Tenant Query

kevgaa

Hi,

I have a query as to where I stand with an issue with my tenants. I called round over the weekend to decorate, painting the kitchen etc.. however while decorating I had to move a free standing freezer ( owned by tenants and they did not ask me could they install it, Granted it has been there over a year and I never said anything about it. ) The issue is that the freezer has leaked water at some stage and has destroyed the wooden floors under it.

My query is

1). Who is responsible the tenant or I?

What do I do next and what are my options? House insurance etc...

The tenants have been decent and are in the house 3yrs and will be there for the foreseeable future as they are now on a council scheme.

Thanks in advance.
Kev.

D3PO

its essentially the tenants issue if they have caused the damage.

HOWEVER Id be very slow to push that if they are there 3 years been no hassle and likely to remain for the forseeable future.

Why would you cut off your nose to spite your face ? Any repair you do is tax deductable anyway so it would cost you significantly less than you think anyway.

Besides which having wooden floors in a kitchen is a really bad idea anyway.

If it means you end up tiling the kitchen instead then its actually a good thing as this is what you should really have in a rental anyway.

KTRIC

Did you unplug it ?

kevgaa

D3PO: You pointed out my exact dilemma and you say is it worth the hassle. The tenants are by no means model tenants often bothering me over stupid things but I can live with that rent is always paid on time etc..

The kitchen in question is a kitchen diner with the kitchen area tiled and the dining area wooden floors. The tenants in their wisdom put the freezer in the corner of the diner on the wooden floors despite there been loads of room on the tiles. One wall completely free.

No I did not unplug the freezer. by the looks of floor it has been damaged for months as its split broke etc..

The next question is could I get it repaired under house insurance? Or approach the tenants and see how I get on?

Kev.

D3PO

kevgaa wrote: »

D3PO: You pointed out my exact dilemma and you say is it worth the hassle. The tenants are by no means model tenants often bothering me over stupid things but I can live with that rent is always paid on time etc..

The kitchen in question is a kitchen diner with the kitchen area tiled and the dining area wooden floors. The tenants in their wisdom put the freezer in the corner of the diner on the wooden floors despite there been loads of room on the tiles. One wall completely free.

No I did not unplug the freezer. by the looks of floor it has been damaged for months as its split broke etc..

The next question is could I get it repaired under house insurance? Or approach the tenants and see how I get on?

Kev.

House insurance claim would be pointless. When you consider your excess and then future increased insurance costs makes no financial sense to go this route.

Personally Id suck it up talk to the tenants let them know your not happy and tell them to move the fridge to the tiled area, explain as a goodwill gesture you wont charge them but if more damage occurs in future they will be liable.

like I said no point in losing good tenants over something so small.

murphaph

I'd leave it until they are leaving. If they stay several more years on the RAS then it's them that has to live with the damage. You can always retain their deposit to cover at least some of the repair costs. How old is the floor anyway? When is it likely to need renewal assuming no damage?

In an ideal world you could order them to fix their damage immediately but I don't imagine that will get you very far if they are RAS tenants. The council aren't strictly responsible but it might be worth a shot getting them to pay for the damage.

If the costs are going to be significant then perhaps enquire with your insurer.

djimi

D3PO wrote: »

like I said no point in losing good tenants over something so small.

It depends on how much the repairs are going to cost. If its a case that its going to cost hundreds (but not enough to make an insurance claim worthwhile) then I would absolutely be looking to recover the money from the tenants. The tenant caused the issue in the first place, and while I agree its not worth losing good tenants over a dispute like this, Im not sure I would describe someone who cost me hundreds in repairs as a good tenant...

Ray Palmer

They caused the damage therfore they get it fixed. Deposit is not there to cover damage as it arrises. It is there for damage found when leaving.

The issue is do you get them to fix it or do you get it fixed. If they do it they may not do a good job or cut corners.

D3PO

djimi wrote: »

It depends on how much the repairs are going to cost. If its a case that its going to cost hundreds (but not enough to make an insurance claim worthwhile) then I would absolutely be looking to recover the money from the tenants. The tenant caused the issue in the first place, and while I agree its not worth losing good tenants over a dispute like this, Im not sure I would describe someone who cost me hundreds in repairs as a good tenant...

Sorry Im making the assumption its only a few boards that would need replacing and therefore relatively low cost. Probably shouldnt have clearly cost of the repair has to be considered.

Mr.Wemmick

Have the tenants got insurance in case their property in the house gets damaged by flood or accident? I rent and I have it - I would not hesitate to repair any damage done to the LLs floor if is was my fault. You need to check with them and ask, so they can make a claim and fix the floor.

If your fridge leaked and damaged the floor, then it would be up to you to fix it.. and from what you have written, they would be very quick to inform you and ask you to repair it.

It's their fridge, and it leaked on your property and damaged the floor.
It needs to be repaired and they're responsible.

I would go back into the property, giving them the correct notice, and photograph the damage to the floor and the fridge - see if you can locate the leak. Make sure they're there when you do it, tell them you're going to get quotes for the floor to be repaired but they have to pay the bill. I would also demand that the leaking fridge is removed from the property immediately.

djimi

Mr.Wemmick wrote: »

Have the tenants got insurance in case their property in the house gets damaged by flood or accident? I rent and I have it - I would not hesitate to repair any damage done to the LLs floor if is was my fault. You need to check with them and ask, so they can make a claim and fix the floor.

As a tenant the highest level of insurance you can take out is contents insurance, which would not cover damage of this nature.

Mr.Wemmick

djimi wrote: »

As a tenant the highest level of insurance you can take out is contents insurance, which would not cover damage of this nature.

Never knew that. I thought damage would be covered.. goes to show how little experience of insurance I have - as a tenant whenever anything has been damaged by me, it's paid for and fixed without delay. Tenants need to take care of the property, their rental home, respecting it and the LL.

D3PO

Mr.Wemmick wrote: »

Never knew that. I thought damage would be covered.. goes to show how little experience of insurance I have - as a tenant whenever anything has been damaged by me, it's paid for and fixed without delay. Tenants need to take care of the property, their rental home, respecting it and the LL.

You must have an insurable interest in something to insure it. I.E you must own it. You dont own the floors as a tenant therefore couldnt have insurance cover on it.

The same way I couldnt insure Lionel Messi's legs as they are not mine to insure.

Mr.Wemmick

D3PO wrote: »

You must have an insurable interest in something to insure it. I.E you must own it. You dont own the floors as a tenant therefore couldnt have insurance cover on it.

The same way I couldnt insure Lionel Messi's legs as they are not mine to insure.

yeah, but their Fridge i.e. their property, has caused accidental damage to another's property, no?

djimi

Mr.Wemmick wrote: »

yeah, but their Fridge i.e. their property, has caused accidental damage to another's property, no?

Contents insurance would only cover damage to the fridge, not damage caused by it.

Mr.Wemmick

I have lived in Europe too long.. as far as I remember, we had to have insurance that covered damage to LL's property by us, our furniture, washing machine etc. Thought it would be the same here.. not just contents insurance.

murphaph

Mr.Wemmick wrote: »

I have lived in Europe too long.. as far as I remember, we had to have insurance that covered damage to LL's property by us, our furniture, washing machine etc. Thought it would be the same here.. not just contents insurance.

Indeed, standard renters insurance here in Germany does cover damage to the landlord's property (and say the flat below you if your broken washing machine leaks down onto their silk bed linen).

We are not renters here but we have this insurance in case we damage the neighbour below or indeed the structure of the building.

In general the Irish are poorly insured I'd say. How many Irish have general 3rd party liability insurance for example? Can it even be bought?

Joe Hart

You will have a tough time proving negligence on the tenants part. They could be have been away for a night whilst there was a power cut.

Gatling

If there decent tenants why not actually sit down with them an explain your concerned about the damage to the floor ,and that you would like the fridge moved and the damaged floor fixed to a satisfactory standard ,and also ask them to have there fridge looked at,

And I dont think they would have needed permission to buy and bring there own fridge into the property

nibtrix

Joe Hart wrote: »

You will have a tough time proving negligence on the tenants part. They could be have been away for a night whilst there was a power cut.

Surely it's still their fault? It's their freezer and they placed it in an unsuitable area on the wooden floor. If they'd put it on the tiled area then there wouldn't have been an issue in the case of a power cut.

kevgaa

Hi Folks,

Thanks for the responses. I'm satisfied that the damage was caused by by the tenants freezer and he confirmed that today. However when I brought up the issue of getting it sorted and he is liable and i was willing to split the cost he wasn't best please.

He said he knew the law and it was my responsibility and was wear and tear. I told him if he has an issue bring it up with the PRTB or council but i'm willing to bet they will side with me.

He calmed down after that and has agreed to move the freezer to the tiled area and they will live with the damage till they decide what to do about it. So I will wait and see.

Thanks again,

Kev.

djimi

Wear and tear?!! Fantastic!