S2S Cycleway - northside

Tenzor07

Seems to be a lot more tiny stones along the track between St.Annes and Bull Island causeway..

That new restaurant pub area is a disaster, how long can it stay like that before repair work is done to safely facilitate all the extra traffic?

mrcheez

Damn that place must be good. I did pass by it once and got the smell of French Fries, but nothing particularly amazing.

Fighting Tao

mrcheez wrote: »

Damn that place must be good. I did pass by it once and got the smell of French Fries, but nothing particularly amazing.

Probably more to do with locals wanting to be able to say they are there and being too lazy for a short walk to it.

Effects

Tenzor07 wrote: »

That new restaurant pub area is a disaster, how long can it stay like that before repair work is done to safely facilitate all the extra traffic?

What's the planning permission say about parking? They don't seem to mind breaking PP clauses in other areas so I doubt they care about parking.

StabiloBoss

Just a quick word on the new restaurant: be very careful passing by. The cars are crossing the cycle lane to get back out onto the road. I stood and watched it for 10 minutes on Saturday with my hands in front of my face. Cars coming out intending to turn right seemed to have no clue there were bikes coming from the left. I saw 2 near misses in the 10 minutes. To be fair to the cars, I think from their perspective they are missing the track entirely and intending to come to a stop at edge of road. Just so happens that means they are coming straight onto track without looking.

mrcheez

I wonder would speed bumps bordering the bike lane (I.e. running in parallel) be a solution here?

So that cars are forced to approach exit slowly.

StabiloBoss

mrcheez wrote: »

I wonder would speed bumps bordering the bike lane (I.e. running in parallel) be a solution here?

So that cars are forced to approach exit slowly.

I don't think speed was the problem, just total lack of visibility. Bikes moving pretty quick along there so a car's nose appearing basically out of nowhere can cause havoc.

mr spuckler

I think something has to be done alright, speed bumps, a raised crossing point for cyclists (so basically an extended speed bump), painted yellow boxes, highly visible signage, flashing lights akin to a level crossing, something more than what they have anyway!

Leroy42

StabiloBoss wrote: »

I don't think speed was the problem, just total lack of visibility. Bikes moving pretty quick along there so a car's nose appearing basically out of nowhere can cause havoc.

When you say lack of visibility, do you mean lack of observation?

odyssey06

Fighting Tao wrote: »

Probably more to do with locals wanting to be able to say they are there and being too lazy for a short walk to it.

Come off it, you have absolutely no idea whether what you are saying is true.

If you have some way to tell which cars are local and which aren't, we're all ears.

StabiloBoss

Leroy42 wrote: »

When you say lack of visibility, do you mean lack of observation?

Little from Column A, Little from Column B, to be honest. Hard to see, but good observation would get you there. Don't see any harm in helping everyone out though: encourage observation, and make it easier to do so.

Leroy42

It was being pedantic, but the point stands. At that point, visibility (on a normal day) is not an issue. It is lack of observation. The car driving simply did not observe the cycle lane. To state visibility would suggest that there is an issue with it.

On a different point, I do think that the cycle lane actually stops on the 'road' part. Who has the right of way (and as such who should be prepared to stop before entering the space)?

For quite a distance on either side their is a dedicated cycle lane, free from any traffic. It seems crazy to simply throw in this 'road' section with little warning and it would be fairly usual to assume that the cycle lane continues as before.

StabiloBoss

Leroy42 wrote: »

It was being pedantic, but the point stands. At that point, visibility (on a normal day) is not an issue. It is lack of observation. The car driving simply did not observe the cycle lane. To state visibility would suggest that there is an issue with it.

On a different point, I do think that the cycle lane actually stops on the 'road' part. Who has the right of way (and as such who should be prepared to stop before entering the space)?

For quite a distance on either side their is a dedicated cycle lane, free from any traffic. It seems crazy to simply throw in this 'road' section with little warning and it would be fairly usual to assume that the cycle lane continues as before.

Carpark was packed on Saturday, I personally don't think there was a clear view to the lane.

Why not make it clearer and easier for the drivers? Who loses in that situation?

I don't know, maybe I have a different perspective: I'm a newly-qualified driver myself and I was looking at this carpark exit thinking to myself that I was really glad I'd seen it in operation before ever driving it myself.

Chips Lovell

It probably depends too on the signage on the cycle lane. Does the lane stop/start again at the entrance. Or are there yield signs on the lane or on the road?

mathie

I see the Pro Life campaign parked a truck as close as they can to the bike lane (just up to the orange hazards that stop people parking across the bike lane)
It was Mattress Mick last week.

Leroy42

StabiloBoss wrote: »

Carpark was packed on Saturday, I personally don't think there was a clear view to the lane.

Why not make it clearer and easier for the drivers? Who loses in that situation?

I don't know, maybe I have a different perspective: I'm a newly-qualified driver myself and I was looking at this carpark exit thinking to myself that I was really glad I'd seen it in operation before ever driving it myself.

I have no issue with increasing signage, painting lines, flashing lights etc.

Your post said it was visibility, I was merely making the point that visibility is not really the issue, rather that the car drivers are not paying attention to what they can see.

As I said, its a pedantic, although I happen to think, quite an important distinction. It follows on from the usual refrain of "He came out of nowhere" that is trotted out.

But I do agree that some signs should be put up. Certainly as you enter/leave there should be signs to warn the drivers of the possible cyclists. The restaurant can play its part too. It should have something on the door leaving the establishment to remind the car owners of their responsibilities.

To simply go from having very little car pass through to now a full carpark and DCC having done nothing in terms of the quite easily foreseen issues is crazy.

The cycle path from Alfie Byrne to Sutton is an amazing amenity and plenty of money has been spent on it. To allow a single business to create such potential problems is crazy. In reality, they shouldn't be allowed to use that section for parking

Shedite27

Baron de Charlus wrote: »

It probably depends too on the signage on the cycle lane. Does the lane stop/start again at the entrance. Or are there yield signs on the lane or on the road?

Yeah I presume the cycle lane stops there just like it does for the car parkes up by the Yacht club

mr spuckler

Leroy42 wrote: »

I have no issue with increasing signage, painting lines, flashing lights etc.

Your post said it was visibility, I was merely making the point that visibility is not really the issue, rather that the car drivers are not paying attention to what they can see.

As I said, its a pedantic, although I happen to think, quite an important distinction. It follows on from the usual refrain of "He came out of nowhere" that is trotted out.

But I do agree that some signs should be put up. Certainly as you enter/leave there should be signs to warn the drivers of the possible cyclists. The restaurant can play its part too. It should have something on the door leaving the establishment to remind the car owners of their responsibilities.

To simply go from having very little car pass through to now a full carpark and DCC having done nothing in terms of the quite easily foreseen issues is crazy.

The cycle path from Alfie Byrne to Sutton is an amazing amenity and plenty of money has been spent on it. To allow a single business to create such potential problems is crazy. In reality, they shouldn't be allowed to use that section for parking

surely there would at least be an onus on the business to fund the improvement of the roadway, better signage etc? this is fairly stanadard afaik. like, they've ripped out some of the concrete bollards and just left ugly holes. they dug up part of the road that the cycle lane crosses and left it in very rough condition too. I'm very much hoping that it's still way off its final state at the moment.

Fighting Tao

odyssey06 wrote: »

Come off it, you have absolutely no idea whether what you are saying is true.

If you have some way to tell which cars are local and which aren't, we're all ears.

I know the way most people are in Ireland when it comes to driving short distances. Many won’t even walk 200m. I think my assumption is a fair one.

fattymoon

Fighting Tao wrote: »

I know the way most people are in Ireland when it comes to driving short distances. Many won’t even walk 200m. I think my assumption is a fair one.

You are spot on. I watched an interview on the television with prof. Donal o'shea (clinical lead for obesity with the HSE) and he was saying the average car journey in Ireland is somewhere in and around the 2km mark. Outrageous.

mr spuckler

fattymoon wrote: »

You are spot on. I watched an interview on the television with prof. Donal o'shea (clinical lead for obesity with the HSE) and he was saying the average car journey in Ireland is somewhere in and around the 2km mark. Outrageous.

yes, this is a well shared and really quite awful statistic.
one commentary on it here

lambayire

I wonder if funds are an issue for lack of improvements to the surface around there.

The place was way behind on its intended opening date.

Effects

fattymoon wrote: »

The average car journey in Ireland is somewhere in and around the 2km mark. Outrageous.

Is that more an issue of saving time?

The baths is 1.4km from my house so I know I'd walk it. Locals also have the option of walking one way and getting a taxi home.

Effects

lambayire wrote: »

I wonder if funds are an issue for lack of improvements to the surface around there.

The place was way behind on its intended opening date.

And they are also in breach of their planning permission because they won't spend money. I can see car parking being low down on their list. Cyclist's safety probably isn't even on the list.

mr spuckler

lambayire wrote: »

I wonder if funds are an issue for lack of improvements to the surface around there.

The place was way behind on its intended opening date.

I wouldn't rely on getting too much satisfaction from the owners anyway, given some of their previous dealings. a quick Google is very informative indeed.

site_owner

Shedite27 wrote: »

Yeah I presume the cycle lane stops there just like it does for the car parkes up by the Yacht club

yes, but at the bus depot there are stop signs for the cars so cyclists actually have right of way. i.e. its more like a 4 way junction where cyclists have priority

the restaraunt setup is a joke. its set up like a 4 way junction with no indication of who has right of way. the cycle lane ends but there are no stop or yield signs so, treating it as a 4 way, by law, its first come first served. i wont hold my breath for cars to obey that one.

as far as i know its not an actual road, so traffic pulling in has to follow the same rules as traffic pulling into any private driveway across a public footpath. i.e. wait

cars pulling in from the opposite side of the road have no where to stop to allow cyclists already in the junction so either block the road or endanger the cyclist if they mis time their turn in.
cars pulling out have no excuse other than the usual car pushing through, **** the rules and everyone else

fattymoon

Effects wrote: »

Is that more an issue of saving time?

The baths is 1.4km from my house so I know I'd walk it. Locals also have the option of walking one way and getting a taxi home.

Perhaps in some cases. Irrespective you're contributing to the inordinate traffic congestion on the roads as well as placing a strain on the health system due to unhealthy lifestyle. This is what professor o'shea was getting at.

odyssey06

fattymoon wrote: »

Perhaps in some cases. Irrespective you're contributing to the inordinate traffic congestion on the roads as well as placing a strain on the health system due to unhealthy lifestyle. This is what professor o'shea was getting at.

It would be great if we could put Professor O'Shea on the dole by removing the need for his clinic ... and go teetotal and car free to claim the state pension for 40 years, thereby placing a strain on the state finances due to healthy lifestyle

Budawanny

I'm not sure of the wisdom of tri/cycling clubs using it in group cycles as they do today.
i was out on Sunday a group went by (I'm going to sound like a motorist here) 2 abreast on the S2S cycleway,.. going at a fair clip.
Problem is the wee kids on their bikes get terrified by over taken by large like this. Also group cycling 2 a breast on the S2S is wrong in the first place, especially on narrower sections. I don't think its really fair on other cyclists or the wee kids. Perhaps splitting the group up into smaller chunks whiles on spaces like this would be a smart move.

Effects

fattymoon wrote: »

As well as placing a strain on the health system due to unhealthy lifestyle. This is what professor o'shea was getting at.

If the baths were open then you could at least offset the unhealthy part.