Your opinion.

wylam

Just a post to clarify what a bouncer can and can't do.

First of all a bouncer has no more power than the normal person walking down the street.The only real weapon they have is to refuse entry, as the premises they work at has the right to refuse admission.So they are basically an extension of the internal staff.When i worked as a barman we had no door staff, which meant that the person was already inside and at the bar counter before we could refuse them.This made life extremely difficult and stressful for the bar staff who were then required to remove the person from the premises.After the PSA license came in it made it virtually impossible for bar staff to do this as you left yourself open to all types of legal action.

If a bouncer asks you to leave the premises for a minor incident you have the right to refuse.The bouncer can put his hand on your back and direct you to the exit, this does not constitute assault.If you threaten , spit or hit the bouncer they have the right to defend them selves which includes removal by force and or restraint.If you act in a calm manner and do not react and you are still removed by force and or restrained you can bring a case for assault.The key thing is to remain calm(easier said than done)But this will be invaluable to your case should you bring it.

If a bouncer refuses you entry they must give a valid reason, if you are not happy with this reason then remain calm and go look for a garda (if u can)They are not required to provide their name but their license number should be displayed on their PSA card which should be in plain view.The key thing here is to remain calm, if a garda see's a frantic guy or girl coming towards them complaining about a doorman they probably wont do much for you.But i have seen garda to walk to the door and instruct the door man to leave the person in.

A lot of the problem's encountered on the door can be sorted easily if people remain calm, that goes for the door man just as well as the person looking to gain entry.

wylam

I started this thread to try and gain more of an understanding of how bouncers are viewed and what we can do to try and change peoples perception of us.Contrary to what some of the posters believe, our ranks are not filled with failed mma psychopaths, that are like predators waiting to pounce on innocent and unsuspecting punters while they sit quietly trying to enjoy a pint.What you will actually find if you ever did any real research into it, is that after people start door work they then find they need to do some kind of martial art in order to defend themselves.The way some of the posters view us sounds like the dirty harry films "go ahead punk , make my day".Bouncers need to be able to defend themselves simply because we dont know who we are going to meet on a nightly basis.being able to defend yourself is all fine and well when you're 1 on 1 with a guy , when it comes to the night when you're faced with 2 ,3 ,4,5 guys all looking to knock your teeth in is when you run into trouble.Being able to subdue 1 man and restrain him on the ground isn't going to work when his 3 friends are kicking the crap out of you while you do it.This is where the need for some kind of offensive martial art is required.I do not practice any kind of offensive martial arts myself.

I'd like to see the ordinary punter educate themselves on what the laws of the country are.Get to know your rights what people can do to you and what they can't do. The power of knowlage is worth alot more than any amount of martial arts training.There will always door staff that are below par and make bad decisions, but I garauntee these would be few and far between if people knew the proper course of action to take when dealing with this kind of person.

SteelyDanJalapeno

I've been living in Cork with a few years now, and have been regularly going out to pubs and clubs with the last 7 years, I'd like to think I've had enough exposure at this stage to give a decent opinion on the matter.

Back when I was 18 - 21 I wasn't sure how much drink I could handle and probably drank too much most of the time I went out, this is also partly due to being a student and drinking as much as possible before you go will save you some money in the long term, I was refused entry a fair number of times back down for the "you've had too much pal" and even though I disagreed at the time, and I know my own character that I was much less of a danger than others that were going in, I still believe now looking back on it that they were right to refuse entry on the occasions they did as I probably did have too much. On the other occasions when I was clearly in a better state and still refused entry, I took it on the chin, politely commented about it, "Fair enough, maybe tomorrow night" and I was often ushered in after this.

But now at the ripe old age of 25, I don't ever have problems with bouncers, bar maybe once or twice in the last few years when I clearly was too drunk.

Milly33

Ah bouncers!! I for one have no problem with them normally, they are there as you say to judge if you are not sober enough or well I suppose in the right form to be in the bar/nightclub. It makes for a better evening for all.. The part about clothing etc and tats I dont like as everyone if differant just because they dont stand to the norm does not mean they should be refused entry to a place, altough most of the places that do this kinda of a thing you know about already so you can either fit their bill or go somewhere else. I defo have to add though that the bouncers in Reardons/havana browns are some arseholes on a major powertrip and have been for many a year. The last and final time i went in there was before Christmas last year, and after last orders and the lights coming on I noticed my friend had gone. Me thinking she had gone outside went out to see if I could find her (now she was after a fair few so I was worried). No sign outside so going to head back in the bouncer stopped me saying na Youve had Enough". I replied saying that i was just going back in to look for a friend and told him way, he said no not a hope. I went to the other bouncer saying in fairness what was i going to do the place had stopped serving and that even if one could come with me if they were that worried. and got a shower of abuse back from him. You could sense the fecking powertrip off them.. I asked could I speak to a person in charge and was told where to go... So this kinda crap I hate but then Reardons is well known for it - I hope that is not where you work :P

wylam

Just to reply to a few points.When i started going out in town myself 16-20 years old , if you were not wearing black shoes, jean/trousers and a shirt you were refused point blank.I think things have progressed since then.The wearing of runners is now more of a fashion thing and more and more places are accepting them.I personally will allow the more dressy type runners but i'll will still refuse some one with Nike air max and other type's of similar fashion..Also with ref. to tattoo's these like the runners have become more of a fashion thing, 20 years ago only big hairy biker types had tattoo's and there was a certain stigma attached to them.I am pretty easy going when it comes to tat's as i have some my self so i don't cast any aspersions on the persons character by them having a few tat's.

Just on your final point about not being let back in.The club / pub have 30 mins after last call to empty the premises ,if a garda walks into the club/pub after this time and there are people still inside, the premises can face prosecution , fine's and even closure for up to a week.No premises these days can afford this and it could lead to the place being shut down.So you can imagine the pressure the doorstaff are being put under by management to clear the place.Once people are out they usually tend to keep them out.But the shower of abuse was unwarented a not called at all.

Milly33

Fair point about the clubs/bars being fined, but I would have been a lot quicker getting her out of there thant they were.. It is a shame that Cork bouncers do have a bad name but then if they get away with it what do u do

mr bungle.

there seemed to be as many people taking the piss because you were from cork rather than you being a bouncer in the AH thread

wylam

@Mr bungle.I dont mind people that know me taking the piss and having a bit of craic. But when you put up a post about something that is quite a serious issue, only to have total strangers post mindless rubbish "crap threads forum" "Cock-cork forum" and to have someone say that you are a worse than a war criminal because of the job that you do. Its that kind of thing that irritates me to no end.It just show's everyone the attitude's of the people we deal with every night.I'd love for anyone to stand at a door for one night and witness the kind of stuff we have to deal with , there wouldn't be so many smart ass comments then.

wylam

As an earlier poser said , one of the main problems is recruitment.There are stricter checks for taxi drivers than bouncers.All the info you need to supply is name, age, d.o.b and a garda signed form to say you have not had any convictions that is basically it.And even that can be bypassed , even if you still have a conviction ( an assault conviction) you can still get a license depending on the mitigating factors of you conviction.

In my opinion no one with a conviction for any kind of violent conduct should ever get a license to work in this industry.Also i think there should be some kind of psych evaluation as part of an overall interview to make sure the applicants dont have any underlying violent tendency's or racist views.The application and training you receive to get your license is open to all sorts of abuse the way it is set up.And like everything in this country if there is an easy way out people will take it.

wylam

Can we put this post to bed or has anyone got anything further to add to it?Some of the replies i made went unanswered do those posters still have issue's or was my reply sufficient?

Cheers.