Cafe Pay

sozbox

Hi all,

Friend is opening a cafe soon and asked me what about what he should pay.
He doesn't want to pay minimum wage as he believes, rightly or wrongly, that he will attract poor staff.

Can anyone advise on what the expected hourly rate for an experienced cafe worker should be?

ironclaw

Not exactly like for like, but in the leisure industry back in 2007, we had relatively skilled, customer facing people in at 8am and finishing at 6pm on mainly weekends. Fast paced work and 'on your feet all day' sort of thing. That was €10 per hour.

I wouldn't necessarily say low wages attract poor staff. Anyone who sticks their nose up at anything remotely higher (Even by less than a euro) of minimum wage is someone I wouldn't want on my team (Provided they were offered good hours, reasonably conditions of work and the chance of a good bonus) That person is more than likely only interested in the wage of the job rather than the job itself.

A model that has worked well for some is a decent wage slightly above minimum but a performance bonus based on sales as a team (Don't do individual, it leads to all out war) Staff make or break a business, there are plenty of cafe's I won't be returning to purely based on the staff. If people know that a good job could land them perhaps €100 extra at the end of the month, they are going to be more productive.

jd83

10 euro an hour and then some sort of bonus based on mystery shopper results or other metrics. I also have a number of businesses i wont be returning to based solely on their staff!

sozbox

The bonus thing didn't even cross my mind, great idea.

Bandara

You pay the industry standard, which is basically minimum wage.

By paying more you are not going to get better applicants who will be harder working or more loyal to you. That is achieved by how you run the place and how you treat staff.

You can pay someone 20 an hour, but if your pig/idiot of a boss they will still hate you regardless.

Pay minimum wage, tell people what you expect of them, and if they are not good enough/doing what you requested just replace them with some that are.

You pay €1 an hour above minumum wage and you have five staff, you've just added close to 15k a year to your wage bill, a cafe can't afford that.

Advertise the job and see the applicants you get, there is loads of waiters, ex-deli and shop staff etc who would love to work for you for €8.65 an hour, and they would value the job. Your crazy if you start handing out money needlessly before you have even sold a single thing.

And if you do get someone sh!t hot and after 6 months they look to leave you can increase their wages then, no reason on earth to do it beforehand.

sozbox

Hammertime wrote: »

You pay the industry standard, which is basically minimum wage.

By paying more you are not going to get better applicants who will be harder working or more loyal to you. That is achieved by how you run the place and how you treat staff.

You can pay someone 20 an hour, but if your pig/idiot of a boss they will still hate you regardless.

Pay minimum wage, tell people what you expect of them, and if they are not good enough/doing what you requested just replace them with some that are.

You pay €1 an hour above minumum wage and you have five staff, you've just added close to 15k a year to your wage bill, a cafe can't afford that.

Advertise the job and see the applicants you get, there is loads of waiters, ex-deli and shop staff etc who would love to work for you for €8.65 an hour, and they would value the job. Your crazy if you start handing out money needlessly before you have even sold a single thing.

And if you do get someone sh!t hot and after 6 months they look to leave you can increase their wages then, no reason on earth to do it beforehand.

Great advice, I'll send him to this thread.
How do you feel about bonus schemes in this kind of role?

DubTony

Personally I wouldn't have a bonus scheme in this type of role. Bonuses should be based on production and/or sales. I don't think a cafe is the right environment. If there's a particular employee who shines, throw him or her a few quid extra every few months.

sandin

at minimum wage, you won't get good staff as there are plenty of jobs paying €10 an hour.

At €10 an hour, you get a better standard of staff who won't be checking out every second advert for another job, they'll represent you better on the cafe floor - very important for repeat custom.

In addition to a better rate, also have an interest in the staff and understand their needs - if they are young they may stay out late on a Friday or saturday, so allow for a later shift. If they are religious, allow for not working sunday's, if they have a kid, allow for family time etc - happy staff can give a great atmosphere in a shop/cafe and are worth their weight in gold.

ironclaw

if they are young they may stay out late on a Friday or saturday, so allow for a later shift. If they are religious, allow for not working sunday's

Couldn't agree less. Allowing someone a later shift every Saturday or Sunday for any reason is just asking for trouble. If someone has been out drinking the night before , even at 4pm the next day they won't be 100%. Hangovers are easily detectable and you'll just have zombie staff.

The odd one, "one in four" type of thing is fine but every single weekend is ludicrous. In these times you need to fit your social life around your work, not the other way around. I don't expect my employer to accommodate my social schedule. Like I said though odd exceptions or big occasions are OK.

I think I've worked every weekend (At least a Sat or Sun) and most bank holidays in the past 4 years.

sozbox

sandin wrote: »

at minimum wage, you won't get good staff as there are plenty of jobs paying €10 an hour.

At €10 an hour, you get a better standard of staff who won't be checking out every second advert for another job, they'll represent you better on the cafe floor - very important for repeat custom.

In addition to a better rate, also have an interest in the staff and understand their needs - if they are young they may stay out late on a Friday or saturday, so allow for a later shift. If they are religious, allow for not working sunday's, if they have a kid, allow for family time etc - happy staff can give a great atmosphere in a shop/cafe and are worth their weight in gold.

The aim is to get staff who will stay long term and help to retain customers and drive repeat business. The proposed rate is 9/hour, should he expect difficulty in getting decent staff at this rate in your experience?

Mr Simpson

What I've had is, pay minimum wage, then mystery shop. If your staff reach a set target, then they all get 50c extra per hour for the week.

It worked quite well where I was, encouraged upselling etc.

sandin

ironclaw wrote: »

Couldn't agree less. Allowing someone a later shift every Saturday or Sunday for any reason is just asking for trouble. If someone has been out drinking the night before , even at 4pm the next day they won't be 100%. Hangovers are easily detectable and you'll just have zombie staff.

The odd one, "one in four" type of thing is fine but every single weekend is ludicrous. In these times you need to fit your social life around your work, not the other way around. I don't expect my employer to accommodate my social schedule. Like I said though odd exceptions or big occasions are OK.

I think I've worked every weekend (At least a Sat or Sun) and most bank holidays in the past 4 years.

Try reading the full post and getting the understanding of the point - the point being, look after good staff and ensure you understand they may requirethe odd bit of leeway here / there in rosters for whatever reason, including those who may want the odd night of enjoying themselves. - I said nothing about drink whatsoever, I'd be concerned about tiredness as I find good staff tend no to go on drinking binges.

Jason1984 wrote: »

The aim is to get staff who will stay long term and help to retain customers and drive repeat business. The proposed rate is 9/hour, should he expect difficulty in getting decent staff at this rate in your experience?

9.00 an hour would be fine in most towns, but I'd go a little higher in Dublin / Cork.
I find pay is only one element. Respecting staff and ensuring they like working for you is as important.