Sexism you have personally experienced or have heard of? *READ POST 1*

ligerdub

Vincent Browne was on a break from presenting his show recently. I can't recall if he was replaced by a woman or a man but there was a reasonable period where each panellist on the show was a woman. They'd discuss various topics but invariably it would come back to discrimination against women, abortion, female body issues (including the pressure of women etc), gender quotas, misogyny, the Rose of Tralee and the like. It always veered back to gibberish on women being victims, the downtrodden etc, and invariably how men were to blame! They could have at least discussed issues not just related to women.

Of course Twitter was ablaze with this being such a positive thing, and that it was "progress". Dark times!

silverharp

Carlos Orange

No

Men without children should do this in Ireland.

midnight city

silverharp wrote: »

I wonder has any of them been asked to argue their point and prove there is a wage gap. Or like everywhere else the Icelandic media would be too PC to question them properly on it, to afraid of being called misogynistic.

They are like a giant union that never has to properly account for or explain its demands. It just makes the demands and cries foul if it doesn't get them. Its hard to predict when this will come to a natural end. Its mob rule.

iptba

midnight city wrote: »

I wonder has any of them been asked to argue their point and prove there is a wage gap. Or like everywhere else the Icelandic media would be too PC to question them properly on it, to afraid of being called misogynistic.

They are like a giant union that never has to properly account for or explain its demands. It just makes the demands and cries foul if it doesn't get them. Its hard to predict when this will come to a natural end. Its mob rule.

according to this article: http://www.itv.com/news/2016-10-25/why-is-iceland-the-best-place-in-the-world-to-be-a-woman/

"An astonishing one-third of Iceland’s women are members of a closed Facebook group – ironically named "Beauty Tips" – in which they actively discuss gender issues."

As one person elsewhere said:

It's a literal Matriarchy meeting.
I mean we joke about having Patriarchy meetings, but these women have actually set theirs up.

LostinBlanch

maybe

I didn't know that. But I saw that article in the guardian yesterday.
There is parental leave that everyone takes, and heavily subsidised nursery schools and after care. Something that anyone with kids would support IMO.

Today, every parent receives three months’ paid leave that is non-transferable. Parents then have an additional three months to share as they like.

Because the pay is significant – 80% of salary up to a ceiling of £2,300 a month – and because it’s on a use-it-or-lose-it basis, 90% of Icelandic fathers take up their paternal leave. This piece of social engineering has had a profound impact on men as well as women. Not only do women return to work after giving birth faster than before, they return to their pre-childbirth working hours faster, too. Research shows that, after taking the three months’ leave, fathers continue to be significantly more involved in childcare and do more housework. Sharing the parental responsibilities and chores from the beginning, it seems, makes a difference.

The author can't quite understand why there is a gender pay gap with all these supports - nothing to do with the women choosing to go into less well paid employment or working part time. No, it's all the Patriarchys fault i.e. employers gender biases despite mandatory quotas.

“It’s a good place to be a woman,” says Thorhallsdottir. And it is. Almost 80% of Icelandic women work. Thanks to mandatory quotas, almost half of board members of listed companies are now women, while 41% of MPs and 65% of Iceland’s university students are now female.

Yeah, about that . . . . how's your equality working out there?

ligerdub

Someone called Louise O'Neill was on TV3 this morning. First time I've heard of her, and without going into detail, I'm sad to report there is another militant feminist for me to break old in a cold sweat at the sight of. A vile person.

midnight city

ligerdub wrote: »

Someone called Louise O'Neill was on TV3 this morning. First time I've heard of her, and without going into detail, I'm sad to report there is another militant feminist for me to break old in a cold sweat at the sight of. A vile person.

What wisdom was she imparting on the Irish viewers?

Carlos Orange

No

" 65% of Iceland’s university students and 41% of MPs are female."

I always find it interesting that places where girls are twice as likely as boys to go to university are apparently paragons of equality.

ligerdub

midnight city wrote: »

What wisdom was she imparting on the Irish viewers?

Not solely this issue, but primarily about the fact that it's ok for feminists/women to wear make-up. Originally she had been against the idea of wearing it due to a patriarchal demand for women to wear make-up, but changed her mind. She gave some sort of vague reasoning for it. I found it odd that there was even an issue about it at all!

blue note

ligerdub wrote: »

Not solely this issue, but primarily about the fact that it's ok for feminists/women to wear make-up. Originally she had been against the idea of wearing it due to a patriarchal demand for women to wear make-up, but changed her mind. She gave some sort of vague reasoning for it. I found it odd that there was even an issue about it at all!

Probably that she decided she wanted to wear it? That would be a good reason to me.

um7y1h83ge06nx

ligerdub wrote: »

Someone called Louise O'Neill was on TV3 this morning. First time I've heard of her, and without going into detail, I'm sad to report there is another militant feminist for me to break old in a cold sweat at the sight of. A vile person.

She's pretty well known around here, there was a thread recently either here or in After Hours about her.

Being mild about it I find her a bit tough on my brain and sanity.

ligerdub

blue note wrote: »

Probably that she decided she wanted to wear it? That would be a good reason to me.

That was basically what she said. It was a strange conversation.

The Black Oil

One of these days Louise or Una will run for the Dáil.

Nah.

Connacht2KXX

Ugh i decided to watch that O'Neill interview on TV3. Pure trash. 2 main issues stood out for me

1. She blamed men and the patriarchy for forcing women to be held up to an unattainable beauty standard. I made this point before that men are programmed to procreate with virtually anything. Provided they aren't morbidly obese, men will go for any woman 9 times out of 10 if she is putting out. Men don't give a shít about makeup, hair care products, finger nails, jewellery etc. The people who set these standards are other women and gay people in the fashion industry.

2. She said the main point of feminism is that women can have a choice. Wait, sorry. I thought modern feminism was about equality between men and women? Women being treated the same as men under the law can sometimes restrict their choices, ie conscription, paying for child support, paying alimony etc. Why doesn't she care about men having any choices? I thought she was for equality? Cannot believe she is given a column in the Examiner and will have her own documentary, considering she is so out of touch with reality.

The rest of the interview is to do with her going on about how she likes make up and doesnt want women to be forced to wear it. I support her in that regard, considering women are being put under severe pressure to dress up their appearance by other women.

newport2

Connacht2KXX wrote: »

Cannot believe she is given a column in the Examiner and will have her own documentary, considering she is so out of touch with reality.

Nothing to do with reality, pure click-bait. A lot of people on here - myself included - may well watch her program next Tuesday just to see what drivel she comes out with. Mission accomplished for RTE. They don't care why people watch, just how many do.

Mr Bloat

Connacht2KXX wrote: »

2. She said the main point of feminism is that women can have a choice. Wait, sorry. I thought modern feminism was about equality between men and women? Women being treated the same as men under the law can sometimes restrict their choices, ie conscription, paying for child support, paying alimony etc. Why doesn't she care about men having any choices? I thought she was for equality? Cannot believe she is given a column in the Examiner and will have her own documentary, considering she is so out of touch with reality.

This is the same woman who proudly calls herself a misandrist on her twitter profile. I find it hard to imagine RTE/TV3 giving any airtime to a man who would proclaim himself to be a misogynist but this man hating woman gets plenty.

newport2 wrote: »

Nothing to do with reality, pure click-bait. A lot of people on here - myself included - may well watch her program next Tuesday just to see what drivel she comes out with. Mission accomplished for RTE. They don't care why people watch, just how many do.

It would be much better for all of us if you and others could restrain yourself from watching and reading her drivel. If you're watching just to get outraged, you're no better than her and you're only adding fuel to the fire and encouraging her. Don't feed the trolls, as the saying goes.

midnight city

Mr Bloat wrote: »

This is the same woman who proudly calls herself a misandrist on her twitter profile. I find it hard to imagine RTE/TV3 giving any airtime to a man who would proclaim himself to be a misogynist but this man hating woman gets plenty.

Good enough reason for men to stop paying their TV licence in protest. If she still describes herself as that RTE should be contacted about it.

ligerdub

midnight city wrote: »

Good enough reason for men to stop paying their TV licence in protest. If she still describes herself as that RTE should be contacted about it.

The new chief in RTE probably agrees with her given the nature of the content on show since she took over.

Wibbs

maybe

Connacht2KXX wrote: »

1. She blamed men and the patriarchy for forcing women to be held up to an unattainable beauty standard. I made this point before that men are programmed to procreate with virtually anything. Provided they aren't morbidly obese, men will go for any woman 9 times out of 10 if she is putting out. Men don't give a shít about makeup, hair care products, finger nails, jewellery etc. The people who set these standards are other women and gay people in the fashion industry.

Hmmm, let's pass her spiel through the Wibbsometer 3000 Feminism Filter(™)©. Women are always the victim, men are always to blame? Yep. Passes the test with flying colours. Never mind - and as I've noted before - porn which is almost exclusively produced by and for men as the main audience produces more content with far more ages, shapes and sizes and ethnicity of women on show in a week than Vogue or Cosmo has ever produced. Catwalk anorexics are almost never seen and would be seen by the majority of men as a fetish.

2. She said the main point of feminism is that women can have a choice. Wait, sorry. I thought modern feminism was about equality between men and women? Women being treated the same as men under the law can sometimes restrict their choices, ie conscription, paying for child support, paying alimony etc. Why doesn't she care about men having any choices? I thought she was for equality?

The second rule of Modern Feminism is "We want to pick and choose "equality" where and when it suits". Rights are seen more like a buffet, with the sauce of responsibility rarely drizzled on the choices. Basically have my cake and eat it and don't you dare "fat shame" me.

midnight city

ligerdub wrote: »

The new chief in RTE probably agrees with her given the nature of the content on show since she took over.

Misandry is basically being ingrained as entertainment. And we get to pay for it through our TV license. Its all over the media too.
Misogyny = sackings, Misandry = ratings

The Black Oil

I've an interest in psychology, forensic psychology and the treatment of sex abusers and victims. If you want to read something that's about as far as "rape culture" narratives as you can get, then have a look at this (long, but worthwhile) piece in the Irish Times. Wasn't sure where to put it in tGC, but thought it was worth sharing.

James’s story

“I was about eight when my brother started coming into my room,” James says. “It began with gentle interference but, over time, became more serious and specific. He told me that if I ever told anyone we would both go to prison. It went on for about three years, until shortly after my dad died.

“During my teens there was a deep and profound sadness that I couldn’t shake, so I drank a lot and took drugs. I carried self-loathing, humiliation, fear and shame. When I was 18 my mum brought me to a psychiatrist. When I told her what had happened she thought I was confused.

“Now I have a good relationship with my mum, but during my 20s she seemed to downplay it. I think people need to find the language to talk, at home and in schools, about good and bad intimacy.

“There’s a lot of focus on priests, rightfully: the abuse and the cover-up were despicable. But we don’t talk about families. A family member who abuses is always a family member, and how does the family cope with that?”
In many cases, James says, nobody wants to ruin the family image. “It’s hard for the survivor, for the other siblings, for the extended family. It creates a perpetual anxiety for the survivor which is hard to put to rest.”

James’s case highlights some stark facts that are not always understood about child abuse. Most abuse is carried out by family members or people known to the victim. Many abusers are young men or teenagers. And few are classic “paedophiles”.

Our current image of child sex abusers in Ireland, and our approach to them, may be putting young people at risk. If we are to keep children safe we may have to gain a new understanding of the problem and make some unpalatable changes to the way we deal with it.

orubiru

Connacht2KXX wrote: »

Ugh i decided to watch that O'Neill interview on TV3. Pure trash. 2 main issues stood out for me

1. She blamed men and the patriarchy for forcing women to be held up to an unattainable beauty standard. I made this point before that men are programmed to procreate with virtually anything. Provided they aren't morbidly obese, men will go for any woman 9 times out of 10 if she is putting out. Men don't give a shít about makeup, hair care products, finger nails, jewellery etc. The people who set these standards are other women and gay people in the fashion industry.

2. She said the main point of feminism is that women can have a choice. Wait, sorry. I thought modern feminism was about equality between men and women? Women being treated the same as men under the law can sometimes restrict their choices, ie conscription, paying for child support, paying alimony etc. Why doesn't she care about men having any choices? I thought she was for equality? Cannot believe she is given a column in the Examiner and will have her own documentary, considering she is so out of touch with reality.

The rest of the interview is to do with her going on about how she likes make up and doesnt want women to be forced to wear it. I support her in that regard, considering women are being put under severe pressure to dress up their appearance by other women.

In a lot of ways she is not wrong. Women do face pressure to conform and people who refuse to conform can have a hard time.

The problem I'd have is that she is not being realistic and not really offering up any alternatives.

Is it even possible to live in a society where the members of that society never have expectations put on them by the society that they are a part of?

You could point out that men face societal pressures too and that many men kill themselves as a result of those pressures but we already know that the answer will be "typical man, making it all about the men" or "yes, The Patriarchy damages men too".

OK so we live in a Straight White Male Patriarchy and, as consequence of that, people are forced to do things or to meet the expectations of The Patriarchy.

Does anyone honestly believe that a Bisexual Black Trans-Female Matriarchy would never put any demands on anyone with regards to conformity?

This is a fundamental problem for me. If we "Smash the Patriarchy" then what do we replace it with? Bearing in mind that whatever we replace it with can never force people to do anything and can never set standards.

It all boils down to going on TV or going online and pointing out that bad things are bad.

"Bad things are bad" OK. What are we supposed to do with that?

I get it. Forcing people to do things against their will isn't great. It really sucks to feel like you don't want to wear make up everyday but to wear it anyway because that's what's expected of you.

What's the alternative though? I don't want to go to work. In fact, I absolutely hate it. Maybe we should "smash" modern society and replace it with a society where people don't have to work.

What you are dealing with here is basically a cult based around the idea of a Utopian society. They produce many sermons that more or less boil down to "we could be living in a Utopian society but the following things are preventing that..."

It's all theoretical though. Take "the unattainable beauty standard" as an example. In theory we could get rid of it but in practice people will always have preferences. People will always be looking to get a better situation for themselves. Eventually there will be a lady who comes along and decides to eat well, get some exercise, maybe get her teeth done, maybe a few cosmetic changes here and there, expensive hair style, investment in some top quality clothing items. She walks down the street and heads turn. She walks into a party and jaws drop. How would they eradicate that?

If we are getting rid of beauty standards then what happens to the women who are setting those standards? Force them to eat more? Stop them from exercising? Smash their teeth in?

Oh no wait, in our Perfect Utopia nobody can ever be forced to do anything so if a woman makes the choice to set an "unattainable" standard then we have to let her.

Unpacking this nonsense gives me a headache. Maybe that's the intention.

silverharp

orubiru wrote: »

It's all theoretical though. Take "the unattainable beauty standard" as an example. In theory we could get rid of it but in practice people will always have preferences. People will always be looking to get a better situation for themselves. Eventually there will be a lady who comes along and decides to eat well, get some exercise, maybe get her teeth done, maybe a few cosmetic changes here and there, expensive hair style, investment in some top quality clothing items. She walks down the street and heads turn. She walks into a party and jaws drop. How would they eradicate that?

If we are getting rid of beauty standards then what happens to the women who are setting those standards? Force them to eat more? Stop them from exercising? Smash their teeth in?

the Amish and Islam have it sussed :pac: there are probably less self esteem issues for women where they are forced to be more equal?
Men are biologically wired to chase youth and attractively proportioned women is a sign of health yada yada, men will never be educated into liking fat positivism unless its a fetish for a minority

orubiru

silverharp wrote: »

the Amish and Islam have it sussed :pac: there are probably less self esteem issues for women where they are forced to be more equal?
Men are biologically wired to chase youth and attractively proportioned women is a sign of health yada yada, men will never be educated into liking fat positivism unless its a fetish for a minority

I suppose they could always just force all women to be fat. Or they could just "disappear" all the hot women.

Obviously the thread is about sexism men have faced and often Feminism is put forward as one of the main causes of sexism against men.

I do wonder though if Feminism would ultimately end up oppressing women?

silverharp

orubiru wrote: »

I suppose they could always just force all women to be fat. Or they could just "disappear" all the hot women.

Obviously the thread is about sexism men have faced and often Feminism is put forward as one of the main causes of sexism against men.

I do wonder though if Feminism would ultimately end up oppressing women?

not universally, feminism will only oppress feminists nobody else listens to them or only pays them lip service. tangentially its always worth throwing an eye over to countries where there isn't feminism like Japan , if you see any kind of comparison don't give feminists the credit it only makes them appear more of a force than they are. there might be economics and the modern economy creating a new set of winners and losers.

DEFTLEFTHAND

silverharp wrote: »

the Amish and Islam have it sussed :pac: there are probably less self esteem issues for women where they are forced to be more equal?
Men are biologically wired to chase youth and attractively proportioned women is a sign of health yada yada, men will never be educated into liking fat positivism unless its a fetish for a minority

Very true words. it is impossible to deny the reality of nature.

Zulu

No

The Black Oil wrote: »

I've an interest in psychology, forensic psychology and the treatment of sex abusers and victims. If you want to read something that's about as far as "rape culture" narratives as you can get, then have a look at this (long, but worthwhile) piece in the Irish Times. Wasn't sure where to put it in tGC, but thought it was worth sharing.

I'm confused, whats your point?

silverharp

:pac:

ligerdub

Peak buzzfeed.

What a horrible organisation.

tritium

Read that pretty much as

" Tom Hanks, all around decent guy who's worked long and hard to excel in his profession..

....lets get the privileged prick! White man, white man! Get the outrage police ! #patriarchy #BLM!

"
.
:pac:

silverharp

Im pretty sure reversing the genders here would be misogny ;-)

ancapailldorcha

maybe

They ran an article a few days ago saying that a male pill would enable men to do their part. WHAT DO THEY WANT!!!

Connacht2KXX

Anyone watch the Asking For It documentary?

Thought a lot of it was decent - getting the conversation about consent brought to a national level, letting rape survivors and people working in the RCC get a voice etc etc

However, she put out some dangerous ideas. She mentioned numerous times about why it is wrong to even question the victim of a sexual assault. There's so much wrong in this that there's no point addressing it.

She said that we clearly live in a rape culture in Ireland - again, no point in addressing it.

Most worryingly, she said that teaching women how not to get raped is redundant and we should teach boys not to rape, due to the high number of rapes in Ireland. She quoted some stat that 91% of rape victims knew the perpetrator. Does this not show that teaching women how not to get raped (ie don't get completely wasted and get a taxi home with a group of friends) is working, considering only 9% of women didn't know the perpetrator? I assume a percentage less than 9% of the victims of rape actually got raped in an alleyway after a night out.

She focused on how women are portrayed in the media and how boys and girls are brought up differently which ultimately leads to a culture of rape. You know, there's no need to address how genetics, a poor socioeconomic background, an unstable home, childhood abuse, alcohol abuse, drug addiction, violence may mould one's mind and moral compass, but let's put the emphasis on boys playing with He-Man dolls. From my interaction with the RCC, they maintain that many rapists have no control over anything in their lives (ie due to being an alcoholic and stuck in a dead end job) so they inflict their pain and suffering onto another human being, in the most controlling, dominating and humiliating act that one can do.

midnight city

tritium wrote: »

Read that pretty much as

" Tom Hanks, all around decent guy who's worked long and hard to excel in his profession..

....lets get the privileged prick! White man, white man! Get the outrage police ! #patriarchy #BLM!

"
.
:pac:

Check out the wonderful!! Lena Dunham celebrating white male genocide

https://twitter.com/lenadunham/status/793929098926166016?lang=en

I'm not sure how they get away with it and still remain employed. That's some pretty serious white man hating even though her father is a white protestant man.

midnight city

Connacht2KXX wrote: »

Anyone watch the Asking For It documentary?

Thought a lot of it was decent - getting the conversation about consent brought to a national level, letting rape survivors and people working in the RCC get a voice etc etc

However, she put out some dangerous ideas. She mentioned numerous times about why it is wrong to even question the victim of a sexual assault. There's so much wrong in this that there's no point addressing it.

She said that we clearly live in a rape culture in Ireland - again, no point in addressing it.

Most worryingly, she said that teaching women how not to get raped is redundant and we should teach boys not to rape, due to the high number of rapes in Ireland. She quoted some stat that 91% of rape victims knew the perpetrator. Does this not show that teaching women how not to get raped (ie don't get completely wasted and get a taxi home with a group of friends) is working, considering only 9% of women didn't know the perpetrator? I assume a percentage less than 9% of the victims of rape actually got raped in an alleyway after a night out.

She focused on how women are portrayed in the media and how boys and girls are brought up differently which ultimately leads to a culture of rape. You know, there's no need to address how genetics, a poor socioeconomic background, an unstable home, childhood abuse, alcohol abuse, drug addiction, violence may mould one's mind and moral compass, but let's put the emphasis on boys playing with He-Man dolls. From my interaction with the RCC, they maintain that many rapists have no control over anything in their lives (ie due to being an alcoholic and stuck in a dead end job) so they inflict their pain and suffering onto another human being, in the most controlling, dominating and humiliating act that one can do.

I watched the 2nd half of it last night so i won't comment too much on the show as i missed most of it. But i did look at the comments on twitter and maybe about 1 in 20 were from men. 95% were from women. I'm not sure why that was. Plenty of men are on twitter. I don't think she is the right person to get through to men and boys.

professore

Someone whose Twitter strapline is "Author. Feminist/Misandrist, depending on the day." is unlikely to win many male fans.
Imagine a man with a Twitter strapline "Author. MRA/Misogynist, depending on the day." They wouldn't get a series on RT for a start.

Wibbs

maybe

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

They ran an article a few days ago saying that a male pill would enable men to do their part. WHAT DO THEY WANT!!!

"The great question that has never been answered, and which I have not yet been able to answer, despite my thirty years of research into the feminine soul, is 'What does a woman want?'"

Sigmund Freud. While he was talking daft about women there, he unknowingly hit the nail on the head with regard to many modern public feminists and modern feminism itself. Though my take is that what they want is all the perks possible, with as few of the responsibilities as possible. Like children playing as adults.

Connacht2KXX wrote: »

Anyone watch the Asking For It documentary?

Thought a lot of it was decent - getting the conversation about consent brought to a national level, letting rape survivors and people working in the RCC get a voice etc etc

No issues there alright.

However, she put out some dangerous ideas.

Me. Earlier. Not shocked.

She mentioned numerous times about why it is wrong to even question the victim of a sexual assault. There's so much wrong in this that there's no point addressing it.

She said that we clearly live in a rape culture in Ireland - again, no point in addressing it.

Most worryingly, she said that teaching women how not to get raped is redundant and we should teach boys not to rape, due to the high number of rapes in Ireland. Women are always the victims, men are always to blame

Translation service brought to you by the Wibbsometer 3000 Feminism Filter(™)© The level of projection she and other "feminist" talking heads exhibit would dwarf an international fair of cinema equipment.

ligerdub

Connacht2KXX wrote: »

She said that we clearly live in a rape culture in Ireland - again, no point in addressing it.

Most worryingly, she said that teaching women how not to get raped is redundant and we should teach boys not to rape, due to the high number of rapes in Ireland.

Don't worry, statements like that never have to be corroborated if it's on that side of the debate.

I like the argument that teaching women how to rape is redundant but we should teach men not to rape, fine logic! I'm sick of this stuff at the best of times, but at least I'm old enough to just ignore their sick nonsense, I draw the line at making young boys and men feel as though they are future predators. It angers me to be honest. I can't help but feel there is a self fulling prophecy aspect to it.

Why is she fronting this campaign anyway? In what way is she qualified to speak on any of this?

The twitter response as well as from some other sources is just rotten. Some people are saying this should be shown in every school in Ireland! Wrong wrong wrong wrong!!

py2006

When I hear these more extreme feminist talk of rape culture in Ireland I sit back and think of my country and what culture we have......DRINKING CULTURE!!

We love a drink, we socialise alot in pubs, we make friends, meet partners, joke about it and generally have a good times. Its part of our culture. For mainly good but unfortunately sometimes bad (addiction etc).

But when I hear the phrase rape culture I am thinking, eh no, we do not support it, enjoy it, accept it as part of a night out, meet like minded rapists to converse and joke about it. We don't celebrate it. It is not the culture of Ireland. It happens unfortunately but that doesn't mean there is a culture of it.

Am I mad with that comparison?

um7y1h83ge06nx

I agree with you py2006. A "culture" to me is something to me that is promoted, supported and celebrated or at the very least tolerated.

I think people would need to be severely disconnected with reality if they thought the crime of rape is dealt with in that way here.

Why would someone like Larry Murphy be vilified if we had a rape culture.

midnight city

py2006 wrote: »

When I hear these more extreme feminist talk of rape culture in Ireland I sit back and think of my country and what culture we have......DRINKING CULTURE!!

But when I hear the phrase rape culture I am thinking, eh no, we do not support it, enjoy it, accept it as part of a night out, meet like was rapists to converse and joke about it. We don't celebrate it. It is not the culture of Ireland. It happens unfortunately but that doesn't mean there is a culture of it.
?

When i read that article on the Brazilian man who raped and left a 23 yr old Irish woman lying on the street i felt such anger. If i could have got my hands on him i would have battered him. I'm sure most men would have felt similar revulsion and anger. That guy will have to be separated from general population in prison for his own safety. That is hardly evidence of a rape culture. For the likes of Louise to push the idea of rape culture is her basically saying that men condone rape. Its a scandalous assertion. She needs to be getting men on side not blaming them as a group.

Pepe LeFrits

I think it's more pertinent to ask why don't we hear about assault or murder culture, if rape culture is such a /fact/. The case for assault in particular being 'normalised' in our country is far stronger.

Or if it's rape jokes or the portrayal of rape in popular culture, again assault and even murder are far more 'normalised'. How many heroic or sympathetic murderers are there on TV? How many heroic or sympathetic rapists are there?

ligerdub

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

I think it's more pertinent to ask why don't we hear about assault or murder culture, if rape culture is such a /fact/. The case for assault in particular being 'normalised' in our country is far stronger.

Or if it's rape jokes or the portrayal of rape in popular culture, again assault and even murder are far more 'normalised'. How many heroic or sympathetic murderers are there on TV? How many heroic or sympathetic rapists are there?

Very good point.

Came across this the other day from a particular type on Facebook: "Why go for consent as a baseline? Shouldn't we be going for enthusiasm?". Great.

gizmo555

Time Magazine explains this week hat "If there’s one lesson to draw from this historic election, it’s that even women a hair away from the most powerful position in the world can still see themselves quickly derailed by badly behaved men."

The badly behaved men referred to are Bill Clinton and Anthony Weiner, Bill for his alleged sexual abuse of women, and Weiner for his sexting. (And by the way, FBI Director Comer for having the temerity to suggest she might not be above the law.)

Of course, neither Hillary's alleged bullying and intimidation of the women who complained about her husband, nor her lunatic use of an insecure homebrew mailserver for her official duties as US Secretary of State have anything to do with this. It's all those awful men dragging her down.

Padraig Mor

The likes of Louise et al see all men as the enemy and truly believe the old 'all men are rapists' schtick. However, they have enough cop on to realise that the vast majority of women would not agree with them. Hence the creation of the 'rape culture' myth, which assigns all men to one of three groups:
1. Are rapists themselves.
2. Directly support rape and would do it if they got a chance; have probably 'sexually assaulted' women (within the extremely loose interpretation that these people use of that term).
3. Indirectly support rape by telling dirty jokes etc, which supposedly 'normalises' rape.

Of course, it's patently a nonsense - rape of women is topped only by rape of children for sheer offensiveness to the overwhelming majority of men. Even criminals look down on rapists - hence separate sex offender prisons etc. This wave of 'feminists' genuinely believe that hordes of men are laughing together in locker rooms across the country about how many women they forced into sex etc the previous weekend. While many men will engage in apparently scandalous banter, it's clear to them all that it's tongue in cheek and a 'surface' - the reality is that any man who boasts to a bunch of others of sexually assaulting women can count himself lucky if he 'gets away' with only being reported to the Gardaí.

They will point to what they say is light sentencing for sexual assaults - completely ignoring the widespread criticism of the failure of the judiciary to properly sentence an enormous amount of violent crimes, not just rape. I haven't seen the programme but I've read that Louise also said that alleged rape victims should not be questioned by the Gardaí - is that not simply a case of any man accused of rape is guilty until proven innocent?

They will use all manner of dubious facts and figures to support their contentions - and of course you're wrong if you point this out. How many surveys which are reported as saying "x% of women have been raped" actually turn out to cover everything from rape to the most minor of sexual assaults, or less, AND are hopelessly biased, based on self selected respondents? That such conflation and misreporting could actually result in a trivialisation of rape is of course lost on our 'feminist' friends.

Panthro

maybe

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3900414/Mother-two-37-naked-boy-14-her.html


Ah Shure she was drunk so it's fine.
FFS.

Iseedeadpixels

Panthro wrote: »

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3900414/Mother-two-37-naked-boy-14-her.html


Ah Shure she was drunk so it's fine.
FFS.

Oh god that 14 year old is now a rapist :rolleyes:

The Black Oil

midnight city wrote: »

I watched the 2nd half of it last night so i won't comment too much on the show as i missed most of it. But i did look at the comments on twitter and maybe about 1 in 20 were from men. 95% were from women. I'm not sure why that was. Plenty of men are on twitter. I don't think she is the right person to get through to men and boys.

A lot of it was comments from her mates, fellow media people, etc. Bit of a bubble going on there. Most of the negative male responses seemed to be from anonymous accounts.

I watched the doc. I suspect Liam Fay of the Sunday Times might be about the only one with the neck not to give it a free pass. There were good parts such as the woman who works in victim support at the courts, the SC, the RCC, the academics and Niamh Ní Dhomhnaill. The bad? O' Neill's broad statements. She spoke to zero second level students even though, more than once, she said they need better sex ed and information about consent. The two men she spoke to - waste of time. And capping it off with that boys need to be taught not to rape, of course.