The Greatest Injustice of All Time!

The_Kew_Tour

AdamD wrote: »

What the actual ****

Its quite simple.

Both Sunshine rugby supporters and Koreans are both brainwashed into thinking they are something that they are not.

Twas to be taken light hearted.

Anyway back on topic.

jmayo

Only looking at internationals, there have been some very famous injustices down the years.
The 1934 WC hosted by Italy was stitch up from the start where Mussolini appointed the refs and the night before the final had dinner with the ref. Austrian and Spanish teams were by all accounts robbed in games and an Austrian player even claimed the linesman handled the ball back into play for Italians.

Maybe Italy got justice in 2002.

Argentina in 1978 was a farce as well, especially Peru's convenient lapse.

From the ones I remember actually seeing.
Germany in 1982 got away with murder.
Their game against Austria, where a draw knocked out Algeria, was an utter disgrace where they didn't even bother playing.
Then Schumacher's escape without even a card after his assualt on Battison meant he was on the pitch for the penalty shootout in the semi final.

England have gotten screwed a couple of times, but I guess we just laughed when it happened to them.

It wasn't quiet so funny when we have gotten screwed ourselves.
The night in Heysel in 1981 was daylight robbery where the cheating Belgiums were up to their usual tricks.
Then of course we had the hand of frog with henry.

I think most clubs and nations, particularly the less significant ones, can point to some injustice in their history.

roanoke

ronjo wrote: »

I am pretty sure we wouldnt have qualified for the second round with two points if Quinn hadnt scored.

This is correct. Also, strange as it sounds Ireland had the benefit of being drawn in group F. This is because groups A to E had finished and Ireland/Holland knew what they had to get (pointswise) to at least be one of the best 3rd place teams.

By comparison if Ireland/Holland had been in Group A and pulled that trick of playing the game out for 1-1 they'd have (almost) guaranteed 2nd+3rd between them alright but there was no guarantee that whoever the 3rd place team was would have made it to the next round.

That said though, Egypt still had their own game in progress at the same time, so it wasn't at the same level as what happened in 1982 imho.

The_Kew_Tour

roanoke wrote: »

This is correct. Also, strange as it sounds Ireland had the benefit of being drawn in group F. This is because groups A to E had finished and Ireland/Holland knew what they had to get (pointswise) to at least be one of the best 3rd place teams.

By comparison if Ireland/Holland had been in Group A and pulled that trick of playing the game out for 1-1 they'd have guaranteed 2nd+3rd between them alright but there was no guarantee that whoever the 3rd place team was would have made it to the next round.

That said though, Egypt still had their own game in progress at the same time, so it wasn't at the same level as what happened in 1982 imho.

If Egypt had of scored every team would of been on 3 points having scored 2 and conceded 2.

I dont know what the rule book had in store for which team lost out had that scenario taken place.

roanoke

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

If Egypt had of scored every team would of been on 3 points having scored 2 and conceded 2.

I dont know what the rule book had in store for which team lost out had that scenario taken place.

Yep, that's why I changed my post at the last second there as I didn't qualify that.

I forgot to mention that whilst what Ireland/Holland were doing was to an extent gamesmanship to engineer qualification it was never guaranteed to work. A goal at any time by Egypt would have thrown the group into chaos and any team could have ended up ranked in any of the four positions.

The_Kew_Tour

roanoke wrote: »

Yep, that's why I changed my post at the last second there as I didn't qualify that.

I forgot to mention that whilst what Ireland/Holland were doing was to an extent gamesmanship to engineer qualification it was never guaranteed to work. A goal at any time by Egypt would have thrown the group into chaos and any team could have ended up ranked in any of the four positions.

Might of been better off not knowing cause it may have been Ireland losing out.:pac::pac::pac:

Would of just been interesting to see what Fifa would of done all same if what was the rule.

Might check up on that sometime.

Fr Tod Umptious

roanoke wrote: »

This is correct. Also, strange as it sounds Ireland had the benefit of being drawn in group F. This is because groups A to E had finished and Ireland/Holland knew what they had to get (pointswise) to at least be one of the best 3rd place teams.

By comparison if Ireland/Holland had been in Group A and pulled that trick of playing the game out for 1-1 they'd have (almost) guaranteed 2nd+3rd between them alright but there was no guarantee that whoever the 3rd place team was would have made it to the next round.

That said though, Egypt still had their own game in progress at the same time, so it wasn't at the same level as what happened in 1982 imho.

And that is one of the problems you have with a 24 team competition, 3rd placed teams qualifying from 4 out of the 6 groups.

We will see it again in 2016

ronjo

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Might of been better off not knowing cause it may have been Ireland losing out.:pac::pac::pac:

Would of just been interesting to see what Fifa would of done all same if what was the rule.

Might check up on that sometime.

I am pretty sure it would have been lots, just like with Ireland/Holland for 2nd/3rd place in the group.

The_Kew_Tour

ronjo wrote: »

I am pretty sure it would have been lots, just like with Ireland/Holland for 2nd/3rd place in the group.

I actually was just wondering that.

Holland got West Germany so I think we got lucky there.

ronjo

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I actually was just wondering that.

Holland got West Germany so I think we got lucky there.

That was the game Voeller got sent off for being spat at by Rijkaard.
Another injustice actually that really p*ssed me off as I had backed Voeller to be top scorer in the tournament

Cienciano

Balmed Out wrote: »

Not on the pitch but for me the greatest football related injustice was the murder of Andres Escobar after he scored an own goal against the USA and Columbia got knocked out of the 94 World Cup. Puts things in perspective. Think this thread is hilarious as being born out of Tuesday nights game.

The thing is, Tuesday nights decision hasn't even gotten a mention. After the knee jerk reaction, looking back in hindsight, man-u fans are realising that it wasn't that bad a decision.

homerjay2005 wrote: »

and likewise, you rarely see cheating of the likes of Suarez or Henry proportions at big stage in Rugby and GAA.

There's loads of cheating in rugby! Look how many penalties are given in each game. Sin bins are common, and so are players cited after a game.
The one lesson football needs to learn from rugby is respect for the ref. It's gotten out of hand in football, players screaming at the ref shouldn't be tolerated. Stuff like Rio's hand clap in the refs face should be a straight red, and if it happens after the whistle, just a 2 match ban.

Kimbot

I think the beachball not getting a professional contract after scoring that fine goal is a travesty.

AdamD

Cienciano wrote: »

The thing is, Tuesday nights decision hasn't even gotten a mention. After the knee jerk reaction, looking back in hindsight, man-u fans are realising that it wasn't that bad a decision.

There's loads of cheating in rugby! Look how many penalties are given in each game. Sin bins are common, and so are players cited after a game.
The one lesson football needs to learn from rugby is respect for the ref. It's gotten out of hand in football, players screaming at the ref shouldn't be tolerated. Stuff like Rio's hand clap in the refs face should be a straight red, and if it happens after the whistle, just a 2 match ban.

The thing rugby has going for it is that they tend to deal with the cheating far better than in football. Incidents like Huth's stamp v Liverpool or Rooney's elbow v whoever it was, would get punished every time in rugby, the rules around post match decisions in football are really poor, justified as attempts to defend the refs when in reality they make it even worse when the ref doesn't see the situation correctly.

On the Suarez topic; its not really that much of an injustice, they were unlucky in that it happened so late that the red card didn't matter but a penalty and a red is enough of a punishment. You can justify penalty tries in Rugby as there is no equivalent to a penalty kick (in terms of the chance of getting the 7 points).

roanoke

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

And that is one of the problems you have with a 24 team competition, 3rd placed teams qualifying from 4 out of the 6 groups.

We will see it again in 2016

Yep. At the very least I hope they use some better system at Euro2016 for allocating the teams in the last 16 than the contrived version they used in the past World Cups.

For instance. Without meaning using the word "seed" Ireland were for all intents and purposes "semi-seeded" for the last 16 at WC 1990 despite not even winning a game. It was like a perfect storm of luck went our way. First we land in the final group to play, which meant we we knew the outcomes of the other groups could engineer our final result to an extent. Then we win the drawing of lots vs Holland and then we just happen to be in one of the two groups out of six in which 2nd place was arbitrarily "semi-seeded" for the next round. It was a joke (albeit fortuitous for us ).

homerjay2005

Cienciano wrote: »

Stuff like Rio's hand clap in the refs face should be a straight red, and if it happens after the whistle, just a 2 match ban.

Video refs are used anytime there is a dodgy call, it eliminates alot (not all) of the mistakes.

refs get more respect, as there are less mistakes.

intellectual dosser

Cienciano wrote: »

The thing is, Tuesday nights decision hasn't even gotten a mention. After the knee jerk reaction, looking back in hindsight, man-u fans are realising that it wasn't that bad a decision.

It was mentioned in the OP as a form of premise, but maybe you'd like MU fans to keep going on about it anyway?


Im surprised Spurs fans haven't mentioned the Chelsea FA Cup semi final last year. Game was 1-0 to Chelsea who were then given a goal that wasnt. The game had been pretty even for me only for a superbly taken goal from Drogba. The stage was set for a Spurs drubbing after the goal that wasnt was given.

A spurs supporting friend of mine lost a passion for the game that day that he hasnt recovered since.

People will obviously argue this one, but thought it was worth a mention.

jaykay74

Cienciano wrote: »

The thing is, Tuesday nights decision hasn't even gotten a mention. After the knee jerk reaction, looking back in hindsight, man-u fans are realising that it wasn't that bad a decision.

Since the thread is about "The Greatest Injustice of All Time!" the Nani red is hardly worth a mention in that frame of reference. I'd imagine thats why it hasn't been mentioned, quite a leap to suggest then than based on the lack of a Nani mention here that "man-u fans are realising that it wasn't that bad a decision". Pretty stupid jump in logic right there.

jimjimjimmy

Liverpool not winning the 08/09 season when they only lost 2 games and were by far better than Man Utd for 99% of the season. I'm an Inter fan so not biased either way.

Deise Vu

intellectual dosser wrote: »

It was mentioned in the OP as a form of premise, but maybe you'd like MU fans to keep going on about it anyway?


Im surprised Spurs fans haven't mentioned the Chelsea FA Cup semi final last year. Game was 1-0 to Chelsea who were then given a goal that wasnt. The game had been pretty even for me only for a superbly taken goal from Drogba. The stage was set for a Spurs drubbing after the goal that wasnt was given.

A spurs supporting friend of mine lost a passion for the game that day that he hasnt recovered since.

People will obviously argue this one, but thought it was worth a mention.

A true Spurs fan knows it is not a game unless the opposition get a goal that wasn't or Spurs score a goal that isn't given. Mendes, FA Semi Final, Gomes recovers a boo-boo but not according to the ref(Chelsea again).

Thats why I mentioned the Stoke game earlier. Stoke played with four goalkeepers and three linebackers, Spurs still had a legitimate goal disallowed and throw in a red card for Kaboul (hilariously) making a spectacles gesture at the ref and later brushing against a Stoke player. Even Merson thought it was farcical.

jaykay74

jimjimjimmy wrote: »

Liverpool not winning the 08/09 season when they only lost 2 games and were by far better than Man Utd for 99% of the season. I'm an Inter fan so not biased either way.

Is that a fact

intellectual dosser

Deise Vu wrote: »

A true Spurs fan knows it is not a game unless the opposition get a goal that wasn't or Spurs score a goal that isn't given. Mendes, FA Semi Final, Gomes recovers a boo-boo but not according to the ref(Chelsea again).

Thats why I mentioned the Stoke game earlier. Stoke played with four goalkeepers and three linebackers, Spurs still had a legitimate goal disallowed and throw in a red card for Kaboul (hilariously) making a spectacles gesture at the ref and later brushing against a Stoke player. Even Merson thought it was farcical.

You and my spurs supporting friend are definitely of the same mould.

I missed your earlier post, but dare I say "Chris Foy" ? I'm no spurs fan but even I remember that one.

sReq | uTeK

jimjimjimmy wrote: »

Liverpool not winning the 08/09 season when they only lost 2 games and were by far better than Man Utd for 99% of the season. I'm an Inter fan so not biased either way.

Premiership table states otherwise if only you could win leagues on drawing and not killing off teams.....pewpew

Deise Vu

intellectual dosser wrote: »

You and my spurs supporting friend are definitely of the same mould.

I missed your earlier post, but dare I say "Chris Foy" ? I'm no spurs fan but even I remember that one.

You say Chris Foy, Spurs fans have several other ephitets, none of which are repeatable.

sReq | uTeK

Back on topic.

For me it was Henry's hand ball, secondly is see how Trap sets out his team game in game out when we are capable of so much more.

It frustrates me that whelan is so attacking for stoke, yet can't get into the opponents half in an irish jersey.

**** U TRAP

adox

Cienciano wrote: »

The thing is, Tuesday nights decision hasn't even gotten a mention. After the knee jerk reaction, looking back in hindsight, man-u fans are realising that it wasn't that bad a decision.

What a load of bollix. You seem intent on stirring it up again now that the match thread is locked.

Its already been explained to you so leave it at that.

gosplan

Klinsmann dive vrs Argentina in the 1990 world cup final.

Basically the same thing as Nani but in a final.

I would point to the Chelsea vrs Barca for the scale of it. Germany, Utd, Henry = one wrong decision.

Chelsea should have had at least 3 penalites that night. it was astounding.

764dak

Spain winning the 2010 World Cup is an injustice.

Villa should have been sent off against Honduras for punching a player. FIFA should have suspended him after reviewing but they did not. Villa scored against Chile and Torres dived to get Chilean player sent off (Chile outplayed them with 10 men). Villa’s goal against Portugal was offside and a Portuguese player was sent off because a Spanish player pretended to get hit. Paraguay’s goal was wrongly disallowed and Paraguay’s missed penalty should have been retaken for encroachment. Germany should have gotten a penalty against Spain.
Iniesta should have been sent off against the Netherlands. Puyol should have been sent off also. Netherlands were twice denied clear corners (one in regular time and the other in the second extra time period). There was a clear foul on Elia that was ignored which led to the counterattack that led to Spain’s winning goal. They only scored 8 goals in 7 games. Wow, powerful Spain.

Mont

gosplan wrote: »

Klinsmann dive vrs Argentina in the 1990 world cup final.

Basically the same thing as Nani but in a final.

I would point to the Chelsea vrs Barca for the scale of it. Germany, Utd, Henry = one wrong decision.

Chelsea should have had at least 3 penalites that night. it was astounding.

Ah come on, there wasnt one of them a clear cut penalty. Look back over them and you will see. That game had justice written all over it.

SEPT 23 1989

Pele 1966

bullvine

Has the 2001 FA Cup final been mentioned, Henchoz handled the ball on the line twice I think with neither resulting in a Peno.

gosplan

Mont wrote: »

Ah come on, there wasnt one of them a clear cut penalty. Look back over them and you will see. That game had justice written all over it.

Riggggghhhhht.

Look, I'm not a Chelsea fan and I admit to finding the whole thing pretty funny at the time. But come on - to not get a single penalty out of these.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyzEhFi92e4

What happened United was not fair, granted. But if those decisions had have happened the the day, I reckon it would have killed Fergie and the internet would have exploded.

jmayo

dan1895 wrote: »

That was just incompetence rather than cheating. the blood capsule incident a couple of years ago on the other hand...

Ehh check out this link...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XBqetaCfgo

It was not incompetence because he only penalised one side and affectively reffed one side.
For it to be incompetence the spanner would have to be equal.

FFS to show how bad he was one example was how he gave a scrum to France for a knock on for a kiwi handling the ball, yet he failed to give a penalty as the guy was lying on top of a ruck off his feet.
If he saw him knock it on he could hardly have missed the fact he was horizontal.
Don't get me started on richie mccaw and all the times he somehow managed once again to land on the other side of a ruck.

craig joubert was a fooking joke and if it was any other sport the French would demand he never ref them again.
Of course what happened this 6 naitons.

paddy o'brien, IRB cheif of refs board, made sure his home country won.
Only when the WC is in NZ do they manage to get the same ref in semi and final, convenient or what ?

roanoke wrote: »

This is correct. Also, strange as it sounds Ireland had the benefit of being drawn in group F. This is because groups A to E had finished and Ireland/Holland knew what they had to get (pointswise) to at least be one of the best 3rd place teams.

By comparison if Ireland/Holland had been in Group A and pulled that trick of playing the game out for 1-1 they'd have (almost) guaranteed 2nd+3rd between them alright but there was no guarantee that whoever the 3rd place team was would have made it to the next round.

That said though, Egypt still had their own game in progress at the same time, so it wasn't at the same level as what happened in 1982 imho.

I have never seen anything as blatant or downright fixed as 1982 West Germany Austria game.
Each side played around a bit and then out of respect for their fellow Aryans they handed the ball over to the other side to play with for a while.

The only other thing almost as mind boggling in that world cup was the walk off by Kuwait and the sheik with the tea towel in the stand giving the go ahead for the match to continue.

dfx-

TheNinthGate wrote: »

In fact, Ireland DID do it at Italia 90, in the 1-1 with Holland. Result suited both, after Quinn equalised in the 71st minute the game literally ended, with twenty minutes of Bonner to McCarthy to Bonner hoof to van Breukelen to Koeman to van Breukelen hoof to Bonner to McCarthy ad infinitum.

It then took the drawing of lots to determine the final standings in the group. Holland went on to lose to Germany, and Ireland beat Romania on Penalties. If Holland had have went for the win, they'd have ended up second and likely progressing against Romania, while Germany would likely hvae beaten Ireland.

I wouldn't claim that as the same thing, where there is no disadvantage to a third party unlike Ajax in the CL or Brazil in 1978 or Algeria in 1982.

England benefitted and Egypt didn't lose out because of the game finishing as a draw after the equaliser.

lmao

lmao wrote: »

Djimi Traoré has a Champions League winners medal!

Sappy404 wrote: »

It'd be a bit unfair to not give him a medal considering he won the thing

You really are missing the point!

padd b1975

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Pele 1966

Maradona 1982.

eh i dunno

Everton not allowed to compete in the European cup in 1985 and 1987 when they had a great chance of winning it. Only one team should have been banned not the whole lot

bullvine

eh i dunno wrote: »

Everton not allowed to compete in the European cup in 1985 and 1987 when they had a great chance of winning it. Only one team should have been banned not the whole lot

Only had this conversation with a liverpool fan on tuesday, terrible what happened at Heysel but to ban the other teams was a disgrace, Everton could have easily have won the European Cup when you think of the teams that won it in that era prior to Milans Domination.

The_Kew_Tour

Spain v Ireland in 1992 is another. John Aldridge had perfect good goal ruled out for offside. He was miles onside.

keano_afc

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Spain v Ireland in 1992 is another. John Aldridge had perfect good goal ruled out for offside. He was miles onside.

We really were robbed over the years, its actually astounding when you look at all the decisions. Bulgaria away in 87 was another one.

monkey9

The Of The Ball crew leaving!!

Ronin247

Can't believe this hasn't come up...

1966 World Cup Quarter final....... England v Argentina.....the sending off of Antonio Rattin.

The German, ref Rudolph Kreitlein, sent Rattin off after 35 minutes, not for a foul but for "violence of the tongue".
Rattin was one of the best players in the world and, strangely enough, he spoke no German and the ref spoke no Spanish so it would have been difficult for the ref to have heard/understood him swearing. When this fact was pointed out to the ref after the game he replied that he "did not like the look" on Rattins face.
Historians(British) have since tried to paint the Argentinian side as dirty and cynical during the game but history shows England committed 33 fouls to the Argentinian 19.
The fact that England were the hosts had no influence whatsoever.

As a United fan I would have to say that the biggest injustice I have seen (on tv) was the Chelsea Barca robbery...to quote Drogba " a f*cking disgrace!"

Rezident

DazMarz wrote: »

For me personally, the 2009 Champions League Semi-Final is up there near the summit. Chelsea had I don't know how many penalty shouts waved away, some of them stonewall that would have been given in 9 cases out of 10.

You should watch those replays. Malouda's dive in the box would not have been given as a penalty by Mike Reilly in Old Trafford if he had been a United player. Drogba's dive was, among his anthology of dives such a poor effort that it is clear he needed to dive more convincingly, like he normally does. There was a slight pull of his shirt backwards but the way be dives forwards with no forward pressure just looks like a lazy dive. Watching it again, you just feel sorry for him, it's like he's just not putting the effort that we know he's capable of into his diving in that scene. Maybe if he didn't have his reputation as one of the most prolific divers in world football, he might have gotten that one. The big boy who cried wolf.

The handball claims, while often given (wrongly), were ball-to-hand, and not handball, according to the rules:

Handling the ball

Handling the ball involves a deliberate act of a player making contact with the ball with his hand or arm. The referee must take the following into consideration:

• the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
• the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
• the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an infringement
• touching the ball with an object held in the hand (clothing, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement
• hitting the ball with a thrown object (boot, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement

Extract from: http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/worldfootball/clubfootball/01/37/04/28/law12-en.pdf

Note the use of the word "deliberate". If Michael Ballack blasts a shot at goal at around 100kph and you are a few yards away and the ball strikes your hand - before you even have the chance to get out of the way, let alone deliberately handle it, it is not a "handball". Although you are right, refs regularly get this one wrong (among other things), it is a common misconception.

I wish more refs would stand up to the divers and cheaters that are ruining the modern game. Ultimately, that game was decided by two great goals, the way it should be.

Cienciano

gosplan wrote: »

What happened United was not fair, granted. But if those decisions had have happened the the day, I reckon it would have killed Fergie and the internet would have exploded.

If that happened to man-u, the mods would just have to lock the entire soccer forum for about a month.

The_Kew_Tour

Cienciano wrote: »

If that happened to man-u, the mods would just have to lock the entire soccer forum for about a month.

:pac::pac:

derfderf

keano_afc wrote: »

Personally, the end of Arsenal's 49 game unbeaten run at Old trafford was very hard to take. Freddie Ljungberg pulled down by Ferdinand when clean through and not even a free kick given. Van Nistelrooy nearly removing Ashely Cole's knee and again nothing given. A systematic hatchet job on Jose Reyes that went unpunished until well into the the second half. And then to top it all, an appalling dive by Rooney punsihed by a penalty. If we lost the unbeaten run fair and square it wold be no problem, but to have it robbed that was was hard to stomach.

Like to Portsmouth?

Benimar

bullvine wrote: »

Only had this conversation with a liverpool fan on tuesday, terrible what happened at Heysel but to ban the other teams was a disgrace, Everton could have easily have won the European Cup when you think of the teams that won it in that era prior to Milans Domination.

The reason all teams were banned was because of the general behaviour of English fans at the time. The English clubs in general were on a 'last warning' and that horrible night was the tipping point.

Liverpool were banned for one extra year at the end of the ban. Probably lucky to only get one extra year, but the blanket ban of English teams was a lot to do with previous incidents as well.

It was tough on Everton as thy had won the CWC in 1985 and would have done well in the European Cup.

dreamers75

Schumacher 82 for me, he ****ing GBHd him.

event

Leeds vs Bayern Munich 1975 European cup final.
The game that inspired the "we are the champions, champions of Europe" chant for Leeds.
Corruption at the highest level

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

764dak wrote: »

Spain winning the 2010 World Cup is an injustice.

Villa should have been sent off against Honduras for punching a player. FIFA should have suspended him after reviewing but they did not. Villa scored against Chile and Torres dived to get Chilean player sent off (Chile outplayed them with 10 men). Villa’s goal against Portugal was offside and a Portuguese player was sent off because a Spanish player pretended to get hit. Paraguay’s goal was wrongly disallowed and Paraguay’s missed penalty should have been retaken for encroachment. Germany should have gotten a penalty against Spain.
Iniesta should have been sent off against the Netherlands. Puyol should have been sent off also. Netherlands were twice denied clear corners (one in regular time and the other in the second extra time period). There was a clear foul on Elia that was ignored which led to the counterattack that led to Spain’s winning goal. They only scored 8 goals in 7 games. Wow, powerful Spain.

Wow is right. Possible the most biased post I've seen here in a long while. We won't mention the hacking Spain received in the final, how MVB should have been sent off (about 4 times throughout the tournament actually), how Robben should have been sent off for kicking the ball away after he was flagged for offside (already on a yellow) and along with a host of other shocking challenges from possibly the most negative (in a thuggery sense) display of football I've seen in a major final. I may as well give Nigel Kung-Foo De Jong a mention while I'm at it. The Dutch were lucky they didn't finish with 8 men, never mind 10.

On a related but different note, I thought the booing that Webb received after the final when he received his plaque or whatever was quite unjustified. Personally, I thought he did the best he could in extremely difficult circumstances. And I know it obviously pales in significance to footballing matters, in fact it's pretty much irrelevant really, but I feel it deserves to be mentioned all the same.

dfx-

Rezident wrote: »

The handball claims, while often given (wrongly), were ball-to-hand, and not handball, according to the rules....

....Note the use of the word "deliberate". If Michael Ballack blasts a shot at goal at around 100kph and you are a few yards away and the ball strikes your hand - before you even have the chance to get out of the way, let alone deliberately handle it, it is not a "handball". Although you are right, refs regularly get this one wrong (among other things), it is a common misconception.

As a Barcelona fan, I'll admit there was one genuine claim for a penalty in that game - the Pique handball, the rest were nonsense.