Yet another shooting.

space_man

This time in D22.
Young man (20) shot in the neck.
Critically ill.

Probably drug related, but he might just be an innocent guy walking home.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/man-shot-a-number-of-times-in-ganglandstyle-attack-29116590.html

DrumSteve

space_man wrote: »

This time in D22.
Young man (20) shot in the neck.
Critically ill.

Probably drug related, but he might just be an innocent guy walking home.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/man-shot-a-number-of-times-in-ganglandstyle-attack-29116590.html

No innocent bystanders these days eh?

Mr. Wong

And?

Praetorian Saighdiuir

"...and they killed him with one shot...bang bang".

I wonder was it random or targeted.

space_man

Praetorian Saighdiuir wrote: »

"...and they killed him with one shot...bang bang".

I wonder was it random or targeted.

Gardaí say he wasn't involved in the drug business. Possibly in the wrong place .....

Boombastic

The victim is not thought to be involved in serious crime.
Detectives are trying to establish a motive for the shooting but believe it could be drug related.



Time to take the drug trade out of the scum's hands (I'm not calling this guy scum because he could still turn out to be innocent)



Gardaí do not believe he has been involved in serious crime and there was speculation that it may have been a case of mistaken identity

kirving

People say that it's all grand once it's gang mmbers shooting one another, and maybe they're right, but how long will it be until another innocent guy walking home one night gets shot?

The only policy that works is absolute zero tolerance. That means that the Gardai need to be properly equipped to deal with armed gangs, and give life in prison for anyone with a gun on the street.

gaffer91

A great way to cut down on drug related murders would be to legalise drugs and treat it like any other industry, not have a "zero tolerance" approach which would be another costly failure.

space_man

gaffer91 wrote: »

A great way to cut down on drug related murders would be to legalise drugs and treat it like any other industry, not have a "zero tolerance" approach which would be another costly failure.

yes it could be a nice little earner for the exchequer. there would be strict quality control, so users would know exactly what they're getting.

problem is no other country (that i know of) has ever tried this, so it would be a giant social experiment with possibly unforseen consequences.

.jacksparrow.

A cashless society would eradicate 80 percent of the drug gangs.everything done by card,yes people would still find a way,but its just too easy when cash is involved.

Zebra3

gaffer91 wrote: »

A great way to cut down on drug related murders would be to legalise drugs and treat it like any other industry, not have a "zero tolerance" approach which would be another costly failure.

But with the spineless tossers running this country, not a chance...

Big Nasty

'Merica!


Oh, wait.

Snake Pliisken

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

A cashless society would eradicate 80 percent of the drug gangs.everything done by card,yes people would still find a way,but its just too easy when cash is involved.

Probably the most un-Jack Sparrow thing anyone has ever said.

.jacksparrow.

Snake Pliisken wrote: »

Probably the most un-Jack Sparrow thing anyone has ever said.

Haha good one!

ChRoMe

space_man wrote: »

yes it could be a nice little earner for the exchequer. there would be strict quality control, so users would know exactly what they're getting.

problem is no other country (that i know of) has ever tried this, so it would be a giant social experiment with possibly unforseen consequences.

Take a look at Portugal.

im invisible

MCMLXXV wrote: »

'Merica!


Oh, wait.

why cant people put the location at least in the thread title? Last thread on a shooting i saw was in china, or russia... I cant remember.
Do you want to know why? Because it WASNT IN THE ****ING TITLE

space_man

ChRoMe wrote: »

Take a look at Portugal.

why? what have they achieved?

ELSuarez

space_man wrote: »

why? what have they achieved?

Alot more than us, decriminalization off all drugs in 2001 and it works.

http://www.businessinsider.com/portugal-drug-policy-decriminalization-works-2012-7

1ZRed

gaffer91 wrote: »

A great way to cut down on drug related murders would be to legalise drugs and treat it like any other industry, not have a "zero tolerance" approach which would be another costly failure.

Here we go again...

space_man

ELSuarez wrote: »

Alot more than us, decriminalization off all drugs in 2001 and it works.

http://www.businessinsider.com/portugal-drug-policy-decriminalization-works-2012-7

interesting, but i cant see Minister Sh1tter approving that anytime soon.

harry Bailey esq

space_man wrote: »

yes it could be a nice little earner for the exchequer. there would be strict quality control, so users would know exactly what they're getting.

problem is no other country (that i know of) has ever tried this, so it would be a giant social experiment with possibly unforseen consequences.

i think the swiss decriminalised hard drug use(not dealing) and it didn't work out all that well.in Holland addicts are given heroin by the state as opposed to methedone everywhere else

ScumLord

Kevin Irving wrote: »

The only policy that works is absolute zero tolerance.

That's the only policy that's been proven not to work, conclusively.

Seachmall

space_man wrote: »

problem is no other country (that i know of) has ever tried this, so it would be a giant social experiment with possibly unforseen consequences.

Canada provided addicts with heroin and allowed them to inject in a supervised environment. This reduced the number of needles in the street, reduced crime and reduced the number of ODs and had no negative effects.

ScumLord

Seachmall wrote: »

Canada provided addicts with heroin and allowed them to inject in a supervised environment. This reduced the number of needles in the street, reduced crime and reduced the number of ODs and had no negative effects. They're even considering opening more permanent clinics.

Similar clinics are open in Holland with similar effects.

Similar clinics even opened in Iran, they had awful problems due to being on the heroin trail. As you'd expect they had a policy of zero tolerance and limb removal for offenders which had no affect whatsoever. They now have treatment and rehabilitation and are finally beginning to see improvements.

StinkyMunkey

ELSuarez wrote: »

Alot more than us, decriminalization off all drugs in 2001 and it works.

http://www.businessinsider.com/portugal-drug-policy-decriminalization-works-2012-7[/QUOTE]

So more people take drugs just because its illegal, i call BS on that - thats what that article implies.

I agree the approach has merit. Im totally anti drugs, the strain on the health service through alcohol and smoking is enough. The Health service is becoming a sham in Ireland. Im all for better treatment and preventive measures when dealing with "junkies", but not every drug user is a junkie.

Decriminalizing drugs may not be such a bad idea, as in the person taking them is not the real criminal in my eyes, they are just idiotic. Repeat offenders or people who refuse help should go to prison, and im sure thats the case in Portugal.

G Power

whatever happens lets keep drugs illegal and in the hands of these nice chaps

G Power

space_man wrote: »

interesting, but i cant see Minister Sh1tter approving that anytime soon.

if we demanded it he would and if he didn't we'd just have to go knocking on his front door until it happened. while we sit around joking that this idiot wouldn't approve it anytime soon there are many people suffering needlessly.

ScumLord

StinkyMunkey wrote: »

So more people take drugs just because its illegal, i call BS on that - thats what that article implies.

Drugs are surrounded by a whole culture now. People buy into the lifestyle and can become separated from society as a whole. If people could try drugs without having to get into the whole scene and culture they may just try a drug and move on. If they're invested in the culture they'll have to stay around drug dealers and people that use drug and go to parties where they can get drugs.

The law basically forces people down a one way street and wont let them come back.

StinkyMunkey

ScumLord wrote: »

Drugs are surrounded by a whole culture now. People buy into the lifestyle and can become separated from society as a whole. If people could try drugs without having to get into the whole scene and culture they may just try a drug and move on. If they're invested in the culture they'll have to stay around drug dealers and people that use drug and go to parties where they can get drugs.

The law basically forces people down a one way street and wont let them come back.

If you decriminalize drugs, its still illegal to sell, import or distribute them. So for people to obtain drugs they still have to go down that "dark alley way".

I do agree Ireland is becoming a drug culture. Because of the buisness im in, ive dealt with drug users, both junkies and recreational users. Problem is these days, more people are "just trying" drugs.

fasttalkerchat

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

A cashless society would eradicate 80 percent of the drug gangs.everything done by card,yes people would still find a way,but its just too easy when cash is involved.

Do food coupons in the USA work? No. It just makes targeting poorer people more profitable.

ScumLord

StinkyMunkey wrote: »

If you decriminalize drugs, its still illegal to sell, import or distribute them. So for people to obtain drugs they still have to go down that "dark alley way".

I do agree Ireland is becoming a drug culture. Because of the buisness im in, ive dealt with drug users, both junkies and recreational users. Problem is these days, more people are "just trying" drugs.

I don't agree with decriminalisation, I don't see the point of it really. It's fine for the end user but does nothing to tackle the problem.

Ireland like the rest of the world has always had a drug culture, drugs are and have always been a big part of human culture. I think religion is the direct result of people taking drugs.

space_man

ScumLord wrote: »

I don't agree with decriminalisation, I don't see the point of it really. It's fine for the end user but does nothing to tackle the problem.

Ireland like the rest of the world has always had a drug culture, drugs are and have always been a big part of human culture. I think religion is the direct result of people taking drugs.

i was in agreement upto that point, but as much as i have little time for organised religion i cannot quite see the connection?

ScumLord

space_man wrote: »

i was in agreement upto that point, but as much as i have little time for organised religion i cannot quite see the connection?

Traditionally up until the churches came along drugs were always seen as the path to god. Most religious leaders were heavy drug users and were seen as being able to go over to this other dimension were the gods lived.

Many, many societies had a drug binge as the ritual a boy had to go through to become a man. Fairy rings so popular in Ireland are actually markers for magic mushroom locations.

Any one that's ever taken an hallucinogen would be able to understand how people would see it as travelling to another dimension or talking to the gods. Your head is filled with new thoughts and beliefs and it allows you to see the underlying geometric patterns that makes up everything in nature.

StinkyMunkey

ScumLord wrote: »

Traditionally up until the churches came along drugs were always seen as the path to god. Most religious leaders were heavy drug users and were seen as being able to go over to this other dimension were the gods lived.

Many, many societies had a drug binge as the ritual a boy had to go through to become a man. Fairy rings so popular in Ireland are actually markers for magic mushroom locations.

Any one that's ever taken an hallucinogen would be able to understand how people would see it as travelling to another dimension or talking to the gods. Your head is filled with new thoughts and beliefs and it allows you to see the underlying geometric patterns that makes up everything in nature.

I think its unfair to use some obscure ritual from a tribal group who only use the drug during their rituals.

Dont get me started on religion and its leaders, the biggest hyopcrites in human history - "do as i say, not as i do".

Drugs or taking them is not a simple subject, you have people hooked on perscription drugs as well as illegal drugs. Anything that alters someones perception can only be a bad thing, and yes that includes alcohol, but alcohol is so deep rooted in the "civilised" world that i can never see it being made illegal (and i do enage in a bit of drinking myself).

I tolerate people smoking weed because it usually doesnt end in tears, even though ive seen the use of it having a detrimental effect on someones life if used to excess. The way i see it, there is enough things in the world that cause problems that are legal without exacerbating the problems caused by the likes of alcohol.

Drugs are bad mmkay.

.jacksparrow.

Deleted my post,maybe too soon to post what I heard.

MadsL

space_man wrote: »

yes it could be a nice little earner for the exchequer. there would be strict quality control, so users would know exactly what they're getting.

problem is no other country (that i know of) has ever tried this, so it would be a giant social experiment with possibly unforseen consequences.

Czech Republic decriminalised all drugs in 1990, then criminalised again in 2001 then decriminalised again in 2011. They found criminalising had no impact on addiction rates.

space_man

ScumLord wrote: »

Traditionally up until the churches came along drugs were always seen as the path to god. Most religious leaders were heavy drug users and were seen as being able to go over to this other dimension were the gods lived.

Many, many societies had a drug binge as the ritual a boy had to go through to become a man. Fairy rings so popular in Ireland are actually markers for magic mushroom locations.

Any one that's ever taken an hallucinogen would be able to understand how people would see it as travelling to another dimension or talking to the gods. Your head is filled with new thoughts and beliefs and it allows you to see the underlying geometric patterns that makes up everything in nature.

i've never read such codswallop in all my life.

Guy:Incognito

Seachmall wrote: »

Canada provided addicts with heroin and allowed them to inject in a supervised environment. This reduced the number of needles in the street, reduced crime and reduced the number of ODs and had no negative effects.

And if they gave shoplifters free tvs and cameras there would be very low rates of shoplifting too. Sure legalise everythng and there will be a zero crime rate. How can we lose.

Pushtrak

space_man wrote: »

i've never read such codswallop in all my life.

Interesting informative rebuttal.

Said no one.

Steve O

Has the term "Tax Eurons" been used yet?

space_man

i think we're a bit off topic here.
the young man in question may never walk again, as one of the bullets hit his spine.
poor guy.

UCDVet

I don't understand why they don't just pass a law against shooting people. And, if they aren't going to do that, pass a law against gun ownership!

If we just had laws, we could prevent these problems.

Herb Powell

1ZRed wrote: »

Here we go again...

You can roll your eyes, but all the anti- crowd have going for them is some kind of perverted sense that they have the "moral high ground". All the emmpirical evidence suggests that it is the way forward.

Pushtrak

Herb Powell wrote: »

You can roll your eyes, but all the anti- crowd have going for them is some kind of perverted sense that they have the "moral high ground". All the emmpirical evidence suggests that it is the way forward.

What is the way forward? And for whom?

Herb Powell

Legalisation or decriminalisation.

As stated already, you just have to look at Portugal for a case study on decriminalisation.

It benefits everyone. Less people end up using, and once you legalise something, it's obviously removed from the realm of the black market. Resources in law enforcement can be re allocated to more important matters, the war on drugs is a massive waste of time, manpower, money, everything.

It's time people just fuccking dealt with the fact that people want to get high, and stop pretending otherwise.

Pushtrak

Herb Powell wrote: »

Legalisation or decriminalisation.

As stated already, you just have to look at Portugal for a case study on decriminalisation.

I had read through the thread, but forgot about the drug angle that came up earlier. When I read your post, it looked like it was a suggestion on guns as I had forgotten. The drug legalization? That's a whole other thing, and honestly, I guess now that I'm replying I'll say both I think that's a good approach, for the most part, though it would require systemic changes beyond a law change. Also, this thread didn't really need to be talking about such things. I know, I'm not really helping there.

Herb Powell

Pushtrak wrote: »

I had read through the thread, but forgot about the drug angle that came up earlier. When I read your post, it looked like it was a suggestion on guns as I had forgotten. The drug legalization? That's a whole other thing, and honestly, I guess now that I'm replying I'll say both I think that's a good approach, for the most part, though it would require systemic changes beyond a law change. Also, this thread didn't really need to be talking about such things. I know, I'm not really helping there.

Absolutely.

I guess the drug angle is coming from the angle that this may have been a gange shooting, and most gangs are dealing drugs. That's all really.

I still don't think it's impossible to follow a similar route to Portugal though. It can't be any worse than the current standard.

Pushtrak

Honestly, I was preparing for a "we should get everyone owning guns like the States. See? We're having people get shot now, so lets get everyone guns." There are likely people here who hold such an opinion.

space_man

Herb Powell wrote: »

I still don't think it's impossible to follow a similar route to Portugal though. It can't be any worse than the current standard.

you might be right.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324374004578217682305605070.html

Herb Powell

space_man wrote: »

you might be right.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324374004578217682305605070.html

That's exactly what I'm talking about

space_man

Herb Powell wrote: »

That's exactly what I'm talking about

u agree withthose crazy hippies in the WSJ !!!:eek: