Driver Ignorance

TheChizler

The bus lane line doesn't count as a continuous white line, in the sense that you can't cross it except when facing an obstruction or for access. If you go to the S.I. outlining the laws behind each line they have different rules behind them, the regular continuous has the meaning described above, while the bus lane line acts merely as a separator. Therefore you can cross into a bus lane at any point as long as the time is ok. I however do agree that the right hand lane has precedence while merging, that's blindingly obvious.

Chuck Stone

TheChizler wrote: »

The bus lane line doesn't count as a continuous white line..

You should really back that up because it's not what the RSA say below:

Where there is a bus lane, you will see an upright blue and white sign on the side of the road on a pole and on the roadway there will be markings of a continuous white line and the words "Lána Bus". You must obey the road marking and the sign.

http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/traffic-signs-road-markings/buses.html

TheChizler

Chuck Stone wrote: »

You should really back that up because it's not what the RSA say below:

S.I. trumps RSA! :-D

Surely that means you observe it in that you don't cross in while the bus lane is operating. I'll have a look for the law there and get back.

TheChizler

The law for bus lanes:

Road Traffic (Traffic and Parking Regulations), 1997, (S.I. No. 182/1997) wrote:

Bus Lanes
32. (1) A bus lane shall be indicated by means of traffic sign number RUS 028 or traffic sign number RUS 029 used in association with traffic sign number RRM 024, and a contra flow bus lane shall be indicated by means of traffic sign number RUS 030 used in association with traffic sign number RRM 024.

(2) A person shall not enter a bus lane with a vehicle other than an omnibus or a pedal cycle during the period of operation of the bus lane which shall be indicated on an information plate.

where sign no. RPM 024 is defined as;

Road Traffic (Signs) Regulations, 1997, (S.I. No. 181/1997) wrote:

Bus Lane.
27. (1) Traffic sign number RRM 024 shall, in association with traffic sign number RUS 028, RUS 029 or RUS 030, indicate a bus lane.

(2) The sign to which sub-article (1) refers shall consist of—

(a) a continuous white line, or lines, 250 millimetres wide, save where one edge of the bus lane coincides with the centre line of a roadway between the bus lane and an adjoining traffic lane; and
(b) lettering consisting of the words "BUS LÁNA", the dimensions and design of which shall be as set out in the diagram contained in section 4 of the Seventh Schedule.

The former makes only one reference to crossing continuous white lines not being allowed, which refers to a differently defined line (RRM 001):

Road Traffic (Traffic and Parking Regulations), 1997, (S.I. No. 182/1997) wrote:

Centre of Roadway Lines
25. (1) Where traffic sign number RRM 001 [continuous white line] has been provided on a roadway or where two such traffic signs are provided in parallel, a driver shall not cross that sign or signs.

where RRM 001 is defined as:

Road Traffic (Signs) Regulations, 1997, (S.I. No. 181/1997) wrote:

Centre of Roadway .
11. (1) The following traffic signs may be provided along the centre of a roadway:—

(a) traffic sign number RRM 001—a continuous white line approximately 100 or 150 millimetres wide and extending not less than 20 metres along the centre of the roadway,

In summary; it is an offence to cross a continuous white line of width 100-150 mm, but over that you're off the hook!

Solair

I just parked in a shopping centre car park and carefully ensured that I was in the centre of the space.

The lady beside me got out of her car, threw the back door open, whacked it into my paintwork (while I was in the car).

I gave her a bit of a 'look of horror' and she started going on about how "I shouldn't park so ****ing close to her car" and how "I have to get my shopping out of the door."

No damage done, but people seem to just have some ridiculous 'attitude' sometimes. She basically dinged my correctly parked car and then got aggressive with me!!

It's not even a shopping centre with particularly tight spaces either.
Some of the older multi-stories in Cork City seem to have been designed for 1970s minis or something.

astronut

I really hope you had something to say to her. That would drive me crazy :mad:

Solair

astronut wrote: »

I really hope you had something to say to her. That would drive me crazy :mad:

I spent a while looking for the mark and discussing how expensive panel beaters are and let her sweat for a while...

Not stooping to the being a complete **** but I made my point.

Chuck Stone

TheChizler wrote: »

In summary; it is an offence to cross a continuous white line of width 100-150 mm, but over that you're off the hook!

Would I be right in saying that you're coming to the above conclusion because there is no specific law against crossing a broad continuous white line (CWL) but there is in the case of a regular white line? So it's not so much that it's fine to cross a bus lane CWL - more that you'd get 'off the hook' for it?

Are all bus lane CWL's broad? Seems as clear as mud. They'd be better off making a little dash in the bus CWL every ten meters or w/e to indicate that people can indeed cross it outside the bus priority times although that would probably encourage people to do it all the time.

Gah!

Edit: Thanks for taking the time btw.

TheChizler

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Would I be right in saying that you're coming to the above conclusion because there is no specific law against crossing a broad continuous white line (CWL) but there is in the case of a regular white line? So it's not so much that it's fine to cross a bus lane CWL - more that you'd get 'off the hook' for it?

Are all bus lane CWL's broad? Seems as clear as mud. They'd be better off making a little dash in the bus CWL every ten meters or w/e to indicate that people can indeed cross it outside the bus priority times although that would probably encourage people to do it all the time.

Gah!

[SIZE="1"]Edit: Thanks for taking the time btw.[/SIZE]

I came to that conclusion based on the fact that the law states that crossing an exactly specified line wasn't allowed and does not state that crossing a bus lane line, which it specifies as different line entirely, is not allowed.

quietsailor

hoodwinked wrote: »

yes but look at the newly painted road markings they very clearly show the bus lane is the one filtering into traffic....even though technically the lane is right in front of them traffic in the right lane has the right of way going by the road markings.

i have seen buses stop before filtering in yet cars in the bus lane seem to ignore the road markings....

Aha, so they've gone and changed it completely then, I must go for a drive down that road some time and see what they've done, I live nearby but rarely use the Wilton R/about - Dennehys cross road, I can get where I wany usually without travelling it.

Is there any sign up before the junction to give the filtering direction, I drive Cork/Limerick and Cork/Bandon roads a lot and I've noticed 2 new different types of signs for merging points, Outside gives way to inside lane or vice versa, it depends on the road shape, the way you describe it it should be a unside giving way to outside sign

quietsailor

I drove down that road last night with a learner driver - they're practicing with me - and that's a godawful junction. There is no sign before it to indicate the merging convention that I could see. All there is is a set of dotted white line, which, in the busy rush hour traffic that is usually on that road will be obscured so bit lanes will think they have priority.

My L driver honestly would have had to stop and carefully read the junction to see what was correct and that's no good, you can'y stop at every junction to descipher the correct lane priorities.

TheChizler

They could really do with a yield sign all right! Anyone with me for emailing the council?

Milly33

Solair wrote: »

I just parked in a shopping centre car park and carefully ensured that I was in the centre of the space.

The lady beside me got out of her car, threw the back door open, whacked it into my paintwork (while I was in the car).

I gave her a bit of a 'look of horror' and she started going on about how "I shouldn't park so ****ing close to her car" and how "I have to get my shopping out of the door."

No damage done, but people seem to just have some ridiculous 'attitude' sometimes. She basically dinged my correctly parked car and then got aggressive with me!!

It's not even a shopping centre with particularly tight spaces either.
Some of the older multi-stories in Cork City seem to have been designed for 1970s minis or something.

Had this one time in Wilton shopping Centre some snotty woman with her daughter. Two of them as stuck up and anything whacked open the door and when I got out to look she was all well its your fault.. I was parked in the car in line, well before she parked her car..Muppets.

Milly33

TheChizler wrote: »

They could really do with a yield sign all right! Anyone with me for emailing the council?

We drove through this last night, and only for himself as he drives to work that way and back every day, I wouldnt have known what to do. We were coming from Ballincollig and heading straight all the way. That junction that splits in two lanes is rather confusion, fine there are bollards up but it doesnt really tell you what to do

hoodwinked

Milly33 wrote: »

We drove through this last night, and only for himself as he drives to work that way and back every day, I wouldnt have known what to do. We were coming from Ballincollig and heading straight all the way. That junction that splits in two lanes is rather confusion, fine there are bollards up but it doesnt really tell you what to do

we're on about coming up to dennehys cross from the wilton side there are no bollards :pac:


but yes that part is confusing too, ive seen people go down the wrong lane there so many times.

hedgehog21

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Was waiting to get on a 207 at the top of Patrick St tonight. There was already a 205 at the stop and the 207 tried to pull in behind, but couldn't.

There was also an '01 Audi parked at the bottom of the stop, preventing the 207 from pulling in completely.

Bus driver tried to get the Audi to move from the stop, but the car wouldn't move. So the bus driver got out, and gave the Audi driver (smartly dressed young woman) what for.

The reason? There was a lady in a wheelchair who wanted to get on the bus, but couldn't as the bus could not pull into the stop.

Guess what the driver did? He made the Audi driver get out of her car and apologise to the lady in the wheelchair!

Fair play to the man. And shame on the ignorant ***** for being too selfish and lazy to find somewhere to park properly!

I'd love to know which driver that was as my dads a bus driver. I'd love to shake that mans hand, too often people think cause they have a fancy car they own the road

hoodwinked

hedgehog21 wrote: »

too often people think cause they have a fancy car they own the road

Fyp

hedgehog21

hoodwinked wrote: »

Fyp

Fair point :P

hoodwinked

another thing on driver ignorance, if you are driving into Tesco Douglas's car park PLEASE STOP PARKING IN THE FIRST 15 SPACES ON EITHER SIDE when you get up the ramp in fact if you park upstairs you are closer to the lifts and safer and not holding up half of douglas you ignorant halfwits! :mad:


Sorry, place drives me mad when the ramp gets all backed up when some idiot feels they have to grab the first space they see and spend the next 5 minutes trying to park there....

or worse see's people getting into the car and waits for them to leave...


its not like that place is ever full.

mikeym

What pisses me off the most is people cutting in during rush hour traffic.

Its pure ignorant and they think that the indicator is their right of way.

cantdecide

mikeym wrote: »

What pisses me off the most is people cutting in during rush hour traffic.

Its pure ignorant and they think that the indicator is their right of way.

The lower rd for example:rolleyes: It's the good samaritans who let them in thus encouraging them to do it every day that bother me...

the beer revolu

cantdecide wrote: »

The lower rd for example:rolleyes: It's the good samaritans who let them in thus encouraging them to do it every day that bother me...

Why, oh why, oh why do people always let these fcukers in?

hoodwinked

cantdecide wrote: »

The lower rd for example:rolleyes: It's the good samaritans who let them in thus encouraging them to do it every day that bother me...

yup or in wilton coming on to the sarsfield roundabout! if they were't cutting in the traffic would be moving alot faster! :mad:

Chuck Stone

Although I agree that, on the whole, letting people cut in only encourages that type of behaviour I sometimes give a driver the benefit of the doubt that they've made a mistake, gotten confused with the layout, or might be from out of town.

If anyone tries to intimidate their way in I'll be a lot less accommodating though.

quietsailor

hoodwinked wrote: »

yup or in wilton coming on to the sarsfield roundabout! if they were't cutting in the traffic would be moving alot faster! :mad:

What confuses the living **** out of me is that if they stayed in the RH lane from Wilton down onto the Sarsfield roundabout they can get onto the N40 towards the tunnell where there is a set of lights ie they don't have to merge. It's actually signposted by the NRA this way -- admittedly after the LH & RH lanes diverge but it's visible from the LH lane.

Why take the harder route to joining the main road??

cantdecide

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Although I agree that, on the whole, letting people cut in only encourages that type of behaviour I sometimes give a driver the benefit of the doubt that they've made a mistake, gotten confused with the layout, or might be from out of town.

If anyone tries to intimidate their way in I'll be a lot less accommodating though.

I think it's often easy enough to spot the difference but I do agree.

the beer revolu

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I sometimes give a driver the benefit of the doubt that they've made a mistake, gotten confused with the layout, or might be from out of town.

Funny how confused people always just happen to join the short queue by mistake!

Hogzy

hoodwinked wrote: »

another thing on driver ignorance, if you are driving into Tesco Douglas's car park PLEASE STOP PARKING IN THE FIRST 15 SPACES ON EITHER SIDE when you get up the ramp in fact if you park upstairs you are closer to the lifts and safer and not holding up half of douglas you ignorant halfwits! :mad:


Sorry, place drives me mad when the ramp gets all backed up when some idiot feels they have to grab the first space they see and spend the next 5 minutes trying to park there....

or worse see's people getting into the car and waits for them to leave...


its not like that place is ever full.

^^^
THIS!!!!!!

I think Tesco should close off those bloody spaces and when traffic starts to build up inside the car park then an attendant should open the 15 spaces which would instantly remove the traffic back log.
90% of the time I go into that Tesco there are carpark attendants there anyway. They do feck all tbh.

Shenshen

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Although I agree that, on the whole, letting people cut in only encourages that type of behaviour I sometimes give a driver the benefit of the doubt that they've made a mistake, gotten confused with the layout, or might be from out of town.

If anyone tries to intimidate their way in I'll be a lot less accommodating though.

This.
While I'm not from out of town, I have only been driving in Cork for about a year now. And I have to admit that I sometimes do find it stressful figuring out which lane I will need to be in, especially in heavy traffic when I can't see what's painted on the road. I do wish they'd put up more sinage instead of insisting a bit of official graffiti is sufficient.

Max_Charger

hoodwinked wrote: »

yup or in wilton coming on to the sarsfield roundabout! if they were't cutting in the traffic would be moving alot faster! :mad:

People still haven't copped that if they stayed in the right hand lane down to the roundabout and just turned left at the lights, it's far faster then staying in the clogged up left lane waiting at the stop sign.