Tesco Ennis

AnarchistKen

Le_Dieux wrote: »

Pardon me for intruding:

I live in Newbridge & I have seen what has happened to Naas first hand since Tesco built their large store out on the Monread ( next to the Highway to Limerick/Cork/Waterford). While this was going on, Naas Town Council ( NTC) were building a large shopping centere right in the centre of Naas and Dunne's were supposed to be the anchor tenant. Whatever happened there, Dunne's pulled the plug, and eventually NTC also pulled the plug on that half built site.

Naas also has a terrible problem with parking, with €2 ( iirc) per hour or part thereof. Between all three occurances ( and probably another one or two ) the centre of Naas is a ghost town, with LOTS of shop fronts boarded up. Naas was once a beautiful town, still is, but to see all these derelict sites ( remember the Superquinn site is also deserted now) is a sad indictment on everything that's wrong with this once beautiful country.

As I say at the start, I am intruding, but I just want to paint the picture here so that Ennis doesn't become another Naas.

No mention of the large number of jobs in construction and retail that Tesco create year on year. I lived in Naas for five years I actually think that they done a fine job on that site and left it with a fine looking building.

Tesco cannot be blamed for the NTC mess in the middle of the town.

Back on topic I hope for jobs alone the Ennis one goes ahead

Clareman

I'm a bit tired this evening, but I'm trying to think of what businesses would be affected if Tesco was to open a second shop in Ennis, besides their direct competitors (Dunnes, Centra, Aldi & Lidl) I would see Off Licenses and Electronical shops as the businesses under the most threat by Tesco opening a new large shop.

In regards to taking people out of town, as I have already said, I don't think many people go up town on foot from Tesco, the first site Tesco were going for (West County) would have gotten people almost as close to town as they would be in the current location, if they have to move further out that would put an even larger pull away from the town centre. In addition, I would imagine that a lot of businesses that would be looking to open in a shopping centre/mall type location would be franchises (like Argos), people are going to use these whether they are in Limerick or Ennis, why not have shops in Ennis and have people employed here instead of in Limerick/Galway?

Finally, Tesco would be a 24/7 operation, that would be ~8 hours extra each day that any local shop would hope to do, that would be 8 hours extra salary for staff, that staff would be local people, salaries paid by multi-nationals like Tesco are exactly the same as salaries paid by local businesses.

rainbowdash

buck65 wrote: »

All I hear you all mention is price. Is there not more to it than cost? Do you make a decision based only on price?

Do you buy your burgers in Tesco or do you go to the local butcher who sources his meat from traceable sources.

What about customer service. I like to buy wine from a small shop who will let you sample a bottle and give you a free bottle when you accumulate 10 bottles.

the boxes sell the same trash, mass produced for the masses. These malls are souless with European and English owned companies. Look at Grafton St in dublin you might as well be in London.

Your entitled to your opinion but that's all it is. We in our house think the crescent shopping centre is savage. The kids love it and we can park underground out of the rain for free. It has cinemas and takeways all in the same premises.

Its always buzzing and safe, there are no run down or boarded up shops and no feel of a recession when you go in there.

Why would I go to a local shop and listen to them piss and moan about the recession or tell me about how Mary up the road has cancer or Johnny down the road has lost his job, and then pay more money for a loaf of bread or milk as I listen to the whine.

pilate 1

Clareman wrote: »

I'm a bit tired this evening, but I'm trying to think of what businesses would be affected if Tesco was to open a second shop in Ennis, besides their direct competitors (Dunnes, Centra, Aldi & Lidl) I would see Off Licenses and Electronical shops as the businesses under the most threat by Tesco opening a new large shop.

In regards to taking people out of town, as I have already said, I don't think many people go up town on foot from Tesco, the first site Tesco were going for (West County) would have gotten people almost as close to town as they would be in the current location, if they have to move further out that would put an even larger pull away from the town centre. In addition, I would imagine that a lot of businesses that would be looking to open in a shopping centre/mall type location would be franchises (like Argos), people are going to use these whether they are in Limerick or Ennis, why not have shops in Ennis and have people employed here instead of in Limerick/Galway?

Finally, Tesco would be a 24/7 operation, that would be ~8 hours extra each day that any local shop would hope to do, that would be 8 hours extra salary for staff, that staff would be local people, salaries paid by multi-nationals like Tesco are exactly the same as salaries paid by local businesses.

point taken but profits DONT.

Clareman

rainbowdash wrote: »

Why would I go to a local shop and listen to them piss and moan about the recession or tell me about how Mary up the road has cancer or Johnny down the road has lost his job, and then pay more money for a loaf of bread or milk as I listen to the whine.

There are some great reasons to shop local, you might hear about a plan to shut the electricity or water off or something like that. There's also some great local shops (e.g. Bakeries like O'Connors and Cootes) that make products that (imvho) are far superior than anything that can be gotten in large supermarkets (although they do supply the large shops as well), same goes for meat, I always get that from a local butchers.

Mr. G

O'Connors have some really nice rolls

I noticed a good lot of the bakerys in large supermarkets, have a sell by date of that day every time I go in there and some of the stuff is not fresh.

Do Tesco make rolls there?

pilate 1

rainbowdash wrote: »

Your entitled to your opinion but that's all it is. We in our house think the crescent shopping centre is savage. The kids love it and we can park underground out of the rain for free. It has cinemas and takeways all in the same premises.

Its always buzzing and safe, there are no run down or boarded up shops and no feel of a recession when you go in there.

Why would I go to a local shop and listen to them piss and moan about the recession or tell me about how Mary up the road has cancer or Johnny down the road has lost his job, and then pay more money for a loaf of bread or milk as I listen to the whine.

bringing up youre children in the rarefied confines of the cresent must be bliss:)

collie0708

dpofloinn wrote: »

''I run a business that competes with much larger businesses and I guarantee you I am far cheaper than these companies. You might be surprised if you investigated prices a bit further.''

That's great that you have found a way for your business to compete and survive while others go to the wall,but for these businesses to blame Tesco and other large organisations for their demise is just a cop out , these businesses failed to adapt to the times we are in and sadly have paid the price.We all have overheads to pay but I don't see why I or anyone else should pay extra for goods or services just because its local

I couldn't agree more,if you are running your business well and satisfying your customers you have nothing to worry about.

Will never understand the number of people who go mental about big companies and how they put all these local places out of business..... Truth is no business puts another out of business customers do by deciding where not to spend there money..

catallus

I'm still in the dark about precisely where this is supposed to be happening?

dee_mc

Is this the proposed site roughly across the road from Flannan's College near the Applegreen service station or has a new site been proposed?

Carazy

souza64 wrote: »

i have seen where tesco ireland r in advanced discussions with nama to acquire a large development site on the outskirts of ennis with a view to building a very large supermarket similar to coonagh cross or the large one in naas.in addition they will be trialing a dobbies garden centre.com.they also plan for a pharmacy, opticians and bistro style cafe/ eatery.

car parking is being put at over 600 spaces.the development will include a creche and other child friendly free services.

Unless you have a link to such developments I think this is a bit suspect considering you have just joined here and your very first post is this ''inside'' info.......

Clareman

catallus wrote: »

I'm still in the dark about precisely where this is supposed to be happening?

Tesco Ireland have made no secret about wanting to build a new shop in Ennis, they have tried to get permission to build across the road from the West County and failed, they are now rumours going around that they are looking for other sites, with rumours circulating of sites ranging from Ballymaley (out old Gort Road) to the site of the "old" National School to the site on the by-pass where the new Cusack Park was going to go. I would say that Tesco are probably looking at all those sites and more and will decide on what 1 eventually.

foxcoverteddy

Aren't you the lucky ones, our County Council come Borough council won't allow Tesco into Kilkenny, so everyone has to goto Carlow, Wexford or Tipp.
Funny we have two Dunnes in the city, pathetic parking but plenty of small shops selling for tourists mainly.
Didn't mean to crash in but we would love a TESCO.

Balagan

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

Aren't you the lucky ones, our County Council come Borough council won't allow Tesco into Kilkenny, so everyone has to goto Carlow, Wexford or Tipp.
Funny we have two Dunnes in the city, pathetic parking but plenty of small shops selling for tourists mainly.
Didn't mean to crash in but we would love a TESCO.

It took forever to get Dunnes into Kilkenny.

Shapey Fiend

Tesco just loss lead everything, that's why the prices are low. When they've killed off the competition prices go back up. The playing field is far from level because they have weight to throw around that independent shops will never have. They don't even take a hit on the sale stuff the supplier has to take that. And if he doesn't then he loses a huge chunk of the market. The only reason to put your faith in these places is if you're blindly short term minded because they'll **** everybody over eventually.

Price is not the whole equation. If you want a tin of beans or whatever then fine but doing all your shopping in these places doesn't make good sense. The meat and veg isn't as cheap as you'll find elsewhere by shopping around, and it's 10 times worse than the local places. If you're only eating precooked meals and stuff then fair enough you'll find them in Tesco but if you're living on that kind of thing you're tripling your grocery bill anyway.

The Crescent is boooring. Give me Ennis town center on a rainy day over that any time. The cinema is one of the dirtiest in the country, the speakers are all broken and they've selotaped the screens where it's ripped.

Le_Dieux

AnarchistKen wrote: »

No mention of the large number of jobs in construction and retail that Tesco create year on year. I lived in Naas for five years I actually think that they done a fine job on that site and left it with a fine looking building.

Tesco cannot be blamed for the NTC mess in the middle of the town.

Back on topic I hope for jobs alone the Ennis one goes ahead

I have no idea how many jobs were created during the construction. And yes I agree, the site is not bad at all.

But aare You telling me Tesco are blameless for what's happened in the town centre? Please.....but sorry, Im not going to detract from the thread title...just wondering if and when this supermarket opens & assuming this store sells what Tesco in Naas sells, will florists/mobile shops/toystores/electrics/pharmacy's in Ennis town centre not suffer and end up laying off staff?

Clareman

Shapey Fiend wrote: »

Tesco just loss lead everything, that's why the prices are low. When they've killed off the competition prices go back up.

Sorry to pull you on this, and I was thinking of leaving it, but that's just wrong on so many levels. I've worked for many years in multi-national companies and have a fairly detailed understanding of supply chain and pricing from vendors, what you are saying here is a common misconception as to how multi-nationals work.

Tesco (and other large companies such as Dunnes and Centra) operate off a central purchasing and pricing centre, if you are buying something in Tesco Ennis you can almost guarantee that it'll be the same price in every other Tesco in Ireland (excluding yellow sticker items). The reason Tesco gets great pricing is because they are buying in massive quantities directly from the manufacturer, the manufacturer can offer to give discounted pricing because they only have to deliver to 1 place and they also have a guaranteed price at an agreed time, they don't have to worry about chasing for money or not being paid, they know that they'll get paid.

Often what large companies will do is go out to manufactures of a certain product and tell them the quantities of what they want and where they want it. For example, they want to run a special on pasta sauce, they'll go to Dolmio, Roma and a few more and say they want 1 million jars at 20c per jar delivered to their main depot on the 1st of May, it's up to the suppliers to say whether they want to do business or not.

There'll also be a case where companies will have to pay "hello money" to get their products sold, this will be deemed the cost of doing business (e.g. IT setup costs, advertising, product placement), this will have the impact of meaning that smaller operators won't be able to get get their products sold by larger companies because the cost of setup would be too large.

Large supermarkets will also make their own brand products for a very large variety of products, a lot of these products will suffer from "Yellow Pack" stigma and people won't go near them, people will be very brand loyal to their favourite products (e.g. Coke over Pepsi), Tesco may off a loss leader on products like these to get people used to buying them or to break brand loyalty to other products, once they sense that people are buying the product they'll remove any reductions.

In essence, Tesco don't really care about small shops in the same town as they operate, they are all about market share and profit margin, they'll want to have "x" amount of shops opening at "y" sales levels and "z" profit margins, this will all be laid out at a corporate level.

Sorry about the long post, but it's easy for people to blame the "Evil Multi-National" but all they want to do is increase their share price to keep share holders happy by giving their customers what they want.

Clareman

Le_Dieux wrote: »

just wondering if and when this supermarket opens & assuming this store sells what Tesco in Naas sells, will florists/mobile shops/toystores/electrics/pharmacy's in Ennis town centre not suffer and end up laying off staff?

There's already a Tesco in Ennis, it's not as if they are going to move in and mean that no-body can compete with them. Also, all that seems to be opening in Ennis now is Cash for Gold and Poundshops type places, businesses are closing anyway in town, walking through town and you'll be greeted by a lot of closed shops.

Also, all the business types you have mentioned already has large multi-national presences in town anyway with Interflora/O2 and the rest/World of Wonder/Euronics/Boots, but there's also local businesses that are surviving in the face of competition like Swiss Flower shop/Phone Repairs/Tierneys/Heaney's/Flynns.

Le_Dieux

Clareman wrote: »

There's already a Tesco in Ennis, it's not as if they are going to move in and mean that no-body can compete with them. Also, all that seems to be opening in Ennis now is Cash for Gold and Poundshops type places, businesses are closing anyway in town, walking through town and you'll be greeted by a lot of closed shops.

Also, all the business types you have mentioned already has large multi-national presences in town anyway with Interflora/O2 and the rest/World of Wonder/Euronics/Boots, but there's also local businesses that are surviving in the face of competition like Swiss Flower shop/Phone Repairs/Tierneys/Heaney's/Flynns.

There is also a Tesco in Naas centre ( that was supposed to close when the Hypermarket opened, but for some reason it stayed open). I'm not from Naas - Newbridge here - but Naas town centre now is a ghost town, and there are lots of empty/boarded up shops.

I apologise, I don''t mean to hijack Your thread over the 'troubles' within Naas.

Clareman

Le_Dieux wrote: »

There is also a Tesco in Naas centre ( that was supposed to close when the Hypermarket opened, but for some reason it stayed open). I'm not from Naas - Newbridge here - but Naas town centre now is a ghost town, and there are lots of empty/boarded up shops.

I apologise, I don''t mean to hijack Your thread over the 'troubles' within Naas.

An awful lot of towns have these issues, all over Ireland, it's very easy to blame the nasty shopping centre out of town, but there are other issues that can't be ignored like MASSIVE rates in town centres, high wage costs and the fact that we're in a recession.

pilate 1

Clareman wrote: »

Sorry to pull you on this, and I was thinking of leaving it, but that's just wrong on so many levels. I've worked for many years in multi-national companies and have a fairly detailed understanding of supply chain and pricing from vendors, what you are saying here is a common misconception as to how multi-nationals work.

Tesco (and other large companies such as Dunnes and Centra) operate off a central purchasing and pricing centre, if you are buying something in Tesco Ennis you can almost guarantee that it'll be the same price in every other Tesco in Ireland (excluding yellow sticker items). The reason Tesco gets great pricing is because they are buying in massive quantities directly from the manufacturer, the manufacturer can offer to give discounted pricing because they only have to deliver to 1 place and they also have a guaranteed price at an agreed time, they don't have to worry about chasing for money or not being paid, they know that they'll get paid.

Often what large companies will do is go out to manufactures of a certain product and tell them the quantities of what they want and where they want it. For example, they want to run a special on pasta sauce, they'll go to Dolmio, Roma and a few more and say they want 1 million jars at 20c per jar delivered to their main depot on the 1st of May, it's up to the suppliers to say whether they want to do business or not.

There'll also be a case where companies will have to pay "hello money" to get their products sold, this will be deemed the cost of doing business (e.g. IT setup costs, advertising, product placement), this will have the impact of meaning that smaller operators won't be able to get get their products sold by larger companies because the cost of setup would be too large.

Large supermarkets will also make their own brand products for a very large variety of products, a lot of these products will suffer from "Yellow Pack" stigma and people won't go near them, people will be very brand loyal to their favourite products (e.g. Coke over Pepsi), Tesco may off a loss leader on products like these to get people used to buying them or to break brand loyalty to other products, once they sense that people are buying the product they'll remove any reductions.

In essence, Tesco don't really care about small shops in the same town as they operate, they are all about market share and profit margin, they'll want to have "x" amount of shops opening at "y" sales levels and "z" profit margins, this will all be laid out at a corporate level.

Sorry about the long post, but it's easy for people to blame the "Evil Multi-National" but all they want to do is increase their share price to keep share holders happy by giving their customers what they want.

i think you could have been a mod for thatcher in another life.corporate level all well and good ,but this is not london its clare boards?

Diving Board

pilate 1 wrote: »

i think you could have been a mod for thatcher in another life.corporate level all well and good ,but this is not london its clare boards?

Thats it, play the man not the ball

buck65

Clareman wrote: »

There's already a Tesco in Ennis, it's not as if they are going to move in and mean that no-body can compete with them. Also, all that seems to be opening in Ennis now is Cash for Gold and Poundshops type places, businesses are closing anyway in town, walking through town and you'll be greeted by a lot of closed shops.

Also, all the business types you have mentioned already has large multi-national presences in town anyway with Interflora/O2 and the rest/World of Wonder/Euronics/Boots, but there's also local businesses that are surviving in the face of competition like Swiss Flower shop/Phone Repairs/Tierneys/Heaney's/Flynns.

Euronics is a franchise i.e it is owned by a local businessman, Mary Mulqueen is part of Interflora yes but owns her own business, the other businesses you have mentioned are all probably just hanging in there like most other retail business theses days. A large outlet type mall will close many I'm sure.

You saying that all that's opening up is cash for Gold shops etc. is dsiningenous too. these shops are everywhere not just Ennis, they are temporary pop up shops and are nothing to do with this thread. (indeed withthe massive drop in gold prices recently they might already be counting their days).

Open a new outlet and you'll be greeted by twice as many boarded up shops, you mention rates as a problem, I agree with this too. The council in their blind wisdom are taxing to death local businesses but don't seem to realise they're cutting of their own noses instead.

Clareman

pilate 1 wrote: »

i think you could have been a mod for thatcher in another life.corporate level all well and good ,but this is not london its clare boards?

If we want to live in a free market society where there are rich and poor, big and large, then we have to accept the circumstances. As I have mentioned, I have worked for multi-nationals for a long time, them being painted as an evil organisation with a Scrooge at the top wanting to wipe out the little guy is just wrong, they go where there's an opportunity to make money and increase their profit margins.

buck65

You are deluded. Market share and profit comes at other peoples expense. You may have worked for these people but I compete directly everyday against a billion euro company whose stated aim on their published accounts is to continue to increase pressure in areas where they see weakness.

I am competing against cost or just over cost price. Yes they buy better than me, not much as I deal with same suppliers, but they are continuing this tactic with a view to shaking a few apples from the tree.

Then the prices will not be so keen.

another thing and I mentioned it to a customer one day who came looking for sponsorship (after going to the competitiion with his order)for a local GAA team, can you walk into Tesco etc (i don't compete in the grocery sector) and ask for a few hundred euro to support your local charity?

I'm sure people will mention McDonalds etc. as promoting local charities etc. they are only doing it to be seen to be doing it. We give with no recognition except from the charity itself.

Clareman

buck65 wrote: »

You are deluded. Market share and profit comes at other peoples expense. You may have workerd for these people but I compete directly everyday against a billion euro company whose stated aim on their published accounts is to continue to increase pressure in areas where they see weakness.

I am competing against cost or just over cost price. Yes they buy better than me, not much as I deal with same suppliers, but they are continuing this tactic with a view to shaking a few apples from the tree.

Then the prices will not be so keen.

another thing and I mentioned it to a customer one day who came looking for sponsorship (after going to the competitiion with his order)for a local GAA team, can you walk into Tesco etc (i don't compete in the grocery sector) and ask for a few hundred euro to support your local charity?

I'm sure people will mention McDonalds etc. as promoting local charities etc. they are only doing it to be seen to be doing it. We give with no recognition except from the charity itself.

McDonald's is a franchise, if I'm being pulled on it then so can you

I'm being called a Thatcherite and Deluded in 1 thread, I don't know what's worse, if ye knew me in the RW you'd laugh.

Anyway, it's easier for Tesco to make money when they sell 100 of something at €1 profit on each, whereas if you are just selling 1 of the same item then you won't be able to do that.

Lots of local clubs/teams/societies are sponsored by multi-nationals, I don't think Tesco sponsor any, a friend of mine's wife works for Tesco and they don't pay her maternity pay, they are all about their bottom line and profit margin, they know that they don't have to do much to have people coming into them, saying that, a lot of clubs/etc. make money by bag packing in Tesco.

Palmach

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

Aren't you the lucky ones, our County Council come Borough council won't allow Tesco into Kilkenny, so everyone has to goto Carlow, Wexford or Tipp.
Funny we have two Dunnes in the city, pathetic parking but plenty of small shops selling for tourists mainly.
Didn't mean to crash in but we would love a TESCO.

Balagan wrote: »

It took forever to get Dunnes into Kilkenny.

It seems there is a sensible county council in Kilkenny who can see beyond the grubby one-dimensional price narrative.

Clareman wrote: »

Tesco (and other large companies such as Dunnes and Centra) operate off a central purchasing and pricing centre, if you are buying something in Tesco Ennis you can almost guarantee that it'll be the same price in every other Tesco in Ireland (excluding yellow sticker items).

Not ture. Local managers have discretion to change prices depending on local competition. That includes selling below cost. Tesco Kilrush White Spirits 4l 8 euro. In Clondalkin 11 euro.

.

There'll also be a case where companies will have to pay "hello money" to get their products sold, this will be deemed the cost of doing business (e.g. IT setup costs, advertising, product placement), this will have the impact of meaning that smaller operators won't be able to get get their products sold by larger companies because the cost of setup would be too large.

This is illegal.

Sorry about the long post, but it's easy for people to blame the "Evil Multi-National" but all they want to do is increase their share price to keep share holders happy by giving their customers what they want.

I recommend two books Shopped and Not On the Label. There are lot less rose tinted and expose the under hand tactics as well the social, economic, health and cultural damage done by big multinational supermarkets.

Clareman

Local shops can put yellow stickers on stuff, otherwise everything is controlled from a central database, a couple of years ago I got 144 rolls of Christmas toilet paper for 50c cause of an issue with the way it was input, they didn't have the ability to rectify the error locally.

Setup costs are not illegal, it's all part of the costs of doing business, forcing someone to pay you money to handle your products (i.e. take a bribe) is illegal, making someone cover the costs of handing your products isn't.

There are an awful lot of books that could be read on the topic, I know there's are different economic cultures we could have, all I know is that I can get the same products in different locations for different prices, I will by and large go for the cheapest, freedom of choice. I will however try to shop local and support the local businesses wherever possible, but not to a drastic expense to myself, for example, recently I've had to buy a new car seat for my baby girl, I went to World of Wonder and it was going to cost me €298.99 for the seat we wanted, I got it online for GB£89.99, am I a bad person for not having supported the local business?

rainbowdash

buck65 wrote: »

another thing and I mentioned it to a customer one day who came looking for sponsorship (after going to the competitiion with his order)for a local GAA team, can you walk into Tesco etc (i don't compete in the grocery sector) and ask for a few hundred euro to support your local charity?

Any time I have been in Tesco in Kilrush there seems to be a bag packing day raising money for local groups, does every small shop allow this?

I've seen Tesco run computer for schools and other things, aren't they great.

Of course they are only doing these things to be seen to be doing it but every other business is the same.

If I owned a pub and sponsored the local hurling team I would expect them to spend some money in the premises after games or functions etc.

Sponsorship is in itself a form of advertising / marketing.

Balagan

Palmach wrote: »

It seems there is a sensible county council in Kilkenny who can see beyond the grubby one-dimensional price narrative.

Dunnes was kept out of Kilkenny for so long in the past by the well-heeled local businesses with heavy representation on/connection to the local authority who wanted the status to stay quo and who felt that what was good for it/them was good for everybody. The 'one-dimensional price narrative' may indeed be grubby but it is not the only thing that is grubby.