Can my boss force me to go outside in the rain?

ellybabes

I work on a very large campus, where all the office buildings, except one, are joined by internal corridors. I have recently been moved to the one building not joined to the others, that is a 5-7 min walk away from the rest. My manager is insisting on me going from this building to the others for specific meetings, even in the most inclement weather. Driving is not realistic, as by the time I've walked to my car, I'm half way there, and there's no guarantee of parking near the other building.

I am a permanent employee and my contracts were signed well before this new building existed. Do I have any rights to refuse to go outside when it's lashing down / snowing?

Avasa

Buy an umbrella...

Corkbah

ellybabes wrote: »

I work on a very large campus, where all the office buildings, except one, are joined by internal corridors. I have recently been moved to the one building not joined to the others, that is a 5-7 min walk away from the rest. My manager is insisting on me going from this building to the others for specific meetings, even in the most inclement weather. Driving is not realistic, as by the time I've walked to my car, I'm half way there, and there's no guarantee of parking near the other building.

I am a permanent employee and my contracts were signed well before this new building existed. Do I have any rights to refuse to go outside when it's lashing down / snowing?

Does your contract specify which building you are to work from or does it say you are an employee and must do what we say ?

Triangla

Plus one on buy an umbrella.

Time yourself getting there so make sure to factor this time into putting meetings into calendar.

Wait until sunny days, you'll be delighted.

ellybabes

Corkbah, it doesn't specify what building - if it did, there would have needed to be updates in the last few years, as they've moved me several times to different buildings. It may have something about the "being an employee and doing what we say", but I'll have to dig it out and re-read it tonight.

ellybabes

Triangla wrote: »

Plus one on buy an umbrella.

Time yourself getting there so make sure to factor this time into putting meetings into calendar.

Wait until sunny days, you'll be delighted.

It's not as simple as buying an umbrella, even with that my trousers get soaked walking across.

I do plan most of my days so that I group my meetings into one end of the campus or another, and head out well in advance when there's a break in the showers, but today the rain / snow didn't let up for 2 hours straight.

Today's meeting is a "mandatory" one for my team, and when I expressed that I didn't want to go outside in the current weather, I was told I had no choice.

StompToWork

If the company was decent, they would provide a supply of umbrellas at each entrance/exit for use between buildings. That's what our company does, and nobody has a problem with it.

tatli_lokma

Buy a pair of welly's that will go over your trousers. Lots of nice wellys now a days, not all of them are the red or yellow ones from our childhood. Some of them look really nice. Carry your shoes, stick on wellys, trousers covered, feet warm and dry, get to other building, swap shoes.

You live in Ireland - it rains.

Corkbah

I dont want to be rude but have you considered quitting ?

if you are not willing to travel a little bit in the outdoors to get to a meeting you seriously need to look at yourself in terms of your work ethic....do you tell your boss you cant make it into work when it snows ? or is icy on the roads ?

there are hundreds/thousands of people who are possibly qualified to do your job and they cannot get a job, I work in a job where I'm outdoors at some part of the day - every day!! and basically if I don't work, I don't earn money....I've stood out in the rain, sleet, snow, freezing temperatures (I think we had -12, -15 about 2/3 years ago) and strong northerly winds.

Working is not a right, its a privilege .... you can very easily walk away from your job and you don't have to go out in the rain/sleet/snow/wind for those 5/7mins ever again !!

Maybe I have a strong work ethos because I was unemployed for a period during the boom years (2003/2004 ...for about 6months) .... maybe I have issues with people who have a sense of entitlement !! .... either way .... its your job, if you don't want to do part of your job that your boss says you need to do ...your alternative is quitting or putting up with it and wait for the good weather !!

would you be complaining if it was not raining/sleet/snowing ???

It's rain, despite what the grown ups told us when we were kids - we will not catch pneumonia. I work in an office away from the main building, I walk several times a day for meetings, or even just to get tea, I've been doing it for 4.5 years and I'm still alive.

Avasa's suggestion of an umbrella is the best advice you're going to get. I honestly think complaining about walking for a few minutes in the rain is entirely unreasonable.

ellybabes

Corkbah wrote: »

I dont want to be rude but have you considered quitting ?

if you are not willing to travel a little bit in the outdoors to get to a meeting you seriously need to look at yourself in terms of your work ethic....do you tell your boss you cant make it into work when it snows ? or is icy on the roads ?

there are hundreds/thousands of people who are possibly qualified to do your job and they cannot get a job, I work in a job where I'm outdoors at some part of the day - every day!! and basically if I don't work, I don't earn money....I've stood out in the rain, sleet, snow, freezing temperatures (I think we had -12, -15 about 2/3 years ago) and strong northerly winds.

Working is not a right, its a privilege .... you can very easily walk away from your job and you don't have to go out in the rain/sleet/snow/wind for those 5/7mins ever again !!

Maybe I have a strong work ethos because I was unemployed for a period during the boom years (2003/2004 ...for about 6months) .... maybe I have issues with people who have a sense of entitlement !! .... either way .... its your job, if you don't want to do part of your job that your boss says you need to do ...your alternative is quitting or putting up with it and wait for the good weather !!

would you be complaining if it was not raining/sleet/snowing ???

No, I've not considered quitting. This is the first time this issue has raised it's head in years. When I was previously based in a remote building, the meetings all took place in that building.

As for when it rains / snows / etc on the roads, I leave extra time to get to work, and if I'm late I more than make up the hours.

Please don't question my work ethic based on 2 or 3 posts on Boards.ie, you've no idea what I've gone through in the last 10 years to stay in work, and keep my family/house running. I chose a career path that meant office work, because I'm not cut out for outdoor work. If I spend too much time outdoors, or get wet and can't dry out, then I get sick easily, and that's much worse for my boss, as I'd have to take time off to recover.

I appreciate all your suggestions and those of the others that have posted, but I was simply trying to find out the answer to one question - does my boss have the right to MAKE me go outside in inclement weather?

Ash.J.Williams

how far are you from your transport? What if it's raining in the evening after work? Or in the morning on the way?

ellybabes

Deleted User wrote: »

It's rain, despite what the grown ups told us when we were kids - we will not catch pneumonia. I work in an office away from the main building, I walk several times a day for meetings, or even just to get tea, I've been doing it for 4.5 years and I'm still alive.

Avasa's suggestion of an umbrella is the best advice you're going to get. I honestly think complaining about walking for a few minutes in the rain is entirely unreasonable.

It may be true that it has done you no harm, but the multiple times I've been sick in my life because of it, means my circumstances are different. I've been punished in my annual reviews for "taking too much sick time" in the past, so I'm really trying to avoid it.

You may be believe that what I'm asking is unreasonable, but I wasn't asking for comment on it, I was just asking if anyone knew the legal position.

ellybabes

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

how far are you from your transport? What if it's raining in the evening after work? Or in the morning on the way?

Not part of the question I am asking, not relevant to the discussion.

ellybabes

ellybabes wrote: »

You may be believe that what I'm asking is unreasonable, but I wasn't asking for comment on it, I was just asking if anyone knew the legal position.

If you refuse to do your job on unreasonable grounds, then you could end up in disciplinary meetings and ultimately lose your job.

Corkbah

ellybabes wrote: »

No, I've not considered quitting. This is the first time this issue has raised it's head in years. When I was previously based in a remote building, the meetings all took place in that building.

As for when it rains / snows / etc on the roads, I leave extra time to get to work, and if I'm late I more than make up the hours.

Please don't question my work ethic based on 2 or 3 posts on Boards.ie, you've no idea what I've gone through in the last 10 years to stay in work, and keep my family/house running. I chose a career path that meant office work, because I'm not cut out for outdoor work. If I spend too much time outdoors, or get wet and can't dry out, then I get sick easily, and that's much worse for my boss, as I'd have to take time off to recover.

I appreciate all your suggestions and those of the others that have posted, but I was simply trying to find out the answer to one question - does my boss have the right to MAKE me go outside in inclement weather?

and like I posted in my first response to you - check your contract, its more than likely you are an employee so must do what you are told, as whoopsydaisy has said 5-7mins of outdoors (regardless of the weather) is not going to kill you and the likelihood it will make you sick is fairly slim.

Best thing you can do is invest in rain gear (ie. umbrella, rain proof pants and jacket) and leave them in work for when you need to go out in the nasty bad weather.

if you happen to get sick from travelling 5-7mins in rain I would suggest you ensure that your boss knows it was because you were out in the rain for a few mins (although personally I think you will quickly find yourself on the unemployment line if you constantly get sick when exposed to the elements for a few mins a day)

What do you do for your lunch ?? stay indoors ?? how do you travel to and from your car ?? its pretty much the same thing.

tatli_lokma

Ash J.Williams asks a valid point - how do you keep your trousers dry and avoid the dreaded sickness getting to/from your car? You have said walking to your car is practically half the journey already, so when it's raining how do you keep your poor feet and trousers dry?

Seriously, buy a waterproof jacket and a pair of wellys and a brolly - suck it up.

Legally do you not have a soggy leg to stand on!

The best you can hope for is maybe to ask your employer to cover the cost of the above items.

Duggys Housemate

ellybabes wrote: »

It may be true that it has done you no harm, but the multiple times I've been sick in my life because of it, means my circumstances are different. I've been punished in my annual reviews for "taking too much sick time" in the past, so I'm really trying to avoid it.

You may be believe that what I'm asking is unreasonable, but I wasn't asking for comment on it, I was just asking if anyone knew the legal position.

The legal position is you have to work in the Offices they provide, and be prepared to travel to other offices of the company across the country and world within reason if your job demands it. At least that is my contract, which is standard. . I can't see it being an illegal contract.

zoobizoo

Someone once said that there's no such thing as bad weather.... only bad clothing.

I hate getting wet but 5 - 7 minutes is nothing in the rain if you have a large gold umbrella, a decent long coat and decent shoes.

You can always leave a spare set of shoes, socks and trousers in the office for when you do get wet.

You say that you'd be at your car in 3 mins or so and presumably you don't have an issue with getting from your car into the office when it rains. I'm not sure why another 3 mins on top of that has you so aggrieved. I also think that in work we need to choose our battles.

It rarely rains that torrentially in Ireland.

How many of these meetings might you have a week?

tatli_lokma

ellybabes wrote: »

Not part of the question I am asking, not relevant to the discussion.

:rolleyes: of course it's relevant!

Corkbah

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

how far are you from your transport? What if it's raining in the evening after work? Or in the morning on the way?

ellybabes wrote: »

Not part of the question I am asking, not relevant to the discussion.

its completely relevent !!

you ask can your boss make you go outdoors for a period of 5-7mins to get to a meeting and you object because of the weather, but you could be walking 15mins in the same weather getting to and from your car so walking a couple of mins during the working day is immaterial if you have a longer trek to get to and from your vehicle.

To be honest it makes your point moot !

Peregrinus

ellybabes wrote: »

. . . does my boss have the right to MAKE me go outside in inclement weather?

Unless there's something quite unusual in your contract of employment, yes, he does.

I'm assuming there's no question of your being victimised. You haven't, for instance, been moved to a remote and inconvenient work location because the boss has taken a dislike to you. I'm assuming the fact that you work in this building is the outcome of a defensible operational reason, having regard to the available accommodation and the needs of the employer, yadda, yadda, yadda.

It would be an unusual contract of employment which gave an express or implied guarantee that all the places you might have to go to would be in the same building, or would be connected by covered accommodation. Hospitals, universities and lots of large industrial employers have campus-type premises with buildings separated by open space, and having to walk between buildings in the course of the working day is pretty standard.

As others have said, umbrellas are your friend. If your trousers are still getting wet, get one of those huge golf umbrellas. Also, unless the dress code at your workplace prevents it, invest in a couple of pairs of quick-drying non-iron trousers, as sold in camping/outdoor activity shops to travellers. They don't have to look like army surplus - you can get quite smart ones.

NIMAN

I can't do my job cos I might get wet !

Jez, I despair of some people.

There's about 430,000 people who would love to swap places with you and get a good soaking if they could get a permanent job out of it.

Mycroft H

5 minute walk? Seriously, this is exactly what's wrong with this country. Get a pair of wellies and a coat.

ellybabes

Corkbah wrote: »

its completely relevent !!

you ask can your boss make you go outdoors for a period of 5-7mins to get to a meeting and you object because of the weather, but you could be walking 15mins in the same weather getting to and from your car so walking a couple of mins during the working day is immaterial if you have a longer trek to get to and from your vehicle.

To be honest it makes your point moot !

The car is 3-4 mins walk away. If it's pissing down, I stay late in work instead of walking in the rain. In the mornings, the car is 30 secs away from my house, and if it's raining (not drizzling, but raining), then I wait in the car for it to stop before heading into the office.

ellybabes

Peregrinus wrote: »

Unless there's something quite unusual in your contract of employment, yes, he does.

I'm assuming there's no question of your being victimised. You haven't, for instance, been moved to a remote and inconvenient work location because the boss has taken a dislike to you. I'm assuming the fact that you work in this building is the outcome of a defensible operational reason, having regard to the available accommodation and the needs of the employer, yadda, yadda, yadda.

It would be an unusual contract of employment which gave an express or implied guarantee that all the places you might have to go to would be in the same building, or would be connected by covered accommodation. Hospitals, universities and lots of large industrial employers have campus-type premises with buildings separated by open space, and having to walk between buildings in the course of the working day is pretty standard.

As others have said, umbrellas are your friend. If your trousers are still getting wet, get one of those huge golf umbrellas. Also, unless the dress code at your workplace prevents it, invest in a couple of pairs of quick-drying non-iron trousers, as sold in camping/outdoor activity shops to travellers. They don't have to look like army surplus - you can get quite smart ones.

Thank you for the contract-related advice. That makes sense.

ellybabes

NIMAN wrote: »

I can't do my job cos I might get wet !

Jez, I despair of some people.

There's about 430,000 people who would love to swap places with you and get a good soaking if they could get a permanent job out of it.

Those 430,000 people might want to do my job, but I'd doubt that more than 5 of them are qualified to do so.

Corkbah

ellybabes wrote: »

Those 430,000 people might want to do my job, but I'd doubt that more than 5 of them are qualified to do so.

Really !! ... I want to know what you do now.

tatli_lokma

ellybabes wrote: »

The car is 3-4 mins walk away. If it's pissing down, I stay late in work instead of walking in the rain. In the mornings, the car is 30 secs away from my house, and if it's raining (not drizzling, but raining), then I wait in the car for it to stop before heading into the office.

ok fine, that all makes sense...but you have a job where you can afford to take time and sit in your car for fear of getting wet, obviously have a fairly flexible employer if this is allowed, and yet you are moaning about having to walk 5-7 mins in 'possibly' wet weather!! :eek:

Jesus, I wish I had your problems :rolleyes:

zoobizoo

I used to avoid the rain all the time as I'd get sick often. I used always think that getting rained on is what did it to me.

I surf these days and am out in rain, snow, cold water (for hours on end) and get changed on the sides of country lanes in lashings of rain while being blown away. I haven't gotten sicker because of it.

In fact now, I don't mind getting rained on as much. Mind over matter.

tatli_lokma

Getting wet is not usually what makes you sick - sitting in wet clothes/shoes in a warm room will possibly make you unwell (humidity, and the fact that you sweat more despite feeling cold etc just knocks your own internal thermostat out and then you can end up with a cold or feeling unwell). Being wet for a prolonged period might increase muscle aches and pains.
But it is easily solved as many have said by dressing appropriately and having a spare set of shoes and clothing available.

Where there is a will there is a way - looks like OP just doesn't want to inconvenience themselves.

Personally, I would rather go out in the rain to attend a meeting all my peers and colleagues are attending than be the only one not attending and be left of a potenitally important and/or informative meeting. Priorities - some people just don't seem to get what is more important.