New house build - cabling

jester77

I have a new house being built at the moment and I am about to talk the cable guy soon and looking for a heads up/best practices before hand.

I will have a switch in the basement and ideally I want to have a network point in each bedroom, maybe 2? I seen it mentioned on some forums that it's better to have 2 but no one explained why. I will have 2 points in the office and probably 4 behind the TV. Or is it better just to have 1 point and a small switch here that I can change if I need more points in the future? Any point in paying out a bit more for CAT6 cable or will CAT5 do the job (There will HD content flowing through it)?

At some point in the future I'll install a ceiling projector. This will be at the opposite side of the room to the equipment. Would I be better running 2 CAT6 cables from where the equipment is to the projector (CAT6->HDMI) or 1 extremely long HDMI cable between them?

The couch will be up against the wall which means it will make surround sound difficult. Is there any point in even thinking about 7.1 sound here, or is 5.1 the best I can get away with?

ilovesuarez

jester77 wrote: »

I have a new house being built at the moment and I am about to talk the cable guy soon and looking for a heads up/best practices before hand.

I will have a switch in the basement and ideally I want to have a network point in each bedroom, maybe 2? I seen it mentioned on some forums that it's better to have 2 but no one explained why. I will have 2 points in the office and probably 4 behind the TV. Or is it better just to have 1 point and a small switch here that I can change if I need more points in the future? Any point in paying out a bit more for CAT6 cable or will CAT5 do the job (There will HD content flowing through it)?

At some point in the future I'll install a ceiling projector. This will be at the opposite side of the room to the equipment. Would I be better running 2 CAT6 cables from where the equipment is to the projector (CAT6->HDMI) or 1 extremely long HDMI cable between them?

The couch will be up against the wall which means it will make surround sound difficult. Is there any point in even thinking about 7.1 sound here, or is 5.1 the best I can get away with?

check list

1. run speaker cable from ceiling speakers in each room back to your closet(where all equipment will be stored).
2. run 2 cat6 & 2 coax to each tv point in each room.
3. run 1 cat6 cable to each keypad point in each room.
4. run 1 cat6 cable to each point for network you may want in each room. (behind smart tv and at a desk for connecting laptop/PC)

Concerning the 7.1 system of course you could have a system in the room, but run 2 coax from central closet to the AV receiver point also, and wire all speakers in this room back to your AV receiver location.

hope this helps and best of luck with build

Cuddlesworth

ilovesuarez wrote: »

check list

1. run speaker cable from ceiling speakers in each room back to your closet(where all equipment will be stored).
2. run 2 cat6 & 2 coax to each tv point in each room.
3. run 1 cat6 cable to each keypad point in each room.
4. run 1 cat6 cable to each point for network you may want in each room. (behind smart tv and at a desk for connecting laptop/PC)

Concerning the 7.1 system of course you could have a system in the room, but run 2 coax from central closet to the AV receiver point also, and wire all speakers in this room back to your AV receiver location.

hope this helps and best of luck with build

?

1. Run lengths of speaker cable without knowing the resistance of the speakers or working out the type of cable needed for the distance?
2. Not a bad idea
3. Who said anything about a keypad in each room.
4. TBH, now days I would just recommend getting a set of decent wireless AP's. Hard lines are old news.

Ethernet is run in twin pairs traditionally in case one is damaged. Other valid reasons came and went over time(dual networks, IP phones etc.).

I'd watch running long lengths of HDMI, performance tanks on bad cables over any serious distance(15metres +).

jester77

Thanks guys.

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

1. Run lengths of speaker cable without knowing the resistance of the speakers or working out the type of cable needed for the distance?

I had already planned on running speaker cable down stairs, to 2 different zones (living room & kitchen). At the moment I've an old speaker setup that I will eventually throw out and replace but it could be 12-24 months down the line. Not a high priority at the moment. What should I be looking out for in terms of cable for running?

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Ethernet is run in twin pairs traditionally in case one is damaged. Other valid reasons came and went over time(dual networks, IP phones etc.).

Cheers for that. I had been wondering why people were saying to run in pairs. Makes sense.

ilovesuarez wrote: »

3. run 1 cat6 cable to each keypad point in each room.

I won't be bothering with keypads. I'm trying to keep it simplish. Satellite and network switches in the basement with 2 cat6 and 2 coax feeds to each room (Plus a few extra cat6 to the living room). A receiver in the living room that will control my media downstairs and has support for 2 zones, living room and kitchen. And some speaker cables going from the kitchen and living room back to the receiver. And 2 feeds from the receiver to projector and TV.

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

4. TBH, now days I would just recommend getting a set of decent wireless AP's. Hard lines are old news.

This I will be doing anyway for laptops, smartphones, etc. Is it possible to daisy chain AP's so that they feed off each other or does each AP require a direct connection back to the router?

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

I'd watch running long lengths of HDMI, performance tanks on bad cables over any serious distance(15metres +).

This is the only point I am really not sure about. If I run a HDMI cable to the projector and in 10 years I want to change projector then there is probably a good chance that the existing cable won't do the job. I had thought about running 2 cat6 cables and using a converter. But then again that may not be a good option either and in 10 years wireless standards could more than handle the task anyway. I don't want too many connections where the projector is as they will have to be in the ceiling. I won't be able to use the wall where the projector is as it's a special type of wall that has to meet energy standards and I can't drill too deep (would be ok for network point but not for the power point).

Cuddlesworth

Speaker cables lengths


I'd put two CAT6 to the projector and get over Ethernet converter. They tend to scale with the cables, VGA is now 1080p on CAT5 atm.

7.1 is a waste because nobody does it.

andy1249

4. TBH, now days I would just recommend getting a set of decent wireless AP's. Hard lines are old news.

If you want any kind of quality system then hard wired is still very much the way to go.

Wireless is the lowest common denominator for the masses , OK for email and other general online doodling , but next to useless for streaming content in a quality entertainment system because of the constant bandwidth throttling/variation and the drop outs.

The problem with wireless is that performance varies constantly throughout the day depending on the interference in that spectrum , and given the amount of devices contending for bandwidth in that spectrum anyone with such a device within 100 meters of your house affects the bandwidth performance. Wireless spectrums are swamped , and performance cannot be guaranteed with any of the current systems.

Regarding two runs of CAT cable ,long HDMI cable runs ( 10 -15 meters) are out of the question due to reliability issues and there is no ratified standard for wireless HDMI due to the inherent problems.

IF you want unmolested HD content from the likes of Blu ray , i.e. no extra compression or artifacts , then wired is essential , and currently the only way to do this over long distances reliably is with two runs of Category Cable and some extenders.

Note: These extenders typically use the CAT cable to carry the HDMI TMDS signal , such signals are not compatible with TCP/IP or Ethernet and will not work through network switches , so keep that in mind.

Here is some reading on the subject
http://www.maildogmanager.com/pics/AdminDPL/library/HDMIoverCAT_DL.pdf

jester77

andy1249 wrote: »

Here is some reading on the subject
http://www.maildogmanager.com/pics/AdminDPL/library/HDMIoverCAT_DL.pdf

Excellent read, thanks for that. Just hope I get a competent electrician that knows what he is doing.

Cuddlesworth

andy1249 wrote: »

If you want any kind of quality system then hard wired is still very much the way to go.

Wireless is the lowest common denominator for the masses , OK for email and other general online doodling , but next to useless for streaming content in a quality entertainment system because of the constant bandwidth throttling/variation and the drop outs.

The problem with wireless is that performance varies constantly throughout the day depending on the interference in that spectrum , and given the amount of devices contending for bandwidth in that spectrum anyone with such a device within 100 meters of your house affects the bandwidth performance. Wireless spectrums are swamped , and performance cannot be guaranteed with any of the current systems.

Sorry, but your so wrong on that. If it was 4-5 years ago I would disagree, but its not and wi-fi has moved on from 2.4ghz and wireless G.

Good dual band Wireless N AP's placed strategically around a house provide far more reliability and flexibility with today's devices and provide more then enough bandwidth for streaming 1080p H264 content. Wireless AC will again, blow that out of the water. 1ghz isn't really too far away either. And buffered/stored content avoid the whole "half duplex" argument. H265 has been ratified as well, reducing the bandwidth again by half and allowing the possibility of 4k wireless content being accessible. Expect that to be the next big thing in the digital AV world.

I would try stop fighting the world on this. TV's, phones, laptops and tablets, the most commonly used devices in the modern home are now wireless orientated. Even other stauncher segments of the AV/home market are catching up, wireless projectors that stream 1080p content are available, stereo systems that stream music over wireless.

While DNLA and subsets of that have their own problems, wifi is both the now and the future. Cable runs throughout a house are simply to expensive in comparison and are not flexible enough for modern needs.

andy1249

Sorry, but your so wrong on that. If it was 4-5 years ago I would disagree, but its not and wi-fi has moved on from 2.4ghz and wireless G.

Good dual band Wireless N AP's placed strategically around a house provide far more reliability and flexibility with today's devices and provide more then enough bandwidth for streaming 1080p H264 content. Wireless AC will again, blow that out of the water. 1ghz isn't really too far away either. And buffered/stored content avoid the whole "half duplex" argument. H265 has been ratified as well, reducing the bandwidth again by half and allowing the possibility of 4k wireless content being accessible. Expect that to be the next big thing in the digital AV world.

I would try stop fighting the world on this. TV's, phones, laptops and tablets, the most commonly used devices in the modern home are now wireless orientated. Even other stauncher segments of the AV/home market are catching up, wireless projectors that stream 1080p content are available, stereo systems that stream music over wireless.

While DNLA and subsets of that have their own problems, wifi is both the now and the future. Cable runs throughout a house are simply to expensive in comparison and are not flexible enough for modern needs.

As posted , there is no wireless solution for HDMI that does not introduce artifacts. Its as simple as that , and if you have a big screen and want no drop in Video quality then wired is your only option.

Likewise , for a quality music streaming experience with drop out free performance guaranteed , wired is the only option. Sure they all come with some kind of wireless system , but quality systems like Sonos , Marantz , Denon , Naim , etc. also always come with an RJ45 network port and all manufacturers recommend this over the wireless if quality is your main concern.

Home entertainment systems are generally not portable , wiring a system outperforms any wireless setup , sure its a bit more work , but network cable is cheap as chips ( 50 euros per 105 meters ) and its childsplay to terminate yourself.

Even Homeplugs outperform wireless for most tasks , giving a much more consistent throughput than the continuously varying throughput from any wireless connection.
Wireless remains firmly on the bottom of the ladder when it comes to network performance.

Throughput performance from a CAT6 hardwired connection ( 10 Gbps ) is so far ahead of anything available from wireless that this is likely to remain the case for a long time to come. Wire with CAT6 and its unlikely you would have to change it for decades.

The quality end of your system should always be wired , saved the wireless for the compromised content devices , Apple iphones , ipads , mp3 players and all that other beginners gear !

eamonnq

jester77 wrote: »

Excellent read, thanks for that. Just hope I get a competent electrician that knows what he is doing.

You might be better getting an experienced AV installer instead of an electrician with no experience of this sort of stuff.