greatest injustice. my word. :pac:

niallo27

cambo2008 wrote: »

I never said the incidents were the same. Some views have changed on the whole letter of the law thing is all I'm getting at, not surprising though...

The main argument after that desicion was that both players should have got the same punishment.

niallo27

jaykay74 wrote: »

Did someone really say that ? That'd be a daft thing to say. Maybe in a sporting context at a stretch but generally the greatest injustice. my word. :pac:

That's the general feeling I'm getting, yes.

Saganist

Quazzie wrote: »

Ah I give up on you. Your posts are becoming embarrassing at this stage as has been previously pointed out.

ad hominem to you sir. Well done. :rolleyes:

irish bloke

Lonesome Boatman wrote: »

Keane called it right. Was a red card.

There was a time when I thought the sun shon out of Keanes arse. Now the more I hear and see of him the more I think he is a bit of a tool.

jaykay74

niallo27 wrote: »

That's the general feeling I'm getting, yes.

Has Gill come out and asked for a replay? Will United ask to be the 9th Quarter finalist ?

Dietsquirt

I really don't know why all the united fans are complaining on facebook and twitter tonight; although one could say it was a harsh red to award to Nani, the ref was still well within his rights. Nani lept in to a player, his foot a meter off the ground without looking.. wreckless

Fair decision, the ref could/should have awarded a yellow IMO in terms of keeping the game flowing.

argosy2006

Nani makes contact,then makes even more, why ?
On second clip you see his knee bend he then pushes it out and into player again
That in itself could have made it a red in ref's mind was no need to push his leg into player on purpose once initial contact was made.Nani then stays on ground, why? Sign of guilt ?.He stays down for ages for reasons I can't seem to see

SlickRic

after seeing the replay there on UTV, I'm even more convinced that it wasn't a red.

and Nani only sees Arbeloa at the last minute.

also, you can tell from the players, especially the Real ones, how shocked they were at the decision.

if there was even a hint of a red, in that sort of tense atmosphere, you, i'd imagine, would have also seen a very different reaction.

Real really were clinical in those 10 minutes after the sending off though.

Cienciano

SlickRic wrote: »

after seeing the replay there on UTV, I'm even more convinced that it wasn't a red.

and Nani only sees Arbeloa at the last minute.

also, you can tell from the players, especially the Real ones, how shocked they were at the decision.

if there was even a hint of a red, in that sort of tense atmosphere, you, i'd imagine, would have also seen a very different reaction.

Real really were clinical in those 10 minutes after the sending off though.

Since when is going studs into a player not a red?
Reactions from players makes no difference.

Utopia Parkway

argosy2006 wrote: »

Nani makes contact,then makes even more, why ?
On second clip you see his knee bend he then pushes it out and into player again
That in itself could have made it a red in ref's mind was no need to push his leg into player on purpose once initial contact was made.Nani then stays on ground, why? Sign of guilt ?.He stays down for ages for reasons I can't seem to see

Looks worse the more you see it. He catches Arbeloa in the ribs and Arbeloa was jumping himself which show you how high Nani's boot was. OK he didn't quite catch him full on but it would still have been pretty damn sore. Think most refs would have given a yellow but it's far from a scandalous decision.

argosy2006

It was second part of that contact that looked nasty, Spun Arbeloa around way Nani pushed leg into player after he has seen him, that's deliberate and sneaky lil kick, And he showed his guilt by staying down for no reason

Mars Bar

argosy2006 wrote: »

Nani makes contact,then makes even more, why ?

Because his own knee has just hit his own chest?

argosy2006

What I'm saying is Nani tried to bring ball down, lost it, then pushed leg that was bent outward and into Arbeloa spinning him around, That's on purpose and a red, really well spotted by ref's, a deliberate action is hard to disguise

Cienciano

The more I look at that gif I wonder how on earth people think it wasn't a red?