Captain America Sequel The Winter Soldier

norrie rugger

Honestly it felt like two films
-A spy thriller
-An action flick

They almost worked seamlessly but not quite. Very predictable in places but that's to be expected. Really enjoyed it.
What was not to be predicted was how ropey some of the CGI was.

Necronomicon

norrie rugger wrote: »

Honestly it felt like two films
-A spy thriller
-An action flick

They almost worked seamlessly but not quite. Very predictable in places but that's to be expected. Really enjoyed it.
What was not to be predicted was how ropey some of the CGI was.

That was kind of my feeling as well. I loved the espionage/paranoia tone for the first two thirds of the film, so I was disappointed that it descended into another bland, over-the-top, Avengers-esque set piece finale.

Zubeneschamali

I liked it, but I don't think it bettered the original Captain America.

Too much shakey-cam in the fight scenes, too much stupid monologuing from the bad guys, no-one in the whole cinema believed

Fury was dead,

, and not much Winter Soldier in a movie called The Winter Soldier.

In the comics, the Winter Soldier was a Soviet agent - why does this one have a red star on his arm?

silverbolt

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I liked it, but I don't think it bettered the original Captain America.

Too much shakey-cam in the fight scenes, too much stupid monologuing from the bad guys, no-one in the whole cinema believed

Fury was dead,

, and not much Winter Soldier in a movie called The Winter Soldier.

In the comics, the Winter Soldier was a Soviet agent - why does this one have a red star on his arm?

Dont start comparing the comics to the movies or you will go down a path that can only lead to insanity.

though i agree there wasnt much winter soldier in it at all

thomas anderson.

They were only introducing the character because in the next movie he becomes Captain America, the first Cap gets killed by Crossbones (the guy all burnt at the end)

FunLover18

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

In the comics, the Winter Soldier was a Soviet agent - why does this one have a red star on his arm?

Misdirection on Hydra's part?

Gbear

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

In the comics, the Winter Soldier was a Soviet agent - why does this one have a red star on his arm?

Because he was also a soviet agent?

Zubeneschamali

Gbear wrote: »

Because he was also a soviet agent?

So

Hydra were also inside Soviet intelligence, without anyone there ever knowing?

FunLover18

Gbear wrote: »

Because he was also a soviet agent?

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

So

Hydra were also inside Soviet intelligence, without anyone there ever knowing?

More likely that it was misdirection.

Hydra working within SHIELD used TWS to alter things in their favour, JFK, etc. Naturally it wouldn't work out if he could be traced back to SHIELD so paint a red star on him and pretend he's a Soviet.

Gbear

FunLover18 wrote: »

More likely that it was misdirection.

Hydra working within SHIELD used TWS to alter things in their favour, JFK, etc. Naturally it wouldn't work out if he could be traced back to SHIELD so paint a red star on him and pretend he's a Soviet.

He was also speaking what sounded like Russian when he was on the road with his gang of miscreants.

FortuneChip

Are post credit scenes really necessary anymore?
Initially it was to tease us about a potential idea that everybody superhero fan wished for but never fully expected to happen.
Now, we even know who the main villain is in the next Avengers movie, so there's isn't any need to tease us with two post-credit scenes.


Really good movie though, the fight scenes (not the OTT destructive scenes which are inescapable in Marvel movies) were great. Lots of high energy, high impact hitting. I do wish we got more of the Winter Soldier's persona though. He didn't say much beyond "I don't know you"

Saw it tonight and rather enjoyed it though it did have a very, made by committee feel. Like the recent Thor film it felt like a film heavily compromised from what the writers and directors originally intended. The 70s style conspiracy plot was really well done and a nice change of pace from the CGI fest that was the Avengers. The early action scenes were well shot and there was a sense of symmetry and spatial awareness to them meaning that we never got lost. Sadly the final set piece just felt far too similar. It played out like the final set piece in every other blockbuster of the past decade and you could easily have thrown in a few deleted scenes from The Avengers and not many would have noticed

Like then ending, a lot of the films most interesting moments felt rushed. I'd love to have seen more of Steve and Peggy, Steve exploring his past and I'd really have liked to see more of the vets and how Steve actually was adapting to modern life. Dr Zola was a complete missed opportunity and for such a smart AI he'd obviously never seen any action film from the past 40 years.

Still, it's one of the few Marvel films that I left the cinema looking forward to watching again. There was a sense of fun that many a marvel films lacks and the plot actually has a few interesting ideas.

It was also nice to see Redford and Newman share the screen again. It was a simply little moment that put a smile on my face and left me eager to revisit Butch and Sundance and The Sting

humanji

Like then ending, a lot of the films most interesting moments felt rushed. I'd love to have seen more of Steve and Peggy, Steve exploring his past and I'd really have liked to see more of the vets and how Steve actually was adapting to modern life.

The Avengers movie had several cut scenes about with Steve adapting to modern life that were cut, so I'd assume there's probably more here. They did seem to really rush past the Peggy part in this. I was expecting something to come of it.

It was also nice to see Redford and Newman share the screen again.

They shared the screen in this?

Zubeneschamali

humanji wrote: »

They shared the screen in this?

Redford had Newman's Own sauce in his fridge

Agent Coulson

humanji wrote: »

They shared the screen in this?

When

Redford opened his fridge Newmans Own's was in it.A nice nod to their friendship I think

humanji

Ah, I didn't notice that. Brilliant, haha!

Meant to say in my first post but for me Anthony Mackue was the stand out. He managed to take a character I never cared for and make him interesting and fun. I really hope that we see more of him and I'd sooner see a Falcon film than a Black Widow one. Have to say that Scarlett Johansson was atrocious, she was bland and seemed to be bored throughout the film. There was no chemistry between her and any other character and I'm hiping that all the "do you trust me" crap means that she's going to be killed off in the next Avengers

I'm sure it's been discussed before but Marvel really need to convince me that all these films exist in one universe. I get that each hero needs their own film but where was everyone else? Surely Iron Man or Hulk who seened to be hanging around Avengers Tower would have been around to lend a hand.

Hopefully as the universe expands there'll be more characters to play with, the mention of Stephen Strange hopefully means that a Dr. Strange film isn't too far away.

Adamantium

Agent Coulson wrote: »

When

Newmans Own's

That's in bad taste.

LOL


That sounds ****ing hilarious. I'm tittering thinking of it.

I think I'll have to go see this now.

Adamantium

Adamantium wrote: »

That's in bad taste.

LOL


That sounds ****ing hilarious. I'm tittering thinking of it.

I think I'll have to go see this now.

I thought that it was a nice little nod to Redford's past. Think I was the only one in the cinema who caught it as my girlfriend had to ask what I was smiling about.

crazyderk

Watched this on Tuesday, I enjoyed it I have to say.

Question for you though with

Shield being destroyed

What's going to happen to agents of shield now?

norrie rugger

You'll have to watch next week's episode. I think that the film is only being released this week in the States so might seem a bit disjointed

humanji

Shield will be rebuilt, no doubt. And it'll take a while for the full fallout out of the film to reach them. Shield is a huge organisation, so it'll take a long while for the government to reassign everyone and they're still going to want teams of agents doing their job, so they could still act in an unofficial capacity while the rest of Hydra are routed out.

Then again, it's a comic book world, so they can decide to have anything happen.

Soft Falling Rain

Unless Fury plans on rebuilding it, I can't see it happening.

The ending showed various agents going their separate ways. Sharon Carter is in the CIA, Maria Hill is applying for a job with Stark, BW and Cap have gone solo etc etc....

It doesn't look like anyone is too cut up about Shield's demise.

Then again, if they're following the comics, there's an outside possibility that the reason Stark is hiring Hill is because he is the one who plans to rebuild and take over Shield, and wants Hill by his side to do it. It would be a nice way of easing Stark's (and RDJ's) participation in the cinematic universe.

Zubeneschamali

Soft Falling Rain wrote: »

Unless Fury plans on rebuilding it, I can't see it happening.

Indeed, no comic-book franchise would ever pull a switcheroo and reset things back the way they were after a big surprising change.

FunLover18

Soft Falling Rain wrote: »

Then again, if they're following the comics, there's an outside possibility that the reason Stark is hiring Hill is because he is the one who plans to rebuild and take over Shield, and wants Hill by his side to do it. It would be a nice way of easing Stark's (and RDJ's) participation in the cinematic universe.

In which case he may have to pass the responsibilities of Iron Man on to someone else

pah

Anybody else spot what was written on

Furys headstone

"The path of the righteous man... "

grinning to myself

Looper007

Got to say this Marvel's Studio best film aside from The Avenger's. Very dark and downbeat with a nice touch of heart to it. I got to say I had a bit of dust in my eye a little with the scene between Steve Roger's and

A elderly Peggy Carter

. Robert Redford, god he would have been a perfect Captain America in his 70's pomp was brilliant and is it the first time he played

A Villian, I know he played a few shady characters in the 70's

. Loved the action scenes (some of the fight scenes were really hard hitting) and the Winter Solider and his past give the film a nice tragic touch. Scarlett Johansson is really winning me over with her last few films and I wouldn't be agaisn't a Black Widow stand alone film. I know Robert Downey Jr gets all the acting plaudits but Chris Evans is really excellent as Captain America.

Soft Falling Rain

Johansson's star seems to never have been more hotter than it is right now alright. I'm not sure a standalone film would have legs but I wouldn't be surprised if Marvel run with it now (not like them to turn down opportunity and money).

cloud493

Best film of the year for me so far, I liked it even more than the first one. Specially loved the falcon and Evans.

nix

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3480822/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_1

Announced apparently?

Solid Snake to direct?

:eek:

nix

nix wrote: »

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3480822/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_1

Announced apparently?

Solid Snake to direct?

:eek:

I wouldn't have much hope of that panning out. A David Hayter Black Widow film has been in various forms of production for a decade or so.

nix

Drats!

Id like to see David Hayter rise to the occasion.

Gbear

I presume there's a reason there aren't many action films with female leads (excluding ones that are awful).

It'd be interesting if they had the balls to make one that wasn't terrible.
The safest bet would be to go light on the explosions and heavy on the spy/intrigue side of things. Those parts worked well in Captain America and have been the more interesting elements of Agents of Shield.

It's probably something super hero films have to do in general. People really love seeing cities get trashed and people beating the **** out of one another but diversifying a bit couldn't hurt.

Cookie_Monster

where is everyone getting the 30% from, it was only 2 million out of 7 billion

also why

do they insist with the stupid helicarriers, easiest thing in the world to destroy seemingly

maximoose

Saw it lastnight, must say it's probably become my new favourite Marvel movie

Good story, solid action sequences with some great fight scenes (the first with cap/winter soldier was brilliant)

Is it just me, or was it noticeably more violent than previous marvel films? I know it was still pg-13, it just felt a bit less kid-friendly with the

non-ambiguous shootout scenes, point blank head shots, graphic arm break, WS throwing someone into a jet engine :pac:

.

Zubeneschamali

maximoose wrote: »

Is it just me, or was it noticeably more violent than previous marvel films?

Yes, especially at the start. It was probably even more violent that it looked to me, since a combination of 3D and extreme shakycam meant I couldn't follow some fight scenes, but frex Cap nailing that guy's hand to a wall with a throwing kniife was more graphic than the run of Marvel movies.

It's also a good trick, when the wall is a steel plate.

CatInABox

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Yes, especially at the start. It was probably even more violent that it looked to me, since a combination of 3D and extreme shakycam meant I couldn't follow some fight scenes, but frex Cap nailing that guy's hand to a wall with a throwing kniife was more graphic than the run of Marvel movies.

It's also a good trick, when the wall is a steel plate.

One of the main criticisms of Captain America has been how ordinary he is. People left the The First Avenger thinking that he was just a human with a great work out regime and an impressive ability to throw a Frisbee like a boomerang.

With that criticism in mind, I think it's clear why TWS is more violent, and why Cap doesn't use guns. By making Captain use only his physical ability, by making every punch and kick bone-crunching, they emphasise how super-human he is. Of course, if they make him more "violent", then they have to make his enemies both more violent and merciless, otherwise they'd just come across as fodder for Cap.

Still not sure how it got that rating though, they do seem to push the boundary a good bit.

Mickeroo

Saw it Friday night and thought it was great too. Thought Thor 2 was pretty mediocre and when I saw they had goten TV directors for this again I was beginning to think Marvel were starting to move away from giving any freedom to their directors at all. Glad to see I was wrong and this film is probably up there with Avengers as the best of the bunch.

The action was very well shot, the story kept me guessing and the chemistry between all the leads was great too. I thought the first Cap film had a brilliant first hour but suffered by having to rush the final act to tie in with Avengers, in this case the film stands very much on its own. Cap get's some real bad ass moments too,

loved the build up in the elevator.

I liked the scene with

Agent Carter

though I felt it would have been better in the Avengers. My main criticism of the thing is they probably should have fleshed out the Cap/Winter Soldier stuff a bit more as WS felt a bit under used, though the scenes we do get are probably the best in the film.

I really like Evans in the role, it would be very easy for CA to be a completely dull character, as let's face it he is by far the most unappealing Avenger, but in both this and Avengers (and even the first CA film) they've managed to make him as compelling as any of the other characters if not more so. Just goes to show you can have a heroic, earnest, goody two shoes character and still make him interesting in the right hands without having to make him into a conflicted tortured angsty type. Something Zack Snyder & co could do with taking on board when portraying the other big blue boyscout.

DrumSteve

I know some people might have said this already but the films action scenes had real "weight" to them...

For instance, when cap was running through the hall chasing TWS and went through the walls, it looked...heavy or something. Was an excellent film.

Sudden Valley

Best of the Marvel movies imho.Action sequences and general interplay between all the characters was great. used real world politics in a clever way. Also the winter soldier is one of the coolest looking villains in a long while. Really great movie.

Nervous Wreck

Mickeroo wrote: »

I liked the scene with

Agent Carter

though I felt it would have been better in the Avengers. My main criticism of the thing is they probably should have fleshed out the Cap/Winter Soldier stuff a bit more as WS felt a bit under used, though the scenes we do get are probably the best in the film.

Reckon Cap3 will be heavy on this side of things.

Mickeroo wrote: »

I really like Evans in the role, it would be very easy for CA to be a completely dull character, as let's face it he is by far the most unappealing Avenger, but in both this and Avengers (and even the first CA film) they've managed to make him as compelling as any of the other characters if not more so. Just goes to show you can have a heroic, earnest, goody two shoes character and still make him interesting in the right hands without having to make him into a conflicted tortured angsty type. Something Zack Snyder & co could do with taking on board when portraying the other big blue boyscout.

Couldn't agree more. One of my favourite moments in The Avengers was when Cap gets blasted through a window by a Chitauri grenade and lands on a taxi, crushing its roof. The look of absolute pain on his face is really great and really shows that he's an ordinary guy under it all. But then he shakes it off and puts on his game face and suddenly he's a hero again. Makes him much more compelling than the others imo.

Zubeneschamali

Sudden Valley wrote: »

the winter soldier is one of the coolest looking villains in a long while.

Yes, very comic book, BUT...

he's supposed to be a ghost, a myth, a legend -

yet he's running about in broad daylight on busy freeways killing people. With a gang of henchmen, and his bionic arm out.

Not very subtle. When exactly did

Hydra

decide it was time to put him on the cover of Time magazine?

humanji

That did seem a bit odd, alright. But my excuse for it would be that Hydra were at the end-game and had no reason to hide him anymore. They were about to kill millions, so there was no reason to keep to the shadows. And since next to nothing was known about him (not even who he was working for), then they really had nothing to lose.

nix

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Yes, very comic book, BUT...

he's supposed to be a ghost, a myth, a legend -

yet he's running about in broad daylight on busy freeways killing people. With a gang of henchmen, and his bionic arm out.

Not very subtle. When exactly did

Hydra

decide it was time to put him on the cover of Time magazine?

Well he has probably never tackled someone as hard as himself to take down before this, most of his hits were probably from afar with a sniper, remaining unseen..

So going for Fury/Cap would require a more hands on approach.

Fuzzytrooper

Wouldn't it be easier to take Cap on from a distance with a sniper rifle?

Zubeneschamali

Fuzzytrooper wrote: »

Wouldn't it be easier to take Cap on from a distance with a sniper rifle?

Hard to be sure he's dead from a distance with those freaky powers of his.

FunLover18

The Empire Spoiler Podcast. Really good discussion of the film and it's impact on the MCU. Also a great interview with the Russo bros

Victor

It's an interesting remake of the Star Wars Trilogy - star destroyers, dangling over precipices / off aerials, metal hands, father and son ...

Zubeneschamali

Victor wrote: »

father and son ...

What now? Who's father and son in this one?

humanji

Victor wrote: »

It's an interesting remake of the Star Wars Trilogy - star destroyers, dangling over precipices / off aerials, metal hands, father and son ...

Funny you should say that when in the Agents Of Shield latest episode there's a scene where

they have to rescue one of their own from an enemy held base and pull the Star Wars "Wookie in Cuffs" trick

.