Irish Grocery Symbol Groups

skeoghan

Hey all
Was just wondering if any current retailers trading within a symbol group would be able to offer me a bit of advice vis-a-vis what symbol to choose, your experience with your symbol group and their annual fee's etc. I'm a young business person with a profitable 1800 sq foot convenience store and deli but kinda feel spoilt for choice when it comes to partnering with a symbol. Want to get some brand recognition, buying power and ongoing business support hence the decision to move to a symbol group. have a bit of experience with Costcutter (Barry's) and SPAR (BWG) but just thought somebody on this might be able to lend a helping hand!
Thanks for your time!

DubTony

I've no experience with BWG, but based on how the operation worked with Clohiseys 8 to 12 group effectively running BWG before he took it over, I always steered clear.

My personal experience has been with Centra and ADM Londis. These two companies are so far apart in terms of professionalism it's laughable. Having said that, it also means that the costs are pretty far apart as well.

Musgrave will give you all the support you need - and more. Londis will throw a sign over the door and pretty much leave you to your own devices. So it depends on what you want. I'm being quite vague here, but if it's a professional operation with tons of support you want, Musgrave is your answer.

ScouseMouse

Musgrave would dwarf Londis, but you also will be expected to pay out large amounts of money in advertising and fit out to their specs. Its true, MG are much more professional and have serious weight behind them.

They practically take over your store with their rules.

Loads have Centra stores have gone under (like every other chain), and Musgrave had to go in run them themselves to keep them open.

Be very careful.

DubTony

I wouldn't blame the sign over the door for shops going under. It's a sign of the times.
My experience has been that Musgrave will tell you if it will work or not (and reject the application if they think it's not viable) whereas Londis will just want to know if you're going to do up your shop and pretty much accept any application as long as it's backed by a personal guarantee.
The finance meeting in ADM took 15 minutes with a business development person, whereas the same meeting in Musgrave took 90 minutes, with the sales manager, company financial director (yeah :eek:) store development guy and the regional manager.
Chalk and cheese.
BTW, Musgrave never told me how much I could expect to turn over, focusing primarily on cost and break-even, while the nice girl in Londis told me that "it should probably be ok."

donegal.

i know a town thats crying out for a convenience shop, What would be the start up costs be like for a centra? ( starting from scratch).

DubTony

It's been a while since I did it, but for a Centra, budget for about €150 per square foot for fitting out to their standard. This includes everything inside the store. (Tills, refrigeration, tiling, lighting etc.)

DubTony Wealth Warning: Don't go into that business without the necessary experience.

newcavanman

As someone who supplies convenience stores on a wholesale basis ( confectionery ), i think there are pros and cons to being in a group . The way wholesale prices have gone through the recession, i think an arms lenght arrangement is the most any small shop keeper should go for . Take advantage of their buying power for certain things, but be very aware that there are great prices to be got, if you take on to buy yourself .
Where many places came to grief was just accepting the wholesale pricelist from their own group, not bothering to shop around, then when times got tough, they had lost those skills, and werent able to compete . Your job as a shop keeper, is to buy the best product you can , at the best price, and to sell it at the best price your customers will bear . Bottom line is, its your shop, if you want BWG, Musgraves or someone else to run it , then get a job as a manager, and enjoy 4 weeks paid holiday, and social welfare if all goes wrong, cause you wont be getting either of those while you work for yourself .
Dont want to sound down beat, because, i think that people who accept the reality of the market conditions we are in , are actually doing quite well . Our sales are up nearly 15% this year .

DubTony

newcavanman wrote: »

Bottom line is, its your shop, if you want BWG, Musgraves or someone else to run it , then get a job as a manager, and enjoy 4 weeks paid holiday, and social welfare if all goes wrong, cause you wont be getting either of those while you work for yourself.

What? And miss out on taking a couple of hours off during the day, and the thrill of knowing that the profit is yours, and "borrowing" from the business when the car breaks down, and deciding who you work with, and not taking crap from anybody, and deny oneself the pleasure of f*cking opinionated cash and carry owners out of your shop ... just because you can?

NEVAAHHH! NEVAAHHH I tell you !!!

The fact is, as a symbol store owner I bought from who I wanted, when I wanted, and used the name over the door to tell the idiots I didn't want to talk to that I wasn't allowed buy from them.
Maybe we've met.