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Moving to a less interesting job

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  • 24-03-2013 10:23pm
    #1
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭


    I may have a bit of a dilemma on my hands soon: I am working as a software developer in .NET. The pay is poor (25k) as the company is struggling for sales. I have a second interview for a VBA/Access job coming up and I think I have a good chance of getting it. The pay is much better (30k+).
    For those that don't know programming languages very well, let me explain;VBA is a bit of a stone age language. Not very interesting to develop in, not very challenging or varied in what you can do with it.
    I really enjoy my current job (most of the time). I get to do lots of interesting things every day; desktop development, web development, SQL, ASP.NET, Server OS, Networking etc.
    I don't really like VBA; I did it for a couple of years before my current job but left it because I found it boring (I had a lot of travel in the job as well).
    I wanted to work in a more interesting programming language so that's why I went for a .NET role and I got this one. However I've been on the same salary for two years now and there's no chance of a raise. I have tried for other .NET roles but I didn't get any of them (I'm only an average programmer).
    I need the money though as I am only living from day to day in this job. I would love to own my own home and getting this job would enable me to do that.
    However I am afraid I will get bored and de-motivated working in VBA.
    I don't know what to do. I suppose I have to wait and see if I get the job first but I am posting this in advance to get some opinions first.
    There might be a chance of some .NET development in the job I am interviewing for but it's a slim chance.


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    #2
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,969 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Are you contributing to any open source projects, or working on any applications of your own that you could market as a sideline?


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    #3
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,257 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    It sounds like the only benefit of the VBA job would be quite short-lived. I'd take the longer term view and skill up in net so you've a better chance in interviews. You must have a good idea of what you need to brush up on.


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    #4
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    Are you contributing to any open source projects, or working on any applications of your own that you could market as a sideline?

    I have a .NET website that I did while I was in the last VBA job (it helped me get the current position) but it's a bit out of date now. To be honest I don't really feel like doing "side-projects" because even though I like IT, I don't always feel like booting up a computer at the weekend or in the week evenings as I spend 40 hours a week in front of one.
    I was able to do it before but now I want to live a little. Maybe that sounds lazy but it's hard to do it again. I worked my ass off on that website and I don't know if I could do it again.
    Working on side-projects is difficult when you are in a full-time job and I find emplyers don't really take them seriously when you go for interviews.


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    #5
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Eoin wrote: »
    It sounds like the only benefit of the VBA job would be quite short-lived. I'd take the longer term view and skill up in net so you've a better chance in interviews. You must have a good idea of what you need to brush up on.

    I mainly go down on technical things like reviewing a piece of code and finding what is wrong with it and also when I am asked about design methodolgies and design patterns (I have no experience of that).
    I have revised and revised before interviews but it's no good, I can't cover everything.
    It's easier to get a job in VBA 'cause those questions don't come up. I'm beginning to think I am just not good enough to be a "proper" developer and I should just admit defeat and take the less prestigious job. I don't want to admit defeat but it pays better.
    I have to take money from my parents (they can well afford it but that's not the point) and it's humiliating.


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    #6
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,257 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    risteard_99 wrote: »
    I find emplyers don't really take them seriously when you go for interviews.

    I would consider showing an interest in the technology as a good thing if I was interviewing a developer.

    A sideline project could be a pet project at work if you can find a bit of time here and there; it doesn't have to be at home.

    Though maybe investing a little bit of your own time now is better than going back to an area that doesn't interest you at all and does not sound like a good career move.


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    #7
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Eoin wrote: »
    I would consider showing an interest in the technology as a good thing if I was interviewing a developer.

    A sideline project could be a pet project at work if you can find a bit of time here and there; it doesn't have to be at home.

    Though maybe investing a little bit of your own time now is better than going back to an area that doesn't interest you at all and does not sound like a good career move.

    I hear what you are saying but others would say that it's an act of hubris to stay in a job that doesn't pay well (and is by no means stable) just because it is interesting and stimulating.
    I swore when I left the last VBA job that I would never go back to it again. I was happy when I started coding in C# in this job. It was what I always wanted but the pay is simply not enough.
    However money is important and this job is with a prestigious company. I think I could take the boredom if it meant I could make a beter life for myself.


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    #8
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,257 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    risteard_99 wrote: »
    I hear what you are saying but others would say that it's an act of hubris to stay in a job that doesn't pay well (and is by no means stable) just because it is interesting and stimulating.
    I swore when I left the last VBA job that I would never go back to it again. I was happy when I started coding in C# in this job. It was what I always wanted but the pay is simply not enough.
    However money is important and this job is with a prestigious company.

    My point was really that you might be increasing your longer term career options by staying there and skilling up, not because it's more interesting.
    risteard_99 wrote: »
    I think I could take the boredom if it meant I could make a beter life for myself

    Just make sure you're thinking longer term than a few extra grand now. In 3,4,5 years time, do you think you'd have more options as a VBA developer or a .NET developer?

    I wouldn't rule out investing a bit of time in upskilling now though so you've a better chance in the interviews.

    Is the new company big enough that you could move to another role down the road? In that case, then it could be worth going for.

    Best of luck with whatever you decide


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    #9
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,675 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    Sorry to gatecrash this....

    My understanding was that software developers were rolling in it, could name their own price and so on and so forth.....

    Is that not the case?


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    #10
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,257 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    Tombo2001 wrote: »
    Sorry to gatecrash this....

    My understanding was that software developers were rolling in it, could name their own price and so on and so forth.....

    Is that not the case?

    That's a little exaggerated, but there is lots of demand for experienced software developers. There seems to be a good few junior developers around though, so employers can be a bit pickier.


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    #11
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,969 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    There is lots of demand for developers - in some languages, and with a certain depth of experience.

    I haven't heard of VBA being in demand, and most of the devs I know pretend that they know nothing about it.


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    #12
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Well I've had two telephone interviews and I'm going for the walk-in interview tomorrow so I must be in with a shout. The thought of going back doing VBA depresses me a bit I must say.
    I will try and sound them out about how much possibilty there would be for me to do some things in .NET when I am in the job.
    If I am offered it and then turn it down, the guy in the agency who set it up for me will be fuming.
    I don't know what to do really.


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    #13
    youcancallmeal
    Registered Users Posts: 8,023 ✭✭✭youcancallmeal


    Wow thats a criminal amount of money to be paying a .net developer. I would suggest keep looking for another .net job. I can't imagine it will take much longer if you just keep applying also all the time you are building up marketable experience.


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    #14
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    youcancallmeal wrote: »
    Wow thats a criminal amount of money to be paying a .net developer. I would suggest keep looking for another .net job. I can't imagine it will take much longer if you just keep applying also all the time you are building up marketable experience.
    It's ridiculous money but my boss is notoriously tight with money. Every person who has worked for him or had any financial dealings with him has had problems getting money off him. That's another story though. I have tried to get a better paid job but I am restricted geographically in where I can apply to. I have just accepted that I'm not going to get a better .NET job at this stage. I will accept the new job if I am offered it.


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    #15
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Don't know if anyone is still reading this thread but I just heard back from the agency and it looks like I have got the job. I have mixed feelings but I am more happy than sad to be honest. Sad to be leaving .NET behind but glad to be moving on to a bigger salary. I can finally end the humiliation of having to take money from my parents and maybe even think about accomplishing a long-term goal; owning my own home.
    It's a compromise but one I feel I have to make. There is a recession on and even though IT is not doing too badly, I might not get an offer like this again for a few years.
    I mean there are people in this country that are out of work and would take anything at the moment so I'm sure they would think I was crazy to turn down a job because the type of work wasn't what I wanted to do.
    I does hurt to give up my cherished dream of becoming a "proper" .NET developer but I just have to accept it isn't going to happen.
    There is the possibility of doing some .NET if the company decides to move in that direction (they are not a software company) so I have to cling to that.
    Just thought those that replied to me would like to know how it finished up.
    I would like some feedback (if anyone wants to).


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    #16
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    I'm resurrecting this thread to act as a warning to others (and in the hope of getting some advice). Things didn't work out too well for me since I moved to the VBA job. I left after just over a year. A combination of boredom and also just not being able to do the job were the reasons. I hated VBA so I don't know why I took the job in the first place. I suppose I thought I could tolerate it and also maybe hoped they would move on to a .NET language(s).
    It soon became clear to me that neither of those things were going to happen. I also had difficulty performing my role as it was a financial institution and most of my tasks seemed to require an understanding of finance (which I don't have and have no desire to either).
    I was working with one other guy and he quit the same day as he hated it too. I knew it was a crap job when I took it and I feel really stupid now. I got really depressed there and often left for work in tears at the prospect of the day ahead. I also had a panic attack one morning and had to take a week off. I tried to upskill at home in the evenings learning new stuff but I just couldn't as I was really depressed.
    Maybe I should have toughed it out but I just couldn't do it. After I left I was out of work for six months. During that six months I did a good few interviews for .NET jobs but I didn't get any of them. Eventually I got a 10 month contract teaching IT. Even though it was a short contract I had to take it as I couldn't get anything else. I actually liked it and would have continued in it if another contract was offered. Even though my manager was very happy with me there wasn't any work for me so that ended.
    I've been job-hunting since then and I've come close to landing good jobs but just fell short (or so I've been told by the people who interviewed me). All in all it's a bit of a mess and I can't see a way out of it. I've been keeping myself busy; I've done a couple of small websites and I'm teaching myself new stuff like MVC and AngularJS but in interviews that doesn't seem to cut much ice with them. They want commercial experience, not stuff I did on the side. The stuff I did in the job I did before the VBA job is now a bit out-of-date (it was three years ago). To make matters worse that company has now gone bust so that isn't good for me.
    I am also hamstrung by the fact I cannot move too far from where I am living for personal reasons (so that limits the jobs I can apply for). I've now got four gaps of six months each in the last eight years on my CV. I could fill them in by lying but I don't really want to do that. I've really made a mess of things and despite my best efforts I can see myself being out of work for a long time. The only job I've come close to getting was actually a VBA-based job. I went for the interview for the craic even though I had no intention of accepting if successful and sure enough I was contacted asking for references a week later. I told them I had changed my mind. It just proves my point about VBA jobs being s###e as nobody wants to do them.
    I'm getting very uptight about being out of work; even though it's only been four months I am getting really anxious. I'm pacing the floor in the evenings,I can't sit down for very long so I don't watch much TV.I also don't sleep very well even though I can't wait for when I go to bed as the evenings are so boring and I want the morning to come quickly so I can get back to looking for jobs again. I'm always thinking about it, constantly wracking my brains trying to think of a way out of this mess. It's my own fault, I should have listened to the people on this thread who told me not to take that crappy job. It was a year down the drain and I haven't done much of note since then either. I learnt a few new things in the teaching job and I've been desperately trying to learn new stuff by myself in the hope of broadening my knowledge. However I'm just concerned that all the gaps I have will be held against me by potential employers.


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