Protest at Tower Hotel

Up2NoGood

albert kidd wrote: »

you asked for folk who were there to be named and shamed..why do you want the peoples names splattered all over the internet?

my reason was a personal one..im not part of any group.

I would like these people named and shamed for the exact same reason the

banks and bankers should be..... People / Institutions should be held

accountable for their words and actions !!

I agree with the protest, just not the personal attacks on people weather

in the public eye or not.

Sully

albert kidd wrote: »

you asked for folk who were there to be named and shamed..why do you want the peoples names splattered all over the internet?

my reason was a personal one..im not part of any group.

I don't think he meant literally, figure of speech.

albert kidd

Up2NoGood wrote: »

I would like these people named and shamed for the exact same reason the

banks and bankers should be..... People / Institutions should be held

accountable for their words and actions !!

I agree with the protest, just not the personal attacks on people weather

in the public eye or not.

people should be held accountable..especially for what has went on in this country..but the majority of them havent and never will be..

democracy in this country is merely for show..if your vote could change anything it wouldnt be allowed..

if standing outside the tower hotel and letting them animals hear what i think of them it is my way of getting my feelings across then so be it..because as long as i draw breath ill never vote for any of them.

Trotter

The hopes, fears, worries and awful current situations of many families in Waterford deserve better.

They deserve better in terms of acceptable protests.

They deserve better than to be treated poorly by this and the previous government. Many of these people engage in social media to discuss with great dignity about their own frustrations. For example, comparing the unemployment rate in Waterford to other gateway cities. My opinion on the amalgamation of Waterford city and county is known. I believe that if it doesn't happen in the other gateway cities then its a relegation for us. I try my best to put that point across in a dignified way. That's important to me.

Saying that, the announcement was a great step. Anything that brings the Taoiseach to Waterford for positive reasons is a good thing. If he was coming to open an empty library in Waterford it would've frustrated me no end. I expressed my thumbs up to the great announcement elsewhere here on the forum.

It's important too to many people to be able to express their totally justifiable frustrations in any way they can that remains dignified. I don't think the protest while the Taoiseach did us any good. 15000 people marching in town before sent the message in a right way. Each to their own but I didn't feel comfortable with the coverage of the protest when the Taoiseachs party arrived. Regardless of who he is, and how he in my opinion has allowed ministers to chip away at Waterford's 'assets', the office he legitimately holds should be respected accordingly, and protested to suitably.

Having said all that, going back to the social media aspect, Im also uncomfortable how things are sometimes discussed here on the forum and on other social media outlets. I notice how criticism of current situations in Waterford is commented on flippantly by a similar group of clearly alligned posters. I'd love if people said - ' I'm a Fine Gael / Fine Fáil / Whatever supporter, and it is my choice to give them more of my time and benefit of my doubt than others.'

I'm uncomfortable with how people's genuine grievances are often sneered at disrespectfully because some maybe perceive that to be what would make their chosen party hierarcy happy. I'm uncomfortable about how if I write 'Ye're all imagining things about problem X, party Y haven't said it'll happen..' Then the same group of people will have thanked / liked / favourited it, depending on the social media involved.

Essentially for the TLDR, lets respect that some people are a little or a lot affiliated. Lets respect their right to do that. Let them respect people's right to feel hard done by their affiliated party without sneering or grouping the dignified posters/protesters in with the outrageously undignified comments which do the cause of those respectfully annoyed people no good.

Honesty. Even if it annoys party HQ.

Respect, even if you dislike/hate the party the person supports.

Dignity no matter what the protest.

/Rant

nice_very

want to add my 2c to this thread.. I was not at the protest, I would have been if I could have been, I was however at the recent protest in Ferrybank against Hogan, and many other protests. I am not a member of any political party, so please desist putting a label on people like me, I have never carried a flag or banner of any political party. The anti property tax campaign, I will say, were in the majority but not alone. The "independent protester" and the IRSP attended too.

Do people not get that we (protesters and many more who dont protest) are fed up with the lies and carry on of the govt? I would say that nobody at the tower on thursday did not welcome the jobs or museum, so that argument is very much invalid.

The protest was against Kenny and his Government, their lies and selling out of the Irish people, many people who were there had the liathroidi to call him to his face: traitor, and quite rightly to put shame on him. Its funny how Burton at the Granville and Kenny at the Tower did almost exactly the same...: get out of the car all smiles thinking people were there to greet them, and how quickly their faces dropped when they realised that was not the case.

Cabaal

albert kidd wrote: »

people should be held accountable..

So you think people should be held accountable? Great!

So, those people that have sad Enda should be hung, have his throat cut, that people should go after politicians family's at home and make such comments as...and i quote "Love to bump into that ****er on a dark country rd and wipe that smirk of his mug.."

Do you also believe that they should be held accountable?

Finnbar01

Cabaal wrote: »

So you think people should be held accountable? Great!

So, those people that have sad Enda should be hung, have his throat cut, that people should go after politicians family's at home and make such comments as...and i quote "Love to bump into that ****er on a dark country rd and wipe that smirk of his mug.."

Do you also believe that they should be held accountable?

Some woman in England said she'd like to egg David Cameron. Two weeks later the police come along.

I think the clowns on that facebook page should be ignored.

7upfree

Cabaal wrote: »

So you think people should be held accountable? Great!

So, those people that have sad Enda should be hung, have his throat cut, that people should go after politicians family's at home and make such comments as...and i quote "Love to bump into that ****er on a dark country rd and wipe that smirk of his mug.."

Do you also believe that they should be held accountable?

Are you even aware of the depth of hatred towards Enda and his cronies? Because of the platform of lies that they were elected on? And what they have done to generations of Irish people yet to come?

Thousands of home repossessions loom, some children are going to school hungry, people can barely pay for the basics. And you ask that people who - righty - vent their anger "should be held accountable". No they certainly should not. This sham of a Government, it's bully boy enforcers, and its deluded, idiotic "supporters" should ALL be held accountable.


They have gotten away very mildly, and if threats are all they have to contend with, then they have gotten off light indeed.

7upfree

albert kidd wrote: »

people should be held accountable..especially for what has went on in this country..but the majority of them havent and never will be..

democracy in this country is merely for show..if your vote could change anything it wouldnt be allowed..

if standing outside the tower hotel and letting them animals hear what i think of them it is my way of getting my feelings across then so be it..because as long as i draw breath ill never vote for any of them.

Well said. Reality. A pity it doesn't dawn on a lot more.

Sully

7upfree wrote: »

Are you even aware of the depth of hatred towards Enda and his cronies? Because of the platform of lies that they were elected on? And what they have done to generations of Irish people yet to come?

Thousands of home repossessions loom, some children are going to school hungry, people can barely pay for the basics. And you ask that people who - righty - vent their anger "should be held accountable". No they certainly should not. This sham of a Government, it's bully boy enforcers, and its deluded, idiotic "supporters" should ALL be held accountable.


They have gotten away very mildly, and if threats are all they have to contend with, then they have gotten off light indeed.

Perhaps in Waterford, but not countrywide. Seeing as Fine Gael won the by-election in Meath East (and the next austerity party with a history of lies came a close second), remain second or topping all national polls (with the next austerity party with a history of lies coming a close second or first) and Enda Kenny remains the most popular leader or one of the most popular leaders (I believe, followed by Fianna Fail!). So, by your logic, the majority of the Meath East electorate who voted should be held responsible and the thousands of people who are surveyed for the polling should also be held responsible. There is still a very strong support for the main government party and a strong support for austerity parties. Parties that are both supporting a property tax.

Most level headed supporters understand that the amount of people struggling, sending kids to school hungry and so on has increased since the recession began. Most people understand that the cuts are not helping them, but making it even worse. Most people are frustrated that the top isn't being cut, politicians are not taking more of a cut (they have taken about 30-40% so far, but it isn't enough for those on higher salaries and when you consider expenses) and most people are annoyed with some of the lies - yes there were lies - in the general election campaign. Anybody who knows me on a personal or political level knows I am one of those who have repeatedly pointed out my frustrations and anger, much to some of the die hard supporters disgust. I have been at political party meetings where members have voiced the same points I am raising above and want to see more balance and fairness.

But despite all of the above, this country IS improving. It has only been two years (only just) since this government took office and there has been strong positive indications that things are slowly improving and moving upwards. I'm not an economist, christ I am ****e at anything Maths related but I do read the papers, listen to the news, look at economists reports, look at the figures and so on. The country as a whole, economically and on the jobs front, is slowly improving and that's a fact. Are these improvements reflecting on the ground? Not in the majority of cases, no. Could they? I very much doubt any austerity implantation will help the less well off in society but I do feel that those on the top could have taken more of a hit (not withstanding that its those on the top that are helping in our recovery and taxing the **** out of everybody will have a negative impact on our country).

The vast majority of those protesting took the positive element out of the announcement by shouting, throwing coffee, beeping car horns and being generally destructive on a positive news day for our City which has been crying out for more jobs and investment. The vast majority were not there because of 'broken promises' or those on the ground feeling the pinch. They protest at anything any government does because they don't believe in how we do things in this country - politically and economically. That includes when we had the Celtic tiger. They are a different political party than we have on offer from FF/FG/Lab/SF/DDI/Ind. If DDI were in power, they would be protesting because its their life blood - oppose, oppose and well, oppose.

Once again, Waterford were reflected in a negative spotlight in the national and local media. Does that make a difference? Waterford has always had a reputation of being a militant city, strongly into Unions, and so on. Employers don't like that and employers don't want to come here and be surrounded in negativity. A 200+ jobs announcement and all people could do is shout it down and suggest boycotting a hotel for hosting the event! Not withstanding peoples right to protest and let the government know they are angry (again, a small portion), but at a very positive event for Waterford and for the duration of the event? That for me, is where the line was crossed. A protest was expected by all, even the visiting parties knew it - Waterford always does. But the behaviour and attitude by some to destroy a positive event for Waterford is where the "shame shame shame" should be firmly directed at.

nice_very wrote: »

Its funny how Burton at the Granville and Kenny at the Tower did almost exactly the same...: get out of the car all smiles thinking people were there to greet them, and how quickly their faces dropped when they realised that was not the case.

Just worth noting here that it was known well before the visit that there would be protests and they would have been informed on the way down that the protesters had gathered. Your forgetting that Waterford has a reputation for this and it was on Facebook the day before they came even. From the pictures I saw, they were still smiling well after they arrived and were being shouted at.

7upfree

Sully wrote: »

in Waterford, but not countrywide. Seeing as Fine Gael won the by-election in Meath East (and the next austerity party with a history of lies came a close second), remain second or topping all national polls (with the next austerity party with a history of lies coming a close second or first) and Enda Kenny remains the most popular leader or one of the most popular leaders (I believe, followed by Fianna Fail!). So, by your logic, the majority of the Meath East electorate who voted should be held responsible and the thousands of people who are surveyed for the polling should also be held responsible. There is still a very strong support for the main government party and a strong support for austerity parties. Parties that are both supporting a property tax.

Wrong on both counts. She was elected on a sympathy vote, plus 65% of the electorate never turned up. And yes indeed, the sheep who voted for these people in Meath must burden their responsibility. And in fairness, given the circumstances, with Meath being a FG stronghold, the result was a foregone conclusion. And a wonderful showing by DDI on their first outing. Watch that space.

Sully wrote: »

Most level headed supporters understand that the amount of people struggling, sending kids to school hungry and so on has increased since the recession began. Most people understand that the cuts are not helping them, but making it even worse. Most people are frustrated that the top isn't being cut, politicians are not taking more of a cut (they have taken about 30-40% so far, but it isn't enough for those on higher salaries and when you consider expenses) and most people are annoyed with some of the lies - yes there were lies - in the general election campaign. Anybody who knows me on a personal or political level knows I am one of those who have repeatedly pointed out my frustrations and anger, much to some of the die hard supporters disgust. I have been at political party meetings where members have voiced the same points I am raising above and want to see more balance and fairness.

"Rising above". Do explain....the reality is that there is a gravy train in Kildare street which needs to be urgently addressed. This cannot happen as long as people follow a party ideology like sheep, unquestioningly.

Sully wrote: »

But despite all of the above, this country IS improving. It has only been two years (only just) since this government took office and there has been strong positive indications that things are slowly improving and moving upwards. I'm not an economist, christ I am ****e at anything Maths related but I do read the papers, listen to the news, look at economists reports, look at the figures and so on. The country as a whole, economically and on the jobs front, is slowly improving and that's a fact. Are these improvements reflecting on the ground? Not in the majority of cases, no. Could they? I very much doubt any austerity implantation will help the less well off in society but I do feel that those on the top could have taken more of a hit (not withstanding that its those on the top that are helping in our recovery and taxing the **** out of everybody will have a negative impact on our country).

Seriously, Sully. Improving? Not a hope. The same economists who tell us it is "improving" are the same ones who couldn't predict the bust. So don't rely too much on what you read. In a week where we see part-time presenters being paid over €200k in RTE, that would be a very hard sell for most people.

Sully wrote: »

The vast majority of those protesting took the positive element out of the announcement by shouting, throwing coffee, beeping car horns and being generally destructive on a positive news day for our City which has been crying out for more jobs and investment. The vast majority were not there because of 'broken promises' or those on the ground feeling the pinch. They protest at anything any government does because they don't believe in how we do things in this country - politically and economically. That includes when we had the Celtic tiger. They are a different political party than we have on offer from FF/FG/Lab/SF/DDI/Ind. If DDI were in power, they would be protesting because its their life blood - oppose, oppose and well, oppose.

I would agree to a degree about SOME of the protesters. But what are we to do? Roll over and take it up the ass - again? It's a pity more didn't turn out actually.

Sully wrote: »

Once again, Waterford were reflected in a negative spotlight in the national and local media. Does that make a difference? Waterford has always had a reputation of being a militant city, strongly into Unions, and so on. Employers don't like that and employers don't want to come here and be surrounded in negativity. A 200+ jobs announcement and all people could do is shout it down and suggest boycotting a hotel for hosting the event! Not withstanding peoples right to protest and let the government know they are angry (again, a small portion), but at a very positive event for Waterford and for the duration of the event? That for me, is where the line was crossed. A protest was expected by all, even the visiting parties knew it - Waterford always does. But the behaviour and attitude by some to destroy a positive event for Waterford is where the "shame shame shame" should be firmly directed at.

There was no line crossed. The people were entitled to protest. I'm only sorry there were not more. We have a Government who are completely detached fro the reality of the situation. Who promised several things and delivered nothing.
Who have sold the populace into economic servitude for generations to come. And who are undermining Waterford at every opportunity. And you wonder why people protest Sully? Shame indeed on Enda Kenny, his cronies, and his supporters.

Can I ask you - as a FG supporter - why you blindly follow the party mantra - without a thought for this City and its Citizens? It fascinates me to watch people who are obviously intelligent and educated - engage in this behaviour; in relation to ANY party.

Roanmore

7upfree wrote: »

Are you even aware of the depth of hatred towards Enda and his cronies? Because of the platform of lies that they were elected on? And what they have done to generations of Irish people yet to come?

Thousands of home repossessions loom, some children are going to school hungry, people can barely pay for the basics. And you ask that people who - righty - vent their anger "should be held accountable". No they certainly should not. This sham of a Government, it's bully boy enforcers, and its deluded, idiotic "supporters" should ALL be held accountable.


They have gotten away very mildly, and if threats are all they have to contend with, then they have gotten off light indeed.

Surely your anger should be directed towards Labour and not FG. For all their faults and incompetence FG in their election manifesto said they would introduce a property tax (all the main parties with the exception of SF did), reduce the Social Welfare budget, reduce the Public Service numbers, reduce the Public Service wage bill. They were up front about it. They said they were going to renegotiate the terms of the bailout deal, not burn the bondholders. Again they were up front about it and people voted for them.

Where they should be hammered is for not doing something about the pensions of the politicians who put us in this mess. They give us some crap how they can't legally do it but can pass a law in no time to dip into our pension funds.

They should be hammered on Healthcare, waiting lists. They're big thing was free healthcare for all, that's not going to happen, not even remotely close.

Where is the banking inquiry they promised? How many quangos have they cut? Seanad referendum, where is it?

Sully

7upfree wrote: »

Wrong on both counts. She was elected on a sympathy vote, plus 65% of the electorate never turned up. And yes indeed, the sheep who voted for these people in Meath must burden their responsibility. And in fairness, given the circumstances, with Meath being a FG stronghold, the result was a foregone conclusion. And a wonderful showing by DDI on their first outing. Watch that space.

She didn't get much of a sympathy vote anyway, that's for sure and even the papers said as much. I'd more put it down to loyalty - they knew her father was a hard worker and felt she could offer the same. The majority of the electorate who turned up voted for Fianna Fail and Fine Gael - what sympathy vote did Fianna Fail get? DDI did very well, to be fair to them and fair play. They did much better overall than Sinn Fein who have been operating in that constituency for years. But I don't think there is an appetite in this country to change the political way - they voted for DDI (1k voters) but considering a large number of the electorate yet again didn't bother voting - says a lot about the type of system DDI want brought in.

"Rising above". Do explain....the reality is that there is a gravy train in Kildare street which needs to be urgently addressed. This cannot happen as long as people follow a party ideology like sheep, unquestioningly.

Seeing as I am a Fine Gael member, a sheep as you like to call me, and seeing as I attended many meetings with similar sheep as you would call them - the vast majority called for change and were unhappy. It is questioned. Even the Labour party has its own TDs questioning them.

Seriously, Sully. Improving? Not a hope. The same economists who tell us it is "improving" are the same ones who couldn't predict the bust. So don't rely too much on what you read. In a week where we see part-time presenters being paid over €200k in RTE, that would be a very hard sell for most people.

Yes, a hope. Its widely known across Europe and outside of Europe that Ireland is recovering. Looking set to exit bailout at the end of the year, markets reacting well to our return, employment on the increase (job creation wise), live register steady, a bit of growth creeping into the economy and so on.

[quite]I would agree to a degree about SOME of the protesters. But what are we to do? Roll over and take it up the ass - again? It's a pity more didn't turn out actually.[/quote]

Majority. The Socialists were the majority at the protest. Were you there?

There was no line crossed. The people were entitled to protest. I'm only sorry there were not more. We have a Government who are completely detached fro the reality of the situation. Who promised several things and delivered nothing.
Who have sold the populace into economic servitude for generations to come. And who are undermining Waterford at every opportunity. And you wonder why people protest Sully? Shame indeed on Enda Kenny, his cronies, and his supporters.

We will agree to disagree, but I felt that a protest was fine as long as it was to the point, short and simple. But to throw a hot drink, make threats of violence against them, and shout down the positive news being announced was the crossing of the line.

Can I ask you - as a FG supporter - why you blindly follow the party mantra - without a thought for this City and its Citizens? It fascinates me to watch people who are obviously intelligent and educated - engage in this behaviour; in relation to ANY party.

[/quote]

I answered this question to you and others loads of times, and seeing as you don't take my answer with a pinch of salt, I won't bother answering it again.

mccarthy37

I was very disappointed to hear the abuse thrown at an Taoiseach on his visit to Waterford, it only served as a stick to beat the protester's with as the views here and on the paper have shown. Enda Kenny's statement of the ringing endorsement he received from the Meath East byelection though I would strongly disagree with as only 38% of the electorate turned and with 62% deciding not to vote looks to me to be a ringing endorsement of voter apathy. History has shown down through the years that voter apathy can be a very dangerous thing and will only lead to more of what we have witnessed outside the Tower Hotel as Politician's become more detached from the harsh realities that the general populance are expected to face because of the gambling debt that we have been burdened with through mostly no fault of our making after all didn't Enda say so in the Dail not so long ago.
It was sickening to read about the shock an Taoiseach got when he heard about the exorbitant wages that are being paid to some of the top star's of RTE.
Well Enda I'm even more shocked that you did not know this already if as you say we must all tighten our belts. Even more of a joke was Michael Noonan's appeal to some of the top judges to consider their conscience about accepting wage cuts, you see by some strange law wage cuts to this very elite few cannot be enforced by the government. Now I wonder who first enacted that law. By the way they weren't accepted.
It only works for so long that you can fool a traumatized electorate but I fear if this government keeps burying their heads in the sand and by looking around Dublin 4 that believing things are getting better and that the cuts are not really hurting that bad the backlash will only be more violence. I welcome the announcement of the 200 jobs by Nypro I'm sure the tax breaks they have received were a major factor in their return but I hope they wont up and leave when these expire. I am being very cynical here but it has happened so much in the past in this globalized economy. Good luck to all those who gain employment I hope it will lead to more good things to happen in Waterford and the south east that has suffered very badly in this latest recession that seem to be a trend in this country since I was a boy. Will we ever get a proper balance where everybody are treated fairly I wonder in despair.

Finnbar01

mccarthy37 wrote: »

I was very disappointed to hear the abuse thrown at an Taoiseach on his visit to Waterford, it only served as a stick to beat the protester's.....

I remember there last Christmas, the Occupy Waterford crowd thought it would be great to protest at the turning on of the Christmas lights.

Great move there lads.

Royal Legend

7upfree wrote: »

So you're an economist as well now Sully?:D

Ah well, butty. You just keep telling yourself that. The reality is very different.
Mass repossessions loom, the Gardai under the cosh from Government, people who can't feed their children and pay for the basics.

But hey - you go right ahead and believe otherwise.

In fairness to Sully, he is as qualified an economist as any of the government is.
But, they are smug, because they keep telling us how they rescued the country and are bringing a new type of politics to the country.

sorry, but I need to shout. THIS IS THE MOST ARROGANT, SMUG, UNCARING, IGNORANT, LYING, DOUBLE STANDARD, OUT OF TOUCH WITH THE PEOPLE, INCOMPETANT GOVERNMENT I HAVE EVER HAD WITNESS TO IN MY LIFE.

Roanmore

Royal Legend wrote: »

sorry, but I need to shout. THIS IS THE MOST ARROGANT, SMUG, UNCARING, IGNORANT, LYING, DOUBLE STANDARD, OUT OF TOUCH WITH THE PEOPLE, INCOMPETANT GOVERNMENT I HAVE EVER HAD WITNESS TO IN MY LIFE.

Surely that accolade goes to the last FF / Green government, the parties (along with the PD's) who got us into this mess?

leduke

mccarthy37 wrote: »

I was very disappointed to hear the abuse thrown at an Taoiseach on his visit to Waterford, it only served as a stick to beat the protester's with as the views here and on the paper have shown. Enda Kenny's statement of the ringing endorsement he received from the Meath East byelection though I would strongly disagree with as only 38% of the electorate turned and with 62% deciding not to vote looks to me to be a ringing endorsement of voter apathy. History has shown down through the years that voter apathy can be a very dangerous thing and will only lead to more of what we have witnessed outside the Tower Hotel as Politician's become more detached from the harsh realities that the general populance are expected to face because of the gambling debt that we have been burdened with through mostly no fault of our making after all didn't Enda say so in the Dail not so long ago.
It was sickening to read about the shock an Taoiseach got when he heard about the exorbitant wages that are being paid to some of the top star's of RTE.
Well Enda I'm even more shocked that you did not know this already if as you say we must all tighten our belts. Even more of a joke was Michael Noonan's appeal to some of the top judges to consider their conscience about accepting wage cuts, you see by some strange law wage cuts to this very elite few cannot be enforced by the government. Now I wonder who first enacted that law. By the way they weren't accepted.
It only works for so long that you can fool a traumatized electorate but I fear if this government keeps burying their heads in the sand and by looking around Dublin 4 that believing things are getting better and that the cuts are not really hurting that bad the backlash will only be more violence. I welcome the announcement of the 200 jobs by Nypro I'm sure the tax breaks they have received were a major factor in their return but I hope they wont up and leave when these expire. I am being very cynical here but it has happened so much in the past in this globalized economy. Good luck to all those who gain employment I hope it will lead to more good things to happen in Waterford and the south east that has suffered very badly in this latest recession that seem to be a trend in this country since I was a boy. Will we ever get a proper balance where everybody are treated fairly I wonder in despair.

the most coherent contribution to this thread so far ... well done sir!!!

S.E.F.L

After looking over this thread there is a quite a few mistruths about thursdays protest, before I go into I must clarify I am a neither a member nor a supporter of any political party or political group so don,t try and label me. Re someone threw coffee at enda and there was threats of violence against him, there a few videos floating around on facebook of thursdays protest when enda arrived at the tower hotel and left afterwards, in none of the videos is there any footage shown of anyone thrown coffee at him and as for so called threats of violence the most was said to him was shame on you and one person yelled get out of waterford, hardly threats of violence now is it?

7upfree

Roanmore wrote: »

Surely that accolade goes to the last FF / Green government, the parties (along with the PD's) who got us into this mess?

That's really played out at this point. FF dipped their toes in the water. FG plunged headlong.

7upfree

Sully wrote: »

She didn't get much of a sympathy vote anyway, that's for sure and even the papers said as much. I'd more put it down to loyalty - they knew her father was a hard worker and felt she could offer the same.

Sully, seriously man. Are you actually that naive?

Sully wrote: »

The majority of the electorate who turned up voted for Fianna Fail and Fine Gael - what sympathy vote did Fianna Fail get? DDI did very well, to be fair to them and fair play. They did much better overall than Sinn Fein who have been operating in that constituency for years. But I don't think there is an appetite in this country to change the political way - they voted for DDI (1k voters) but considering a large number of the electorate yet again didn't bother voting - says a lot about the type of system DDI want brought in.

FF's vote was a protest vote amongst those who turned out. Even more proof - if it was needed - that Ms McEntee got a huge sympathy vote. If that hadn't existed FG would have been hammered, with, unfortunately, FF the beneficiaries. And regarding DDI - they overt Labour. As did SF. If that's not change then I don't know what is. Worth reading:

http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/aaron-mckenna-is-this-the-new-party-weve-been-waiting-for-850321-Mar2013/

Sully wrote: »

Seeing as I am a Fine Gael member, a sheep as you like to call me, and seeing as I attended many meetings with similar sheep as you would call them - the vast majority called for change and were unhappy. It is questioned. Even the Labour party has its own TDs questioning them.

Sully, I ask again - how can you remain a member of, and support the actions of, a party which is dismantling Waterford city around you? WRH on the ropes, our City Status belittled on the eve of our 1100th anniversary, and no university delivered (as promised by FG in 2008) Interesting to read the phraseology ('Waterford being neglected, blah, blah"). Protest with your feet. Walk my friend. Grow a pair. You owe these shysters nothing.

Sully wrote: »

Yes, a hope. Its widely known across Europe and outside of Europe that Ireland is recovering. Looking set to exit bailout at the end of the year, markets reacting well to our return, employment on the increase (job creation wise), live register steady, a bit of growth creeping into the economy and so on.

Let's look at the reality: exit bailout because FG/Lab committed the Irish people to financial servitude for years to come; return to the markets so that we continue to borrow more money which we can never repay; 428,000 still unemployed, with little or no job prospects; and as for growth? Talk to any City Centre trader and they'll give you the reality. This is the difference between people like you and people like me Sully. Reality.

Sully wrote: »

Majority. The Socialists were the majority at the protest. Were you there?

No - I was working.

Sully wrote: »

We will agree to disagree, but I felt that a protest was fine as long as it was to the point, short and simple. But to throw a hot drink, make threats of violence against them, and shout down the positive news being announced was the crossing of the line.

I wouldn't agree with the hot drink. But I would agree with protest 100%. Anytime. This is not North Korea.

Sully

7upfree wrote: »

Sully, seriously man. Are you actually that naive?

Nope, but I spoke with numerous people who canvassed for FF, FG and DDI there. The message on the door was not overly sympathetic but remembering herself and her father, and wanting to keep the seat because they trusted her Dad and felt she could offer the same. Are they naive? Probably.

FF's vote was a protest vote amongst those who turned out. Even more proof - if it was needed - that Ms McEntee got a huge sympathy vote. If that hadn't existed FG would have been hammered, with, unfortunately, FF the beneficiaries. And regarding DDI - they overt Labour. As did SF. If that's not change then I don't know what is. Worth reading:

http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/aaron-mckenna-is-this-the-new-party-weve-been-waiting-for-850321-Mar2013/

A protest vote? Don't be silly. Fianna Fail has a huge footing in Meath East and their campaigners know it - as do others. They had a seat in the 2007 election, they lost it in the 2011 and nearly regained it in 2013. The previous constituency make-up also had a strong Fianna Fail number of seats - three in 2002, same in 1997, same in 1992, same in 1989 etc.

The polls, a new one out today, is confirming as did the by-election that Fianna Fail support is on the rise.

Sully, I ask again - how can you remain a member of, and support the actions of, a party which is dismantling Waterford city around you? WRH on the ropes, our City Status belittled on the eve of our 1100th anniversary, and no university delivered (as promised by FG in 2008) Interesting to read the phraseology ('Waterford being neglected, blah, blah"). Protest with your feet. Walk my friend. Grow a pair. You owe these shysters nothing.

I answered this already.

Let's look at the reality: exit bailout because FG/Lab committed the Irish people to financial servitude for years to come; return to the markets so that we continue to borrow more money which we can never repay; 428,000 still unemployed, with little or no job prospects; and as for growth? Talk to any City Centre trader and they'll give you the reality. This is the difference between people like you and people like me Sully. Reality.

You don't fully understand how running a country works, do you? For what its worth, I work with a lot of City Centre retailers of various sizes and also some in the county. So I am well aware of the reality on the ground. Your right, there is a huge difference between us - thankfully you are with the minority.

7upfree

Sully wrote: »

You don't fully understand how running a country works, do you? For what its worth, I work with a lot of City Centre retailers of various sizes and also some in the county. So I am well aware of the reality on the ground. Your right, there is a huge difference between us - thankfully you are with the minority.

In fairness I appear to have a greater grasp than you do Sully.:p Given your earlier statements above. I'd love to meet these business people who are cheerleading the economy. Obviously you met them at that FG meeting.:)

And as for the minority. Both your feet are firmly planted there.

Am Chile

I have observed and noticed since opening and started this thread-the original poster who begun this thread on the protest the other day hasnt come back into the discussion to comment or reply to any points made by others-two posts from two people at the protest and others who supported the protest-some might say and conclude the only reason the OP began this thread was to specifically have a go at dissenters and hop the ball then disappear into the background.

albert kidd

sully..may i ask where your getting the threats of violence and hot drinks thrown from?

Sully

7upfree wrote: »

In fairness I appear to have a greater grasp than you do Sully.:p Given your earlier statements above. I'd love to meet these business people who are cheerleading the economy. Obviously you met them at that FG meeting.:)

And as for the minority. Both your feet are firmly planted there.

Well considering you suggest that we can survive without the markets and the bailout "FG/Lab committed the Irish people to financial servitude for years to come" when they had nothing to do with the agreement and actually got it changed in parts.

Do enlighten me as to where exactly I said the business were 'cheerleading the economy'? Or where did I say in any shape or form that these business were positive about it? Shouldn't be putting words out there that people didn't say.

albert kidd; Witnesses say they heard violence, there was threats of violence on Facebook, and the Gardai confirmed that there was at least 'splashes' from the coffee.

albert kidd

i was there sully and i can tell you it's 100% nonsense about threats and coffee thrown in the direction of elma.

there was bad language used..but you go to walsh park or even the peoples park tomorrow and im sure you would hear the same swear words..its no biggie in my opinion.

nice_very

"splashes" LMFAO that the best you can do FG fanboy?

Am Chile

Sully wrote: »

Well considering you suggest that we can survive without the markets and the bailout "FG/Lab committed the Irish people to financial servitude for years to come" when they had nothing to do with the agreement and actually got it changed in parts.

Do enlighten me as to where exactly I said the business were 'cheerleading the economy'? Or where did I say in any shape or form that these business were positive about it? Shouldn't be putting words out there that people didn't say.

albert kidd; Witnesses say they heard violence, there was threats of violence on Facebook, and the Gardai confirmed that there was at least 'splashes' from the coffee.

Looked at the comments on facebook there was comments of violent intent on a thread on the save waterford page by two posters there-one of the videos of the protest at least a similar comment or two-are we meant to blame the save waterford moderators and the person who posted the video for single individual comments people might post? having looked at media reports about the protest if someone threw coffee as alleged one would think the gardai would arrest the person on the spot for assault.

Sully

albert kidd wrote: »

i was there sully and i can tell you it's 100% nonsense about threats and coffee thrown in the direction of elma.

there was bad language used..but you go to walsh park or even the peoples park tomorrow and im sure you would hear the same swear words..its no biggie in my opinion.

A local journalist stated that the threats of violence was made. The remark was made on their private Facebook page. The individual isn't pro FG or Labour.

Am Chile wrote: »

Looked at the comments on facebook there was comments of violent intent on a thread on the save waterford page by two posters there-one of the videos of the protest at least a similar comment or two-are we meant to blame the save waterford moderators and the person who posted the video for single individual comments people might post? having looked at media reports about the protest if someone threw coffee as alleged one would think the gardai would arrest the person on the spot for assault.

They can surely moderate the comments and remove them? I'm not sure what exactly happened, but this is what was being said along with the accusation of being spat at which the Guards said was false.