S2S Cycleway - northside

Mercian Pro

I have a fair bit of experience in making observations on planning applications and in appeals to Bord Pleanala and in reading the Inspector's Reports subsequently.

There is a reasonable summary of the process at https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/planning_permission/commenting_on_planning_application.html

You will see that the fee for making an objection or obsevation is €20. Many planning authorities now offer an online system for lodging applications and for making observations. The planning authority may only consider observations/objections relating to planning issues and not those based on personal dislikes, grievances or opinions. All valid observations go on the public record and can be viewed online usually a few days after they are submitted.

Planning Inspectors' reports generally group and summarise the issues raised in submissions and assess these based on objectives in the Development Plan, Local Area Plans and National Policies. Whether a valid issue is raised by one objector or by many doesn't seem to matter very much. The Inspector will also consider technical reports on the application prepared by the various sections within the Local Authority and it is likely, in this case, that the report of the Enivonment & Transportation section will be critical.

If all that sounds a bit off-putting, if you feel strongly that something shouldn't go ahead or should be modified, by all means object. I have seen cases where multiple well presented observations were rejected but a single badly composed hand-written note from a neighbour has resulted in an application being refused. Objecting at this stage also allows you to appeal the decision to Bord Pleanala if permission is granted by DCC.

expectationlost

Mercian Pro wrote: »

The planning drawings have finally been uploaded for the proposed alterations at the Baths and can be seen at the above link. Looks like the cyclepath is 3.0m wide. I presume the kink at the entrance is to allow cars to fully pull in off the road/bus-lane before .

and to slow those nasty speeding cyclist? I'd prefer to have a straight run, there isn't much conflict with cars driving in and out, its the cars parked on the cycle lane thats the problem and there still isn't anything physically stop them parking beyond the outlined parking spaces at either end there.

was out for cycling along here today much busier then usual even for a Sunday more cars on the road too

expectationlost

see they've put 4 flexible wands across the entrance to the kilbarrack road, i'll put up a photo later if you want, not sure how water works vehicles will access then now, they don't look easily detachable.

Raam

expectationlost wrote: »

see they've put 4 flexible wands across the entrance to the kilbarrack road, i'll put up a photo later if you want, not sure how water works vehicles will access then now, they don't look easily detachable.

Now cyclists get to cycle into them in the dark instead. :pac:

site_owner

you can fit a van thru on the right. seems to be only designed to avoid driver error, not stop anyone determined to get on.

https://twitter.com/AlanDub13/status/1241693485473902592?s=20

mrcheez

expectationlost wrote: »

see they've put 4 flexible wands across the entrance to the kilbarrack road, i'll put up a photo later if you want, not sure how water works vehicles will access then now, they don't look easily detachable.

yes and they've put them smack bang in the middle of the cycle lane. Would it have been so hard to put them in line with the wall?

Raam

mrcheez wrote: »

yes and they've put them smack bang in the middle of the cycle lane. Would it have been so hard to put them in line with the wall?

Even when thinking of cyclists, no one thinks of cyclists.

mrcheez

Raam wrote: »

Even when thinking of cyclists, no one thinks of cyclists.

afaik they were thinking of pedestrians... hence why they are nowhere near pedestrian paths either side of the bike path

Stark

Got to protect those pedestrians from the "real danger" :rolleyes:

expectationlost

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/big-flaws-in-these-plans-new-clontarf-flood-defences-selected-1.4209295 *groan*

https://councilmeetings.dublincity.ie/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=141&MId=3965&Ver=4
lack of public info as usual

expectationlost

mrcheez wrote: »

yes and they've put them smack bang in the middle of the cycle lane. Would it have been so hard to put them in line with the wall?

pass by today and they've put 4 solid poles along the same line of the wall...


the amount of redoing of cycling infrastructure.. and initially had put in just 2 flexiwands https://twitter.com/DublinPedaller/status/1241015361857826817

car could probably squeeze in either side

mrcheez

expectationlost wrote: »

pass by today and they've put 4 solid poles along the same line of the wall...


the amount of redoing of cycling infrastructure..

car could probably squeeze in either side

Spotted that, thought my eyes were deceiving me.

You can still see the old pole positions too. Mad how they considered that ok at the time.

brocbrocach

The lack of consideration and sense on the lane is getting to me now, been on it 3 times in the last few days. It really is too full for people to be doing intense efforts or pbs.

Leroy42

brocbrocach wrote: »

The lack of consideration and sense on the lane is getting to me now, been on it 3 times in the last few days. It really is too full for people to be doing intense efforts or pbs.

It's not, and never was, meant for that. It's designed for the casual cyclist, move them off the road for more safety and thus increase participation.

You need to find somewhere else for your high intensity training

railer201

^^^^^^
There's another consideration with the Corona virus - it doesn't allow cyclists to maintain the required 2 metre physical distancing from each other on many sections, so I'll be giving it a skip until the restrictions are lifted. The quieter suburban roads will do just fine. Good luck out there, stay safe !

brocbrocach

Leroy42 wrote: »

It's not, and never was, meant for that. It's designed for the casual cyclist, move them off the road for more safety and thus increase participation.

You need to find somewhere else for your high intensity training

Flatten the curve, so to speak...

mrcheez

railer201 wrote: »

^^^^^^
There's another consideration with the Corona virus - it doesn't allow cyclists to maintain the required 2 metre physical distancing from each other on many sections, so I'll be giving it a skip until the restrictions are lifted. The quieter suburban roads will do just fine. Good luck out there, stay safe !

Well you can overtake comfortably with 2m gaps, but just wait until the pedestrian section is clear before moving out?

Tenzor07

If you're going to be talking about the 2m distance, just make sure you present the facts, and not get worried about passing someone out who's less than 2m away, the facts are that if you're passing a pedestrian at 25kph and they are walking at 5kph then the passing maneuver will take a split second!

railer201

mrcheez wrote: »

Well you can overtake comfortably with 2m gaps, but just wait until the pedestrian section is clear before moving out?

The section between the back entrance to Manresa and Mount Prospect Ave., is barely 2 metres across both lanes. There's nowhere to go, as on one side you have the road and on the other the kerbed footpath.

However the main problem, the part you've no control over, is how other cyclists behave. Over the last few days, I had experiences of approaching and following cyclists coming well within the 2 metres on a continual basis when passing, in either direction.

Under the current circumstances with this pandemic, I'm not keen on breathing in anyone else's exhaled air or possible cough and snot droplets which is why I'm giving it a skip for the foreseeable future.

railer201

Tenzor07 wrote: »

If you're going to be talking about the 2m distance, just make sure you present the facts, and not get worried about passing someone out who's less than 2m away, the facts are that if you're passing a pedestrian at 25kph and they are walking at 5kph then the passing maneuver will take a split second!

I'm just complying with the social distancing instruction of 2 metres as issued by the HSE, others are free to interpret it whatever way they want. If there is an exemption for cyclists, written down anywhere, feel free to quote it.

Tenzor07

railer201 wrote: »

I'm just complying with the social distancing instruction of 2 metres as issued by the HSE, others are free to interpret it whatever way they want. If there is an exemption for cyclists, written down anywhere, feel free to quote it.

You're interpreting it the way you want, just read the full facts in order to comply with the directive..

COVID-19 (Coronavirus) is spread through close contact with an infected person. A close contact involves either face-to-face contact or spending more than 15 minutes within 2 metres of an infected person. Close contact does not include someone you passed on the street or in a shop. The risk of contact in that instance is very low.

Source: https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/472f64-covid-19-coronavirus-guidance-and-advice/#how-covid-19-coronavirus-spreads

railer201

Tenzor07 wrote: »

You're interpreting it the way you want, just read the full facts in order to comply with the directive.

I have read the full facts, not just the partial facts you quoted.

Current HSE advice is as follows. No exemptions are mentioned in the link below for cyclists or anyone else.

Avoid close contact with people - keep a distance of 2 metres (6.5 feet) between you and others.

https://www2.hse.ie/conditions/coronavirus/protect-yourself.html?gclid=CjwKCAjwguzzBRBiEiwAgU0FTwCIj95SBO9yZ9Q1dimIWJMZe7XRJIvYsawI1UWr_uxPsHbmNT-KGBoCs4MQAvD_BwE

brocbrocach

Leaving aside the letter of the directives the fact is that many cyclists and pedestrians aren't comfortable being near each and at the moment. So gaps for overtaking that might be taken for granted before are now seen as personal space. So even if you're comfortable within 2 metres the other person might swerve or do something silly. I saw this happen multiple times and, particularly at speed, people's margin for error has decreased.

Even when walking I've had people step out onto the road when passing me and not shoulder check :eek:

expectationlost

can people refrain from spitting/snotting

mrcheez

expectationlost wrote: »

can people refrain from spitting/snotting

better to swallow it? :pac:

expectationlost

mrcheez wrote: »

better to swallow it? :pac:

better that I don't

magicbastarder

expectationlost wrote: »

can people refrain from spitting/snotting

out on the bike? i do it when there's no one near, regardless of covid19 concerns. that said, i always ride solo.

railer201

expectationlost wrote: »

can people refrain from spitting/snotting

Disgusting habit, spitting and blowing snot on to the ground while cycling. Handkerchiefs anyone ???

mrcheez

expectationlost wrote: »

better that I don't

unless it was aimed directly into your mouth as someone passed this is unlikely to happen...unless of course you're licking the pavement on the bike path