No agreement on kids

GreenAngel2012

Hi,

I will try to keep this short! My ex and I are separated, have an agreement drawn up but not signed. We have a verbal agreement re: visitation etc which generally has worked well. He has them every other weekend, fri and sat night. However, we swapped weekends last weekend as it was Mothers day and I wanted kids with me, which he agreed. This weekend is a bank hol, and the 2nd weekend after that is a bank hol also. We don't have anything agreed re: bank hols, either verbally or written. He is demanding that he have the kids right up till 6pm the mon night of both weekends - I feel this is too long and I want him to return them as per agreed, on sun nights, at least for one of these weekends. He has them stay with him at his sisters house, which I hate. What rights do I have? I am the main caregiver.

Thanks!

audman

GreenAngel2012 wrote: »

Hi,

I will try to keep this short! My ex and I are separated, have an agreement drawn up but not signed. We have a verbal agreement re: visitation etc which generally has worked well. He has them every other weekend, fri and sat night. Howeever, we swapped weekends last weekend as it was Mothers day and I wanted kids with me, which he agreed. This weekend is a bank hol, and the 2nd weekend after that is a bank hol also. We don't have anything agreed re: bank hols, either verbally or written. He is demanding that he have the kids right up till 6pm the mon night of both weekends - I feel this is too long and I want him to return them as per agreed, on sun nights, at least for one of these weekends. He has them stay with him at his sisters house, which I hate. What rights do I have? I am the main caregiver.

Thanks!

I really think you should let him have them until the Monday.At the end of the day he is their father and you have them most of the time.Put yourself in his shoes. . How would you like it if you could only see your kids every second weekend for two nights !At least he wants to see them unlike a lot of fathers

Peppa Pig

Why don't you ask your children, or are they just pawns?

Taltos

Peppa Pig wrote: »

Why don't you ask your children, or are they just pawns?

Peppa Pig - tone it down a lot - this type of reply is not acceptable in this forum.

OP - as this thread is more to do with the parenting of your children do you want me to move it to the Parenting forum?
While this forum is a place to help people going through a Separation and/or Divorce it might not be the right location for this specific type of issue.

Unless of course you are seeking advice on how to get firm access rights in place.

Thanks
Taltos

eviltwin

Sounds like you're happy to change the goalposts to suit yourself OP but won't give him the same consideration.

sffc

eviltwin wrote: »

Sounds like you're happy to change the goalposts to suit yourself OP but won't give him the same consideration.

Exactly. Most separated dads including me would be tempted to say "great I can have a few jars on Sunday night and a lie on on Monday! " This guy isn't and wants to use his extra spare time to see and care for his kids, you should be giving him credit. He also did a swap for mother's day ... something he could have been a pig about but wasn't.
Two more points - please don't make the kids choose as suggested , it's cruel. By all means give them an imput in your roster overall but dont make them choose over specific flashpoints. Secondly please don't tell your ex where to bring the kids just because you don't like it. Its a dangerous road apart from the fact you have no right. In time you may have a new partner - is your ex to decide the new guy is to have no contact because he " doesn't like him " ?
You guys are nearly there! Get your agreement signed, do up a roster FOR THE REST OF THE YEAR ( we have) and love and care for kids jointly ...while living apart.

eviltwin

sffc wrote: »

Most separated dads including me would be tempted to say "great I can have a few jars on Sunday night and a lie on on Monday! " This guy isn't and wants to use his extra spare time to see and care for his kids, you should be giving him credit. He also did a swap for mother's day ... something he could have been a pig about but wasn't.
Two more points - please don't make the kids choose as suggested , it's cruel. By all means give them an imput in your roster overall but dont make them choose over specific flashpoints. Secondly please don't tell your ex where to bring the kids just because you don't like it. Its a dangerous road apart from the fact you have no right. In time you may have a new partner - is your ex to decide the new guy is to have no contact because he " doesn't like him " ?
You guys are nearly there! Get your agreement signed, do up a roster FOR THE REST OF THE YEAR ( we have) and love and care for kids jointly ...while living apart.

I am giving him credit I'm not the OP.

I don't see the problem with the dad wanting the kids for the extra day seeing as its a bank holiday. My point is the OP was okay to make changes to their agreement in order to facilitate her own wish to have the kids home on Mothers Day, surely the dad is entitled to the same level of consideration. If he wanted he could have insisted they stay with him last weekend, he didn't. I think he deserves some respect for that.

sffc

eviltwin wrote: »

I am giving him credit I'm not the OP.

I don't see the problem with the dad wanting the kids for the extra day seeing as its a bank holiday. My point is the OP was okay to make changes to their agreement in order to facilitate her own wish to have the kids home on Mothers Day, surely the dad is entitled to the same level of consideration. If he wanted he could have insisted they stay with him last weekend, he didn't. I think he deserves some respect for that.

Was quoting you in total agreement with your point Eviltwin .

NinjaTruncs

OP asking what Rights you have could come back to haunt you, your ex could decide that he doesn't want accommodate you in the future with your requests.

How about trying to negotiate with him, suggest that for one of the bank holidays he can keep them until Monday evening. you could find that forcing him now could lead to him wanting something in writing which could be disadvantageous to you in the future.

You didn't say how long you are separated for but how have you handled long week ends in the past?

GreenAngel2012

Thanks for replies. My exH takes them to a place that is so filthy you wouldn't put a dog to be honest.
I rarely ask favours to change weekends etc.
Usually when he has kids for a long weekend he gives them back sun night.
We are separated nearly 3 years, kids are 4 and 5 so I won't be asking them what they would prefer, it is indeed cruel.
The man is a bully and has told lies about me, making my life miserable.
It is him in fact who uses them as pawns, he calls time with the kids as HIS time. He sees them as a possession. He spent an evening try to coax them into going with him (as I had agreed it was half term and he could take them for 2 nights), even though they were too sick to go anywhere and it upset them greatly.
I would have no problem letting him take them, he is their father and they deserve to see him, but the children are not looked after adequately when in his care. He gets his sister to pick them up (who can't seem to strap them in right) and they stay in a dirty house.....he won't try to find himself a better place to live, and I have caught him working when he was supposed to have them. His sis was looking after them, and he never told me.

Atomicjuicer

Do you want cooperation with him or not? Sounds like you just hate him and are looking for problems.

If you want this to work half and half you need to be constructive. Both of you need to have some trust or things will only get worse.

Best of luck

GreenAngel2012

That isn't true. A social worker who he went to with lies about me (who consequently found nothing wrong) contacted me to say she was worried about how he treats the children. He has been to the guards about me, who again found nothing wrong. He constantly intimidizes me in our home, including my 70 year old mother, often in front of the children.

Does this sound like I am just trying to get at him, or that I am concerned for my children's welfare?

Peppa Pig

Sounds like you need to go to court and apply for sole custody

GreenAngel2012

I just want to add, he comes round on wed eves too to see them....

desbrook

GreenAngel2012 wrote: »

Thanks for replies. My exH takes them to a place that is so filthy you wouldn't put a dog to be honest.
I rarely ask favours to change weekends etc.
Usually when he has kids for a long weekend he gives them back sun night.
We are separated nearly 3 years, kids are 4 and 5 so I won't be asking them what they would prefer, it is indeed cruel.
The man is a bully and has told lies about me, making my life miserable.
It is him in fact who uses them as pawns, he calls time with the kids as HIS time. He sees them as a possession. He spent an evening try to coax them into going with him (as I had agreed it was half term and he could take them for 2 nights), even though they were too sick to go anywhere and it upset them greatly.
I would have no problem letting him take them, he is their father and they deserve to see him, but the children are not looked after adequately when in his care. He gets his sister to pick them up (who can't seem to strap them in right) and they stay in a dirty house.....he won't try to find himself a better place to live, and I have caught him working when he was supposed to have them. His sis was looking after them, and he never told me.

Before I begin I am NOT saying he's an angel - what I am saying is that to make things better for EVERYONE (especially the kids) you need to see things from his perspective aswell as your own . Disagreements of this kind usually have a fear at the root of them with the party in fear hiding it by being aggressive . You are BOTH doing it and it has to stop !

Let me take what you have written and give you some of his perspective, again to help you all :

"Filthy house " - using terms like this won't help . They make him feel inadequate as a dad . Decent guys are brought up to be providers . To him you are rubbing his nose in the fact that the accomadation he cares for the kids in is inferior to yours as you have the family home . Its his sisters so he isn't really in control of it .He presumably can't afford his own place and you are stoking the fears that he may never be able to . Because I agreed to pay my wife more than I needed to I cant afford to rent a two bed apt or even own my own place at the moment . They start at 800euro a month and I cant'afford it and neither can he I presume . When he does work to try and get more money you still have a problem but I'll get back to that !

Are you going to divide up the money differently so he can afford it ? Fact is how clean a house is is sometimes a matter of opinion - is there other kids there ? are they being taken into care because of it ?? If not the you haven't got a leg to stand on , your husband is doing nothing wrong .

I say your "husband "purposely because legally he still is . You may be giving more care in trerms of time etc - but the term "main caregiver" one you created and has no standing . He still has every right to parent as he did before ye split . This is the biggie that you just aren't getting OP .

He see's less of the kids than you do so naturally he gaurds the time jealously . Your attitude makes this jealousy worse . He has to call it "his time " to remind you that it's just that . He was coaxing the kids to see him while sick for good reason . You were unlikely to allow him to make up the time another weekend etc . In legal agreements thats what happens but he is in fear your won't be fair .

He is not a babysitter whom you can dictate to re how he cares for the kids . When it is "his time" he is under no obligation to be actually hands on looking after them himself . Just like you are'nt !!!! If you wanted to meet a friend for a drink or get your hair done you'd get somelse to look after them . That's your right as a parent . The fact that he was working makes your attitude worse . He may actually be trying to earn a few bob extra and get a better place . These days it hard to turn down work if bosses call etc . You should apologise if you rowed with him over this . It'll be a start .

In short OP you need to parent together with him .You casting yourself as the boss is understandably making him feel second best, fearful and resentful . Any bad behavior on his part is largely a reflection of yours I'm afraid :-(

hickory99

OP you asked the qiestion "what rights do I have"

Answer to that question is if you were married essentially none as there is no court order or legal agreement in place. I say this from experience if he holds onto the children (which to be perfectly honest I think sounds fair since he has been flexible with your request for a change on mothers day) and you disagree then there is not much you can do about it. You can call the Guards but if your ex is well informed he can simpy tell the Gaurds that there is no court order and he has joint legal custody of his children (again this is only the case if you were married). The Guards hands will be tied (like I said I speak from direct experience).

cgh

OP,

its time you put the agreement on paper, even if it means arranging mediation to sort it out.
for everyones sakes get this much done and then at least you both have a proper agreement that can be signed off on.

Boombastic

He was flexible enough to change the arrangement for you to have them Mothers day, yet you don't seem to afford him the same flexibility.

Your relationship with him, should not be confused with his relationship with his children

desbrook

cgh wrote: »

OP,

its time you put the agreement on paper, even if it means arranging mediation to sort it out.
for everyones sakes get this much done and then at least you both have a proper agreement that can be signed off on.

Totally agree - although OP there are still compromises to be made within an access schedule and you need to accept his right to parent his way during his time .

Lostdad

I have to say, I agree totally with Desbrook - his comments echo everything I am feeling as a dad who has had to leave the family home. If both parents, both husband and wife, acted fairly in the best interest of the kids..which in essence, is also acting in the best interest of the opposite party, then there should be a very easy, caring, and emotionally secure environment for the kids to grow up in despite the separation. Adults need to grow up and act with fairness...this is about the best interests of the child (as it was when you both were married and rearing the child together).
I wish you luck but please, stop staring over his fence and just concentrate on nurturing the kids while on your side of the fence...trust in him that he will do the same