F.C. Barcelona vs A.C. Milan CL last 16 2nd leg Match Thread

adox

CSF wrote: »

This isn't an isolated incident though, I can't remember Barca ever not getting a game changing decision when behind in the KO stages in the last few years.

But can you not see how that could have been given to anyone? It just happened to be Barca. Linesmen are human and its easy to see how it wasn't given.

It's not a big talking point IMO.

handsomecake

CSF wrote: »

Messi was offside. I didn't think Barca should have had a peno in the first. In the second half yes, but the game would have been much different in the second if it was still 1-0.

These injustices are getting too frequent in the Champions League with Barca and I don't know if Mourinho was too far off the mark with some of his statements in the past.

your dead right . milan were unreal tonight. unplayable and robbed by the ref.

Andersonisgod

Ordinary man wrote: »

They better hope that they don't meet real madrid in the next round considering the lesson they got in the last cup game;)

I doubt Madrid or Barcelona would like to be drawn against each other this soon.

That being said, the Champions League is very different to the Copa Del Rey, you'd have to imagine that against Madrid the attitude would be much like it was tonight. The intensity, the speed of the play, the control, this was akin to Barcelona circa 2011.

CSF

adox wrote: »

But can you not see how that could have been given to anyone? It just happened to be Barca. Linesmen are human and its easy to see how it wasn't given.

It's not a big talking point IMO.

But it wasn't anyone else, it was Barca, as it always seems to be. Too coincidental.

monkey9

The 'offside' was too tough a call for the linesman. It's blatant when freeze framed, but it happened so quickly it obviously wasn't even noticeable.

Non issue really.

Turtwig

CSF wrote: »

This isn't an isolated incident though, I can't remember Barca ever not getting a game changing decision when behind in the KO stages in the last few years.

All teams seem to get those though.(Real did, Porto did. Man Utd, AC Milan etc..) It's just the nature of the game. Milan were very lucky imo to end that game with all 11 players. Thought Constant should have been sent off in the first half, which is probably why the ref didn't give that penalty.

Some performance by Barca, but yet another capitulation by Milan. That's what the fourth? Arsenal, Deportivo PSV? Ok they scraped through two of them, but still. Is there any other club that has squandered such strong positions?

CSF

handsomecake wrote: »

your dead right . milan were unreal tonight. unplayable and robbed by the ref.

Milan were 2 nil up from the home leg, with no Barca away goal for safety. They did not have to be unreal or unplayable tonight to go through.

kryogen

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I doubt Madrid or Barcelona would like to be drawn against each other this soon.

That being said, the Champions League is very different to the Copa Del Rey, you'd have to imagine that against Madrid the attitude would be much like it was tonight. The intensity, the speed of the play, the control, this was akin to Barcelona circa 2011.

What kind of idiocy is this theory?

That in the league or the cup Barca don't care as much about beating Madrid but would bother with the game if it was a European competition, come off it mate and don't let delusion get the better of you

CSF

Jernal wrote: »

All teams seem to get those though.(Real did, Porto did. Man Utd, AC Milan etc..) It's just the nature of the game. Milan were very lucky imo to end that game with all 11 players. Thought Constant should have been sent off in the first half, which is probably why the ref didn't give that penalty.

Some performance by Barca, but yet another capitulation by Milan. That's what the fourth? Arsenal, Deportivo PSV? Ok they scraped through two of them, but still. Is there any other club that has squandered such strong positions?

Barca seem to get them every single time. Much more than anyone else. Even when they went out last year against Chelsea.

adox

CSF wrote: »

But it wasn't anyone else, it was Barca, as it always seems to be. Too coincidental.

Nah not tonight. That call was tight as fook and you are grasping at straws.

Moneymaker

Reminded me of the 5-0 vs Madrid. Awesome display. Milan had no answer.

kryogen

adox wrote: »

Nah not tonight. That call was tight as fook and you are grasping at straws.

Agree 100%

Very hard to cry conspiracy on that one. Tough decision for the linesman with the speed it happened

CSF

adox wrote: »

Nah not tonight. That call was tight as fook and you are grasping at straws.

No, because I expected it to happen. Said it to the lad I was watching the game with before Messi even got his first. It happens every time. I honestly can't think of an exception.

Turtwig

CSF wrote: »

Barca seem to get them every single time. Much more than anyone else. Even when they went out last year against Chelsea.

I forgot to add in my original post that team with the most possession tends to get fouled the most too. It's a bit like scrummages in rugby, the referee's perceive one team to have upper hand and subconsciously that will always influence their decisions even if their intent is to remain as fair and objective as possible. They're only human and that offside require laser like focus and observations to spot.

I wouldn't entertain the conspiracy theory though that they're favourited. Kassai let a lot of fouls go early in the game that he could have given against Milan and it looked like he wasn't going to give any penalty all night.

Andersonisgod

kryogen wrote: »

What kind of idiocy is this theory?

That in the league or the cup Barca don't care as much about beating Madrid but would bother with the game if it was a European competition, come off it mate and don't let delusion get the better of you

Are you saying that players application is the same in every game? Because that's a bizzare claim that is simply wrong. A Champions League game against Madrid is bigger than a Copa Del Rey game against Madrid. I'm not saying that they didn't try against Madrid in their last couple of meetings, I am simply saying that they would surely give a bit extra (like tonight) in the Champions League than domestically. That's hardly an outlandish claim.

For example, watch Spain's group game against Italy at the recent Euro's, then watch the difference in the aggression of their pressing in the final. Bigger games often wield more effort.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

My new favourite poster = Andersonisgod.

Anyway, gutted with the Alba goal, had Messi to score and Barca to win 3-0 at 14/1. Ah well, only put a euro on it :pac:

CSF

kryogen wrote: »

Agree 100%

Very hard to cry conspiracy on that one. Tough decision for the linesman with the speed it happened

All well and good if you treat this as an isolated incident, but you shouldn't.

miralize

kryogen wrote: »

What kind of idiocy is this theory?

That in the league or the cup Barca don't care as much about beating Madrid but would bother with the game if it was a European competition, come off it mate and don't let delusion get the better of you

It's not exactly a secret that Mourinho is targeting the Champions League.

From a Barca perspective, the CL is also much more important than progression in the Copa, the league is effectively over. Barca would most definitely approach those CL games differently.

Andersonisgod

THFC wrote: »

My new favourite poster = Andersonisgod.

Anyway, gutted with the Alba goal, had Messi to score and Barca to win 3-0 at 14/1. Ah well, only put a euro on it :pac:

I'll take that as a compliment.

I said to my brother I think Barcelona will win 4-0, I was laughed out of it. Needless to say I've been doing a bit of laughing of my own since the final whistle.

Turtwig

Also, I'd blame the folks at the Vatican and Emeritus Benedict. It seems any time there's been a Conclave going on and Barcelona are playing they won 4-0.

Blatter

Andersonisgod wrote: »

That being said, the Champions League is very different to the Copa Del Rey, you'd have to imagine that against Madrid the attitude would be much like it was tonight. The intensity, the speed of the play, the control, this was akin to Barcelona circa 2011.

That is bullshít as Barca were terrible in the first leg v Milan, and that was in guess what competition, yeah that's right.

Madrid in the Copa de Rey was a big occasion, it was not a matter of motivation for Barca, it was matter of their form being very poor at the time and Madrid being ruthless. Nothing more, nothing less.

If the two meet again in the CL and Barca play like they did tonight, Madrid will find it difficult for sure. Madrid are obviously very capable though. I'd love to see how Bayern would match up to Barca, really hope they draw each other.

CSF

Jernal wrote: »

Also, I'd blame the folks at the Vatican and Emeritus Benedict. It seems any time there's been a Conclave going on and Barcelona are playing they won 4-0.

Even if you think I'm being silly, entertain me and tell me when Barca needed a decision to stay in the CL and didn't get it.

miralize

Blatter wrote: »

That is bullshít as Barca were terrible in the first leg v Milan, and that was in guess what competition, yeah that's right.

Madrid in the Copa de Rey was a big occasion, it was not a matter of motivation for Barca, it was matter of their form being very poor at the time and Madrid being ruthless. Nothing more, nothing less.

If the two meet again in the CL and Barca play like they did tonight, Madrid will find it difficult for sure. Madrid are obviously very capable though. I'd love to see how Bayern would match up to Barca, really hope they draw each other.

Hes not saying that Barca will automatically **** all over Madrid, but the motivation to win is greater than the last 3 meetings

Seaneh

Barca deserved to win and Milan didn't take the chances they did get. Milan should have had a peno, Barca should have had one at 1-0 and the other barca peno shout was well offside.

I still think of Niang had of scored that goal at 1-0 it was game over as it would have knocked the stuffing out of Barca and Messi's second wouldn't have happened. Going in 1-1 at half time would have been worlds apart from going in 2-0 down.

As for Barca's last goal, Robinho deserves to be shot. We should have shipped him back to Santos in Janurary when we had a chance and used his insane wage packet and €12million transfer fee to buy someone who actually gives a ****e and has a brain.

We missed a Pazzini or a Balotelli up front. Playing Niang centrally for the first half was massive ask for an 18 year old and it didn't pay off, he did ok at times but he's just not experienced or strong enough to play as the focal point of an attack at that level against a team like Barca.

Milan's biggest problem was our defence was shocking. 3 of the back four had nightmares and even Abate was borderline rubbish. De Sciglio at left full would have been a better choice, Constant was pants and looked exactly what he is, an average player playing out of position to try and patch over Milan's lack of depth at left full.

Zapata and Mexes had the worst games I've seen them have since september. Both of them had nightmares and looked like red cards waiting to happen.

Ambrosini will be extremely disappointed with himself, looked extremely off the pace and frustrated all night, Muntari's complete inability to control the ball to pass it more than 4 yards off either foot meant when he come on he wasn't any better.

All in all, Barca deserved the win tonight but Milan should have scored more in the first leg and should have scored atleast one tonight so they can have no complaints for going out.

I'm proud of Milan for being in the position they were in going into the game, coming from where they were a few months ago to their recent form has been almost miraculous and the fact that Allegri is still in a job is a credit to the players and himself over the last few months but tonight he and the team got it all wrong.

Barca played really well and when they play like that they can beat anyone, but they aren't perfect, they have massive flaws that can be exploited as has been shown over the last few months and Milan totally failed to do that tonight.

Back to the drawing board for Max and the lads, forget tonight and concentrate on Palermo this weekend and securing a champions league spot for next year but money needs to be spent in the summer.

The milan team tonight cost a total of €****all, abate, ambrosini, abbiati, montolivo, flamini, Constant. Muntari and Mexes, were all youth products, free transfers or loan signings, El Shaawary, Niang and Boateng between them cost about €15 (I think) and even on the subs, Robinho at €18million was the only player real money was spent on, with Bojan being a loan signing.

Milan need massice investment. They need more depth at centre back, they need a proper left full and they need better players than Sully Muntari in midfield.

I see another overhaul of the squad this summer with Traore, Vila, Robinho, Constant,Antonini, Zapata, Bojan, Muntari, and a few others all being sold, not having their loans turned into transfers or allowed to leave for free.

Having Balotelli available for next years CL will be a massive boost and having De Jong back from injury in the summer will be like a new singing for midfield.

Hopefully next season Milan can kick on and get a few steps further than this year.


btw, I don't fancy Barca to win, I think it's Bayerns year myself.

miralize

CSF wrote: »

Even if you think I'm being silly, entertain me and tell me when Barca needed a decision to stay in the CL and didn't get it.

Tonight.

adox

CSF wrote: »

No, because I expected it to happen. Said it to the lad I was watching the game with before Messi even got his first. It happens every time. I honestly can't think of an exception.

So maybe you expecting it to happen has clouded your judgement on this one call? On this one call you are making a mountain out of a mole hill. If that was given against the team I support I wouldn't have much complaint.

Watch it again in real time. It is incredibly tight and he looks onside. I don't get how you can use that decision to further your overall argument.

Turtwig

CSF wrote: »

Even if you think I'm being silly, entertain me and tell me when Barca needed a decision to stay in the CL and didn't get it.

Semi Final V Inter. Messi denied a penalty. Milito goal offside. Bojan goal disallowed for an at best accidental handball.

(You said needed. So I can ignore the Biscuits incident.:D)

CSF

miralize wrote: »

Tonight.

So the goal wasn't offside?

Andersonisgod

Blatter wrote: »

That is bullshít as Barca were terrible in the first leg v Milan, and that was in guess what competition, yeah that's right.

Madrid in the Copa de Rey was a big occasion, it was not a matter of motivation for Barca, it was matter of their form being very poor at the time and Madrid being ruthless. Nothing more, nothing less.

If the two meet again in the CL and Barca play like they did tonight, Madrid will find it difficult for sure. Madrid are obviously very capable though. I'd love to see how Bayern would match up to Barca, really hope they draw each other.

I'm not saying it was motivation. It's a point that has been brought up in the Spanish media, it's a point that has been brought up by both Barcelona and Spain fans that the pressing isn't as aggressive as it was. Compare the pressing tonight to the pressing in the first leg. Massive difference. They still press on a weekly basis but not as aggressively as they did tonight. It's understandable, it's a group of players that have played so much football in the last 4-5 years. That being said, in the massive games they still can muster the aggressive press that we saw tonight, that we saw in the Euro 2012 final. It's not a question of motivation. Simply it's to do with picking their moments.

Yes, both matches would be great, maybe you think both teams would beat Barcelona, I think the opposite, it will be played on the pitch and that will be that.

miralize

CSF wrote: »

So the goal wasn't offside?

They didnt get a decision. It was overlooked, and very hard to spot

Andersonisgod

miralize wrote: »

Hes not saying that Barca will automatically **** all over Madrid, but the motivation to win is greater than the last 3 meetings

I'm glad you manage to decipher my messages since others seem to be struggling.

Blatter

miralize wrote: »

Hes not saying that Barca will automatically **** all over Madrid, but the motivation to win is greater than the last 3 meetings

I know he's not, I was disagreeing with his assertion that motivation was a problem v Madrid in the Copa. It wasn't, it was their form.

CSF

Jernal wrote: »

Semi Final V Inter. Messi denied a penalty. Milito goal offside. Bojan goal disallowed for an at best accidental handball.

(You said needed. So I can ignore the Biscuits incident.:D)

You had to go 3 years back to get that, and then the season before that was the ultimate in screw overs of Chelsea

Morzadec

CSF wrote: »

Even if you think I'm being silly, entertain me and tell me when Barca needed a decision to stay in the CL and didn't get it.

Tonight.

Pedro bundled over in the box at 1-0 for what was a penalty in my book. Maybe not a 100% stonewaller, but at least a 75%er for me.

I would have felt very aggrieved not to be given that peno as a Barca fan.

CSF

Morzadec wrote: »

Tonight.

Pedro bundled over in the box at 1-0 for what was a penalty in my book. Maybe not a 100% stonewaller, but at least a 75%er for me.

I would have felt very aggrieved not to be given that peno as a Barca fan.

Not a peno, and they definitely did get the decision they needed

Blatter

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I'm not saying it was motivation. It's a point that has been brought up in the Spanish media, it's a point that has been brought up by both Barcelona and Spain fans that the pressing isn't as aggressive as it was. Compare the pressing tonight to the pressing in the first leg. Massive difference. They still press on a weekly basis but not as aggressively as they did tonight. It's understandable, it's a group of players that have played so much football in the last 4-5 years. That being said, in the massive games they still can muster the aggressive press that we saw tonight, that we saw in the Euro 2012 final. It's not a question of motivation. Simply it's to do with picking their moments.

Yes, both matches would be great, maybe you think both teams would beat Barcelona, I think the opposite, it will be played on the pitch and that will be that.

I don't think the performance v Madrid in the Copa vs. the performance tonight had anything to do with 'picking their moment'. I just think it's a matter of a natural cycle of form that every team goes through from time to time.

Morzadec

Seaneh wrote: »

I still think of Niang had of scored that goal at 1-0 it was game over as it would have knocked the stuffing out of Barca and Messi's second wouldn't have happened. Going in 1-1 at half time would have been worlds apart from going in 2-0 down.

This was undoubtedly the turning point of the match.

As good as Barca were, they can often be susceptible to a break and Mascherano was caught out. Milan are big big favourites if Niang buries that. It would have really been a tough ask for Barca.

Andersonisgod

Blatter wrote: »

I don't think the performance v Madrid in the Copa vs. the performance tonight had anything to do with 'picking their moment'. I just think it's a matter of a natural cycle of form that every team goes through from time to time.

If you want to call it form that's fine, but don't be surprised of their form (and more specifically the aggression of their pressing) picks up each time a truly massive game comes around.

Seaneh

Blatter wrote: »

I don't think the performance v Madrid in the Copa vs. the performance tonight had anything to do with 'picking their moment'. I just think it's a matter of a natural cycle of form that every team goes through from time to time.

No no no, it's all done purposefully.
Barca don't make mistakes or have blips in form, they are perfect remember.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

CSF wrote: »

Not a peno, and they definitely did get the decision they needed

Ah here, if that happened out the middle of the field it would've been a 100% free kick. Also don't forget the handball near the end, think it was by Mexes?

Seaneh

Andersonisgod wrote: »

If you want to call it form that's fine, but don't be surprised of their form (and more specifically the aggression of their pressing) picks up each time a truly massive game comes around.

El Classico isn't a "truly massice games" for Barca and their fans? The first leg wasn't a "truly massive game"?

Pull the other one.

Andersonisgod

Seaneh wrote: »

El Classico isn't a "truly massice games" for Barca and their fans? The first leg wasn't a "truly massive game"?

Pull the other one.

Of course it is but not as big as a Clasico in the Champions League. Of course the first leg was a big name but not a massive game in the scheme of things.

Honestly the people who haven't a clue what I'm talking about are the people who don't watch Barcelona week in, week out. If you think you will see that level of pressing in their next La Liga game you might get quite a surprise.

Turtwig

Andersonisgod wrote: »

If you want to call it form that's fine, but don't be surprised of their form (and more specifically the aggression of their pressing) picks up each time a truly massive game comes around.

OMG!

Before Christmas they were talking about how they wanted to win the treble. Then after January Rosell said even if they win nothing their season will be a good one if Tito recovers. He's been a huge loss for them and apparently his health prognosis isn't good either:( So there's no telling what kind of bearing that's having on the team. Chalk it up whatever way you like but Barca ALWAYS want to beat Madrid. It's just their form up until tonight has been woeful and one game does not make form either but they've bought themselves some time. Milan capitulated and even still but for a few millimetres of the spin of a ball Barca could have faced a much tougher prospect in the second half.

carlop

Barca will be praying they don't get Madrid. Motivation had nothing to do with it, Mourinho has spent the last three years devising a plan to beat Barcelona, and he's pretty much hit the nail on the head.

That's why I think Real Madrid would rather draw Barca than Bayern, Dortmund or possibly even Juventus. They are at their best on the counter-attack, and can really struggle to find ideas and are far too reliant on Ronaldo when they come up aganst a team that is content to let them have the ball.

Right now they have the edge psychologically, I think Mourinho would be happy getting Barcelona now.

Blatter

Andersonisgod wrote: »

If you want to call it form that's fine, but don't be surprised of their form (and more specifically the aggression of their pressing) picks up each time a truly massive game comes around.

I have little doubt it will now seeing as it's the only competition they are involved in now since the league is finished and they got knocked out of the cup. They can rest players and prepare in a manner that will have their players in peak condition for the Champions League games.

kryogen

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Are you saying that players application is the same in every game? Because that's a bizzare claim that is simply wrong. A Champions League game against Madrid is bigger than a Copa Del Rey game against Madrid. I'm not saying that they didn't try against Madrid in their last couple of meetings, I am simply saying that they would surely give a bit extra (like tonight) in the Champions League than domestically. That's hardly an outlandish claim.

For example, watch Spain's group game against Italy at the recent Euro's, then watch the difference in the aggression of their pressing in the final. Bigger games often wield more effort.

It wouldn't matter if Barca and Madrid played each other in the car park on a Sunday morning, they would both still be going all out to win, to try to diminish Madrids recent victories over them like that is quite frankly, sad and unnecessary.

Morzadec

CSF wrote: »

Not a peno, and they definitely did get the decision they needed

I've tried to find a good replay online but can't get a good view on it.

My first opinion on it at the time was that they had a strong shout. After seeing 2 close-up replays I thought it was certainly leaning strongly on the side of a penalty. My flatmate (a Madridista so hardly sympathetic to Barca's cause) agreed. The Spanish commentators (who will of course have a bias) thought it was a definite penalty.

I'm willing to retract my comment if I see it again and I think I was wrong, but from the live action image and the 2 close-ups I think Abate knows exactly what he's doing and takes Pedro out.

Clumsy at best, cynical at worst.

Have a look again, you may change your mind.

Essien

And people wonder where Barca hate stems from...

Andersonisgod

Blatter wrote: »

I have little doubt it will now seeing as it's the only competition they are involved in now since the league is finished and they got knocked out of the cup. They can rest players and prepare in a manner that will have their players in peak condition for the Champions League games.

But what would that have to do with their pressing? (you know, the thing I've been referring to in the last several posts) assume Pedro is replaced by Tello, Villa with Sanchez, Iniesta with Fabregas, Xavi with Thiago. If, as you seem to be claiming, they press the same amount in every game no matter what the circumstances are, and assuming, as I think most would, that those players coming in are willing to press, do you think the level of pressing would be the same? Of course not because circumstances need to be taken into account.

Anyway this argument is silly. I hardly think Mourinho has his fingers crossed for Barcelona, he's experienced Barcelona decimating his Madrid side in the Champions League before.

applehunter