Season 3: Episode 1*HAVE read the books/spoilers*

Deano7788

Surprised this hasn't been started already.

I thought it was a pretty good opening to the series, setting up a lot of the storylines but never really feeling too busy.

The highlights for me were Tyrions's scenes with Cersei, Tywin and Bronn, and Bronn's interaction with Meryn Trant (I guess I just love Tyrion and Bronn).

I was a bit surprised that they revealed Selmy's identity straight away, rather than having him hide it from Daenerys. I guess we won't be seeing Belwas in the show.

The changes to the Harrenhall plot could also be interesting, although I suspect Robb will move on from there fairly quickly and leave Roose in charge.

I'm kind of surprised we didn't touch on Bran's storyline and have the Reeds introduced and I also missed Arya but I suppose that would have made the episode too full so there's always next week.

And, of course, we now know what Jorah smells like.

KJY

Pretty good overall I thought. No major flaws, Astapor was very good but did it make viewers know Dany understood him?

Tywin was awesome, they're trying to solidify him as a bad ass after the Arya scenes last season. As it stood, killing him would have garnered more pity

Deano7788

KJY wrote: »

Pretty good overall I thought. No major flaws, Astapor was very good but did it make viewers know Dany understood him?

Tywin was awesome, they're trying to solidify him as a bad ass after the Arya scenes last season. As it stood, killing him would have garnered more pity

Yeah there wasn't even any hint of that. I was waiting for Jorah to make a comment about it afterwards or something but it never came.

Witcher

Glad Jorah pointed out Barristan's fighting ability, was only touched on briefly in S1.

KJY

I think it was a good opener overall. Much less cramped than Season 2, willing to cut some characters out till Ep 2. Although it's a pity as the Brotherhood and Jaime were the ones I was looking forward to most. I pray to God Jaime rises to close-to-Tyrion S2 status. Great portrayal I think

Blay

Blay wrote: »

Glad Jorah pointed out Barristan's fighting ability, was only touched on briefly in S1.

Indeed, most people I know who watch the series and havent read the books didn't even remember who he was while he is glorified in the books! One of my favorite characters from the books so good to know we'll be seeing a lot more of him!

Also agree on the change of people's feeling towards Tywin as they are finally going more in line with how he is portrayed in the books.

Overall I am happy with how the show are approaching what will most likely be the busiest season with the amount that will go on. Pity they had no Sandor though

KJY

I still loved Tywin in S2. I liked the added depth but it was good to see a return to his original character.

Anyone else think the Margaery thing was a little bit too much? I suppose it's more acceptable as it's most likely part of some sort of scheme to win favour

hootietootie

Liked it-watching it with 4 non book readers here so listening to them is a bit fun!!! Think it's going to be a long week waiting on the next one!

Didn't seem as long, suppose because they fitted so much into it-good opener, laying the scene for what's gonna be an awesome series

KJY

KJY wrote: »

I still loved Tywin in S2. I liked the added depth but it was good to see a return to his original character.

Anyone else think the Margaery thing was a little bit too much? I suppose it's more acceptable as it's most likely part of some sort of scheme to win favour

I loved the extra scenes with Tywin they were excellent. But you can see they are finally going in line with how he is portrayed in the book and he'll be as hated as Joffrey by the end of it I reckon.

I think what the show were trying to do is create the divide between good queen & bad queen with her & Cersei early. So portrayed her as the opposite of Cersei as a kind gentle queen etc. They also had a few words over dinner so that will just escalate as it did in the books. Not looking forward to seeing the rest of the Tyrells don't like them in the books

titan18

Understandable why the cut the battle at the Fist, would have been a bit expensive, but didn't really understand why they changed why Robb joins Mance, the reason in the book is much better than the TV show. Other than that, no real issue with the episode, although could have done with a little less in it.

Assuming Robb is only at Harrenhal in order to get Roose there so don't mind it as long as he leaves for Riverrun soon enough and leaves Roose in charge there.

Cienciano

The whole fight on the fist of the first men is left out. And samwell didn't sent the ravens, in the books he did.

On the other thread people are saying that they tried to fit too much into this episode. Well, get used to it, so much happens in this book every episode should be similar. Denys story is a lot more interesting instead of being fairly drawn out and boring.

I want Belwas

Seriously confused what this show is doing re: Margaery; in the books her motives are very ambiguous, but last season she announced 'I want to be The queen' and now I don't know if they're trying to make her seem ambiguous again or sticking with that.

I love watching the show acted out, and I genuinely don't mind a lot of the changes made where they're necessary to simplify things for the screen but some of the bizarre, unnecessary changes they made last season (like butchering the Entire storyline in Qarth) makes me a little worried for this season, as the third book has some of the best moments in the series so far!

titan18

Deleted User wrote: »

I want Belwas

Seriously confused what this show is doing re: Margaery; in the books her motives are very ambiguous, but last season she announced 'I want to be The queen' and now I don't know if they're trying to make her seem ambiguous again or sticking with that.

I love watching the show acted out, and I genuinely don't mind a lot of the changes made where they're necessary to simplify things for the screen but some of the bizarre, unnecessary changes they made last season (like butchering the Entire storyline in Qarth) makes me a little worried for this season, as the third book has some of the best moments in the series so far!

Provided they don't mess up major moment, like RW etc, it's not too bad, but I really hate how they've portrayed Jon. Made him look so whiny and not at all like the book character, who's a lot of people's favourite character.

Tzar Chasm

Sam and the ravens was one of the things that really annoyed me, it completely changes sams character, mormont gives out to him for failing whereas in the book he did his duty despite being afraid.

I like where they're going wit margery, she always set herself up as a devout maid and the orphanage scene is a good way of demonstrating her scheeming

I forgot about that with Sam, yeah that moment is where Sam is supposed to start coming into his own 'Sam the Slayer' and all that. Le Sigh. These are the things that annoy me because they're not hard to get right and they don't make the story any more complicated/difficult to film. They tend to be more interesting than the replacements >.>

I'm still bitter there were no cool prophecy scenes from the House of the Undying last season :mad:

Witcher

In the books Sam never attached messages to the ravens so it was basically like they were never sent. They didn't go through Sam writing the messages out etc. like in the books so the easiest thing was for them to never be sent at all.

podgemonster

Jaw hit the floor when i saw the giant! Excellent!

Fine episode. Really just positioning the characters for the series after S2.

Interesting to see Qyburn speaking to Robb. I wonder if he will play a part in influencing Roose.

Cienciano

Blay wrote: »

In the books Sam never attached messages to the ravens so it was basically like they were never sent. They didn't go through Sam writing the messages out etc. like in the books so the easiest thing was for them to never be sent at all.

Are you sure? As far as I remember Sam sent ravens at regular intervals during the battle at the fist, but he also let a load of them go free with no messages.

Witcher

Cienciano wrote: »

Are you sure? As far as I remember Sam sent ravens at regular intervals during the battle at the fist, but he also let a load of them go free with no messages.

Yeah, you're right. I just looked it up there, 2 of them flew out of the Castle Black cage but he sent one there and one to the Shadow Tower.

Cienciano

Blay wrote: »

Yeah, you're right. I just looked it up there, 2 of them flew out of the Castle Black cage but he sent one there and one to the Shadow Tower.

Still fresh in my mind, only read it last week

Sugar Free

titan18 wrote: »

but didn't really understand why they changed why Robb joins Mance, the reason in the book is much better than the TV show.

Yeah I found that unnecessary really. The reason in the book is quite believable and would have made for a great scene if the delivery was right, especially the last part where he describes a feast at Winterfell and where he was left sitting, as the bastard.

titan18

Sugar Free wrote: »

Yeah I found that unnecessary really. The reason in the book is quite believable and would have made for a great scene if the delivery was right, especially the last part where he describes a feast at Winterfell and where he was left sitting, as the bastard.

Yup, it's one of my favourites part of the books when Jon says why he wants to turn. It actually makes sense too rather than I want to find for the people who fight for the living crap.

Tzar Chasm

yes but fighting for the living makes more sense in the overall arc, especially when he becomes lord commander and convinces the wildlings to join him, that's his reasoning, so to start him off on that path makes more sense.

Savage Tyrant

titan18 wrote: »

Yup, it's one of my favourites part of the books when Jon says why he wants to turn. It actually makes sense too rather than I want to find for the people who fight for the living crap.

Refresh my memory please. What reason did he give in the book?

Thought it was a very good episode myself. The giant looked awesome, as did the dragon (wish we'd have seen all 3)
Surprising they chose to reveal Selmy'd identity immediately but I'm glad too that they emphasised how great a knight he is and the esteem in which he is held.
I really can't get into the Sansa storyline arc though. I didn't enjoy them much in the books either though.

Sugar Free

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

Refresh my memory please. What reason did he give in the book?

That he was the bastard Stark, never fully accepted into the family, often kept away from the true Starks during feasts and other occasions where visiting Lords/diplomats might see him etc.

I don't have the book to hand but Jon references the fact that Mance has slipped across the wall numerous times and was in fact in the main hall in Winterfell during a big feast where Jon was not seated with the rest of the Stark family.

Paraphrasing but his last lines to Mance during that scene are: 'And what table did you see me at Mance? Where did they put the bastard?'

Gbear

Thought it was mostly good.

Jon's excuse for joining the wildings was ok. Essentially, Mormont stood by while Craster gave babies to the white walkers. Fair enough and like his book excuse, there was an element of truth to it.

Giant was cool. Wasn't sure if they were going to do the reveal so soon.
Having the army of them go by atop mammoths might have been more epic. I hope to **** they don't cut that. Lots of Tormund Giantsbane is required.

I think this show, more than any other, would benefit from being watched several episodes at a time. Each plot line is only ever a morsel. Now I want MOAR!

Was it Ghost that saved Sam from the wight? Did he not go with Jon to be with the Wildlings?
A bit sad we didn't get to see the zombear at the Fist of the first men.

thehairyone

Noticed the Ghost thing alright. does anyone remember where he was by the end of the second season, was he with john?

Bit worried about shae, the series seems to be making her too likeable. considering what happens, id be worried about how much sympathy the audience will have for her.

Mickeroo

Gbear wrote: »

Was it Ghost that saved Sam from the wight? Did he not go with Jon to be with the Wildlings?
A bit sad we didn't get to see the zombear at the Fist of the first men.

Yeah that was Ghost alright, strange he's not with Jon. Makes me worried they'll continue to ignore the fact that all the Stark kids are wargs and not just Bran.

Enjoyed the episode. The giant looked great, and Daenarys' intro with the dragon swooping in made the hairs on my neck stand up.

None of te changes bothered me apart from Sam not getting his ravens away (and no Belwas!! ), would have been hard for them to disguise Selmy for the whole season so I get why they did that.

The changes are good in a way as it gives the show a few surprises, especially with characters like Margeary who will get fleshed out a lot more.

I wonder what they'll do with the likes of Bronn, who largely disappears in the books from here on iirc. He seems more willing to continue helping Tyrion in this than he did in the book.

I still think they're digging themselves a hole by not making Shae a ditzy whore who's only with Tyrion for the money like she is in the books though.

This is my first season watching the show after reading the books so its nice to have the wait between episodes be so unbearable, still looking forward to next week though

Tristram

Mickeroo wrote: »

I still think they're digging themselves a hole by not making Shae a ditzy whore who's only with Tyrion for the money like she is in the books though.

She was more than just that in the books, no? I think the reveal with her will go a long way to building some great character development with Tyrion depending on how they portray it.

Mickeroo

Tristram wrote: »

She was more than just that in the books, no? I think the reveal with her will go a long way to building some great character development with Tyrion depending on how they portray it.

Never seemed more than that to me, it was always clear she was more bothered about the jewels and clothes she was showered with than Tyrion himself imo. Whereas in the show she seems to genuinely love him. Her protectiveness of Sansa too seems quite genuine, particularly in her scenes during the battle last season. Will be interesting to see how her story plays out in the show though.

Tristram

Mickeroo wrote: »

Never seemed more than that to me, it was always clear she was more bothered about the jewels and clothes she was showered with than Tyrion himself imo. Whereas in the show she seems to genuinely love him. Her protectiveness of Sansa too seems quite genuine, particularly in her scenes during the battle last season. Will be interesting to see how her story plays out in the show though.

Does it not turn out that she has been spying on Tyrion for Tywin the entire time?

Shazbot

Overall the episode wasn't great. It just reminds everyone what's happening and provides a good platform to launch the series.

I liked the nod to the books when Cersei was talking to Tyrion. Something along the lines of 'They say you lost your nose'. As always, Bronns scences were great. From what I remember, he hasn't got a major part in ASOS, AFFC or ADWD but hopefully they will keep him around. It's nice to see Tywin becoming ruthless again, I thought season 2 might ruin his reputation.

I like the way Danys story was rushed a little but didn't like the reveal of Selmy so early. It looks like we're not getting Belwas too. I can't wait for her purchase of the unsullied.

I still think Hinds isn't right for Mance but hopefully his performance in later episodes will change my mind.

From the promo for episode two, it looks like we get an introduction to the brotherhood and the Reeds.

ibarelycare

It is a pity that they had to reveal Selmy so early, but there was no other way around it unless they covered his face the whole time, which would be silly. It was a great moment in the book for me, completely unexpected. My boyfriend was so disappointed, he's reading the 3rd book at the moment and hadn't reached the part of the big reveal yet!

Was surprised that there was no Arya in the episode, what with the episode name and all, but looking forward to her in the next episode hopefully, along with Jaime and Brienne.

Stimpyone

We didn’t get to see the fight on the fist which to be honest was a bit disappointing as the cliff hanger from last season sort pointed at it.

Sam didn’t send the ravens which really annoyed me because in the book it took a hell of a lot of courage for his character to do that. Did they find the dragonglass last season? cos it's going to be difficult to slay a walker without that.

Deano7788

Stimpyone wrote: »

We didn’t get to see the fight on the fist which to be honest was a bit disappointing as the cliff hanger from last season sort pointed at it.

Sam didn’t send the ravens which really annoyed me because in the book it took a hell of a lot of courage for his character to do that. Did they find the dragonglass last season? cos it's going to be difficult to slay a walker without that.

Yeah they found it late last season.

Sleepy

Yeah, I liked the "they said you lost your nose" line too.

The lack of Barristan's reveal makes sense for TV and while Belwas is an interesting character, the TV version of Ser Jorah can probably handle most of his role.

Like many of you, Sam not getting the ravens away annoyed me too.

Tywin becoming more ruthless is welcome but I liked how they humanised him in season 2. We didn't really get to see the reasons for his hatred of Tyrion or for his iron will in the books until Genna's conversations with Jaime in later books so for a series where everyone is shown in shades of grey, it makes sense to show both sides of him prior to his demise.

The unsullied look fantastic, presume it'll be episode 3 before we see them bought though: episode 2 is going to have to focus on the brotherhood, Arya, Bran and the Iron Isles.

podgemonster

With the pace of the first episode I think it may be possible to do most of SoS in one series. I initially thought the plan was to divide it up into 2 series but judging by the storyline at King's Landing, I don't think it will be possibly to end this series without Joffery and Tywin being killed as the wheels are already in motion for that from episode one.

If this is the case Martin would wana get cracking on the books.

I also am curious to how they will handle Shae. If her demise is more unwarranted it may to highlight the bitter, angry man Tyrion becomes in SoS.

RobbingBandit

Doesn't Daenerys free slaves after she gains the Unsullied, might be an opportunity to introduce Strong Belwas.

Sleepy

I think it's safe to say Belwas has been written out. He was only needed initially for "Arstan" to have someone to squire for... The rest of his character's role in the story is of little consequence...

podgemonster

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Doesn't Daenerys free slaves after she gains the Unsullied, might be an opportunity to introduce Strong Belwas.

meh Bewlas is a nothing character. An imposing warrior that also add specks of humour due to his food consuming and limited vocabulary.

His only major scene is where he defeats a knight in 1 on 1 outside Meereen (up for correction) and that can easily done by Selmy to remind viewers how much of a badass he is!

Mickeroo

^^ I wonder will they have Ser baristan **** on the corpse

Tristram wrote: »

Does it not turn out that she has been spying on Tyrion for Tywin the entire time?

I don't think so,

I thought she just turns against him after Tyson catches her.

Cienciano

podgemonster wrote: »

meh Bewlas is a nothing character. An imposing warrior that also add specks of humour due to his food consuming and limited vocabulary.

His only major scene is where he defeats a knight in 1 on 1 outside Meereen (up for correction) and that can easily done by Selmy to remind viewers how much of a badass he is!

Was thinking the exact same thing. That was Bewlas best scene, they could easily get Selmy to do it. Dany sends him out against the knight for him to prove himself to be loyal to her.

The unsullied look great, the nipple scene was horrible, but well done. But I thought it was a lot later in the book that Dany gets the unsullied?

Deano7788

Cienciano wrote: »

Was thinking the exact same thing. That was Bewlas best scent, they could easily get Selmy to do it. Dany sends him out against the knight for him to prove himself to be loyal to her.

The unsullied look great, the nipple scene was horrible, but well done. But I thought it was a lot later in the book that Dany gets the unsullied?

Well she hasn't bought them yet. The scene we were shown occurred in the 2nd Daenerys chapter in ASOS. I'd say we won't see her buying them until Episode 3 at the earliest.

Gbear

In the books isn't Jorah revealed as a traitor when Barristan reveals himself?

How are they going to handle that if that's already occurred?

That doens't happen until Mereen in the books, I think.

Is this thread for people who have read all the books or just the books up until the end of this series (Storm of Swords 1).

Cienciano

Deano7788 wrote: »

Well she hasn't bought them yet. The scene we were shown occurred in the 2nd Daenerys chapter in ASOS. I'd say we won't see her buying them until Episode 3 at the earliest.

Fair enough, thought it was a bit later but it makes more sense. Most of Daenerys story in ASOS is after she buys them.

Gbear wrote: »

In the books isn't Jorah revealed as a traitor when Barristan reveals himself?

How are they going to handle that if that's already occurred?

That doens't happen until Mereen in the books, I think.

Is this thread for people who have read all the books or just the books up until the end of this series (Storm of Swords 1).

I'm only about 6 chapters into a feast for crows myself, just read carefully! No spoilers in the thread yet.

Deano7788

Gbear wrote: »

In the books isn't Jorah revealed as a traitor when Barristan reveals himself?

How are they going to handle that if that's already occurred?

That doens't happen until Mereen in the books, I think.

Is this thread for people who have read all the books or just the books up until the end of this series (Storm of Swords 1).

Maybe spoiler tag anything that occurs after Storm of Swords 1 but speak openly about anything up to the end of that?

Seridisand

No one else have an issue with them sailing to Astapor, but not on the ships belonging to Magister Illyrion Mopatis? It leaves a big hole in the script with the spiders involvement

Aegon

Cookiemunster

podgemonster wrote: »

With the pace of the first episode I think it may be possible to do most of SoS in one series. I initially thought the plan was to divide it up into 2 series but judging by the storyline at King's Landing, I don't think it will be possibly to end this series without Joffery and Tywin being killed as the wheels are already in motion for that from episode one.

Well according to my kindle the RW happens 61% of the way through the book and that looks like being episode 9 (Judging by episode titles). I don't think we'll get as far as Jofferys wedding this season. I do think however that half way through season 4 the story we'll be into AFFC.

Mickeroo

Gbear wrote: »

In the books isn't Jorah revealed as a traitor when Barristan reveals himself?

How are they going to handle that if that's already occurred?

That doens't happen until Mereen in the books, I think.

Is this thread for people who have read all the books or just the books up until the end of this series (Storm of Swords 1).

All they need to do is have the two men argue. Ser Jorah will be jealous of Dany giving attention to Selmy.

Gbear

Mickeroo wrote: »

All they need to do is have the two men argue. Ser Jorah will be jealous of Dany giving attention to Selmy.

But why wouldn't he mention it earlier?

There was an obvious reason why not to in the book - he'd reveal himself - but now he's her queensguard and not mentioning it is pretty bad from a "doing his duty" point of view.

Deano7788

Seridisand wrote: »

No one else have an issue with them sailing to Astapor, but not on the ships belonging to Magister Illyrion Mopatis? It leaves a big hole in the script with the spiders involvement

Aegon

I don't really have a big issue with it. I'd say it would be fairly easy to come up with an alternative way of explaining it.