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Buying bitcoins
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The whole article is really funny
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2331308/senator-joe-manchin-wants-to-ban-bitcoin
"Due to Bitcoin's anonymity, the virtual market has been extremely susceptible to hackers and scam artists stealing millions from Bitcoins users."
""I am most concerned that as Bitcoin is inevitably banned in other countries, Americans will be left holding the bag on a valueless currency.""0 -
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Good news for Bitcoin fans in Ireland. An ATM is set to be installed in Hippetys Cafe in Temple Bar next week. And it should be ready to be used shortly after.
The group in charge of the machine also intend to open another machine in Waterford.
Link
I'm surprised that Waterford has been chosen instead of one of the bigger cities. Not complaining though since I live here 0 -
Suryavarman wrote: »Good news for Bitcoin fans in Ireland. An ATM is set to be installed in Hippetys Cafe in Temple Bar next week. And it should be ready to be used shortly after.
The group in charge of the machine also intend to open another machine in Waterford.
Link
I'm surprised that Waterford has been chosen instead of one of the bigger cities. Not complaining though since I live here
What use is a bitcoin ATM exactly?0 -
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I was just making the point that if your bitcoins are stolen then there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. Sure it's the same with cash if you leave in under the mattress but if I leave it in the bank then it's safe and the same for a credit card. If the money is stolen then it's returned.
You what?
I'm guessing you don't know how close everyone with money in Irish banks came to losing the lot of it. I'm guessing you haven't heard about Icelandic bank depositors, or even Cypriot depositors, to name just 2 recent ones that affect Europe, to say nothing of the recent US banks collapsing or investment funds like Madoff's.
The history of banking is one of huge busts, if you want to naively believe your money is safe in a bank then fair enough.As a matter of interest how do you see this panning out exactly? Where do you see Bitcoin in one years time? How long do you think it will take for it to be widely adopted as the currency of choice?
Even if you're (naively) happy with the safety of your deposited or invested funds they're in a currency that by design is worth less and less each year, because those that "own" it just keep issuing more and more of the stuff. If you keep your assets in Euro or Dollars you're forced to play in a game, because if you don't your hard earned cash is worth less and less each year.Even if it was 100% secure it's far too volatile to be used as a currency and even if it wasn't volatile what government in their right mind would allow it to gain adoption? To me it's just another speculative asset. Buyer beware!
Sure there's people like you saying it'll be worth nothing, there's others that are saying it'll be worth 100K per coin in the medium term. No way of settling that debate now, we'll see what the future holds.
I only have 10 or so bitcoins, but I am utterly convinced that they're as big a game changer as the web was, they allow computers send money using an open standard - they do for value/money what the web did for information.
Edit:
Recent picture from Singapore
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Yes but I can call my bank or credit card company if my details are stolen or compromised and I can get my money refunded. You can't say the same for Bitcoin. There is no recourse.
What is going to happen MT Gox's customers? What would happen if your computer was hacked and the coins were stolen?
I get why people want it to work but I just don't think it will.
I get where you're coming from, and I've a few related thoughts on this, this isn't all directed at your post
but it's related.
Firstly on the "why Bitcoin?" aspect : You're dealing with Irish banks and euro currency, which on a worldwide scale are relatively safe and stable. We're already seeing slower uptake of Bitcoin in Ireland than in other countries because people trust the banks to return their deposits and trust the Euro to not devalue overnight. Where would you keep your money if we had a Cyprus situation and deposits were frozen for days and then given a haircut? What would you do if the Euro lost 12% of its value in a day due to monetary inflation.
There's a reason Neo opened in Cyprus and not Dublin, and that Buenos Aries has 6 times the Bitcoin economy that Ireland has.
Secondly, on the security of traditional banking: Sure you're right, BOI, AIB get bailed out, no one lost deposits, if there's fraud on a credit card or ATM card skimmed you'll probably get your money back. But it's not free, either you pay for it with fees, or the losses get socialised to all users. Many people like that Bitcoin is buyer beware in this manner, that your own competence ultimately determines how safe your coins are, and that any losses by others incompetence does not come out of your pocket.
The libertarian viewpoint is that gox should be allowed to fail, not be bailed out and that good consequences can come from this. Allowing failure is necessary for better services to emerge.
After this gox debacle other exchanges now need to convince users to trust them, it pushes them to improve transparency. One interesting point here, is that with Bitcoin they can prove they have control of funds without any kind of expensive 3rd party audit. Right after the gox trouble, Bitquick announced they now provide proof of their reserves.
The few who took a risk on gox lose, the many who didn't are rewarded with better alternatives that emerge.
The argument is that gov regulation doesn't work anyway, it just moves trust from people to other people. Anglo was regulated and still managed to make what I think are the biggest losses in the history of the world.
I realise these are quite extreme views, and I'm not personally a die hard libertarian, I'm just explaining what the viewpoint of many Bitcoiners is and I'm curious to see how it all pans out.
Thirdly, on the security of Bitcoin:
What if my computer gets hacked? well as you rightly point out then if that's where the private keys to my coins were, I have lost my coins and I'm never getting them back. Buyer/user beware indeed.
But, the Bitcoin protocol allows for some really interesting advanced usage to avoid this risk. You can create what's called a multi-signature wallet. This means you can create a wallet which has 5 (N) keys, and 3 (M) are needed to spend from the wallet. You can then disperse these 5 keys across a number of places, put one in an encrypted file in your gmail or drop box, print two on paper and put them in safe deposit boxes in banks, bury one in your back garden, keep one in your parents house. Anyone finding one key, or even 2 of them still can't steal your money, but you also have redundancy - if the banks refused to give you your keys back you still have 3 remaining keys you can use.
This is just an example, M and N can be any values you like 1 of 3, 5 of 10 etc. In my opinion this is a killer feature - distributed, redundant, secure storage without need for 3rd party trust (or cost). Is there any store of value in the world that offers this type of security? As I said before, creating these wallets isn't yet user friendly but there's no reason why it won't be.
Those speculating on Bitcoin aren't betting on Bitcoin being finished in its current state, they're betting on what future value it will bring.12 element wrote: »Imagine everytime you used your debit card you would have to wait 10-30 minutes for the transaction to go through. Bitcoin...
Do you think the people queuing at the Bitcoin ATM in the pic in post #576 are waiting 30 minutes each for their transaction? You'll see the transaction reach your wallet in seconds, it just takes 10 mins for each confirmation. The chances of a transaction reaching your wallet and not confirming are tiny, for small transactions there's no need to wait.0 -
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Couple of technical (I think!) questions and hopefully they haven’t been asked before…
I plan to buy from bitcoin.de and (maybe) the vending machine opening soon.
- Is it the case that I can buy, say, 0.2 BTC and if someone has 10 BTC they sell me this partial BTC amount and a brand new blockchain code is generated (whereas previously all this person’s full BTC would have had their own blockchain codes)?
- Having received this partial BTC into my wallet I can take this stuff fully 100% “offline” (stored, for example on a USB key)?
- I can continue to buy small amounts, each one with their own blockchain codes, and store all this offline. Or is it the case that if I buy 0.5 BTC today from .de and 0.5 BTC tomorrow from the vending machine, they merge into one block chain code?
1) http://www.getelastic.com/wp-content/uploads/how-bitcoing-works-large.jpg
2) all transactions are always-and-forever on line. You can take your private keys offline using whatever you want from usb key, paper to a qr-code cut on a lawn (risky option
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3) same as 1)0 -
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