Kilkenny GAA Discussion Thread Mod Warning Post # 5885 #4894 & #5202

citykat

Ballyragget through to meet the Vat. No sympathy for Ballycallan after the manner in which they treated their former manager.

paintitblack

Semi final draw for those who haven't seen it
Carrickshock v Clara
Martins v Ballyhale

Kkboy

paintitblack wrote: »

Semi final draw for those who haven't seen it
Carrickshock v Clara
Martins v Ballyhale

I haven't lived in Kilkenny for a long time so im not that close to the club scene, but St Martins always seem to be an interesting club to me. They have been one of the most consistent clubs at Senior level for decades now, had great teams in the 80's and 90's but never seemed to have many county players, the obvious exception being Eamon Morrissey. I dont know if its the fact that they are situated up the hills or something but I always got the feeling that they see themselves as slight outsiders to the rest of Kilkenny. They where always a nightmare to play at underage level when I was younger, good hurlers but tough as nails and not afraid to show it.

unrealtime

noted that Tipp played KK four times this year; Tipp drew one and lost the rest. KK won the league, Leinster and All-Ireland championships; Tipp won nothing at all. Tipp were beaten twice in the championship; KK were unbeaten. KK get 6 All Stars; Tipp get 7.

I believe that the latter fact suggests that the other half of Tipp's team are not up to a whole lot and also that Tipp have no subs of any real quality. On the other hand they suggest that the balance in KK is good and that we have a very fine panel of players. All in all not a very positive thing for Tipp even though on the face of it the fact that Tipp had more All Stars seems hardly justified on performances.

citykat

Kkboy wrote: »

I haven't lived in Kilkenny for a long time so im not that close to the club scene, but St Martins always seem to be an interesting club to me. They have been one of the most consistent clubs at Senior level for decades now, had great teams in the 80's and 90's but never seemed to have many county players, the obvious exception being Eamon Morrissey. I dont know if its the fact that they are situated up the hills or something but I always got the feeling that they see themselves as slight outsiders to the rest of Kilkenny. They where always a nightmare to play at underage level when I was younger, good hurlers but tough as nails and not afraid to show it.

They're gonna get murdered in the semi. Overachieved by getting there at all. Their best player is John Maher who must be in his late thirties by now. John Mulhall is still knocking around but he's no match winner. My memory of Muckalee is the Morans. Tough men and could play too.

dzer2

citykat wrote: »

They're gonna get murdered in the semi. Overachieved by getting there at all. Their best player is John Maher who must be in his late thirties by now. John Mulhall is still knocking around but he's no match winner. My memory of Muckalee is the Morans. Tough men and could play too.

Martins always put up a show against the Shamrocks. A team they are not afraid of but rarely beat. Its the team that had last yrs champions ran ragged for 50 minutes last yr and for some reason took John Maher out of full forward who was having a field day. They have a big catchment area leading to a split sometimes into a you and us mentality. Silly things and rumours often derail the team. Under the right manager they would be a serious outfit.

Kilkennyfella

citykat wrote: »

Ballyragget through to meet the Vat. No sympathy for Ballycallan after the manner in which they treated their former manager.

As the old saying goes, there are 2 sides to every story.

savannahkat

Who are the better equipped for senior the Vat or Ballyragget, and who would survive better in the Intermediate, the Bridge or Moincoin?.

pmy.murphy

savannahkat wrote: »

Who are the better equipped for senior the Vat or Ballyragget, and who would survive better in the Intermediate, the Bridge or Moincoin?.

Id say both Vat and Ballyragget would be both equally equipped for Senior. Nothing much between them at all and it should be a tough final to call. Both have the makings of a good Senior team. The fault I would have with both sides is that they both have dodgy goalies having seen them both this year.

As far as Junior is concerned I would say the Bridge are much better equipped than Mooncoin. They would probs be good enough to go on and have a good run in it next year perhaps even win it but its unlikely in their first year. They should win it down the line though after a few years experience of the grade but they will comfortably stay in it next year

realdanbreen

unrealtime wrote: »

noted that Tipp played KK four times this year; Tipp drew one and lost the rest. KK won the league, Leinster and All-Ireland championships; Tipp won nothing at all. Tipp were beaten twice in the championship; KK were unbeaten. KK get 6 All Stars; Tipp get 7.

I believe that the latter fact suggests that the other half of Tipp's team are not up to a whole lot and also that Tipp have no subs of any real quality. On the other hand they suggest that the balance in KK is good and that we have a very fine panel of players. All in all not a very positive thing for Tipp even though on the face of it the fact that Tipp had more All Stars seems hardly justified on performances.

I didn't realise that the all stars were selected on the basis of how Kilkenny and Tipp fare out when they meet one another?

Realt Dearg Sec

realdanbreen wrote: »

I didn't realise that the all stars were selected on the basis of how Kilkenny and Tipp fare out when they meet one another?

The things you don't realise about hurling could fill a warehouse

J DEERE

Kilkennyfella wrote: »

As the old saying goes, there are 2 sides to every story.

Care to elaborate on this?

dcrosskid

Looks like Ballyhale are the team to beat in Kilkenny again & if they get through that i'd imagine the Leinster will be between themselves and Kilmacud Crokes with an outside chance to Kilcormac. Just as an aside I had an accumulator on the weekend and Carrickshock & Crokes both let me down in normal time for what would have been a nice return.

In Tipp Sars & Loughmore are in the final & despite Sars being warm favorites I think Loughmore are hurling better atm. I can't see either team doing anything in Munster however, too many weeks hurling in a row and they will have to play Cratloe in Clare, a tough ask.

On the All Stars, Tipp were lucky to get 7 imo. We got the nod in 2 positions that I though they would have evened it out one or the other with KK. Naturally I am delighted for the Tipp lads to be getting some form of recognition after a tough year especially to my clubmate Cathal Barrett on his YHOTY, richly deserved I think everyone would agree. For me Richie Power was the most unlucky player to lose out last Friday night and imo is the main reason Kilkenny are All Ireland champions. The reality was that there was very little between Tipp & Kilkenny this year and this was reflected more or less.

savannahkat

[QUOTE= The reality was that there was very little between Tipp & Kilkenny this year and this was reflected more or less.[/QUOTE]

There was a League title, a Provincial title and an All Ireland title between them. I would think that constitutes a massive difference between them.

citykat

realdanbreen wrote: »

I didn't realise that the all stars were selected on the basis of how Kilkenny and Tipp fare out when they meet one another?

You must be delighted the professor is staying on. I know I am.

dcrosskid

savannahkat wrote: »

There was a League title, a Provincial title and an All Ireland title between them. I would think that constitutes a massive difference between them.

After 140 minutes of hurling one puck of a ball separated the 2 teams in September, I think everyone would agree there is very little between the two teams and this was obviously what I was gearing towards. Even the league final went to extra time and was won with the last puck of the game, again by a solitary score.

droppingball

Attended all four games at the weekend, none of the matches were great to be honest.

Carrickshock and the Rower was competitive but the standard of hurling was atrocious and not near as exciting as would be expected for a close match. Not many stand out performances really. Kieran Joyce in the first half at centre back, Pat Lyng also an mainly Richie Power and John Tenneson for Carrickshock. I can see Carrickshock shipping a beating this weekend

Ballyhale tore into Danesfort, I think Danesfort won the toss and elected to play against the wind, maybe someone can confirm this. That is suicide against the shamrocks and they proceeded to tear them apart with runners of the shoulder, accurate shooting and ball into space on a big pitch in the first half. Danesfort should have played with the wind tried to get something to hold on to and defend it with plenty of men behind the ball. All shamrocks forwards hurled well, henry didn't win a 50 50 ball all day but scored 6 points from play as Paul Murphy furiously worked putting out fires left right and centre.

In the intermediate Tullogher fought hard against a Mullinavat team who looked good at times but left a lot of chances behind. Willie O Dwyer seemed to be the danger man with John Walsh scoring a beauty of a point early on and saw very little ball after it. Tullogher nearly snatched it late on through sheer grit and stubborness and a late goal but the Vat men replied to Tulloghers late goal straight away to leave Tullogher devastated. Pat Hartley was outstanding throughout while Mullinavat seem to be solid throughout with no super stars. I would fancy them to win the final.

The second match was an awful game, Ballyragget just did enough to win whilst not hurling well at all. Geoff Brennan probably the stand out for them whilst Eddie Brennan was the best for a very poor Ballycallan team. I don't think I have seen a team with such bad striking and first touch in Nowlan Park in a long time, the only thing you could say was that the were very dogged and turned it into a scrap.

Hopefully there will be better fair in the Park this weekend where Clara and the Shamrocks will be favorites. Interesting to see what the Shamrocks backs will be like when they are tested.

But Cody hardly saw any new shining lights last weekend anyway. That said conditions are starting to determine the type of games being played so maybe better hurling is to much of an ask with the ground getting softer.

DoctaDee

Dan & Pmy - lads we're nearly in November and you're still at it, give it a rest - please

unrealtime

I note too that Galway got more All Stars than KK in 2012. We played them five times that year and won three and drew one. At least Galway were Leinster champions.

But I think that the same thing applied to Galway then as to Tipp now - i.e. that the rest of the players on that team and the whole Galway panel were in fact not up to much. Galway's lack of progress since attests to that. If I were a Tipp supporter I would be worried that the same thing could happen to the current Tipp squad - not enough good players on the team and nothing to bring on.

Fwank wizzo

I'd love to see the names of journalists that picked the team.
And like the all star team,I'd bet that Tipp had the biggest representation on the panel.
Along with that other big KK fan...Denis Walsh

Justice for the individual

Fwank wizzo wrote: »

I'd love to see the names of journalists that picked the team.
And like the all star team,I'd bet that Tipp had the biggest representation on the panel.
Along with that other big KK fan...Denis Walsh

Eoin Murphy, Jackie Tyrell, Conor Fogarty and Richie Power, should have made the All Stars team too - ah hell, the whole Kilkenny team should have made it, and throw in Herrity too, who had two excellent games when Murphy was injured.

Anyway, no All-Star award compensates for an All-Ireland medal, and you can bet the Tipp and Limerick guys would agree with that sentiment.

20silkcut

savannahkat wrote: »

There was a League title, a Provincial title and an All Ireland title between them. I would think that constitutes a massive difference between them.

Are you for real???

A massive difference???

Yes maybe in terms of Jersey colour or tactics or management.

But without doubt Kilkenny 2014 and Tipp 2014 were very very closely matched to say different is just being obtuse for the sake of it.

savannahkat

20silkcut wrote: »

Are you for real???

A massive difference???

Yes maybe in terms of Jersey colour or tactics or management.

But without doubt Kilkenny 2014 and Tipp 2014 were very very closely matched to say different is just being obtuse for the sake of it.

When you play a team four times competitively in a single season and fail to win even one of them I think the players may very well have something to do with it as well.

20silkcut

savannahkat wrote: »

When you play a team four times competitively in a single season and fail to win even one of them I think the players may very well have something to do with it as well.

That's cause Kk are a shade better than Tipp . The better team usually wins.
And if the better team consistently wins by a few pints then it is safe to say they are a few pints better.
But for people to say Kk are way ahead of Tipp is utter bull ****.
Ye had it up ye 're arse from Tipp plenty of times this year.

Kilkennyfella

Carrickshock and the Rower was competitive but the standard of hurling was atrocious and not near as exciting as would be expected for a close match. Not many stand out performances really. Kieran Joyce in the first half at centre back, Pat Lyng also an mainly Richie Power and John Tenneson for Carrickshock. I can see Carrickshock shipping a beating this weekend


I thought young Ciaran Ryan for The Rower was excellent. One for the future hopefully.

Justice for the individual

20silkcut wrote: »

That's cause Kk are a shade better than Tipp . The better team usually wins.
And if the better team consistently wins by a few pints then it is safe to say they are a few pints better.
But for people to say Kk are way ahead of Tipp is utter bull ****.
Ye had it up ye 're arse from Tipp plenty of times this year.

Pints? Are you talking about a drinking contest? Anyway, joking apart, indeed there was only a puck of a ball between them in three of the matches, but sure Kilkenny were seriously lucky to win them (like Brian would say it). I would leave the discussion there, and sure we'll give it another go next year and only hope our luck holds like it has for the last 13/15 years.

homeofhurling

Ballyhale will walk the kilkenny championship beating clara well in the final
dcrosskid i wouldn't agree with you on Kilmacud doing well in leinster laois winners Rathdowney- Errill will beat them, the leinster will be between offalys Kilcormac- Killoughey or Ballyhale both are way ahead of the rest in leinster.

J DEERE

20silkcut wrote: »

That's cause Kk are a shade better than Tipp . The better team usually wins.
And if the better team consistently wins by a few pints then it is safe to say they are a few pints better.
But for people to say Kk are way ahead of Tipp is utter bull ****.
Ye had it up ye 're arse from Tipp plenty of times this year.

Not much between the teams skill wise but Kilkenny have heart in abundance. A lot of Tipps big names are often found wanting on the big day. That's what separates them

mickmackey1

Southern Belle wrote: »

If it hasn't already been done I wonder would TheBiggerTheyCome like to create a KK Club All Star roll of honour?

Not gatecrashing or anything but here y'are

James Stephens - 27
Joe Hennessy 5
Fan Larkin 4
Liam O’Brien 4
Jackie Tyrell 4
Peter Barry 3
Brian Cody 2
Eoin Larkin 2
Mick Crotty
Brian McEvoy
Philly Larkin

Ballyhale Shamrocks - 24
Henry Shefflin 11
Liam Fennelly 4
Cha Fitzpatrick 3
Michael Fennelly 2
TJ Reid 2
Ger Fennelly
Colin Fennelly

Fenians - 20
JJ Delaney 7
Ger Henderson 5
Pat Delaney 2
Pat Henderson 2
Billy Fitzpatrick 2
John Henderson
PJ Ryan

Young Irelands - 13
DJ Carey 9
Charlie Carter 3
Pat O’Neill

Bennettsbridge - 12
Noel Skehan 7
Jim Treacy 2
Liam Simpson 2
Pat Lawlor

Tullaroan - 10
Tommy Walsh 9
Liam Keoghan

Glenmore - 7
Willie O’Connor 4
Christy Heffernan
Michael Phelan
Eddie O’Connor

O'Loughlin Gaels - 7
Martin Comerford 3
Andy Comerford 2
Brian Hogan 2

Carrickshock - 7
Richie Power 2
Michael Rice 2
Richie Power jr 2
Pat Dwyer

Graigue Ballycallan - 5
Eddie Brennan 4
Denis Byrne

Danesfort - 5
Paul Murphy 3
Richie Hogan 2

Rower Inistioge - 5
Eddie Keher 5

Erin's Own - 4
Mick Brennan 3
Martin Coogan

Dunnamaggin - 4
Noel Hickey 3
Eamonn Kennedy

Knocktopher /B]Blackrock,Cork[B - 4
Frank Cummins 4

St Lachtain's - 4
Michael Kavanagh 4

Dicksboro - 3
Michael Walsh 2
Cillian Buckley

Windgap - 3
Kieran Purcell 3

John Lockes - 2
John Power 2

Emeralds - 2
Derek Lyng 2

Clara
Paddy Prendergast

Thomastown
Dick O’Hara

Conahy Shamrocks
Kieran Brennan

St Martin's
Eamon Morrissey

24 Clubs, 64 Players, 172 All-Stars

unrealtime

Does anyone know what the current situation is regarding two players who I thought were certain to be stars - i.e. Richie Doyle and Ger Aylward. Are they still hurling in KK.

Miall108

unrealtime wrote: »

Does anyone know what the current situation is regarding two players who I thought were certain to be stars - i.e. Richie Doyle and Ger Aylward. Are they still hurling in KK.

Richie Doyle has struggled badly with injuries especially his hips and is a shadow of the player he once was or what he promised to be. He was dropped from the panel during the spring after a couple of rounds of the league. It remains to be seen whether he can make it back. With the injuries he has suffered, the amount of time he's been out plus the level of hurling hes playing at with his club at the moment, it seems unlikely whether he can get up to the level required again.

Ger Aylward is the same, he suffered a couple of unfortunate injuries earlier on in the season whilst playing U21 and Intermediate with his club which meant he missed Pre Season along with the Walsh Cup and most of the League and subsequently fell down the pecking order as other players took their chances. Hes still part of the extended/training panel and Id imagine he will get another crack at it next year during the Walsh Cup and League provided he stays injury free

wingbacknr5

Miall108 wrote: »

Richie Doyle has struggled badly with injuries especially his hips and is a shadow of the player he once was or what he promised to be. He was dropped from the panel during the spring after a couple of rounds of the league. It remains to be seen whether he can make it back. With the injuries he has suffered, the amount of time he's been out plus the level of hurling hes playing at with his club at the moment, it seems unlikely whether he can get up to the level required again.

Ger Aylward is the same, he suffered a couple of unfortunate injuries earlier on in the season whilst playing U21 and Intermediate with his club which meant he missed Pre Season along with the Walsh Cup and most of the League and subsequently fell down the pecking order as other players took their chances. Hes still part of the extended/training panel and Id imagine he will get another crack at it next year during the Walsh Cup and League provided he stays injury free

Both will be playing junior hurling at club level next year which may be detrimental to their chances.

Miall108

wingbacknr5 wrote: »

Both will be playing junior hurling at club level next year which may be detrimental to their chances.

Indeed but Ger aylward has the advantage of being still in and around the panel so Id imagine he will get at least one more chance, Junior Hurling may possibly hinder him depending on how long Glenmore stay Junior. Provided the Bridge win the county final I can see Glenmore coming straight back up with some of the players that they have so I cant see Ger Aylward playing Junior Hurling for too long. 5 All Ireland medal winners between the Minors and Seniors this year they had

unrealtime

thanks for that information. Injury is a curse for such young players. I would not be too pessimistic re junior players though - remember Pat Delaney, God rest him.

Miall108

unrealtime wrote: »

thanks for that information. Injury is a curse for such young players. I would not be too pessimistic re junior players though - remember Pat Delaney, God rest him.

Thats true but the gulf in class is much greater these days between Junior and the rest of the grades

wingbacknr5

Miall108 wrote: »

Indeed but Ger aylward has the advantage of being still in and around the panel so Id imagine he will get at least one more chance, Junior Hurling may possibly hinder him depending on how long Glenmore stay Junior. Provided the Bridge win the county final I can see Glenmore coming straight back up with some of the players that they have so I cant see Ger Aylward playing Junior Hurling for too long. 5 All Ireland medal winners between the Minors and Seniors this year they had

I expect the Bridge to beat Mooncoin on Sunday week and go up intermediate. This is their 3rd final in a row and I think they might finally crack it. Mooncoin will be dogged opposition though and the current wet conditions may suit them more.

No guarantee Glenmore will follow them next year, junior is a notoriously tough grade to get out of. Ballyraggett, Thomastown and Lisdowney were all promoted in recent years and are thriving at intermediate but it took them a long time to go up.

They will probably be favourites due to their county contingent but it doesn't always work like that. I saw a few of their games this year and they are very unbalanced. A couple of injuries to key players would render them very ordinary. Teams like Mooncoin, Piltown and Kilmacow will all fancy their chances if Bennettsbridge are out of the equation.

Miall108

wingbacknr5 wrote: »

I expect the Bridge to beat Mooncoin on Sunday week and go up intermediate. This is their 3rd final in a row and I think they might finally crack it. Mooncoin will be dogged opposition though and the current wet conditions may suit them more.

No guarantee Glenmore will follow them next year, junior is a notoriously tough grade to get out of. Ballyraggett, Thomastown and Lisdowney were all promoted in recent years and are thriving at intermediate but it took them a long time to go up.

They will probably be favourites due to their county contingent but it doesn't always work like that. I saw a few of their games this year and they are very unbalanced. A couple of injuries to key players would render them very ordinary. Teams like Mooncoin, Piltown and Kilmacow will all fancy their chances if Bennettsbridge are out of the equation.

Agreed I do think the Bridge will beat Mooncoin and they certainly wont get away with going missing for most of the game like they did against Galmoy. That being said Mooncoin are unlucky to be Junior having been weakened by the emigration of a couple of key players over the last few years along with the retirement of their stalwart Centre Back Eddie Mackey.

Similarly Glenmores Centre Back John Cody emigrated too and added to key injuries, players gone travelling for the summer etc, over the course of the year Glenmore found themselves in deep trouble which they could not get themselves out of in the end.

I saw them myself twice during the year and they struggled badly for scores in those games against Conahy and Tullogher during the League and were fairly unbalanced throughout the team. I do think they can bounce back if they can field their strongest side

homeofhurling

big game today tullaroan again the Fenians to see who will stay senior for next year, i think Tullaroan will win by a few points.

Miall108

homeofhurling wrote: »

big game today tullaroan again the Fenians to see who will stay senior for next year, i think Tullaroan will win by a few points.

Me too, I think they have enough in the tank to get across the line. They shouldnt even be in this situation and should have beaten Danesfort the first day.

homeofhurling

Fenians 2-3 Tullaroan o-2 20 minutes gone suprise on the cards

homeofhurling

HT Fenians 3-5 Tullaroan 0-3

phkk

2 half (21mins) Fenians 3-10 v 0-7 Tullaroan's proud senior record gone at last

Miall108

phkk wrote: »

2 half (21mins) Fenians 3-10 v 0-7 Tullaroan's proud senior record gone at last

Massive shock in Freshford. Tullaroan would have been the favourites going into this game. Rather unlucky I feel they are to be going down but thats the beauty of these games. Anything can happen on a given day.

Is this Tullaroans first time ever playing Intermediate does anyone know?

Miall108

Full Time in Freshford:

Fenians 3-10 0-8 Tullaroan.

Tullaroan would have been the heavy favourites and were rather unlucky not to beat Danesfort in the drawn game in a game they had won which would have kept them up. The scoreline is today is particularly astonishing

phkk

Miall108 wrote: »

Massive shock in Freshford. Tullaroan would have been the favourites going into this game. Rather unlucky I feel they are to be going down but thats the beauty of these games. Anything can happen on a given day.

Is this Tullaroans first time ever playing Intermediate does anyone know?

No, they won the intermediate championship in 1988 and have been senior since. For a small club with a small population, that's some record to compete at the top level for so long. How ironic that G/Ballycallan got relegated last year too after last winning the intermediate in 1987 and were followed up to senior by Tullaroan and now they've done it in reverse!!

homeofhurling

some win for the Fenians JJ hurling senior again next year

Miall108

phkk wrote: »

No, they won the intermediate championship in 1988 and have been senior since. For a small club with a small population, that's some record to compete at the top level for so long. How ironic that G/Ballycallan got relegated last year too after last winning the intermediate in 1987 and were followed up to senior by Tullaroan and now they've done it in reverse!!

It is indeed. The two rivals will meet once again next year down in Intermediate. I can see them being one of the big contenders to come back up next year along with the losers of the Vat and Ballyragget game next weekend.Unlike Ballycallan who were a team in steep decline, I do think Tullaroan have the quality to come back up at the first attempt but thats easier said than done.

phkk

Miall108 wrote: »

It is indeed. The two rivals will meet once again next year down in Intermediate. I can see them being one of the big contenders to come back up next year along with the losers of the Vat and Ballyragget game next weekend.Unlike Ballycallan who were a team in steep decline, I do think Tullaroan have the quality to come back up at the first attempt but thats easier said than done.

I think Tullaroan will be there or thereabouts next year with players like Tommy Walsh, Padraig Walsh, Martin Walsh, Paul Buggy, Stephen Maher and know they have good young hurlers coming through in the other Tommy Walsh and Martin Keoghan so they'll have to look to the future with optimism

savannahkat

homeofhurling wrote: »

some win for the Fenians JJ hurling senior again next year

Delighted for JJ. In my opinion the best hurler Kilkenny ever produced. No disrespect to any of the great players who played with him or went before him. As another poster has said Tullaroan are good enough to come straight back up which may not have been necessarily true for the Fenians.

Miall108

savannahkat wrote: »

Delighted for JJ. In my opinion the best hurler Kilkenny ever produced. No disrespect to any of the great players who played with him or went before him. As another poster has said Tullaroan are good enough to come straight back up which may not have been necessarily true for the Fenians.

Either way you have to be sad for Tommy Walsh too but I can see him playing Senior Hurling once again before his career is over. Thats prob the difference, if Fenians went down, they were probably staying down