Wheelchair user refused entry to Dublin Nightclub.

P_1

Do you know something, this is probably going to play right into the hands of that fool of a Senator who wants all IP's tracked

hatrickpatrick

orestes wrote: »

He wasn't refused because they don't like people in wheelchairs, he was refused because the club has no way to accommodate people in wheelchairs. One is discrimination, the other is an unfortunate but real fact. Simples, no?

Starting an online hate campaign, forcing an apology from the venue, getting a guy fired, and getting the place so much bad publicity that it's practically being stormed by a mob wielding torches and pitch-forks is just throwing a tantrum. I've spent a few years in a wheelchair and I've worked in the bar trade, and the guy who started this is a selfish tool in my opinion.

I would imagine that the bouncer probably wasn't the most polite about it. There's a tactful way to deal with situations like this, and again although I've met many very sound bouncers in my time, I've met enough arrogant douches to say that it's likely the attitude these people were met with probably inflamed their anger.

steddyeddy

I dont know much about what happened here so its hard to judge either way. I find it hard to believe that someone doesn't like guys in wheelchairs. I dont know though it's possible.

I'll add 99% of doormen are decent people. Some are grassholes and shouldnt be working as doormen. Previously these would act with impunity but thanks to facebook and mobile phones things are changing. A bouncer in a certain club in bray was famous for refusing people and making nasty remarks. A few weekends ago he refused a girl and called her ugly and obese, all of which was filmed via camera phone. The same weekend the doorman was fired.

md23040

To me the whole thing may be an orchestrated event by some fame hungry attention grabbers loving the social media stir.

Everyone likes their 5 minutes in the spotlight and certainly this has got it's five minutes but the business in a struggling environment has to live with the repercussions.

This is a tech savvy person by the looks of the YouTube video (of how he ended up in a wheelchair) and if this venue with inadequate facilities hadn't refused ,then maybe another one may have been chosen etc with the then relevant photo-op shot outside the premises for FB etc.

Call me cynical but there are many hungry people out there looking for their 5 minutes. So why pre-emptively flash it all over Facebook then go to boards if it isn't a campaign of some sorts?

My last post stands to the course of action that should have been followed. Report it to the venue on Monday and if not taken seriously or not adequately explained then follow the Internet witch hunt.

Lapin

Pretty shítty how the word of one man has cost another his job.

Bolger should have been man enough to deal with this directly with the club in question in a dignified manner rather than whinging to the world about it on Facebook.

El Inho

michellie wrote: »

Hmmmm...the plot thickens..

http://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/542749_612483468777455_1582971650_n.jpg

he'd want to charge his phone an all!

but yeah this smelled of more to the story from the outset...

was how the guy was named from the OP...that made my ears prick up.

ill be following to see what happens. could be interesting

My name is URL

Your man should claim that it was all part of an elaborate social experiment.

SusieBlue

I work in a nightclub that has three flights of stairs. If a customer in a wheelchair wants to come in, they have to give us 1 hours notice so we can erect the removable ramp for the stairs.

If they don't give us notice, their only other option is to sign a release form giving the bouncers permission to carry them up the stairs. Otherwise, there is literally no other way for us to get them up the stairs. I know it isn't ideal to have to be carried up but we can't get planning permission to install a lift (old building) and there is only one staircase, meaning we can't make a permanent ramp.

Also, when they get up the stairs, they are politely asked to stay in a large designated area near a fire exit so that in case of an emergency a bouncer will be able to get them to safety quickly.

Bouncers are damned if they do and damned if they don't. I never realised how much total crap and shít they had to deal with until I started working in the club.

The witch hunt is totally unnecessary and will cost people jobs. I know most people don't care but the only people who will hurt from this are the staff, who are totally innocent. Recessionary times are hitting cubs hard enough without all this bad press, and a lot of nightclub staff tend to be college students trying to put themselves through college - at least where I work anyway. The affect this could have on the staff is scary.

Grayson

Kenny Logins wrote: »

To be fair, I don't know where the original 'statement' was posted but it does look to me as if it's a case of an angry mob being outraged on his behalf. **** like this can spread very quickly on Facetwat (or Twitter. That's where I saw it first), and he might not have anticipated this level of stampy footing.

I don't know. He and the girl work in entertainment. If you google his name, he's involved at a high level. His friends are posting it on message boards. And there have been so many of these "outrage" things recently, it's so easy to make these things go viral.
Plenty of people have posted that they are in wheelchairs or know of people in wheelchairs who have been refused admittance to places because they simply weren't accessible. But he says it never happens.

I can't believe that they didn't know what the outcome of this would be. Or at the very least hoped it would be this.

orestes

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I would imagine that the bouncer probably wasn't the most polite about it. There's a tactful way to deal with situations like this, and again although I've met many very sound bouncers in my time, I've met enough arrogant douches to say that it's likely the attitude these people were met with probably inflamed their anger.

So you're just assuming that the door-staff were assholes about it?

I don't need to imagine that people who get refused from nightclubs for completely genuine reasons can be belligerent self-righteous arseholes, cos I know that they can be.

But neither of us has a shred of evidence to go on about what happened, but let's not let that get in the way of a witch-hunt eh?

hatrickpatrick

Lapin wrote: »

Pretty shítty how the word of one man has cost another his job.

Bolger should have been man enough to deal with this directly with the club in question in a dignified manner rather than whinging to the world about it on Facebook.

Why is everyone assuming the other bouncer's side of this story is true...?

laugh

michellie wrote: »

Hmmmm...the plot thickens..

http://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/542749_612483468777455_1582971650_n.jpg

I knew he was legless all along.

Grayson

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Why is everyone assuming the other bouncer's side of this story is true...?

Cos there's too many holes in the story.

Why go to a place that has that many stairs? What happened in those 45 minutes? is it really butter?

El Inho

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Why is everyone assuming the other bouncer's side of this story is true...?

why did everyone believe the first guy.

steddyeddy

The man who commented on the status claiming to work with the doorman in question could have used more professional langauge than "you were being a smart ar$ed prick". It doesnt help his case.

WoollyRedHat

One comment:Didn't the NAZI's use the self defence that they were just following orders from Hitler??? Shameful statement from the Management at the Madison. Karma will take care of you guys, I can see a liquidation in the pipeline !!!

Lol

That's all folks!

Grayson

I just went onto facebook. Plenty of my friends are posting it. It's really gone viral. That bouncer has lost his job and a nightclubs reputation has been destroyed. It'll probably be empty next weekend (Although, if it wasn't their fault, they shouldn't have backed down)

I wonder if there's security footage.

My name is URL

steddyeddy wrote: »

The man who commented on the status claiming to work with the doorman in question could have used more professional langauge than "you were being a smart ar$ed prick". It doesnt help his case.

Sometimes it just needs to be said, though.

skimpydoo

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Why is everyone assuming the other bouncer's side of this story is true...?

Well put it this way if I was in a wheelchair and I had to go downstairs to enter a cramped club and then go upstairs to use the toilet, I would not be going there. Would you?.

Kenny Logins

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Why is everyone assuming the other bouncer's side of this story is true...?

What happened in those 45 minutes? I could understand if it was a case of them no letting him out, but in? That should be done and dusted in seconds. :pac:

steddyeddy

Grayson wrote: »

I just went onto facebook. Plenty of my friends are posting it. It's really gone viral. That bouncer has lost his job and a nightclubs reputation has been destroyed. It'll probably be empty next weekend (Although, if it wasn't their fault, they shouldn't have backed down)

I wonder if there's security footage.

Assuming that this was planned then that is pretty scary tbh!

orestes

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Why is everyone assuming the other bouncer's side of this story is true...?

The tens of thousands of people calling for the doorstaffs heads on facebook certainly aren't.

I'm just basing it on my own experiences from spending time in a wheelchair, having worked in the bar trade and the way that this smear campaign has been orchestrated that the guy is full of sh!t in my opinion, and if he is then what he has done here is pathetic.

srm23

the big question is how did he pull that hot totty! :eek:

the only injustice here is that she didn't go home with me!

Gorilla Rising

steddyeddy wrote: »

The man who commented on the status claiming to work with the doorman in question could have used more professional langauge than "you were being a smart ar$ed prick". It doesnt help his case.

Warranted. Probably p1ssed off that his friend/colleague/both was made a scapegoat in this debacle, fired and all with just one side of the story.

hatrickpatrick

orestes wrote: »

So you're just assuming that the door-staff were assholes about it?

I don't need to imagine that people who get refused from nightclubs for completely genuine reasons can be belligerent self-righteous arseholes, cos I know that they can be.

But neither of us has a shred of evidence to go on that either of us is right, but let's not let that get in the way of a witch-hunt eh?

I go out a lot, and on the basis of everything I've seen on nights out, the law of averages in my experience says you're far more likely to see people refused entry for no legitimate reason than the legitimate cases.
As I said, I dealt with this situation myself a few years ago and after asking the staff about me, the club got rid of the bouncer and apologised. His story was that I had been kicked out the week before (mistaken identity presumably), and e was incredibly rude and obnoxious when I asked him for any detail about it. As it happened I'd never been kicked out and the staff knew me well enough to vouch for me. Wrecked my night but at least he can't wreck anyone else's now.

I've seen this exact scenario happen to other people often enough. I also know a lot of very professional and polite bouncers. It's in everyone's interest that the gobsh!tes who give the whole profession a bad name are weeded out and the good ones can do their jobs, no?

fullgas

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Why is everyone assuming the other bouncer's side of this story is true...?

From the OP it appears he threw a tantrum for 45min.

Artful_Badger

Grayson wrote: »

I just went onto facebook. Plenty of my friends are posting it. It's really gone viral. That bouncer has lost his job and a nightclubs reputation has been destroyed. It'll probably be empty next weekend (Although, if it wasn't their fault, they shouldn't have backed down)

I wonder if there's security footage.

With all the clowns vowing to boycott it it will probably turn out to be a pretty nice place.

SusieBlue

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

One comment:Didn't the NAZI's use the self defence that they were just following orders from Hitler??? Shameful statement from the Management at the Madison. Karma will take care of you guys, I can see a liquidation in the pipeline !!!

Lol

That's all folks!

Lol at the fact that a lot of people are probably going to lose jobs over something they had no control over?

If the bouncer refused the man simply because he was in a wheelchair (which I doubt) then yes, I agree, he should be fired. But I think its really unfair that a lot of other staff are now in the firing line cause of someone elses mistake.

I think THAT is far more shameful, personally. This is just getting ridiculous now, people are stupid.

hatrickpatrick

orestes wrote: »

So you're just assuming that the door-staff were assholes about it?

I don't need to imagine that people who get refused from nightclubs for completely genuine reasons can be belligerent self-righteous arseholes, cos I know that they can be.

But neither of us has a shred of evidence to go on about what happened, but let's not let that get in the way of a witch-hunt eh?

fullgas wrote: »

From the OP it appears he threw a tantrum for 45min.

So? Should people who get refused entry for no obvious reason and with no explanation for it just shut up? This is exactly why up until recently, bouncers acted with total impunity.

orestes

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I go out a lot, and on the basis of everything I've seen on nights out, the law of averages in my experience says you're far more likely to see people refused entry for no legitimate reason than the legitimate cases.
As I said, I dealt with this situation myself a few years ago and after asking the staff about me, the club got rid of the bouncer and apologised. His story was that I had been kicked out the week before (mistaken identity presumably), and e was incredibly rude and obnoxious when I asked him for any detail about it. As it happened I'd never been kicked out and the staff knew me well enough to vouch for me. Wrecked my night but at least he can't wreck anyone else's now.

I've seen this exact scenario happen to other people often enough. I also know a lot of very professional and polite bouncers. It's in everyone's interest that the gobsh!tes who give the whole profession a bad name are weeded out and the good ones can do their jobs, no?

So based on a few bad experiences you are taking it for granted that all bouncers accused of acting unprofessionally are guilty until proven innocent?

EoghanIRL

Really is disgraceful that this sort of discrimination still goes on .

orestes

EoghanIRL wrote: »

Really is disgraceful that this sort of discrimination still goes on .

It's not discrimination. It's pragmatism.

skimpydoo

EoghanIRL wrote: »

Really is disgraceful that this sort of discrimination still goes on .

We don't know the full story so I can't agree with you on this.

jeez! I've been refused entry to a club before. Didn't wish that the employees lost their job over the head of it though.

FFS its costs you nothing financially to get refused entry. Getting the sack on the other hand....

hatrickpatrick

orestes wrote: »

So based on a few bad experiences you are taking it for granted that all bouncers accused of acting unprofessionally are guilty until proven innocent?

The fact that he's been fired and the club has apologised would indicate that they had enough evidence against him. Again based on my own experience, bouncers don't get fired in most of these cases, public outcry or not.

steddyeddy

fortune wookiee wrote: »

Warranted. Probably p1ssed off that his friend/colleague/both was made a scapegoat in this debacle, fired and all with just one side of the story.

Well that's fair enough and I would feel the same to be honest. I just think any communication from the Madison side of things should be more professional in this for their own sake!

johnny_ultimate

WhiteRoses wrote: »

I think THAT is far more shameful, personally. This is just getting ridiculous now, people are stupid.

Looking at some of the Facebook comments, it becomes clear that many people these days do not even use the cover of anonymity to protect their aggressive, posturing Internet ways. Really does make for mind-numbing reading. If the justice system or indeed society as a whole followed the same mob mentality... well, history shows us many examples of just such a thing, albeit in response to things on a grander scale than a mildly regrettable incident outside a nightclub.

fullgas

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

So? Should people who get refused entry for no obvious reason and with no explanation for it just shut up? This is exactly why up until recently, bouncers acted with total impunity.

The obvious reason was the steep steps into the nightclub. 45min of arguing "I'm going to the media" etc. would not have changed this fact. He should have gone somewhere else and enjoyed himself.

P_1

orestes wrote: »

It's not discrimination. It's pragmatism.

Exactly. Orestes I think you might be more qualified to speak on the matter (I think you mentioned earlier on this thread that you were in a wheelchair for a while).

On a practical level, if you were in a wheelchair would you want to spend time in a bar where you needed to be carried up a set of stairs when 1) you just wanted to get in, 2) you need to use the bathroom and 3) to leave when you're done?

I know I wouldn't.

We don't know what the bouncer in question said to the chap in the wheelchair but what we have here is the online equivalent of somebody yelling 'Fire' in a crowded cinema without seeing any smoke.

I Luv Crysis

Staff member talking on fm104 now

skimpydoo

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The fact that he's been fired and the club has apologised would indicate that they had enough evidence against him. Again based on my own experience, bouncers don't get fired in most of these cases, public outcry or not.

As there is major outcry on social media most of which is unwarranted, they took the easy way out and fired him. Also as he was not permanent staff its a lot easier to do.

orestes

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The fact that he's been fired and the club has apologised would indicate that they had enough evidence against him. Again based on my own experience, bouncers don't get fired in most of these cases, public outcry or not.

It's exactly this kind of attitude that led to the public outcry, which caused the venue to be forced into a corner and fire the doorman.

"Bouncers are bastards, I've seen it so many times, he must have acted like a pr1ck".

This guy knew exactly what kind of response his campaign would get, and a guy has lost his job without even having a chance to give his side of the story. It's a bullsh1t smear campaign that has cost a guy his job and will probably ruin a business, because one guy who just happens to be in a wheelchair is a tool.

sfwcork

I Luv Crysis wrote: »

Staff member talking on fm104 now

What did they say

Gorilla Rising

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The fact that he's been fired and the club has apologised would indicate that they had enough evidence against him. Again based on my own experience, bouncers don't get fired in most of these cases, public outcry or not.

All it suggests is that it was a damage limitation exercise by Madison management.

When the angry FB mob began posting such vitriol on their page, they obviously felt (despite one side of the story) the bouncer's position became untenable - for their own good.

I'm interested to know what evidence you think they could have?

There's a stairs down into the place after all. As has been stated on the thread, the club (rightly or wrongly) can't really facilitate wheelchair users for any number of health and safety reasons.

Drakares

Incase anyone missed it. A statement from the club Management:

"Madison Nightclub unreservedly apologise for the disgraceful treatment of Graham Bolger last night at the club. The person, who was with us from an outside agency for the last 4 weeks, has been dismissed with immediate effect and he will not be employed by the sub-contractor again. Our company policy is that the club is open to all. We have welcomed people of all abilities and will continue to do so. We are ashamed and embarrassed that this has happened. We have delayed posting here as we have been trying to contact Graham directly to apologise to him in advance of apologising publicly. We deeply regret what has happened and will ensure that it never happens again. We hope to speak to Graham directly as soon as possible."

skimpydoo

Drakares wrote: »

Incase anyone missed it. A statement from the club Management:

"Madison Nightclub unreservedly apologise for the disgraceful treatment of Graham Bolger last night at the club. The person, who was with us from an outside agency for the last 4 weeks, has been dismissed with immediate effect and he will not be employed by the sub-contractor again. Our company policy is that the club is open to all. We have welcomed people of all abilities and will continue to do so. We are ashamed and embarrassed that this has happened. We have delayed posting here as we have been trying to contact Graham directly to apologise to him in advance of apologising publicly. We deeply regret what has happened and will ensure that it never happens again. We hope to speak to Graham directly as soon as possible."

Still sounds like Madison acted rashly and rather too quickly because of the Social Media backlash.

Gorilla Rising

Drakares wrote: »

Incase anyone missed it. A statement from the club Management:

"Madison Nightclub unreservedly apologise for the disgraceful treatment of Graham Bolger last night at the club. The person, who was with us from an outside agency for the last 4 weeks, has been dismissed with immediate effect and he will not be employed by the sub-contractor again. Our company policy is that the club is open to all. We have welcomed people of all abilities and will continue to do so. We are ashamed and embarrassed that this has happened. We have delayed posting here as we have been trying to contact Graham directly to apologise to him in advance of apologising publicly. We deeply regret what has happened and will ensure that it never happens again. We hope to speak to Graham directly as soon as possible."

I'd like to hear what exactly they have in place for wheelchair users then.

So they're now saying they can facilitate wheelchair users.

Right, so the only other reason he might not have been let in is because, to quote the bouncer in his FB post - he was being 'a smart-ar$ed pr1ck'.

If what this bouncer says is true, then it's become a different story.

I wonder if Madison Management contacted the other bouncers to get their side of the story...

..doubtful, as I don't think upon that happening, bouncer two (the FB one) would've posted what he did.

WoollyRedHat

WhiteRoses wrote: »

Lol at the fact that a lot of people are probably going to lose jobs over something they had no control over?

If the bouncer refused the man simply because he was in a wheelchair (which I doubt) then yes, I agree, he should be fired. But I think its really unfair that a lot of other staff are now in the firing line cause of someone elses mistake.

I think THAT is far more shameful, personally. This is just getting ridiculous now, people are tupid.

It was in reference to his nazi comment.

P_1

Interesting, seems the (former) worker on the radio said that the club has banned it's staff from commenting on the issue

skimpydoo

P_1 wrote: »

Interesting, seems the (former) worker on the radio said that the club has banned it's staff from commenting on the issue

Probably because Madison feel they have dealt with the issue and don't want the waters muddied any further.