Milk Price- Please read Mod note in post #1

Deepsouthwest

keep going wrote: »

a couple of answers
no its not the first scheme,there was one available in march at 32.5 which was poorly subscribed to
almost certain there is no priority to another scheme or to previous schemes.
as far as im aware its 5 % of the total milk pool this time whereas last time it was 20% of your quota so my hunch is less than half the suppliers will take it up.that is why my advice to all west cork suppliers is not to take it up;)
somebody was trying to convince me that it was a sure sign milk price was going to go up and they want lock in cheap milk before it does,needless to say i agreed with him

Can't figure out the neagativity around the fixed price scheme. I signed up for 20% of my milk, wish I could've included more, at the 32.5c/l, which with my solids averaged over 36c/l, that's has been a nice boost right through this yr for me. From what I can gather, only 40 out of 640 suppliers signed up to this.
Farmers can be a suspicious crowd!

frazzledhome

Dsw is bang on. We always feel there's an ulterior motive when these are offered. In GII anyone and it's no one has all there milk in and rightly so. The guys with 30% fixed from the start i.e. Took some in every scheme are rock stars today.

You need to take a balanced approach to it and have a portion fixed. You may lose in the high times but you'll gain during leaner times when you really need it.

To answer Kiwtows question it is a fixed amount to one customer for a fixed period. The GII scheme is linked to Ag inflation so you're basically securing a margin for that period. Now who wouldn't like that?

kowtow

frazzledhome wrote: »

To answer Kiwtows question it is a fixed amount to one customer for a fixed period. The GII scheme is linked to Ag inflation so you're basically securing a margin for that period. Now who wouldn't like that?

Is the customer wholly disconnected from GIIL and it's associated entities?

Dawggone

[quote="Deepsouthwest;97776202"
Farmers can be a suspicious crowd![/quote]

+1.
Risk management.
When locking into a price, I usually buy a chunk of fert or chems etc.

frazzledhome

kowtow wrote: »

frazzledhome wrote: »

To answer Kiwtows question it is a fixed amount to one customer for a fixed period. The GII scheme is linked to Ag inflation so you're basically securing a margin for that period. Now who wouldn't like that?

Is the customer wholly disconnected from GIIL and it's associated entities?

Add your reply here.
To date yes, latest I can't tell you

frazzledhome

Dawggone wrote: »

[quote="Deepsouthwest;97776202"
Farmers can be a suspicious crowd!

+1.
Risk management.
When locking into a price, I usually buy a chunk of fert or chems etc.[/quote]
Add your reply here.
That's interesting, with the latest offer from GII there's a mechanism to fix feed costs.

Dawggone

frazzledhome wrote: »

Add your reply here.
That's interesting, with the latest offer from GII there's a mechanism to fix feed costs.

Hedge the hedge.

kowtow

frazzledhome wrote: »

Add your reply here.
That's interesting, with the latest offer from GII there's a mechanism to fix feed costs.

Won't be long before we can lock into enough financial contracts to replicate the full "synthetic milking" experience.

That'll be a great relief. Up until now I've had to stand in a cold shower burning 20 euro notes and getting one of the children to pour slurry over my head and stamp on my fingers.

Dawggone

kowtow wrote: »

Won't be long before we can lock into enough financial contracts to replicate the full "synthetic milking" experience.

That'll be a great relief. Up until now I've had to stand in a cold shower burning 20 euro notes and getting one of the children to pour slurry over my head and stamp on my fingers.

LMAO!!

Deepsouthwest

frazzledhome wrote: »

Add your reply here.
That's interesting, with the latest offer from GII there's a mechanism to fix feed costs.

That makes a lot of business sense.
But unfortunately most farmers want it all, all the time!

Greengrass1

frazzledhome wrote: »

Add your reply here.
38.87 F 4.71 P 4.03
38.97 F 4.73 P 4.04

That's inc Winter, lactose bonus, 1c fro Coop and vat
Excluding winter bonus it would've been 30.87 so that's 6.87 in solids above base.

Surprised my solids are higher than your frazz. Seeing as you have a much higher % of crossbreds than we currently have aswell as about 20% of herd here being fresh calvers in october
Ex winter bonus and top up we got 32.19 or 8.19c over base

kowtow

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Surprised my solids are higher than your frazz. Seeing as you have a much higher % of crossbreds than we currently have aswell as about 20% of herd here being fresh calvers in october
Ex winter bonus and top up we got 32.19 or 8.19c over base

Reblochon?

Dawggone

kowtow wrote: »

Reblochon?

Thought that Reblochon was AOC?

Greengrass1

Dawggone wrote: »

Thought that Reblochon was AOC?

Ye lost me at reblochon

kowtow

Dawggone wrote: »

Thought that Reblochon was AOC?

The cheese is, but the technique could be deployed universally...

First milking clusters off quickly and out to the bulk contract

Milk again, high solids milk into a second tank for premium cheese!

mahoney_j

32.890 c ltre fat 4.57 protein 4.10 .26.08 base inc vat and 0.2 cent SCC top up

WheatenBriar

Lest we forget

Drops in base is money taken from our pockets

We can all crow about how much we make from solids,but we'd be making that anyway

Every glanbia farmer is being underpaid 3c a litre compared to the best purchasers out there at the moment

The narrative here by some that we should look at solids and what we do there and go 'oh wow' or cost cuts and efficiencies in our own yard is a smokescreen tool used by some fan boys to let processors (who are protecting their employer and insulated salaries) off the hook
The good job most of us do to get the best from our cows and farms is frankly our good job,not glanbia's and one we are not paid for, unlike giil management


Lest we forget

RightTurnClyde

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Lest we forget

Drops in base is money taken from our pockets

We can all crow about how much we make from solids,but we'd be making that anyway

Every glanbia farmer is being underpaid 3c a litre compared to the best purchasers out there at the moment

The narrative here by some that we should look at solids and what we do there and go 'oh wow' or cost cuts and efficiencies in our own yard is a smokescreen tool used by some fan boys to let processors (who are protecting their employer and insulated salaries) off the hook
The good job most of us do to get the best from our cows and farms is frankly our good job,not glanbia's and one we are not paid for, unlike giil management


Lest we forget

+1000. Well Said

keep going

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Lest we forget

Drops in base is money taken from our pockets

We can all crow about how much we make from solids,but we'd be making that anyway

Every glanbia farmer is being underpaid 3c a litre compared to the best purchasers out there at the moment

The narrative here by some that we should look at solids and what we do there and go 'oh wow' or cost cuts and efficiencies in our own yard is a smokescreen tool used by some fan boys to let processors (who are protecting their employer and insulated salaries) off the hook
The good job most of us do to get the best from our cows and farms is frankly our good job,not glanbia's and one we are not paid for, unlike giil management


Lest we forget

in my opinion youre only being under paid by one cent compared to carbery at the moment and alot of that 1 cent could be put down to the products ye are in

RightTurnClyde

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

That makes a lot of business sense.
But unfortunately most farmers want it all, all the time!

I don't get it. Why offer a fixed price on 5% of their volume. It's not as if they are going out to try and bid for milk supplies. They have their volume of supplies as good as guaranteed for the next 4 years. I'm sure 5% of their volume isn't the only milk they have sold forward, either short term or long term.Why aren't we offered any of that. Why is that 5% being singled out for offer to the farmers. Why isn't it just part of the total milk price, like every other product.
It's complete smoke and mirrors. Distraction tactics. At the end of the day that 5% at a higher price, being singled out is only reducing the price of the other 95%
Same with the fert, if they have a volume of fert bought forward at the right price, put it out there and offer it to the farmers. First come first served. Maybe that would be a bit too transparent.
Is it going a bit like the grain where you have to by X amount of inputs to sell your grain at X amount, and if you don't you loose x% of the price. So your margin is being dictated to you. At least the grain lads can move the following year, no such luxury with milk

kowtow

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

It's complete smoke and mirrors. Distraction tactics. At the end of the day that 5% at a higher price, being singled out is only reducing the price of the other 95%
Same with the fert, if they have a volume of fert bought forward at the right price, put it out there and offer it to the farmers. First come first served. Maybe that would be a bit too transparent.
Is it going a bit like the grain where you have to by X amount of inputs to sell your grain at X amount, and if you don't you loose x% of the price. So your margin is being dictated to you. At least the grain lads can move the following year, no such luxury with milk

Whether we like it or not, eventually we're going to have to decide between lumping everyone together within each co-op, and sharing the benefits or losses of any added value or market timing - no doubt with plenty of complaints that expanding suppliers are profiting at the expense of those who were there first... ultimately that setup will see calls for more expensive shares for new volume to compensate existing suppliers.

Or alternatively encouraging co-ops to do their jobs properly as our agents, allowing us to pick and choose which contracts we want to participate in (and where applicable, compete on volume / quality / loyalty to get access to them)... accepting that any balance of milk over and above what we hold contracts for is going to pool at a lower overall price much closer to the spot market.

As much as we might want it, we can't have it both ways, and a mish-mash in between those two extremes is going to see everybody unhappy one way or another.

But either one of these two roads requires co-ops to stop acting like school masters with some magical formula in their bags, to be disclosed in the fullness of time to the well behaved boys at the front of the class, and start doing the job for which they have been more than generously capitalised by all of their owners.

Henwin

protein 3.56
butterfat 4.25
gross milk price 31.3 cent
price for 15/17 scheme 37.0 cent
current price 29.5 cent
spring calving holstein herd to kerry co-op

frazzledhome

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Aye, you can be pretty sure Giil has its sums well done on the 32c fixed price thing,a buyer is there at small volumes
It makes great press,certain in the knowledge that farmers representatives aren't as good in the media as the sure in their big salaries glanbia boffins

In my experience,going back nearly 40 years most of the so called ag and ag industry 'experts' couldn't predict ice in a frost to be honest

Add your reply here.
You won't be taking any of it so, I presume

kowtow

frazzledhome wrote: »

Add your reply here.

Would it be helpful if I enclosed a stamped addressed envelope?

PMU

Henwin wrote: »

protein 3.56
butterfat 4.25
gross milk price 31.3 cent
price for 15/17 scheme 37.0 cent
current price 29.5 cent
spring calving holstein herd to kerry co-op

is the 15/17 scheme something to do with liquid milk

Henwin

no its a scheme where tey pay you x amount for 20% of your milk, it was up to each farmer whether or not tey wanted to sign up for 2 years. its to protect us in a bad year.

frazzledhome

http://i.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/dairy/74121139/irish-farming-specialist-warns-nz-dairy-farmers-to-focus-on-grass

Bit of reading

Buford T. Justice XIX

frazzledhome wrote: »

http://i.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/dairy/74121139/irish-farming-specialist-warns-nz-dairy-farmers-to-focus-on-grass

Bit of reading

For three months of the year Irish farmers grew only 3-8kg dry matter/hectare, compared to 16kg DM/ha in summer when they made silage.

Am I misunderstanding that quote or are they using really crap figures?

kowtow

Buford T. Justice V wrote:

Am I misunderstanding that quote or are they using really crap figures?

Think they're mixing up tonnes & kg somewhere...

friesian13

gross milk price 33.382. 15/17 price 39.920. 3.94p 4.28bf kerry supplier.wouldnt mind if all my milk was in 15/17 contract!!

degetme

that scheme really makes a difference. we were lucky when they brought it out. it was undersubscribed at the time of announcement.
with 20% scheme got 41.515c/l
milk price received 35.252c/l
prot 4.11
fat 4.38

frazzledhome

I attended a Glanbia meeting last night.

I brought up milk price and the fact that GII are paying the lowest base price in the country at the moment. One supporting voice, not a word from anyone else in the room.

I cannot understand this, are people so unaware of the facts or conditioned into accepting everything that's sent their way. I understand why price is low etc but to not even question, unbelievable

Dawggone

frazzledhome wrote: »

I attended a Glanbia meeting last night.

I brought up milk price and the fact that GII are paying the lowest base price in the country at the moment. One supporting voice, not a word from anyone else in the room.

I cannot understand this, are people so unaware of the facts or conditioned into accepting everything that's sent their way. I understand why price is low etc but to not even question, unbelievable

Obviously a happy bunch Frazz!
You'd find it hard to believe reading posts on here.
Got a letter from our gang yesterday calling a meeting next month about milk price. Letter says that average milk price in Ireland and Germany is 28cpl...:)

Buford T. Justice XIX

frazzledhome wrote: »

I attended a Glanbia meeting last night.

I brought up milk price and the fact that GII are paying the lowest base price in the country at the moment. One supporting voice, not a word from anyone else in the room.

I cannot understand this, are people so unaware of the facts or conditioned into accepting everything that's sent their way. I understand why price is low etc but to not even question, unbelievable

I'm sure they were very vocal in the pub afterwards, though, because that's the right place to air your grievances.

mahoney_j

frazzledhome wrote: »

I attended a Glanbia meeting last night.

I brought up milk price and the fact that GII are paying the lowest base price in the country at the moment. One supporting voice, not a word from anyone else in the room.

I cannot understand this, are people so unaware of the facts or conditioned into accepting everything that's sent their way. I understand why price is low etc but to not even question, unbelievable

Were u happy with answers returned??,area meetings for my coop coming up next week ,were in a better position than ye currently but still lots of questions to answer ,proposed Msa for one and lack of fixed price scheme another

RightTurnClyde

frazzledhome wrote: »

I attended a Glanbia meeting last night.

I brought up milk price and the fact that GII are paying the lowest base price in the country at the moment. One supporting voice, not a word from anyone else in the room.

I cannot understand this, are people so unaware of the facts or conditioned into accepting everything that's sent their way. I understand why price is low etc but to not even question, unbelievable

What reply did you get

WheatenBriar

frazzledhome wrote: »

I attended a Glanbia meeting last night.

I brought up milk price and the fact that GII are paying the lowest base price in the country at the moment. One supporting voice, not a word from anyone else in the room.

I cannot understand this, are people so unaware of the facts or conditioned into accepting everything that's sent their way. I understand why price is low etc but to not even question, unbelievable

Public glanbia meetings aren't supposed to be starting until the new year
I don't know what type of meeting you attended, but a lot of milk supplier council area members are legacy members there a long time

Time enough to have been buying co op shares when available on whispers of advice so they will on average have considerably more spin out shares than average and they'd have been the pioneers entering any fixed milk available so probably have a lot more than average in the current one,they are on average more comfortable than the minions or should be
That and they are inside a bubble

Its members own fault tbh that more critical voices aren't elected,but frankly its like the IFA,ICMSA etc or even school boards,no one wants to have a job that eats into downtime when you've a hard day and night job like ours

So in the case of glanbia councils, the feedback they're sending to management is virtually useless in my opinion
Round here we call them the yes committees

Public meetings, like the one whelan2 attended in Navan are where you hear what most suppliers are really thinking

kevthegaff

Fixed price schemea should have all suppliers are none, someone's going to get squeezed of a certain number avail...

mahoney_j

kevthegaff wrote: »

Fixed price schemea should have all suppliers are none, someone's going to get squeezed of a certain number avail...

From my knowledge of the fixed price schemes some coops have they are open to all suppliers to fix a certain portion of their milk ,if they choose not to it'll either be a wise move or a foolish one but imo it's a no brainier to fix ,yes u may miss out if milk price sky rockets and goes above fixed price but when markets tank having a portion fixed is a wise move .id love the option of fixing a certain portion of my milk but Arrabawn currently dosnt offer any such scheme

atlantic mist

frazzledhome wrote: »

I attended a Glanbia meeting last night.

I brought up milk price and the fact that GII are paying the lowest base price in the country at the moment. One supporting voice, not a word from anyone else in the room.

what area are you in frazz? love to take a trip up to ur meetings some day

whats their response? u brought up about milk price, did u ask any further questions into why were being paid one of leading lowest prices in the country


are the other suppliers happy to leave one or two people do the talking at meetings, no good 50 of us roaring them were civilized people, and we want questions answered in our two hour meeting where half of it is general taken up by them rambling and putting up pie charts and lovely diagrams

kowtow

Frazz's comment above about people being conditioned to accept what they are told is very telling, and it's a change of mindset that is required, urgently, if we are to do justice to our own farms and to our own hard work.

The evolution - sometimes perhaps unwilling, sometimes unwise - from farm to dairy business in a free market is a reality whether we like it or not, and to make a success of these farms as businesses we need - I think - to be ready to be as constructively critical of the chain we supply outside the farm-gate as we are on ourselves inside the yard. It may well that in a global market price is beyond our direct control, but that doesn't mean it should be beyond our concern - particularly as we seem to have so many well paid (by us!) layers between the us and the final consumer.

I never really understood why farmers accepted traceability in the food chain (and this goes for beef as much as milk) as a one way ticket - we pay for it, suffer the labour of it, and the penalties when something goes wrong and yet the same database which tells Tesco the middle name of the poor farmer who tagged the beast can't tell the farmer where his product is ending up, and in general terms at what price. We need to learn to connect with our customers, and the present state of affairs is simply not good enough.

Of course we shouldn't dwell on price to the detriment of our farms - far from it - but we should use this difficult state of affairs, with a low milk price, to make damned sure that the supply chain which we fund is fit for purpose - which is taking the fantastic milk we produce to the best possible market on the day, with the greatest margin payable directly back to the farm.

For the most part we got the land we need from a previous generation - perhaps our own contribution should be to think harder about the supply chain we want to pass on, along with the land & the cows, to the next.

degetme

can any of these levies be scrapped that are currently being deducted from milk cheque?
1. bovine disease
2. dairy research levy
3.inspection levy
4.n.d.c levy

don't know what number 1 & 3 are for. maybe someone mite enlighten me on the subject

atlantic mist

we have 5 levies on ours
1.Bord Bainne levy (thats in statute since 73)
2.dairy research levy (wouldnt mid that if it went for research)
3.dairy council levy (pays for the adds wit the rugby lads)
4.government services (if were paying for gov services whats our taxes going towards and we pay a levy on ever liter we produce so surely this is covered in 1)
5.disease eradication (who is this being paid to dept of ag/ahi ireland?)

Are they compulsory?

frazzledhome

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Public glanbia meetings aren't supposed to be starting until the new year
I don't know what type of meeting you attended, but a lot of milk supplier council area members are legacy members there a long time

Time enough to have been buying co op shares when available on whispers of advice so they will on average have considerably more spin out shares than average and they'd have been the pioneers entering any fixed milk available so probably have a lot more than average in the current one,they are on average more comfortable than the minions or should be
That and they are inside a bubble

Its members own fault tbh that more critical voices aren't elected,but frankly its like the IFA,ICMSA etc or even school boards,no one wants to have a job that eats into downtime when you've a hard day and night job like ours

So in the case of glanbia councils, the feedback they're sending to management is virtually useless in my opinion
Round here we call them the yes committees

Public meetings, like the one whelan2 attended in Navan are where you hear what most suppliers are really thinking

I must say that's quiet an unfair post. Most of the people I know on committees are fully committed and having a good grasp of issues.

That said there are a few on committees that are like asses looking into furze bushes.

Your comment re share buying is totally unfair.

frazzledhome

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Public glanbia meetings aren't supposed to be starting until the new year
I don't know what type of meeting you attended, but a lot of milk supplier council area members are legacy members there a long time

Time enough to have been buying co op shares when available on whispers of advice so they will on average have considerably more spin out shares than average and they'd have been the pioneers entering any fixed milk available so probably have a lot more than average in the current one,they are on average more comfortable than the minions or should be
That and they are inside a bubble

Its members own fault tbh that more critical voices aren't elected,but frankly its like the IFA,ICMSA etc or even school boards,no one wants to have a job that eats into downtime when you've a hard day and night job like ours

So in the case of glanbia councils, the feedback they're sending to management is virtually useless in my opinion
Round here we call them the yes committees

Public meetings, like the one whelan2 attended in Navan are where you hear what most suppliers are really thinking

I must say that's quiet an unfair post. Most of the people I know on committees are fully committed and having a good grasp of issues.

That said there are a few on committees that are like asses looking into furze bushes.

Your comment re share buying is totally unfair.

WheatenBriar

Well there is a saying Frazz,when two people always agree, only one of them is thinking
I personally thought your comment on the slurry heel neighbour the other night was unfair on complainers implying to complain was a symptom only of bad farmers

frazzledhome

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Well there is a saying Frazz,when two people always agree, only one of them is thinking
I personally thought your comment on the slurry heel neighbour the other night was unfair on complainers implying to complain was a symptom only of bad farmers

That's certainly not what I meant and from reading your posts I know you're bright enough to know that

frazzledhome

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Well there is a saying Frazz,when two people always agree, only one of them is thinking
I personally thought your comment on the slurry heel neighbour the other night was unfair on complainers implying to complain was a symptom only of bad farmers

That's certainly not what I meant

WheatenBriar

Well I'd be hoping so! But when I'm getting pm's thinking thats what you meant or looking at it as a dig,theres a problem

That said this is the Internet
The spoken word contains a lot more context than the written
The latter runs a lot more risk of being mistaken for arrogance and of course I'd include my own contributions as being subject to that risk also
Lets move on

frazzledhome

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Well I'd be hoping so! But when I'm getting pm's thinking thats what you meant or looking at it as a dig,theres a problem

That said this is the Internet
The spoken word contains a lot more context than the written
The latter runs a lot more risk of being mistaken for arrogance and of course I'd include my own contributions as being subject to that risk also
Lets move on

If people can't contextualise or choose not to, what can I do about it. I'm sure you set them straight on what I meant :)

Your posts I wouldn't consider arrogant, they're what you believe and I agree with some but not all. If others can't deal with that, well there's not much I can do.