Kilkenny GAA Discussion Thread Mod Warning Post # 5885 #4894 & #5202

pmy.murphy

Fort Stranger wrote: »

Well sounds like Jackie has committed to coming back, hopefully JJ will to, that will give a good back unit for next year with the two goalies, Murphy, P Walsh, Joey, Kennedy, Joyce, Buckley, M Walsh and Conor Fogarty as options, midfield I think Fennelly will be back, possibly Rice, Fogarty or Lester, Forwards - Richie Hogan, the two Powers, TJ, Colin, Walter, Mark Kelly and JohnJoe Farrell, maybe Aylward a few more of that age plus some good minors.
Of course hopefully Henry, Tommy, Brian Hogan and Taggy will stay on for another go, The squad would look much stronger if they stayed, if they go we are still fairly solid but whether we could cope with a lot of injuries then is debatable, don't forget we were very lucky this year with Rice the only big injury!

Good to see Jackie has committed, You would hope JJ would be thinking about the 10 All Ireland medals too and matching Henry, lets hope he stays too. I do think though that we've seen the last of Henry and Tommy Walsh to be perfectly honest. Henry could not get a better time to bow out to be honest especially after all he went through last year and I think he will protect his own legacy by going now. If rumours of a bust up between Tommy Walsh and Cody are true, it may explain why we havent seen Tommy at all since he was withdrawn against Galway in the replay. How a hurler of that calibre could be left to rot on the bench for the rest of the year really is mindboggling. Tommy may not be the player he once was but by god hes still a fine hurler and is capable of making an impact thats for sure. He got on a hell of a lot of a ball against Offaly when he came on and against Galway the first day he changed the game for us and was excellent when he came on, scored a wonderful point, set up a goal and another point for Taggy. He didnt go that well in the replay when in from the start but he certainly wasnt one of the worst on the field. It has me scratching my head as to why we havent seen him since especially when he made such an impact off the bench early on. He was hurling well for his club recently too in the last round of games so you have to wonder. I think Tommy is that sort of character, I cant see him sticking around when hes not getting much of a look in. Have to say I would be very surprised to see him back next year as Id imagine Mr Cody will be trying to give lads like Ruth, Ger Aylward, Joe Lyng etc runs during the league Id imagine

hurling_lad

Grats wrote: »

As a journalist this man is being well paid. He earns a good living from writing GAA matters which includes Kilkenny and Brian Cody. None of our players or Cody get paid for providing the entertainment they have over the last number of years. The ref also gets paid as do the Sunday Game analysts which includes Donal Cusack who slated Brian Gavin last Sunday and nobody seems to care.

As a GAA volunteer Brian Cody is not answerable to journalists, analysts, commentators etc. He's doing them a favour by presenting himself for interviews so that they can earn a living. He gets nothing from it and they ought to remember that, as should the GAA.

In his long tenure as Kilkenny hurling manager he has rarely dropped his guard despite begrudgers best efforts. Unlike some County team managers he never boycotted the media and is/was always courageous in his dealing with them. Anything he said in his latest interview was a long time coming, was calculated and reflects the views of Kilkenny followers. It's a relief for us that he has finally spoken out and has our full backing.

What I expect to see happening now is that the GAA will let this issue die down, will be relieved when it does and that Cody will be accused of getting off "once more" by the begrudgers.

Brian Cody will continue to handle the situation whichever way Croke Park want it, as he has always done.

You seem to have conveniently omitted to mention that Barry Kelly is every bit as much an unpaid volunteer as Cody is. As a volunteer, he does not deserve to be slated by a high profile GAA figure at a press conference and a normal refereeing decision that he made in the course of a game being labelled as 'criminal' all over the media.

Grats

hurling_lad wrote: »

You seem to have conveniently omitted to mention that Barry Kelly is every bit as much an unpaid volunteer as Cody is. As a volunteer, he does not deserve to be slated by a high profile GAA figure at a press conference and a normal refereeing decision that he made in the course of a game being labelled as 'criminal' all over the media.

The first thing you need to do is to read posts properly before you reply and indeed quote them. I said, and it's a fact, refs get paid, Barry Kelly is a ref.

Also, nobody accused him of been a criminal all over the media. You should make an effort to read the interview. And, the media control what's printed, not the interviewee.

realdanbreen

Grats wrote: »

. I said, and it's a fact, refs get paid, Barry Kelly is a ref.

.

And Managers get 'expenses':D

hurling_lad

Grats wrote: »

The first thing you need to do is to read posts properly before you reply and indeed quote them. I said, and it's a fact, refs get paid, Barry Kelly is a ref.

Also, nobody accused him of been a criminal all over the media. You should make an effort to read the interview. And, the media control what's printed, not the interviewee.

I read your post just fine.

Intercounty managers, players and referees are all paid expenses, so Kelly and Cody are unpaid volunteers to the same extent, as I said in my post.

Also, I didn't say in my post that Barry Kelly was labelled as criminal, it was a decision that he made that Cody described, in the course of a press conference, as criminal.

Justice for the individual

citykat wrote: »

Well they say a paper never refuses ink. Who is this guy other than someone who gets paid to write for a living. What intercounty experience playing/managing has he got? Every manager IMO has the right to call these decisions as they see fit. Then let the public decide the merits of their arguments. Lord knows there's been no end of comment here. What this eejit is saying is basically everybody shut the F**k up. If you have a gripe suck it up. IMO that's akin to communism. No matter your grievance, suffer it for the greater good.

This GAA respect campaign is the greatest load of PC s***e they've ever tried to push. Aping FIFA/EUFA. Forcing guys to shake hands in this lineup is disrespectful to them, trying them like children. Most guys shake hands when they line up. Those that dont so what? Its a free country.

How about Moran asking Barry Kelly to apologise to Brian Cody? Are referees never wrong, or never to be questioned? Is there a Standards Committee for Referees, or are referees left to their own devices and never to be questioned.

Why is this issue be let to fester. There must be balance here, and there was no balance or analysis shown in that article by Moran.

If they all want Kilkenny to go away and stop winning, why not the GAA and media fund a year's holiday away for the whole panel to Barbados or similar.

Do they want Kilkenny to disappear and apologise for continually raising the bar to a higher standard and trying to belittle a genuine, committed manager's honest comment on ONE decision which could have effected the outcome of ONE match. He did not make reference to or dwell on any other calls made against Kilkenny in other matches.

"Respect and fair play" must be a two way concept.

Fwank wizzo

Think all KK supporters should try and stop rising to the bait about Barry Kelly at this stage.His wrong decisions in matches at crucial stages involving us are well documented.
The bottom line is that if they had the same experiences with that ref as we had,they wouldn't be long about giving it loads as well.
Anyway,I doubt he'll be involved with KK much in the future.And I'd have no problem with that.

dcrosskid

Grats wrote: »

And pigs can fly! I never for one moment took you seriously.

Seriously on what?

dcrosskid

Fwank wizzo wrote: »

Think all KK supporters should try and stop rising to the bait about Barry Kelly at this stage.His wrong decisions in matches at crucial stages involving us are well documented.
The bottom line is that if they had the same experiences with that ref as we had,they wouldn't be long about giving it loads as well.
Anyway,I doubt he'll be involved with KK much in the future.And I'd have no problem with that.

What happened in the Oulart Shamrock match Fwank?

When's the club scene back in action and are the Shamrocks favorites?

Mountainlad

Grats wrote: »

And again I ask the questions - why did Tipp supporters spontaneously applaud Barry Kelly off the pitch after the drawn match? Is it right for an official to respond to that applause? And why did the GAA exclude him from the replay?

I can only imagine that Brian Cody will be only too willing attend any CCCC interview! Bring it on.

You are the only person I have seen claiming that. This is next to the conclusion you jumped to about why Kelly wasn't appointed for the replay.

You say if the GAA didn't think Kelly did something wrong, why didn't
they reappoint him? Well they've given him 4 all ireland finals so they obviously rate him highly enough.

Maybe it was on foot of the complaints, like Brennan's, they decided to spare themselves the pain of having to listen to inevitable complaints about Kelly that they appointed Gavin?

There is an argument for Kelly giving the free at the end, maybe he could have let it go. But the bottom line is Gavin got the penalty decision wrong, and didn't consult his umpires. Something Kelly did, twice in the drawn game.

In any other year that would be a key decision, but not this year just because we have the farce of a penalty situation right now. But nobody cares, because Kilkenny won. And yet there is still outrage over Kelly's decision three weeks later?

gobo99

I think its obvious that there are problems with the consistency of refereeing in hurling with different interpretations and enforcement of the rules by different refs. Most refs don't favour either team however, which is the issue with Barry Kelly. Mistakes are made reffing every game which people accept, but a history of bias against one team cant and should not be accepted. The least that the supporters players and managers of any team deserve is an unbiased ref. You can say what you want about other refs but at least they try to ref both teams the same. Barry Kelly doesn't.

fed up sick and tired

Mountainlad wrote: »

You are the only person I have seen claiming that. This is next to the conclusion you jumped to about why Kelly wasn't appointed for the replay.

You say if the GAA didn't think Kelly did something wrong, why didn't
they reappoint him? Well they've given him 4 all ireland finals so they obviously rate him highly enough.

Maybe it was on foot of the complaints, like Brennan's, they decided to spare themselves the pain of having to listen to inevitable complaints about Kelly that they appointed Gavin?

There is an argument for Kelly giving the free at the end, maybe he could have let it go. But the bottom line is Gavin got the penalty decision wrong, and didn't consult his umpires. Something Kelly did, twice in the drawn game.

In any other year that would be a key decision, but not this year just because we have the farce of a penalty situation right now. But nobody cares, because Kilkenny won. And yet there is still outrage over Kelly's decision three weeks later?

The issue of the Tipp. fans applauding and Barry waving has been raised a few times already, by different posters.

They appointed Gavin because it's now customary for a different referee appointed for the replay.

The question is why he wasn't even one of the officials for the replay.

<SNIP>
And less of the smokescreening with individual decisions, please. It is not even about the standard of refereeing in general. It is about patterns of refereeing behaviour over the course of many games.

fed up sick and tired

Mod:There have been repeated warnings about calling people trolls

Can we call them functionally illiterate ?

The evidence is every bit as compelling, but I'm only asking, mind.

piuswal

realdanbreen wrote: »

Please, there really is no need to post them, thanks all the same.

Fine.

I certainly would not want to start another controversial theme.

You must be one of the lucky ones who lives in the county and has seen these displays, time and time again over the past 15 years are so.

I wonder is there any chance that Google might remap the whole county in the next few week! There'd be great promotional material in it but on the other hand it might confuse the boys from Crossmaglen and who would want to do that!

Grats

fed up sick and tired wrote: »

The issue of the Tipp. fans applauding and Barry waving has been raised a few times already, by different posters.

They appointed Gavin because it's now customary for a different referee appointed for the replay.

The question is why he wasn't even one of the officials for the replay.

Instead of trolling, why don't you do people the courtesy of reading through the thread completely.

Hunting out responses to your own posts and blurting out things that show your lack of knowledge, is just trolling.

And less of the smokescreening with individual decisions, please. It is not even about the standard of refereeing in general. It is about patterns of refereeing behaviour over the course of many games.

Thank you for reading my post.

droppingball

Pity this thread has descended into this. Such a shame we are not talking about the amazing backs we have or the workrate and finishing of our forwards, the tactical genius of our management.

I'm going to watch the game again tonight and then book the season ticket for next year.

Liam is back on the backs of the Nore lets forget about Kelly or any begrudgers and savour this win.

Grats

droppingball wrote: »

Pity this thread has descended into this. Such a shame we are not talking about the amazing backs we have or the workrate and finishing of our forwards, the tactical genius of our management.

I'm going to watch the game again tonight and then book the season ticket for next year.

Liam is back on the backs of the Nore lets forget about Kelly or any begrudgers and savour this win.

Right, here we go - favourite moment from the replay - I'll kick it off - the numerous hooks and blocks followed by Jackie's clearance and ending up with John Power's point.

droppingball

Grats wrote: »

Right, here we go - favourite moment from the replay - I'll kick it off - the numerous hooks and blocks followed by Jackie's clearance and ending up with John Power's point.

That is my favorite moment as well, seemed like the last straw for Tipperary, point was great on its own but the work from the backs must have been like daggers to the heart of tipperary, jackie was so hungry for the ball he was nearly fighting fogarty I think it was for the ball.

Reminds me lf last years league final, the passage of play before lar and jj were sent of, where Kilkenny made numerous blocks and shoulders but won a free at end of it, those passages of play are important to win.

Martin567

Mountainlad wrote: »

What did I blurt out that shows my lack of knowledge?

I don't think you know what trolling is. I am gonna say this now, he was not applauded off the field by Tipp fans. Some of these claims are just ridiculous.

I was in Section 305 of the Cusack in the drawn match and I can definitely tell you, he was!

What happened was this: As Barry Kelly and his officials were leaving the field, he was roundly booed by a large section of the Kilkenny supporters who were very unhappy with his performance. When the Tipp fans in the adjoining section heard this, they started applauding him. I thought it was more of a humorous attempt to further rile the Kilkenny fans rather than anything spontaneous based on his performance.

What Barry did next was very unwise. He looked over towards those applauding him, briefly returned the applause with his hands above his head, nodded at them and gave a thumbs up sign!

I've stayed out of this debate until now and will continue to do so. I don't believe that Barry Kelly is setting out to be biased against Kilkenny although he has given a number of horrible decisions against us in recent years. You credit him with consulting his umpires for the penalty decisions but he still got both of them wrong! The last free was ridiculous. Nevertheless, I have no doubt that refereeing an All Ireland Final is very stressful. It may well be that Kilkenny supporters' abuse of him is counterproductive and that he will then subconsciously rule against us on marginal decisions.

I've only posted since your post above was factually incorrect. Barry was applauded off by Tipp fans and he did acknowledge the applause, return it and give a thumbs up sign. That doesn't mean there is a great conspiracy. I think it was an unwise, spur of the moment thing that he probably regrets. But it did happen!

droppingball

Grats wrote: »

Right, here we go - favourite moment from the replay - I'll kick it off - the numerous hooks and blocks followed by Jackie's clearance and ending up with John Power's point.

That is my favorite moment as well, seemed like the last straw for Tipperary, point was great on its own but the work from the backs must have been like daggers to the heart of tipperary, jackie was so hungry for the ball he was nearly fighting fogarty I think it was for the ball.

Reminds me lf last years league final, the passage of play before lar and jj were sent of, where Kilkenny made numerous blocks and shoulders but won a free at end of it, those passages of play are important to win.

droppingball

Grats wrote: »

Right, here we go - favourite moment from the replay - I'll kick it off - the numerous hooks and blocks followed by Jackie's clearance and ending up with John Power's point.

That is my favorite moment as well, seemed like the last straw for Tipperary, point was great on its own but the work from the backs must have been like daggers to the heart of tipperary, jackie was so hungry for the ball he was nearly fighting fogarty I think it was for the ball.

Reminds me lf last years league final, the passage of play before lar and jj were sent of, where Kilkenny made numerous blocks and shoulders but won a free at end of it, those passages of play are important to win.

droppingball

Grats wrote: »

Right, here we go - favourite moment from the replay - I'll kick it off - the numerous hooks and blocks followed by Jackie's clearance and ending up with John Power's point.

That is my favorite moment as well, seemed like the last straw for Tipperary, point was great on its own but the work from the backs must have been like daggers to the heart of tipperary, jackie was so hungry for the ball he was nearly fighting fogarty I think it was for the ball.

Reminds me lf last years league final, the passage of play before lar and jj were sent of, where Kilkenny made numerous blocks and shoulders but won a free at end of it, those passages of play are important to win.

pmy.murphy

droppingball wrote: »

Pity this thread has descended into this. Such a shame we are not talking about the amazing backs we have or the workrate and finishing of our forwards, the tactical genius of our management.

I'm going to watch the game again tonight and then book the season ticket for next year.

Liam is back on the backs of the Nore lets forget about Kelly or any begrudgers and savour this win.

Sure what do you expect, it was the same after the league final, "neutrals" taking over the thread coming on complaining and trying to fault everything we do. I suppose were all worse off for reacting to them. Its always the same anytime we win something. People just green with jealousy come on here and try to find faults

Grats

pmy.murphy wrote: »

Sure what do you expect, it was the same after the league final, "neutrals" taking over the thread coming on complaining and trying to fault everything we do. I suppose were all worse off for reacting to them. Its always the same anytime we win something. People just green with jealousy come on here and try to find faults

Yes. And your favourite moment then?

Realt Dearg Sec

Grats wrote: »

Yes. And your favourite moment then?

My favourite moment was when Brian Cody started complaining about Barry Kelly.

Just kidding, JJ Delaney's hook on Callanan to prevent a certain goal. Timed beautifully.

Grats

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

My favourite moment was when Brian Cody started complaining about Barry Kelly.

Just kidding, JJ Delaney's hook on Callanan to prevent a certain goal. Timed beautifully.

Oh sweet lord, for a moment I thought we were off again!

Terrific moment alright. I actually have more than a few but will confine to just the one and allow others to share.

DulchieLaois

Let me add a few points here and this is from a neutral

Barry Kelly had an excellent game in the first game, let the game flowed and yet KK supporters were out and out nasty with 2-3 decisions that went against them

1 - Tipp did not complain when KK got the 2nd goal when it should have been a free out as corner back was tripped when he was rising the ball

2 - Yes, Larkin was taken out in the first half when he should had won a free, instead a free was awarded against you.

3 - Tipp got 2 penalties which was of no benefit to them in the whole match - yet KK won 2 penalties in the league final under the old rule and were use to their advantage plus KK got a point allowed when in fact, it was wide and Tipp got a legit point waived wide

4 - The Free at the end was a free, you cant charge into a guy who stands their ground, cause one knows that to go around , you could lose the ball or secondly, get penalised for over carrying.

Tipp could feel that they were hard done when KK constantly cynical fouled when they were through on goals, another penalty in the replay was given.

and yet Tipp supporters or background team are saying nothing about it all.

The winners are KK, Cody should have said nothing on the whole thing.
Let me add one more thing, all in all, the KK team and background team are the nicest people one can ever meet.
The supporters though are very loose with their tongues - always 1 sided with their views of the rules.

Martin567

DulchieLaois wrote: »

Tipp could feel that they were hard done when KK constantly cynical fouled when they were through on goals, another penalty in the replay was given.

and yet Tipp supporters or background team are saying nothing about it all.

That works both ways. Tipp got three penalties, none of which should have been penalties. Two were outside the area, the third wasn't a foul.

On Saturday last, Richie Power & Colin Fennelly were both fouled near the 20m line in the 2nd half. If they had got past the man who fouled, it would have been two fairly certain goals. Those fouls were just as cynical as the two by Kilkenny in the first match. It just wasn't as obvious as they were a few yards further out when fouled.

realweirdo

So is Cody staying or going? And realistically when would he have to make a decision at the latest? Probably in a few weeks time I'd say.

The other counties, Cork, Limerick, Clare and Tipp have caught up with KK in recent years and there's no guarantee of another AI next year. Maybe he feels its right to go at the top. But the same man never backed down from a challenge. He's a bit like Alex Ferguson, always something to prove, never satisfied to rest on his laurels.

Realt Dearg Sec

realweirdo wrote: »

So is Cody staying or going? And realistically when would he have to make a decision at the latest? Probably in a few weeks time I'd say.

The other counties, Cork, Limerick, Clare and Tipp have caught up with KK in recent years and there's no guarantee of another AI next year. Maybe he feels its right to go at the top. But the same man never backed down from a challenge. He's a bit like Alex Ferguson, always something to prove, never satisfied to rest on his laurels.

There's no guarantee of an All Ireland any year. Don't see how that's any different. He normally announces he's staying on around late October or November I think. There's been no evidence in the homecoming or the recent press conference that he has had enough. I'd expect business as usual.

dcrosskid

Martin567 wrote: »

That works both ways. Tipp got three penalties, none of which should have been penalties. Two were outside the area, the third wasn't a foul.

On Saturday last, Richie Power & Colin Fennelly were both fouled near the 20m line in the 2nd half. If they had got past the man who fouled, it would have been two fairly certain goals. Those fouls were just as cynical as the two by Kilkenny in the first match. It just wasn't as obvious as they were a few yards further out when fouled.

In fairness to Kelly he got no help from his umpires with regards to the penalties. They had the best view of the 2 the first day and advised him wrong. I actually thought at the time that Bonner was fouled last Sunday but after seeing it back I don't think it was, however I think he should have had one in the first half instead when Walsh grabbed a hold of him when he was gone through on goal.

deadybai

realweirdo wrote: »

So is Cody staying or going? And realistically when would he have to make a decision at the latest? Probably in a few weeks time I'd say.

The other counties, Cork, Limerick, Clare and Tipp have caught up with KK in recent years and there's no guarantee of another AI next year. Maybe he feels its right to go at the top. But the same man never backed down from a challenge. He's a bit like Alex Ferguson, always something to prove, never satisfied to rest on his laurels.

Have they really caught up with us? They have closed the gap alright but we are still the dominant force in Ireland.

Tom Joad

Mod: Another reminder to posters to keep it civil or face being handed cards - I don't particularly want to go down that road, particularly given that no mod actions were required on All-Ireland Final day. I have handed out cards already and will do again.

There have been repeated warnings here about backseat moderation so lets be clear - Call someone a troll - you will be carded.

Try to back seat moderate the thread - you will be carded. If you want to talk to a Mod - PM them. If you have a problem with a post - report it.

You think you were the victim of a conspiracy by the mods - start a dispute resolution process or PM the mod in question.

Set up a sock-puppet account to complain about how you were unfairly treated - you will be banned.

Carry on

realweirdo

deadybai wrote: »

Have they really caught up with us? They have closed the gap alright but we are still the dominant force in Ireland.

On the basis of the replay, KK are still ahead. However, from one year to the next its impossible to know, with injuries, retirements, etc They have caught up certainly. I don't think KK are as far ahead as they were a few years ago.

I was particularly impressed with Limerick in the semi final, and they could be an outside bet for next year.

deadybai

realweirdo wrote: »

On the basis of the replay, KK are still ahead. However, from one year to the next its impossible to know, with injuries, retirements, etc They have caught up certainly. I don't think KK are as far ahead as they were a few years ago.

I was particularly impressed with Limerick in the semi final, and they could be an outside bet for next year.

Yeah definitely looked like a very good team in the semi. But then again they lost to Cork and I wouldnt rate them that much even ignoring their semi final annihilation by Tipp. Its hard to see anyone else winning the AI besides Kilkenny at this stage. They just have that extra 5-10%. A few years ago it was about 50-60% :pac:

MfMan

deadybai wrote: »

Yeah definitely looked like a very good team in the semi. But then again they lost to Cork and I wouldnt rate them that much even ignoring their semi final annihilation by Tipp. Its hard to see anyone else winning the AI besides Kilkenny at this stage. They just have that extra 5-10%. A few years ago it was about 50-60% :pac:

Don't get too confident (or do, if you like.) Leinster final '12 was a fair dash of cold water at the time!!! Also, a middling enough Cork team showed no fear of ye in Thurles last year. Don't make the mistake of thinking ye're too far ahead. Good advice!

realdanbreen

MfMan wrote: »

Don't get too confident (or do, if you like.) Leinster final '12 was a fair dash of cold water at the time!!! Also, a middling enough Cork team showed no fear of ye in Thurles last year. Don't make the mistake of thinking ye're too far ahead. Good advice!

True,

They won't always get away with the pulling and dragging that reduced last Saturdays game to a lottery.

Grats

As a long time follower of Kilkenny I was quietly confident that we would do it this year. Cody did a brilliant job during the league and showed great courage when trying out many new players. He continued the process during the summer always focussed on a settled panel. To a large degree we are/were in transition but managed to win a title at the same time. In my opinion we are further down the road in the development of a new team than is generally appreciated. We did win this latest title without Tommy, B Hogan and to a some extent without The King. TJ Reid had already taken over the free taking duties.

I'm confident we will be up there contesting with the best again next year. The replay in 2012 took its toll in 2013. We could have a similar situation next year but with so many young players on board now there may not be a repeat of the struggles of 2013.

Realt Dearg Sec

realdanbreen wrote: »

True,

They won't always get away with the pulling and dragging that reduced last Saturdays game to a lottery.

Well, at least you tried to lose with a bit of grace, but your natural instincts eventually got the better of you. Maybe you'll do better after ye lose next year. Who knows, maybe somebody else will knock tipp out for a change? Although I know ye have been going for the five in a row...

Mountainlad

Martin567 wrote: »

I was in Section 305 of the Cusack in the drawn match and I can definitely tell you, he was!

What happened was this: As Barry Kelly and his officials were leaving the field, he was roundly booed by a large section of the Kilkenny supporters who were very unhappy with his performance. When the Tipp fans in the adjoining section heard this, they started applauding him. I thought it was more of a humorous attempt to further rile the Kilkenny fans rather than anything spontaneous based on his performance.

What Barry did next was very unwise. He looked over towards those applauding him, briefly returned the applause with his hands above his head, nodded at them and gave a thumbs up sign!

I've stayed out of this debate until now and will continue to do so. I don't believe that Barry Kelly is setting out to be biased against Kilkenny although he has given a number of horrible decisions against us in recent years. You credit him with consulting his umpires for the penalty decisions but he still got both of them wrong! The last free was ridiculous. Nevertheless, I have no doubt that refereeing an All Ireland Final is very stressful. It may well be that Kilkenny supporters' abuse of him is counterproductive and that he will then subconsciously rule against us on marginal decisions.

I've only posted since your post above was factually incorrect. Barry was applauded off by Tipp fans and he did acknowledge the applause, return it and give a thumbs up sign. That doesn't mean there is a great conspiracy. I think it was an unwise, spur of the moment thing that he probably regrets. But it did happen!

Fair enough. But you'd accept that that is totally different, as you say, to there being some sort of conspiracy. No way they'd be clapping him off if Kilkenny fans weren't booing.

And I'm not making a point of the conduct from either fans because to be honest I don't care, firm believer that every County has a few yahoos, just that the whole representation of Barry Kelly being applauded off the field is as one sided as the claim that the GAA officials didn't make Kelly an official because they 'knew he was biased against Kilkenny'.

Don't agree on the first penalty Bonner won by the way, the second one was incorrect but to be honest I think the umpires should be able to assist the ref there. Much like Gavin's mistake when there was no contact, very easy to think it was inside. Kind of worked in Kilkenny's favour in the end though to be honest, though not suggesting Tipp definitely would have won if either of those pens had been pointed.

Grats

Mountainlad - don't try to duck now that you've been caught out once more. Much as you might like to, your latest post cannot be taken in isolation to what you previously posted when you clearly and deliberately misrepresented what was posted. You clearly hadn't read the post you were criticising and you claimed to know that Barry Kelly had not been clapped off the pitch.

It's not the first time you were found out for what you really are. You try to present yourself as a genuine GAA follower when in fact your posts prove otherwise. You would be well advised now to stop your begrudgery and take yourself back to your county thread. There is no way we'll be allowing Luam down to YOU anytime soon. Get over it.

realdanbreen

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Well, at least you tried to lose with a bit of grace, but your natural instincts eventually got the better of you. Maybe you'll do better after ye lose next year. Who knows, maybe somebody else will knock tipp out for a change? Although I know ye have been going for the five in a row...

Are you saying that the game wasn't riddled with pulling and dragging?

Grats

realdanbreen wrote: »

Are you saying that the game wasn't riddled with pulling and dragging?

Nobody got injured unlike what happened to Michael Rice amongst other Kilkenny players in previous games.

Gentleman Off The Pitch

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Well, at least you tried to lose with a bit of grace, but your natural instincts eventually got the better of you. Maybe you'll do better after ye lose next year. Who knows, maybe somebody else will knock tipp out for a change? Although I know ye have been going for the five in a row...

The change in behaviour exhibited by Dan since immediately after the final seems to be common to a lot of Tipp posters. In the aftermath of the game a lot of them showed admirable graciousness and congratulated us on the win, acknowledging that Kilkenny were the better team.

Since then a lot of the same posters seem to have a change off heart and are making a huge effort to taint the win with claims that we simply fouled our way to victory. What changed? Surely Donal 'free hand' Og Cusack cannot be that successful at manipulating people's thoughts?

Grats

Gentleman Off The Pitch wrote: »

The change in behaviour exhibited by Dan since immediately after the final seems to be common to a lot of Tipp posters. In the aftermath of the game a lot of them showed admirable graciousness and congratulated us on the win, acknowledging that Kilkenny were the better team.

Since then a lot of the same posters seem to have a change off heart and are making a huge effort to taint the win with claims that we simply fouled our way to victory. What changed? Surely Donal 'free hand' Og Cusack cannot be that successful at manipulating people's thoughts?

Yeah, amusing really. And no free hands in the drawn match. And for all Cusack's forensic analysis he didn't see that Tipp had over carried 13 times in that drawn match. Mind you he made no reference to the penalty been incorrectly awarded in the replay either. Who does he think he's codding. Is it any wonder that Jimmy Barry Murphy got rid of him. Liam Sheedy appeared uncomfortable with his carry on.

Nickindublin

Hurling is a physical contact sport. Players will always naturally grab another to get advantage. It happens in all sports. Soccer Gaelic football rugby etc. So just get on with it.

Realt Dearg Sec

realdanbreen wrote: »

Are you saying that the game wasn't riddled with pulling and dragging?

Yes, it was a great game played by two hard tough teams who ask and give no quarter played in a fantastic spirit and in a way that both teams wanted and that produced fantastic hurling that one again put lat year's all Ireland in the shadows for quality and physicality.

Just because you personally can't take your beating doesn't change any of that. Note to ask you a question: are you really so blind that you think last weekend was a lottery? You genuinely couldn't see that the better team won? Because if you can't even acknowledge that then there really is no point discussing it with you. Tipp were outhurled. End of.

pmy.murphy

Grats wrote: »

Yes. And your favourite moment then?

Well I have 2 favourites, that hooking and blocking passage of play that led to John Powers point, that was quite unbelievable and Eoin Larkins class point over his shoulder out near the line that hung for what seemed like forever in the air and dropped over the bar. I feel that particular score really lifted the crowd.

pmy.murphy

realdanbreen wrote: »

True,

They won't always get away with the pulling and dragging that reduced last Saturdays game to a lottery.

Ridiculous how incredibly one sided your argument is, you would swear Tipp are completely innocent altogether. But people will only see what they want to see. Cathal Barrett is one who immediately comes to mind I can think of whos at it constantly. Thats why its called "on the edge" hurling and its used for the other team to gain an advantage. It is a mans game at the end of the day, it happens in every match to an extent, if you have a problem with it, go off and play or watch chess for yourself. Its the sheer determination and the points we put over the bar that won us the game at the end of the day. Pulling and Dragging doesnt exactly mean your going to win so if thats your way of belittling us then you have failed miserably.

Mountainlad

Grats wrote: »

Mountainlad - don't try to duck now that you've been caught out once more. Much as you might like to, your latest post cannot be taken in isolation to what you previously posted when you clearly and deliberately misrepresented what was posted. You clearly hadn't read the post you were criticising and you claimed to know that Barry Kelly had not been clapped off the pitch.

It's not the first time you were found out for what you really are. You try to present yourself as a genuine GAA follower when in fact your posts prove otherwise. You would be well advised now to stop your begrudgery and take yourself back to your county thread. There is no way we'll be allowing Luam down to YOU anytime soon. Get over it.

I just looked back and I see that you actually did ask why he wasn't included as a linesman. Apologies. But at the same time, I really don't think that is a good enough reason to be suggesting they think he did a bad job, a linesman has a pretty limited function.

Also you used the scenario Martin has explained to suggest he was biased as well and even Tipp fans think he was. I haven't seen one Tipp fan or talked to one that has suggested and the ironic applause on account of a few Kilkenny fans booing does not support the argument you're making.

Can you please highlight somewhere we actually begrudged any Kilkenny players or Cody his achievements? If you make that insinuation again I will genuinely go back and find all the times (and there are many) where I applauded Kilkenny.


Can you also please tell me what you mean 'what you really are'?


I have an issue with what Cody and Brennan have said. Maybe I have voiced it more than I should or need to but the bottom line is I think most people outside of Kilkenny think they were both out of line, particularly Brennan. Cody's was just unneccesary and bad form considering they just won an all-ireland.