Kilkenny GAA Discussion Thread Mod Warning Post # 5885 #4894 & #5202

fed up sick and tired

Mountainlad wrote: »

Can I just ask the Kilkenny fans that keep having a go at Barry Kelly, to consider that when no impartial observer believes he was particularly biased against them in the drawn match that maybe it would be ye who have the bias in question and not Barry Kelly?

The opinion has not been formed on the basis of one single game. So perhaps your misunderstanding starts right at that most basic level ?

The perception is there now, anyway. At the least, I'd say Barry loves Barry a little bit too much. Winking while players are being sent off, waving at fans. A bit of an attention seeker, I think.

I don't care if I never see him reffing a game again.

fed up sick and tired

delaney001 wrote: »

I wouldn't be suprised if this was actually the truth. There is no end of lads who want that gig, and Eddie might have just gone and shot himself in the foot with a very silly comment

He offered a point of view and gave it an interesting slant with actual statistics. He was right to point it out. It was a fair question to ask, and I haven't heard a satisfactory answer to it.

There's actually a little too much in KK of the "hush-hush for the sake of the association" mentality. Noble in it's way, but I'm delighted that he said it, and that Cody has said his piece too.

I have no idea how the Sunday Game is run, but i wonder would the issue have been discussed and flagged at production meetings ?

ps That Des Cahill is another flutehead, now that i think of it.

bruschi

ellinguistico wrote: »

Brian Gavin giving a penalty Saturday was nothing like what Barry Kelly was like towards Kilkenny in the first game, non comparable. That was a free shot he gave them for nothing resembling a free. If it was a free it was a Kilkenny free. BK has an anti-Kilkenny stance that is clearly visible and although Cody should not have said anything publicly he is telling a pretty obvious truth. Whether Kelly is pandering to the powers that be in GAA headquarters to do everything he can to allow for change or is if it is something personal. To argue that Kelly gives Kilkenny a fair crack of the whip is simply false and can be argued with proof if you have attended/watched the games he has officiated with Kilkenny in them.

its that kind of hysterical nonsense that gives ye a bad name over all this, as if it is some sort of conspiracy theory from up above. Kelly gets a bad rep before he ever gets on the field. I genuinely cant think if there has ever been a referee who has never made a mistake during a game, but for whatever reason Kilkenny have an agenda that every decision Kelly makes is personal and he is out to get them.

anyway, enjoy the win, it is disappointing that once again, things are brought back to a ref for a game that happened 3 weeks ago. Dont know why Cody felt the need to air this in the media.

robbiezero

ellinguistico wrote: »

Brian Gavin giving a penalty Saturday was nothing like what Barry Kelly was like towards Kilkenny in the first game, non comparable. That was a free shot he gave them for nothing resembling a free. If it was a free it was a Kilkenny free. BK has an anti-Kilkenny stance that is clearly visible and although Cody should not have said anything publicly he is telling a pretty obvious truth. Whether Kelly is pandering to the powers that be in GAA headquarters to do everything he can to allow for change or is if it is something personal. To argue that Kelly gives Kilkenny a fair crack of the whip is simply false and can be argued with proof if you have attended/watched the games he has officiated with Kilkenny in them.

What rule was broken that should have resulted in this being a Kilkenny free?

citykat

Mountainlad wrote: »

Can I just ask the Kilkenny fans that keep having a go at Barry Kelly, to consider that when no impartial observer believes he was particularly biased against them in the drawn match that maybe it would be ye who have the bias in question and not Barry Kelly?

Of course the standard response to this has been 'yer not really neutral', a siege mentality not even Davy would be proud of.

Hogan changed his body position to lead with the shoulder, even if he ended up on the ground that is an offence. This quote I find particularly strange:



He's rambling there, and out of order. Through the rest of the article he seems to be having a cut. Didn't think he was going to leave this year, wonder might this be pre-empting it. Don't ever remember him coming out in such a no holds barred manner before.

I didn't think before the game and I dont now that BK is biased. He was definitely inconsistent the last day. S McGrath did the exact same as Hogan in the first few minutes of the drawn game and got a free out (from which Tipp scored). That's what p***ed me off about the Hogan decision. The glennon free in 2012 was a joke - a clear dive. Even someone as unbiased as yourself would admit that.

Mountainlad

fed up sick and tired wrote: »

The opinion has not been formed on the basis of one single game. So perhaps your misunderstanding starts right at that most basic level ?

The perception is there now, anyway. At the least, I'd say Barry loves Barry a little bit too much. Winking while players are being sent off, waving at fans. A bit of an attention seeker, I think.

I don't care if I never see him reffing a game again.

I was at the Leinster final too. The first 50/50 that didn't go Kilkenny's way there was uproar, and one fan in particular calling Kelly every name under the sun. I'm from Waterford, my friend is from Tipp and we both had a good laugh at it to be honest.

But it does annoy me in situations like this. As Bruschi said, ye go in with a preconceived idea that he's out to get ye and then any 50/50 decision or one of the few that happen to go against any team are seen as Kelly's anti Kilkenny bias.

Somebody above claiming at least two more managers other than Cody have a problem with Kelly, while mentioning Davy who has a problem with every official who has been involved in one of his games in the Country and also citing an incident where Barry quite correctly instructed the ref to issue a second yellow to Jack Browne.


Another poster claiming that Kelly was wrong to give the free at the end because the incident happened at least 6 times during the game while unpunished, but without giving any specific examples which means we can't actually review that and debate it properly.

And yet another claiming it should have been a free to Kilkenny, without actually stating why.

So, I think it's pretty easy to see where we are coming from. Also, as Bruschi pointed out, there is no uproar over Gavin because ye won that game even though he incorrectly awarded Tipp a penalty, though all a penalty is now is a glorified free. At the same time, Donal Og gave multiple examples of where Gavin left frees unpunished specifically what could have been a penalty for Padraig Walsh's tackle on Bonner, the free Shane Bourke didn't get at the end and also JJ Delaney catching Seamus Callanan's arm and shoulder which slowed him down and enabled JJ to get the hook in.


No doubt there was a few instances in the middle of the field involving both side, and I would state quite clearly that in spite of any potential qualms over refereeing decisions there is not a shadow of the doubt the better team won on Saturday. But it happens every time Kilkenny play a game now, win, lose or draw that some of ye are complaining about the ref and forming conspiracy theories.

It's just not on to be honest.

fed up sick and tired

Mountainlad wrote: »

I was at the Leinster final too. The first 50/50 that didn't go Kilkenny's way there was uproar, and one fan in particular calling Kelly every name under the sun. I'm from Waterford, my friend is from Tipp and we both had a good laugh at it to be honest.

But it does annoy me in situations like this. As Bruschi said, ye go in with a preconceived idea that he's out to get ye and then any 50/50 decision or one of the few that happen to go against any team are seen as Kelly's anti Kilkenny bias.

Somebody above claiming at least two more managers other than Cody have a problem with Kelly, while mentioning Davy who has a problem with every official who has been involved in one of his games in the Country and also citing an incident where Barry quite correctly instructed the ref to issue a second yellow to Jack Browne.


Another poster claiming that Kelly was wrong to give the free at the end because the incident happened at least 6 times during the game while unpunished, but without giving any specific examples which means we can't actually review that and debate it properly.

And yet another claiming it should have been a free to Kilkenny, without actually stating why.

So, I think it's pretty easy to see where we are coming from. Also, as Bruschi pointed out, there is no uproar over Gavin because ye won that game even though he incorrectly awarded Tipp a penalty, though all a penalty is now is a glorified free. At the same time, Donal Og gave multiple examples of where Gavin left frees unpunished specifically what could have been a penalty for Padraig Walsh's tackle on Bonner, the free Shane Bourke didn't get at the end and also JJ Delaney catching Seamus Callanan's arm and shoulder which slowed him down and enabled JJ to get the hook in.


No doubt there was a few instances in the middle of the field involving both side, and I would state quite clearly that in spite of any potential qualms over refereeing decisions there is not a shadow of the doubt the better team won on Saturday. But it happens every time Kilkenny play a game now, win, lose or draw that some of ye are complaining about the ref and forming conspiracy theories.

It's just not on to be honest.

There is no uproar, not because we won, but because there is no perception that Gavin is biased. His free-for-all approach is just that.

Interestingly, all your instances of use of the second hand etc, are one-sided. There were plenty other instances of the same thing on Tipp's part.

Bad refereeing is one thing. Biased refereeing is quite another, and much worse.

Mountainlad

citykat wrote: »

I didn't think before the game and I dont now that BK is biased. He was definitely inconsistent the last day. S McGrath did the exact same as Hogan in the first few minutes of the drawn game and got a free out (from which Tipp scored). That's what pissed me off about the Hogan decision. The glennon free in 2012 was a joke - a clear dive. Even someone as unbiased as yourself would admit that.

I saw you mention that before, and have watched the game back. Shane McGrath runs out with the ball and is met with a shoulder in the front from Conor Fogarty, which is not side to side as specified. That is correctly a free to Tipperary. Watch the 3rd angle in the below video from where it starts.

I'd agree on the Glennon free, but I reckon that one was to give them an opportunity for a draw. Incorrect, but a sad fact of reffing within the GAA. If Kilkenny did the same, they would also get the free.

EDIT: It's actually starting at the last free for some reason but go to around 22mins and 30 seconds for the Shane McGrath incident.

adrian522

Mountainlad wrote: »

Another poster claiming that Kelly was wrong to give the free at the end because the incident happened at least 6 times during the game while unpunished, but without giving any specific examples which means we can't actually review that and debate it properly.

.

Do you seriously want me to go back to the drawn match to point out these instances? Really?

It happened several times during the game as it does during most games and quite correctly no free was given.

Mountainlad

fed up sick and tired wrote: »

There is no uproar, not because we won, but because there is no perception that Gavin is biased. His free-for-all approach is just that.

Interestingly, all your instances of use of the second hand etc, are one-sided. There were plenty other instances of the same thing on Tipp's part.

Bad refereeing is one thing. Biased refereeing is quite another, and much worse.

And so are yer examples with Barry Kelly. And the perception of him being biased against Kilkenny people is, guess what, generated by Kilkenny people who will naturally have a bias towards there own.

Still not getting it I don't think. The fact that Eddie Brennan used a ridiculous 'statistic' of Kelly refereeing games Kilkenny lost just shows that it is because you won on Saturday your not giving out. Don't pretend for a second you wouldn't be giving out if Tipp had won by a point or after extra time.

Mountainlad

adrian522 wrote: »

Do you seriously want me to go back to the drawn match to point out these instances? Really?

It happened several times during the game as it does during most games and quite correctly no free was given.

Yeah, and to be honest I don't find unreasonable. The only one that has been pointed out is the Shane McGrath one, which was correctly awarded as a Tipp free. I think where CityKat got confused is that both McGrath and Hogan where attacking, but Shane McGrath runs out and doesn't change his body position and is met with a shoulder. Both times the Kilkenny man was the one that meant his direct opponent with his shoulder.

So those two instances are actually, ironically, an example of consistency on Barry Kelly's part.

adrian522

I'm not going back to analyse the game for your benefit, have another watch of the game if you feel you want to see it. Plenty of defenders coming out with the ball in hand similar to Hogan and (correctly) no free awarded for exactly the same type of play.

I don't think Barry Kelly is biased at all, he is just not a very good referee.

He's very inconsistent and loves to make himself the centre of attention. for example that Clare Wexford game this year where he was linesman, the sending off of Donal Og a few years back the Shefflin sending off last year,the frees awarded to Galway and Tipperary in the dying moments of the 2 drawn AI's in 2012 and 2014 are also examples of this.

deadybai

Mountainlad wrote: »

And so are yer examples with Barry Kelly. And the perception of him being biased against Kilkenny people is, guess what, generated by Kilkenny people who will naturally have a bias towards there own.

Still not getting it I don't think. The fact that Eddie Brennan used a ridiculous 'statistic' of Kelly refereeing games Kilkenny lost just shows that it is because you won on Saturday your not giving out. Don't pretend for a second you wouldn't be giving out if Tipp had won by a point or after extra time.

Barry Kelly was clearly giving all the decisions to Tipp in the drawn match I can't understand how anyone would think otherwise. There was one decision in the drawn match where he gave a free out to KK and it clearly wasn't one

I don't think he has a biased against KK but he is some ****e referee in fairness. Gavin while not perfect is the best of the lot. He got some wrong decisions yesterday including the penalty but its a fecking hard job.

Even if the penalty was buried in the back of the net, KK still would have won this game. At the end of the day the best team of 2014 has won the All Ireland.

Grats

To the moderator - a number of Kilkenny posters were banned, or otherwise, not so long ago for defending ourselves against the very same non Kilkenny posters who have reappeared once again. i suggest you deal with them before this escalates into a similar situation.

robbiezero

adrian522 wrote: »

I'm not going back to analyse the game for your benefit, have another watch of the game if you feel you want to see it. Plenty of defenders coming out with the ball in hand similar to Hogan and (correctly) no free awarded for exactly the same type of play.

I don't think Barry Kelly is biased at all, he is just not a very good referee.

He's very inconsistent and loves to make himself the centre of attention. for example that Clare Wexford game this year where he was linesman, the sending off of Donal Og a few years back the Shefflin sending off last year,the frees awarded to Galway and Tipperary in the dying moments of the 2 drawn AI's in 2012 and 2014 are also examples of this.

Can you point to a single instance where a defender sprinted 30 yards with ball in hand and clattered shoulder-first straight into the chest of a static opponent?

Mountainlad

adrian522 wrote: »

I'm not going back to analyse the game for your benefit, have another watch of the game if you feel you want to see it. Plenty of defenders coming out with the ball in hand similar to Hogan and (correctly) no free awarded for exactly the same type of play.

I don't think Barry Kelly is biased at all, he is just not a very good referee.

He's very inconsistent and loves to make himself the centre of attention. for example that Clare Wexford game this year where he was linesman, the sending off of Donal Og a few years back the Shefflin sending off last year,the frees awarded to Galway and Tipperary in the dying moments of the 2 drawn AI's in 2012 and 2014 are also examples of this.

Don't make claims you are not prepared to back up. I have watched the game back and did not note the incidents you are talking about while watching. I've given an example of where he was consistent on that rule in the game, while ye go on about inconsistency.

This making himself the center of attention business is a criticism I always here of referees and it's ridiculous. He blows a whistle, that halts the game, therefore he will inevitably will get quite a bit of attention. The Clare/Wexford game he was spot on. If I remember Donal Ogs rightly, he got a yellow early on for verbal abuse of something and then close lined somebody and deserved a second yellow.

Shefflin's last year was a bit harsh. And I Agree on the Galway free, but don't think there are many (probably any) refs who wouldn't have given it.

And I just don't agree on the free in the drawn game.

Kilkenny love making him the center of attention too, what with Cody's comments TODAY by the way. Criminal like, ffs give us a break.

adrian522

robbiezero wrote: »

Can you point to a single instance where a defender sprinted 30 yards with ball in hand and clattered shoulder-first straight into the chest of a static opponent?

No, can you? Because that is most certainly not what happened at the end of the game.

I can understand people defending Kelly up to a point but the above is quite plainly a silly reading of what happened.

robbiezero

adrian522 wrote: »

No, can you? Because that is most certainly not what happened at the end of the game.

I can understand people defending Kelly up to a point but the above is quite plainly a silly reading of what happened.

Ok, lets have your version of it so?

piuswal

Two points and a follow on;

What I thought interesting about Gavin's penalty decision was that the KK backs seemed to ask him to check with the umpires as Kelly had done and he didn't (inconsistency among referees?).

Re Donal Og picking out various examples of fouls; I've said this before - in situations (melees for the want of a better word) of more than 2 players tussling for a ball (and at the pace events happen) it is virtually impossible for one person to see with the naked eye all that goes one. It's much easier to go back, slow down the motion and zoom in on areas of interest and then find instances as he highlighted. I'm sure one could do this in virtually every match and see every team doing it.

I know there has been some calls for a second referee in order to keep up with the rapidly moving game and I think it is worth having a look at but to deal with Donal Og's issue you would need the American Football system of 6 (I think) on-field officials and then a TV review each time. We certainly do not want to go down that route (imagine having to delay the Angelus because of games over running due TV reviews!)

pmy.murphy

Mountainlad wrote: »

Kilkenny love making him the center of attention too, what with Cody's comments TODAY by the way. Criminal like, ffs give us a break.

Less of that now. Its amazing how little it takes for people to start getting personal on us Kilkenny supporters when theres a point made. Im all for outsiders making a point but not when they start making ridiculous generalisations

adrian522

Mountainlad wrote: »

Don't make claims you are not prepared to back up. .

I won't address the rest of your post as it doesn't make a huge amount of sense but I don't feel I should have to trawl through you tube or what ever for every point I want to make.

I also don't feel you have the right to shut down down conversation based on these arbitrary conditions you are applying.

adrian522

robbiezero wrote: »

Ok, lets have your version of it so?

As I've stated above I don't think any foul occurred and play should have been allowed to continue. Seems pretty obvious to me actually.

Mountainlad

pmy.murphy wrote: »

Less of that now. Its amazing how little it takes for people to start getting personal on us Kilkenny supporters when theres a point made. Im all for outsiders making a point but not when they start making ridiculous generalisations

Pmy, Eddie Brennan had go off him the night of the match. Cody is now having a cut three games even though it doesn't make a blind bit of difference.

That's my angle. We wouldn't be talking about it now only Cody had to give out about. Why? And I don't even agree with him. But either way, it's incredibly petty.

Mountainlad

adrian522 wrote: »

I won't address the rest of your post as it doesn't make a huge amount of sense but I don't feel I should have to trawl through you tube or what ever for every point I want to make.

I also don't feel you have the right to shut down down conversation based on these arbitrary conditions you are applying.

Well we differ in opinion on that then. You said the same incident happened 5 or 6 times but he didn't blow, I mean I would think it's reasonable to assume you have some examples then.

I could say Gavin didn't pull Kilkenny for improper use of the spare hand 5 times inside their own 45 (example by the way, not saying I believe this) but would you be happy if I just said that without backing it up?

Maybe you can tell me what doesn't make sense and I can clarify.

dzer2

piuswal wrote: »

Two points and a follow on;

What I thought interesting about Gavin's penalty decision was that the KK backs seemed to ask him to check with the umpires as Kelly had done and he didn't (inconsistency among referees?).

Re Donal Og picking out various examples of fouls; I've said this before - in situations (melees for the want of a better word) of more than 2 players tussling for a ball (and at the pace events happen) it is virtually impossible for one person to see with the naked eye all that goes one. It's much easier to go back, slow down the motion and zoom in on areas of interest and then find instances as he highlighted. I'm sure one could do this in virtually every match and see every team doing it.

I know there has been some calls for a second referee in order to keep up with the rapidly moving game and I think it is worth having a look at but to deal with Donal Og's issue you would need the American Football system of 6 (I think) on-field officials and then a TV review each time. We certainly do not want to go down that route (imagine having to delay the Angelus because of games over running due TV reviews!)

In fairness have a read of DoCs book and see his hatred of KK. So no matter what else happens he will point out any fouls he can. As far as Kelly he is a very poor ref, annoys players and officals. the main point all of these posters forget is that Brian Hogan put the ball down and walked away he was expecting the free to go against him as in '12. It was pure discipline and this is what Cody expects from his players and other teams. His rant is to get the gaa to man up and appoint decent refs. That last free wouldn't be a discussion point if it happened in the first minute. But it was the last puck of the game and as Cody has said no one would have said any thing if he played on and either side had scored. I haven't looked in great detail at either match because at this stage its irrelevent as KK are AI champs and thats all that will go down in history but I gaurentee that in the first match you could count the amount of frees out given to KK on one hand.

Hitchens

just to calm things down a notch:

1. Senior Hurling Titles - 35 (top)
2. Minor Hurling Titles - 21 (top)
3. U21 Hurling Titles - 11 (joint top)
4. Championship matches longest unbeaten run - 21
5. Four-in-a-row (all through the front door)
6. Number of SH All-Ireland medals held by one player (The King) - 10 (top)
7. The only Grand Slam ever achieved by any county, 2008
8. All time top scorer - Henry Shefflin
9. All time r/up scorer - Eddie Keher
10. Greatest manager in hurling ever (only manager to win the All-Ireland title ten times) - Brian Cody

hon the Cats !!! :pac:

Grats

An amazing thing happened in the drawn match. In all the years I'm going to matches, in a variety of sports, I have never witnessed a referee been applauded off the pitch! That to me said all about how Barry Kelly handled the match.

I rest my case!

Justice for the individual

Grats wrote: »

To the moderator - a number of Kilkenny posters were banned, or otherwise, not so long ago for defending ourselves against the very same non Kilkenny posters who have reappeared once again. i suggest you deal with them before this escalates into a similar situation.

Yes, we could do with them back, if only to deal with non-Kilkenny "supporters" having a go at a manager who has just garnered a unique record for himself and Henry Shefflin of 10 All-Ireland's, and we cannot let sour grapes interfere with that achievement.

After, I think, 17 years as Manager of Kilkenny, he has bit his tongue and kept silent and just got on with guiding Kilkenny through long and tough campaigns without saying a word.

At this stage, for his own reasons, he has decided to take a stand in the interest of fairness for his players, and you would expect nothing else from him.

A great guy, and a gentleman of the highest integrity.

To the hurlers on the ditch, let me know your achievements for the advancement of the great game of hurling.

Mountainlad

Grats wrote: »

An amazing thing happened in the drawn match. In all the years I'm going to matches, in a variety of sports, I have never witnessed a referee been applauded off the pitch! That to me said all about how Barry Kelly handled the match.

I rest my case!

It's a pretty poor case to be honest with you.

Grats

Mountainlad wrote: »

It's a pretty poor case to be honest with you.

In your closed eyes, perhaps!

adrian522

Mountainlad wrote: »

Well we differ in opinion on that then. You said the same incident happened 5 or 6 times but he didn't blow, I mean I would think it's reasonable to assume you have some examples then.

I could say Gavin didn't pull Kilkenny for improper use of the spare hand 5 times inside their own 45 (example by the way, not saying I believe this) but would you be happy if I just said that without backing it up?

Maybe you can tell me what doesn't make sense and I can clarify.

Well I noticed similar instances when rewatching the game the week after. I have no real interest in going back and pulling out individual instances.

The way he reffed the game was not in keeping with that last free. There were very few frees awarded actually, resulting in the high number of scores from play.

If he was blowing up for similar infringements all game you could make some argument for it but he wasn't.

I actually agree with you on a lot of what you are saying about fans constantly going on about referees, Eddie Brennans comments etc. but this free I feel was completely the wrong call.

Grats

Ex Hoganstand - Liam MacCarthy Cup returns to Noreside

An estimated 15,000 Kilkenny fans have turned out in the Mable City this evening to welcome home the new All-Ireland hurling champions.

Having celebrated into the early hours at the CityWest Hotel last night, Brian Cody’s all-conquering team arrived by bus into Castle Park shortly after 4pm before boarding an open-top bus to Nowlan Park where a stage had been specially erected.

There, manager Brian Cody paid tribute to Henry Shefflin, who yesterday became the first player in the history of the GAA to win 10 All-Ireland senior medals.

“It is only right that I should mention the achievement of Henry yesterday,” he said.

“To win 10 All-Ireland medals on the field of play is something that was never done before.

“It’s very, very tempting when you are in these situations to say it will never be done again, but already there is players queuing up behind him to make sure it will be done again. We look forward to seeing it happen again in the very, very near future. Henry has created history, but more importantly than that he has been a magnificent player and a magnificent leader going back to when he started playing.”

The homecoming also honoured the All-Ireland winning Kilkenny minor team and the Kilkenny senior and intermediate camogie teams, which lost their recent All-Ireland finals, while Kilkenny city was also feted following its recent Tidy Towns Award.

Mountainlad

adrian522 wrote: »

Well I noticed similar instances when rewatching the game the week after. I have no real interest in going back and pulling out individual instances.

The way he reffed the game was not in keeping with that last free. There were very few frees awarded actually, resulting in the high number of scores from play.

If he was blowing up for similar infringements all game you could make some argument for it but he wasn't.

I actually agree with you on a lot of what you are saying about fans constantly going on about referees, Eddie Brennans comments etc. but this free I feel was completely the wrong call.

Fair enough, if we differ on opinion as regards the awarding of the free. At least your saying he's inconsistent and not claiming he's out to get Kilkenny.

For what it's worth I thought he had a good game that day and contributed to a great match. His consultation with the umpires for both penalty decisions was also something we should see more of and as was pointed out above Michael Fennelly asked Gavin to do the same and he refused.

Mountainlad

Grats wrote: »

In your closed eyes, perhaps!

I'm not even going to entertain this to be honest.

Grats

Mountainlad wrote: »

I'm not even going to entertain this to be honest.

Honestly, good then!

zombieHanalei

I'm getting fed up of the focus on the supposed "darker side" of Kilkenny's game, so I can only imagine how bored you KK folks are of it.

I have huge admiration with the sheer ferocity at which Kilkenny can play the game with, say whatever you want about how the referee performed, the better team won in the end.

I am as fed up with their dominance as any other non-Kilkenny person but it's bad form to try and cheapen their achievements by focusing on refereeing performances like this.

allthedoyles

The referees decision is final and this must be accepted by all .

Fwank wizzo

Some lads on this thread just thrive on nitpicking and negativity about KK.
Pub bores with no one to listen to their B.S in real life so they come on here for a bitch and moan.
35 senior and counting...

Hitchens

allthedoyles wrote: »

The referees decision is final and this must be accepted by all .

Tell him that

Realt Dearg Sec

allthedoyles wrote: »

The referees decision is final and this must be accepted by all .

Except when it doesn't suit you to think that...such as when you wrote: "And there is no doubt that Man of the Match was the Referee"

DoctaDee

Contrary to some beliefs, Moderators are not actively following every thread in the GAA forum and rely the majority of the time on you the posters to report posts that you feel contravene acceptable posting behaviour. We haven't received a single reported post in either this or the AI final thread in over 5 days

Realt Dearg Sec

DoctaDee wrote: »

Contrary to some beliefs, Moderators are not actively following every thread in the GAA forum and rely the majority of the time on you the posters to report posts that you feel contravene acceptable posting behaviour. We haven't received a single reported post in either this or the AI final thread in over 5 days

That's a great testament to the restraint and good humour we've all shown, I think.;)

DoctaDee

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

That's a great testament to the restraint and good humour we've all shown, I think.;)

LOL.. yeah! .. It struck me on Saturday that all the talk of KK winning so often dampens the after match celebrations, well Saturday dispelled that myth. Well deserved victory congrats

Hitchens

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

That's a great testament to the restraint and good humour we've all shown, I think.;)

...and concrete evidence that restraint and good humour which permeates through all of Kilkenny, was when the free was given to Tipp at the end of the drawn match, and not one KK player remonstrated with the ref, because they knew if they did that the ball might have been moved much nearer to the goal posts.

It takes some balls to do that.

But................it's the way we were 'rared'

Charlie69

This whole Barry Kelly thing has become very boring as far as I'm concerned but as I've said before I don't believe Barry kelly is biased against Kilkenny, but if we play "on the edge" as seems to be the general consensus then Barry's overly fussy style of refereeing was never going to suit our style of play.

Barry seemed to change his style this year though and appeared to try and let the game flow a little more which contributed to a fantastic free flowing game in the drawn final.

It would appear though that a disproportionate amount of the big calls Barry has had to make in Kilkenny games in the past and in the drawn final have gone against us and this has led to him being very unpopular on Noreside.

I can accept most of the decisions or calls Barry made in the drawn final even if I didn't agree with some of them, but for me his failure to give Eoin Larkin a free when he was rugby tackled by Paddy Stapleton (talk about use of the spare hand) which led to a Tipperary point and therefore resulted in a two point swing was unforgivable and just bad refereeing.

And before someone points it out I know R Power tripped Stapleton in the lead up to TJ's goal but that was a hard one to spot, the Larkin incident was right in front of him and to make things worse he gave Larkin a telling off after it which was unbelievable really.

savannahkat

Barry Kelly does have an anti Kilkenny bias and it makes no difference if Mountain lad believes so or not, for Mountain lad has his own anti Kilkenny bias which I have pointed out in previous posts including his posting of the John Dalton video to prove that Kilkenny are a dirty team which he gleefully posted on another forum. Mountain lad claims to be a neutral from Waterford (not the best basis for claiming to be a neutral as far as Kilkenny are concerned) while at the same time falling back on his Tipp relatives when he wants to show how much he knows, loves and admires Tipp. The awarding of a free to Galway for a dive to draw an all Ireland final and deprive Kilkenny of a deserved win on day one, the awarding of a free to Tipp which was never a free and offer them a pot shot to win an all Ireland at Kilkenny expense and forcing us to play Cork with 14 men for an entire second half ( Henry sent of and the card subsequently rescinded)which more than likely cost us the game is simply disgraceful and a shocking standard of acceptable refereeing and for it to happen three years in a row, one would need to be blind or blinkered not to legitimately question it, and seriously question it. Brian Cody has rightly done so.
As one of the Kilkenny posters banned for making similar statements earlier I fully expect to be banned again but as far as i am concerned Mountain lad is about as neutral as the Gestapo were in WW2.
Last Sundays win was a magnificent win and probably the one we least expected at the start of the year. Conor Fogarty, Padraigh Walsh, John Power, Mark Kelly, Joey Holden, Brian Kennedy, Jonjo Farrell names barely known all played their part and it is a magnificent display of management to get us this win.

fed up sick and tired

Mountainlad wrote: »

the perception of him being biased against Kilkenny people is,

I can't believe that anyone has said anything so ridiculous. Can you point that out to me ?

Kilkenny people who will naturally have a bias towards there own.

That does not preclude the possibility of having a valid point of view.

Still not getting it I don't think.

Don't worry. We're here especially to help the likes of you

The fact that Eddie Brennan used a ridiculous 'statistic' of Kelly refereeing games Kilkenny lost just shows that it is because you won on Saturday your not giving out.

Statistics are not ridiculous. They simply quantify a phenomenon. You may think they are irrelevant, but if you do, you should be able to explain why. I've already said that I have not seen any attempt to explain away the point he made.

Don't pretend for a second you wouldn't be giving out if Tipp had won by a point or after extra time.

A bit impertinent of you to make such a presumption. Especially since you're just making stuff up now. Who said anything about extra time ? ? ?

Have to say, as a proud Kilkenny man living in Tipp - there is a touch of class about the informed Tipp supporters both in my locality and on the other thread here, since Saturday, that is sadly lacking in some of the rest of you.

If any of you think that because we've enjoyed amazing success over the last decade-plus, that we're going to listen any auld guff... think on.

fed up sick and tired

savannahkat wrote: »

Barry Kelly does have an anti Kilkenny bias and it makes no difference if Mountain lad believes so or not, for Mountain lad has his own anti Kilkenny bias which I have pointed out in previous posts including his posting of the John Dalton video to prove that Kilkenny are a dirty team which he gleefully posted on another forum. Mountain lad claims to be a neutral from Waterford (not the best basis for claiming to be a neutral as far as Kilkenny are concerned) while at the same time falling back on his Tipp relatives when he wants to show how much he knows, loves and admires Tipp. The awarding of a free to Galway for a dive to draw an all Ireland final and deprive Kilkenny of a deserved win on day one, the awarding of a free to Tipp which was never a free and offer them a pot shot to win an all Ireland at Kilkenny expense and forcing us to play Cork with 14 men for an entire second half ( Henry sent of and the card subsequently rescinded)which more than likely cost us the game is simply disgraceful and a shocking standard of acceptable refereeing and for it to happen three years in a row, one would need to be blind or blinkered not to legitimately question it, and seriously question it. Brian Cody has rightly done so.
As one of the Kilkenny posters banned for making similar statements earlier I fully expect to be banned again but as far as i am concerned Mountain lad is about as neutral as the Gestapo were in WW2.
Last Sundays win was a magnificent win and probably the one we least expected at the start of the year. Conor Fogarty, Padraigh Walsh, John Power, Mark Kelly, Joey Holden, Brian Kennedy, Jonjo Farrell names barely known all played their part and it is a magnificent display of management to get us this win.

Concurred.

Martin567

robbiezero wrote: »

Can you point to a single instance where a defender sprinted 30 yards with ball in hand and clattered shoulder-first straight into the chest of a static opponent?

If that's what you think happened then Padraic Maher must have an iron chest! How is it possible that a player the size of Brian Hogan could run at speed, shoulder first, into the chest of a static opponent and yet it is Hogan who gets knocked backwards and off his feet? I didn't think it was a free to either side but if there was a shoulder to chest contact, it was surely Maher's shoulder into Hogan's chest.

Mountainlad

I am a bit like the gestapo I suppose

Point is made anyway re Cody, Brennan and generally that Barry Kelly gets unfair treatment from a fair number of Kilkenny fans (it wasn't one or two booing at the Leinster final) but I appreciate that doesn't mean all.

Cody is in the wrong with his comments today. That doesn't have any impact on his achievements as manager, they're still outstanding. But referencing his achievements doesn't excuse all conduct, I think that is lost on a few.

Either way, as I said on the day and said after the Limerick game was very impressed with Kilkenny's play and their passing in particular. Precision that was executed by nearly all their players. And a much deserved all ireland win. I'll leave it at that.