Ireland Vs Austria - K/O 7:45PM - Sky Sports 2 & RTÉ 2

grenache

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

First Major Championship appearance in a decade. That was real easy.

Ah yes, that old chestnut :rolleyes:

Go look at the context in which qualification was achieved, then get back to me and tell me if you still think it was a good achievement.

WallyGUFC

wonderfullife wrote: »

I'm not sure there is a Pro-Trap/Anti-Trap divide.

We have one set of fans (the majority) who dislike the coach and want him gone. Mainly because: 1. we play unattractive football 2. He doesn't pick players they rate 3. He doesn't go to the games 4. He's paid too much money 5. He doesn't speak good English.

The other camp acknowledge all of the above yet see the progress this man has made from a team genuinely in disarray under Staunton to a battle-hardened organised outfit with one of the best away records in Europe. But for a bit of tricky business from Thierry it could have been 2 major championships from 2 for this coach. It still might be 2 major championships out of 3, which is something only Charlton has managed to do.

To see where we were in 2007 and to where we are now, i think a lot of fair minded people are willing to say 'good job sir' and not 'sack him he's old, overpaid and useless'.

I'm hugely anti-Trap, but agree with everything you say. You're absolutely right that stability was what was needed after the shambles Staunton left us with. We became solid defensively and became competitive again. We should have got to South Africa and got to Poland. Spot on, he did very well to get us there.
But there comes a time when we should try to move to the next level. Obviously losing 5-2 to Cyprus was a disgrace, and you wouldn't get a freak result like that under Trap, but we need to start doing what Austria did to the Faroes; put terrible teams to the sword. The time for change was after the Euros. The FAI made the fatal error in giving him the new contract before then, when an informed decision could have been made after waiting. He's clearly not going to be sacked now, it'd be pretty pointless. But with each passing game, I just get the feeling that he will be remembered for shambolic decision making, terrible grasp of our language after 5 years, and his huge pay packet, rather than for getting us to the Euros.

weldoninhio

wonderfullife wrote: »

I don't get what his salary has to do with it. He's paid a price for a job, that's market value dictating it and Denis O Brien is chipping in.

If we're going down that route then what do we expect if we get Jose Mourinho in to coach us pro bono for nothing? To finish bottom as he's doing it for free, so value for money is expecting nothing in return?!!

He's doing fine, if by the end of the campaign we finish 4th he has failed. If we finish 3rd he's done OK, no more than that, and if we make the play-offs he has done very well.

Market Value????? He get paid way more than Del Bosque!!!!

Mr.Nice Guy

gnfnrhead wrote: »

Some people seem to be under the impression that we are San Marino. We're not. Bar Stan, we have always been there or thereabout. Even Stan wasnt a million miles off. For the amount of money he is on, qualifying should have been the bare minimum we expected.

I don't care if he was being paid by Roman Abramovich, no way should this country ever expect qualification as a bare minimum. Come on, now.

We haven't got any players playing for top clubs and yet people in this country expect wine from water.

We might not be San Marino but we're not Spain either.

We may have been there or thereabouts in the years before Trap but we had not reached a play-off since McCarthy's time. Under Trap we have reached two play-offs and unlike McCarthy, Trap hasn't had a world class player to call upon.

gnfnrhead

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I don't care if he was being paid by Roman Abramovich, no way should this country ever expect qualification as a bare minimum. Come on, now.

We haven't got any players playing for top clubs and yet people in this country expect wine from water.

We might not be San Marino but we're not Spain either.

We may have been there or thereabouts in the years before Trap but we had not reached a play-off since McCarthy's time. Under Trap we have reached two play-offs and unlike McCarthy, Trap hasn't had a world class player to call upon.

Qualifying for the Euros was what I meant. Considering the group and then the nice play off tie, anything less than qualifying would have raised serious questions.

Ferris_Bueller

monkey9 wrote: »

Trap has diluted us. If we're not going to win or qualify, i'd rather we didn't win or qualify by getting stuck in and giving the fans something to cheer about. Make going to Lansdowne something to look forward to again.

He's on the other night saying we're not Germany or England. Well Trap, we're not Italy either. We're not going to see out one nil victories.

I'm trying to remember who we have actually beaten at home under Trap. Armenia, San Marino or Andorra can't remember which, Georgia. Anyone else? Anybody relevent?

By your logic, who have we bet in a competitive home qualifier apart from the Netherlands this side of the millennium? People can complain about the way we play football, his squad selection and his falling out with players, but results is one thing I don't think people can complain about. I wasn't old enough for the Charlton days, but was the football not absolutely terrible under him as well? Didn't seem to stop the nation getting behind him and the team.

grenache wrote: »

Ah yes, that old chestnut :rolleyes:

Go look at the context in which qualification was achieved, then get back to me and tell me if you still think it was a good achievement.

The context is irrelevant really is it not? We got lucky in drawing Estonia in the play offs but we breezed by them, and finished 2nd in a group where (iirc) we were seeded 3rd which is good going by any means. The finals themselves were very disappointing however.


Trap gets such a raw deal in my opinion, a manager should be mainly judged on results and his have been good, secondary thing to judge them on is performances, which have been poor for the guts of his tenure, but yet people absolute hammer him for this. He has mixed good results in with introducing our better players into the squad (eventually), and has transitioned us from a joke of a team under Stan to a good team for whoever takes over next, with a successful few years in between. What more do people want?

I want him to leave as much as the rest of you, but he is here for the rest of this campaign like it or not. I am certainly not going to rip into a man who has got us to a finals for the first time in 10 years, and made us very competitive in all our other campaigns. While our performances could undoubtedly be better than they have been under him, I don't think our results (generally) could be any better, and football is a results business at this level.

shayno90

Despite all the misery, we seemed to have a found a solid replacement goalkeeper in Forde. Best player over the 2 games.

Based on our recent past history of conceding leads late in games, struggling to beat teams ranked above us (plus below us) and poor team formation/selection, we have to hope that Sweden and Austria collapse as we seem incapable ourselves of qualifying on our own merit.
We lack a belief as capable team and also a winning mentality. This been the case in most recent campaigns even before Trap but more apparent under him.

Blatter

shayno90 wrote: »

Despite all the misery, we seemed to have a found a solid replacement goalkeeper in Forde. Best player over the 2 games.

Based on our recent past history of conceding leads late in games, struggling to beat teams ranked above us (plus below us) and poor team formation/selection, we have to hope that Sweden and Austria collapse as we seem incapable ourselves of qualifying on our own merit.
We lack a belief as capable team and also a winning mentality. This been the case in most recent campaigns even before Trap but more apparent under him.

Yup, just like Slovakia did and also hope to get a couple of flukey results like Moscow away. Would also need to draw another Estonia (if there's one in the pot) in the play off if we managed to get that far.

Xavi6

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Results are the bottom line.

And yet you've taken numerous opportunities to pull people up who dared mention the embarrassment that was the Euros when questioning Trap.

Three comprehensive defeats should be fair game if results are all that matter.

The_Kew_Tour

monkey9 wrote: »

I'm trying to remember who we have actually beaten at home under Trap. Armenia, San Marino or Andorra can't remember which, Georgia. Anyone else? Anybody relevent?

Macedonia. Things don't get any better.

We have yet to impress at home for full 90 minutes.

homerjay2005

Xavi6 wrote: »

And yet you've taken numerous opportunities to pull people up who dared mention the embarrassment that was the Euros when questioning Trap.

Three comprehensive defeats should be fair game if results are all that matter.

against 3 of the top teams in international football,a bit of perspective please. and we played well against Italy

Red Crow

Realistically we need another CB, a midfielder and a striker and then we'd have a decent side. We can certainly do better than this however.

Xavi6

homerjay2005 wrote: »

against 3 of the top teams in international football,a bit of perspective please. and we played well against Italy

They are top teams, however Lloyd says that results are the bottom line so that makes the calibre of opposition irrelevant. Going on that logic, it doesn't matter whether we lost to Spain or Singapore because a loss is a loss.

You can't have a "but they were a good team" caveat only when it suits the case for Trap's defence.

LuckyLloyd

Xavi6 wrote: »

They are top teams, however Lloyd says that results are the bottom line so that makes the calibre of opposition irrelevant. Going on that logic, it doesn't matter whether we lost to Spain or Singapore because a loss is a loss.

You can't have a "but they were a good team" caveat only when it suits the case for Trap's defence.

Eh, significant amount of fail above. Here, I'll blow your mind: results are the bottom line but the expected result changes depending on the opposition! Wow, drink that in a little.

Xavi6

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Eh, significant amount of fail above. Here, I'll blow your mind: results are the bottom line but the expected result changes depending on the opposition! Wow, drink that in a little.

Ah the usual condescending retort from high up on Mount Lloyd.

No fail by the way, I just went with what you said. If you have to clarify afterwards then you probably should just disclose everything in the first place eh?

The_Kew_Tour

I personally would rather Trap to leave now and bring in somebody that will have time to see the squad and build for Euro 2016.

The problem is who we get then.

We have blown so many matches under Trap it's not funny at this stage.

If people can't see that this is mainly the managers fault then they are blind.

Our mentality is our biggest problem and the manager is responsible for that.

Look how crap Armenia are doing in their group and how close they were to getting 2nd in our group for Euros.

LuckyLloyd

Xavi6 wrote: »

Ah the usual condescending retort from high up on Mount Lloyd.

No fail by the way, I just went with what you said. If you have to clarify afterwards then you probably should just disclose everything in the first place eh?

Only for you dude, which means it's more a you problem than a me problem.

LuckyLloyd

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I personally would rather Trap to leave now and bring in somebody that will have time to see the squad and build for Euro 2016.

The problem is who we get then.

He's here to the end of his contract.

The replacement we get will be a significant downgrade. McCarthy is unlikely to be available really; Kerr would never get another shot; we're not going to pay the money for an ambitious Hiddink like replacement. So it will be the usual parade of beaten English League dockets. I'd probably be happy to give Roy Keane a shot.

Pro. F

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Eh, significant amount of fail above. Here, I'll blow your mind: results are the bottom line but the expected result changes depending on the opposition! Wow, drink that in a little.

Great, so now you might acknowledge that the results in the two previous qualifying campaigns were not exceptional.

Xavi6

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Only for you dude, which means it's more a you problem than a me problem.

You made a statement so I took it at face value. If you left out part of it then it's actually your problem dude.

But if we are to go with what you eventually elaborated on

results are the bottom line but the expected result changes depending on the opposition!

then a home draw against 79th in the world Austria is unacceptable right? Because presumably the expected result was a win.

The_Kew_Tour

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

He's here to the end of his contract.

The replacement we get will be a significant downgrade. McCarthy is unlikely to be available really; Kerr would never get another shot; we're not going to pay the money for an ambitious Hiddink like replacement. So it will be the usual parade of beaten English League dockets. I'd probably be happy to give Roy Keane a shot.

The person we replace may not have Trap CV, but surely won't have worse mentality and lack of tactical know how to change games.

Nobody is saying we want manager to play Tika Taka football. Just a manager who can play different formations and be able to change games when needed.

Trap has not done that. He ain't changing either cause he is too stubborn.

dfx-

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Only for you dude, which means it's more a you problem than a me problem.

I doubt it was only for Xavi. 'Results are the bottom line' implies no further clarification. Often the last resort of an ending reign too.

Jarrod

In regards to who we bring in next, they're going to have a stroll in the park. With the expanded Euros, I assume there'll be 9 qualifying groups, with 1st and 2nd qualifying automatically. The best 3rd placed team will also qualify automatically leaving 4 spots up for grabs in the playoffs. Then when we get to the finals, 6 groups with the top two going through plus the four best runners up.

So as far as I'm concerned, Trap is going to be here until the end of the campaign, which hopefully means next summer After that, I definitely don't want anyone on a seven figure contract, considering what the job will entail it's entirely it's unnecessary and I'd like to see someone who could use the farcically expanded Euros to set up a side capable of getting to and putting in a decent showing at the next World Cup and making Lansdowne a place that teams hate coming to.

noodler

Jarrod wrote: »

After that, I definitely don't want anyone on a seven figure contract, considering what the job will entail it's entirely it's unnecessary and I'd like to see someone who could use the farcically expanded Euros to set up a side capable of getting to and putting in a decent showing at the next World Cup and making Lansdowne a place that teams hate coming to.

Traps has made the FAI multiples of what he earns in fairness.

He has kept us in qualification games right until the end of the campaigns, meaning no empty stadiums and has even meant the FAI can charge 45e for a match against Austria (I am not getting into the pros and cons of the attendence/ticket price trade-off, just looking at it financially).

The TV rights for the France games would have been huge.

Actually qualifiying for the euros was the guts of ten million more.

Trap's salary isn't something I worry about too much. In purely financial terms it has paid huge dividends.

Jarrod

noodler wrote: »

Traps has made the FAI multiples of what he earns in fairness.

He has kept us in qualification games right until the end of the campaigns, meaning no empty stadiums and has even meant the FAI can charge 45e for a match against Austria (I am not getting into the pros and cons of the attendence/ticket price trade-off, just looking at it financially).

The TV rights for the France games would have been huge.

Actually qualifiying for the euros was the guts of ten million more.

Trap's salary isn't something I worry about too much. In purely financial terms it has paid huge dividends.

That's a fair argument but do you think there's anyone we could have got that could also have got us to that playoff and to the Euros? I mean someone who wouldn't have commanded such a salary. The only manager who didn't have us in contention until the last game was Stan, Kerr even managed it after the disastrous start to '04 qualifying. As regards ticket sales, the FAI has greatly reduced the cost of tickets since the start of Trap's reign and yet we still don't sell out Lansdowne. I'm not blaming Trap for that but I'm not sure that we're making any more from ticket sales than we did when Stan was in charge. I don't have figures to back it up but thinking back to prices and attendances I'm sure there's not a huge difference.

Also, my original point was in the context of the new style Euros coming in for 2016, which we should expect to qualify for and definitely shouldn't need to pay someone 7 figures to do so.

Lennonist

noodler wrote: »

Traps has made the FAI multiples of what he earns in fairness.

He has kept us in qualification games right until the end of the campaigns, meaning no empty stadiums and has even meant the FAI can charge 45e for a match against Austria (I am not getting into the pros and cons of the attendence/ticket price trade-off, just looking at it financially).

The TV rights for the France games would have been huge.

Actually qualifiying for the euros was the guts of ten million more.

Trap's salary isn't something I worry about too much. In purely financial terms it has paid huge dividends.

His salary isn't an issue because it's largely paid by Denis O'Brien anyway. Will O'Brien continue bankrolling the FAI to pay the next boss when Trap eventually leaves? He might do, 'cos he's got so much money to throw around and it's good for his public image to be seen to be paying the manager of the nation's football team.

Anyway we need Trap out asap because of the damage he's doing to a lot of players in the current set up, and because the team will fail to make the play-offs even though they are capable of doing so. The longer he stays, the more damage he's likely to do.

simongurnick

Lennonist wrote: »

His salary isn't an issue because it's largely paid by Denis O'Brien anyway. Will O'Brien continue bankrolling the FAI to pay the next boss when Trap eventually leaves? He might do, 'cos he's got so much money to throw around and it's good for his public image to be seen to be paying the manager of the nation's football team.

Anyway we need Trap out asap because of the damage he's doing to a lot of players in the current set up, and because the team will fail to make the play-offs even though they are capable of doing so. The longer he stays, the more damage he's likely to do.

Changing manager now would be a disaster. We have as much a chance as Sweden or Austria of taking second place in this group.

homerjay2005

Jarrod wrote: »

As regards ticket sales, the FAI has greatly reduced the cost of tickets since the start of Trap's reign and yet we still don't sell out Lansdowne.

the croke park years, which also corresponded with the biggest boom in the history of our state, gave a massive false impression on attendances in sport in this country...they hit an all time high, but the reality is that the max attendance at competitive level for soccer was 33,000 and it was like this for years before we move to the new stadium.

we have, considering our population, one of the best attendance records in europe yet people seem to keep ignoring this. take out the likes of Germany, England, france and one or two more big populations, we are up there with the best attendances in Europe.

tayto lover

simongurnick wrote: »

Changing manager now would be a disaster. We have as much a chance as Sweden or Austria of taking second place in this group.

Changing managers might ensure we play our best players and instill a bit of impetus into the team, energise them.

simongurnick

tayto lover wrote: »

Changing managers might ensure we play our best players and instill a bit of impetus into the team, energise them.

Best players in whose opinion?

tayto lover

simongurnick wrote: »

Best players in whose opinion?

Many good judges, me included.:D

aindriu80

Like it or not were getting a new manager any way. We may have to wait until the end of the Brasil campaign for financial reasons but its only a matter of time. No matter how great Trapattoni's C.V is he doesn't have TOEFL on it and there of things he could get right with the current Irish team.

We really have to get someone who is knows how to play formations and can make sound tactical swaps, also he has to get on with the entire squad and get the very best out of the players.

simongurnick

tayto lover wrote: »

Many good judges, me included.:D

lol...sure we're all experts from the armchair!

tayto lover

simongurnick wrote: »

lol...sure we're all experts from the armchair!

But we were not laughing at the Euro Finals were we?
Do you think Trap played our best players over there then?

simongurnick

tayto lover wrote: »

But we were not laughing at the Euro Finals were we?
Do you think Trap played our best players over there then?

I think based off our qualification campaign he played the best team.
I think Coleman should have played but he did not have a chance to blood him in during the qualifiers and remained loyal to the players who got us there. Can't think of anyone else that should have played and would have made a difference.
I would fault him at the Euro's for having no plan B. Bilic said before the Croatia game that he knew exactly how we played and he was 100% correct.
Also, all of our "big" players (Given, Dunne, Duff, Keane) had a nightmare tournament.

simongurnick

aindriu80 wrote: »

Like it or not were getting a new manager any way. We may have to wait until the end of the Brasil campaign for financial reasons but its only a matter of time. No matter how great Trapattoni's C.V is he doesn't have TOEFL on it and there of things he could get right with the current Irish team.

We really have to get someone who is knows how to play formations and can make sound tactical swaps, also he has to get on with the entire squad and get the very best out of the players.

Getting on with the squad depends on the players too. You can't have lads acting the bollix and most players who aren't in the first eleven will be unhappy to some degree. There isn't a football manager on the planet who gets on with their entire squad.
Look at Mourinho right now at Madrid, look at the multiple fall outs Fergie has had over the years.

tayto lover

simongurnick wrote: »

I think based off our qualification campaign he played the best team.
I think Coleman should have played but he did not have a chance to blood him in during the qualifiers and remained loyal to the players who got us there. Can't think of anyone else that should have played and would have made a difference.
I would fault him at the Euro's for having no plan B. Bilic said before the Croatia game that he knew exactly how we played and he was 100% correct.
Also, all of our "big" players (Given, Dunne, Duff, Keane) had a nightmare tournament.

Loyalty and failure/fear of change has been the downfall of many a manager.

simongurnick

tayto lover wrote: »

Loyalty and failure/fear of change has been the downfall of many a manager.

It's easy in hindsight to say he was wrong,but at the time they were the players that won qualification. To break up that team wouldn't have been the wisest decision either.

tayto lover

simongurnick wrote: »

It's easy in hindsight to say he was wrong,but at the time they were the players that won qualification. To break up that team wouldn't have been the wisest decision either.

Just like the other night.
Too slow to make changes when the team were dead on their feet and being overrun. Didn't even make the third substitution. I could go on but i'd only annoy myself.

The_B_Man

Look, this is how it is.

Brazil is next year, the next one is feckin Russia, and the one after in bleedin Qatar. The fact is, I'll probably be married before the Russia tournament, and defo before the Qatar one! Me hole am I gonna be able to go and sample the local "cuisine" once I'm locked into a marriage (and I doubt it'll be any good craic in Qatar anyway), so that leaves me with Brazil as me last big blowout. I've a lesbian friend of mine from Brazil that I keep promising to visit, and going by my internet research of Brazilian lesbians, basically we need to qualify. Seriously.

Anyway, for this reason alone (ie, my social life), Trap needs to get us to Brazil. He'll be manager, not just until we get mathematically knocked out but, until we finish out the campaign. He won't be sacked. End of story.

So, I'm behind Trap, I'm behind the team, and I will find it very easy to do so if we keep playin like we did in Sweden and against Austria. I've noticed changes for the better over the last couple of games. We're growing teeth and I find the team selection a fair compromise. He's starting the players that we were begging him to simply include in the squad after the Euros, with the exception of Wes "The Next Messi" Hoolahan, so 10 of 11 is acceptable to me.

In my opinion, we're at the peak of Traps era now. We missed out to France after playing OK in the campaign and had our best performance with our last breath, then in the next campaign we qualified and got destroyed. Currently, we're playing semi-consistently but we've got ourselves into a little hole, that we'll have to simply "be good" to get out of. If we can manage that, I'm confident that we can get through the playoffs and give a respectable showing, the likes of which haven't been seen since our last 3 World Cups.

Let's be positive lads. Look at our run in now. A lot of home games there...!

Jarrod

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the croke park years, which also corresponded with the biggest boom in the history of our state, gave a massive false impression on attendances in sport in this country...they hit an all time high, but the reality is that the max attendance at competitive level for soccer was 33,000 and it was like this for years before we move to the new stadium.

we have, considering our population, one of the best attendance records in europe yet people seem to keep ignoring this. take out the likes of Germany, England, france and one or two more big populations, we are up there with the best attendances in Europe.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. I was responding to the claim that because Trap kept us in the hunt until the last day the FAI were able to charge 45euro a ticket and that the stadium wasn't empty.

I pointed out that I don't think our attendances are actually significantly higher now then under Brian Kerr or Stan (whilst we were at Lansdowne). I'm not going to take Croke Park into consideration because it distorts the stats. Also, the stadium was by no means full on Tuesday and tickets were available for 35euro.

This debate is really nothing to do with my original point which is, whoever we take on after Trap won't be worth a huge sum because with the new Euro format we should qualify with any half competent manager in place.

noodler

Lennonist wrote: »

His salary isn't an issue because it's largely paid by Denis O'Brien anyway. Will O'Brien continue bankrolling the FAI to pay the next boss when Trap eventually leaves? H

Is that even true anymore?

I thought it was half initially and even less in the extension.

Lennonist

noodler wrote: »

Is that even true anymore?

I thought it was half initially and even less in the extension.

You mean the FAI are paying the pensioner most of his 1.2 million salary? It's a disgrace that they did a new deal with Trap prior to the Euros in Poland, and then when they discover he's no longer fit for purpose they can't afford to sack him.

gustafo

The_B_Man wrote: »

Look, this is how it is.

Brazil is next year, the next one is feckin Russia, and the one after in bleedin Qatar. The fact is, I'll probably be married before the Russia tournament, and defo before the Qatar one! Me hole am I gonna be able to go and sample the local "cuisine" once I'm locked into a marriage (and I doubt it'll be any good craic in Qatar anyway), so that leaves me with Brazil as me last big blowout. I've a lesbian friend of mine from Brazil that I keep promising to visit, and going by my internet research of Brazilian lesbians, basically we need to qualify. Seriously.

Anyway, for this reason alone (ie, my social life), Trap needs to get us to Brazil. He'll be manager, not just until we get mathematically knocked out but, until we finish out the campaign. He won't be sacked. End of story.

So, I'm behind Trap, I'm behind the team, and I will find it very easy to do so if we keep playin like we did in Sweden and against Austria. I've noticed changes for the better over the last couple of games. We're growing teeth and I find the team selection a fair compromise. He's starting the players that we were begging him to simply include in the squad after the Euros, with the exception of Wes "The Next Messi" Hoolahan, so 10 of 11 is acceptable to me.

In my opinion, we're at the peak of Traps era now. We missed out to France after playing OK in the campaign and had our best performance with our last breath, then in the next campaign we qualified and got destroyed. Currently, we're playing semi-consistently but we've got ourselves into a little hole, that we'll have to simply "be good" to get out of. If we can manage that, I'm confident that we can get through the playoffs and give a respectable showing, the likes of which haven't been seen since our last 3 World Cups.

Let's be positive lads. Look at our run in now. A lot of home games there...!

good god did ya ever hear so much tripe in your life ??

The_Kew_Tour

I can nearly predict what is going to happen in the Sweden/Austria double header.

We will draw with Sweden. Then we need the 3 points in Austria. We take the lead early on, but it is all Austria after that. We draw.

Then the players and manager say we can still get result in Germany. We lose 1-0.

Bye bye Brazil.

Different qualification but sadly same story.

You just get sick of the same old failings happening each and everytime.

Rekop dog

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I can nearly predict what is going to happen in the Sweden/Austria double header.

We will draw with Sweden. Then we need the 3 points in Austria. We take the lead early on, but it is all Austria after that. We draw.

Then the players and manager say we can still get result in Germany. We lose 1-0.

Bye bye Brazil.

Different qualification but sadly same story.

You just get sick of the same old failings happening each and everytime.

Well that would be a different story from our previous qualification campaigns under Trap then, and an expected one in this group.

The_Kew_Tour

Rekop dog wrote: »

Well that would be a different story from our previous qualification campaigns under Trap then, and an expected one in this group.

Would it?

We practically draw with every team around our level. Cant win a game for love or money.

Mars Bar

This is no longer about the match and is probably more appropriate for the Superthread.