Milk Price- Please read Mod note in post #1

keep going

March price 30. 87inc vat @4.35bf and 3.46 p , there some carry over cows in that

blackdog1

keep going wrote: »

March price 30. 87inc vat @4.35bf and 3.46 p , there some carry over cows in that

West cork coop?

Brown Podzol

Dairygold.


P 3.26 f 4.38. 25.53

770 lts delivered per cow, that's for all cows in the herd, whether calved or not.
Piss poor return for the effort involved.

rangler1

kevthegaff wrote: »

How low and low will prices go before us farmers start protesting would ye reckon?

Like Mr ed I'd be very surprised if there was protest.....no appetite for protest anymore and even those that do go are saying why bother when most farmers are staying at home.
Does even 1% of farmers attend protests now

Milked out

US production up 1.8% in march over last year. Low grain prices driving em on. Bad to be saying it but a serious drought would be needed to knock them back a bit this year

visatorro

Milked out wrote: »

US production up 1.8% in march over last year. Low grain prices driving em on. Bad to be saying it but a serious drought would be needed to knock them back a bit this year

Older generation here used to always give out about high meal price until someone pointed out that high grain price was the only thing keeping our competitors at bay.

keep going

blackdog1 wrote: »

West cork coop?

Yep and in the fixed price schemes, the one finishing in dec 17 currently paying 35.7.i remember being at the meeting about this and suggesting to the fella beside me that id fix half my milk 7n it if I could who thought I was nuts

keep going

rangler1 wrote: »

Like Mr ed I'd be very surprised if there was protest.....no appetite for protest anymore and even those that do go are saying why bother when most farmers are staying at home.
Does even 1% of farmers attend protests now

Ah we moved on from protests, its sit ins now

blackdog1

Brown Podzol wrote: »

Dairygold.


P 3.26 f 4.38. 25.53

770 lts delivered per cow, that's for all cows in the herd, whether calved or not.
Piss poor return for the effort involved.

Did you fix any milk to the 30c scheme Brown?.

Water John

1% hardly turn up at Coop AGM's, where their voice has to be heard, whether top table likes it or not.

Farmer Ed

keep going wrote: »

Ah we moved on from protests, its sit ins now

I have a theory that if boards of co ops were forced to sit on actual boards rather that the soft seating you might find in boardrooms they might find it easier to stay awake at board meetings.

Water John

Look Ed, to offer these elite anything less than a half a million is an insult.

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/ornua-remuneration-sensationalised/

You'd milk a lot of cows to make that.

keep going

Water John wrote: »

Look Ed, to offer these elite anything less than a half a million is an insult.

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/ornua-remuneration-sensationalised/

You'd milk a lot of cows to make that.

Yet again im being under paid .......or maybe not .

Brown Podzol

blackdog1 wrote: »

Did you fix any milk to the 30c scheme Brown?.

Fixed for the max 15%. Only came to 5%, as referenced to last year. Quota issues last year forced us to feed milk to calves and carry as much as we could into April.

rangler1

keep going wrote: »

Yet again im being under paid .......or maybe not .

anyone farming now that has a degree must be feeling a bit silly.......we shuldn't have been in such a hurry to give up learning

keep going

Water John wrote: »

1% hardly turn up at Coop AGM's, where their voice has to be heard, whether top table likes it or not.

This is one my little pet hates.moan all year long but dont even turn up at agm, trust me boards do react to critism especially if it is concerted.the other one is unwillingness to go for posts or take any responsiblity

visatorro

Aib using 24 Base price against loans for the year, memo sent around to go easy on farmers! Aren't they very good!

Farmer Ed

keep going wrote: »

This is one my little pet hates.moan all year long but dont even turn up at agm, trust me boards do react to critism especially if it is concerted.the other one is unwillingness to go for posts or take any responsiblity

Forcing people to buy all their inputs while at the same time not removing the rule that anyone who is insane can not be eligible to run for a position on the Co Op committee, always struck me as a bit of an oxymoron. But I suppose it is a great way of having some excuse for not allowing undesirables to run for positions on the board. IMO the average board member does little more than dress up in his finest suit, turn up at meetings and look on with awe and admiration as their perceived superior intellect of management strikes them dumb.

Water John

Ed, you haven't taken on board the good advice to a dairy farmer from his better a DG board member when he asked about the further drops in milk price each month. He was told 'Be Positive, Be Positive'!!!!

Positivity will be very welcome by the bank manager. It will reduce your loan.

rangler1

keep going wrote: »

This is one my little pet hates.moan all year long but dont even turn up at agm, trust me boards do react to critism especially if it is concerted.the other one is unwillingness to go for posts or take any responsiblity

+1
Did you hear Liam Delany (the young farmer on the Mc Donalds ad)on countrywide this morning saying the same thing.

Farmer Ed

Water John wrote: »

Ed, you haven't taken on board the good advice to a dairy farmer from his better a DG board member when he asked about the further drops in milk price each month. He was told 'Be Positive, Be Positive'!!!!

Positivity will be very welcome by the bank manager. It will reduce your loan.

Is there any truth that the ICOS has issued all board members with a copy of the book the secret. You know the one where it suggests that if things haven't worked out according to plan it is only because you haven't been doing enough possitive visualisation.

milkprofit

visatorro wrote: »

Aib using 24 Base price against loans for the year, memo sent around to go easy on farmers! Aren't they very good!

They are stres testing at 22c

Water John

Keep Going, there may be some thing to be gained from going to the AGM. But going for for posts would be about the same a p***ing against the wind.

Coop spend a lot of time and they have the full time staff making sure the right people get elected.
You can well say its farmers own fault then, but they are not organised and are far less cohesive than before. This has especially happened since they no longer meet every day at the creamery as in the 60's & 70's.

Dawggone

Text from my Brother yesterday...

'Its unheard of that anyone on their deathbed said "I wish I had worked harder in my job/business".

So tru

freedominacup

Dawggone wrote: »

Text from my Brother yesterday...

'Its unheard of that anyone on their deathbed said "I wish I had worked harder in my job/business".

So tru

You above just about any of us on here should take that to heart. Time off is not a luxury.

mf240

Dawggone wrote: »

Text from my Brother yesterday...

'Its unheard of that anyone on their deathbed said "I wish I had worked harder in my job/business".

So tru

Some lads don't be well enough to give a speech while on their deathbed.

kowtow

mf240 wrote:

Some lads don't be well enough to give a speech while on their deathbed.

And even if they could, who would hear it above the noise of the milking machine?

cute geoge

mf240 wrote: »

Some lads don't be well enough to give a speech while on their deathbed.

I would say you would be a gas man to meet up with you over a few pints some night

keep going

Water John wrote: »

Keep Going, there may be some thing to be gained from going to the AGM. But going for for posts would be about the same a p***ing against the wind.

Coop spend a lot of time and they have the full time staff making sure the right people get elected.
You can well say its farmers own fault then, but they are not organised and are far less cohesive than before. This has especially happened since they no longer meet every day at the creamery as in the 60's & 70's.

have you ever put yourself forward for a position.did people ever come to you and ask you to do a job.if you were selected are you saying you wouldnt have the ability or skills to be effective or are you saying that you wouldnt be able to handle the management.just trying to figure out why some one shouldnt go for positions and i think saying that you wouldnt be able to change anything is just saying that you are useless,a bit like saying we wont play the match because we ll lose anyway.i spend alot of time on coop business and act in the best interests at all times of the shareholders,milk suppliers and the coop and at every oppurtunity i encourage everyone to get involved in it because the more people that see how things work the better and i find people who have previously been on the board are the best at asking the questions that need to be asked.not getting involved is a total cop out no matter what the circumstances be cause my attitude is if you want something done you must do it yourself

Dawggone

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Do you allocate most of your wages to the tillage enterprise. would costing 1 wage/100 cows change the figures much
And do you cost what comes across from the tillage ( maize, tractor hire, etc) at your cost price or at market price, Iykwim
Curious

Used €40k/100 cows wages.
Land charge of €145/ha set by Gov inc.
Dairy pays the tillage op for forage and feed. This is charged at slightly less than market value for tax reasons. Therefore dairy pays for tractors/work etc as if bought in.
Dairy has 3 tractors, diet feeder and 2 loaders charged to it.
Dairy pays for rearing replacements. When you factor out the cost of replacements it makes a big difference to the bottom line.
At this stage, as I said today, I'm looking forward to replacements getting expensive as it will be indicative of good milk price.

Milked out

Dawggone wrote: »

Used €40k/100 cows wages.
Land charge of €145/ha set by Gov inc.
Dairy pays the tillage op for forage and feed. This is charged at slightly less than market value for tax reasons. Therefore dairy pays for tractors/work etc as if bought in.
Dairy has 3 tractors, diet feeder and 2 loaders charged to it.
Dairy pays for rearing replacements. When you factor out the cost of replacements it makes a big difference to the bottom line.
At this stage, as I said today, I'm looking forward to replacements getting expensive as it will be indicative of good milk price.

That land charge is less than half what it would be over here. Labour costs higher in France I assume?

Farmer Ed

keep going wrote: »

have you ever put yourself forward for a position.did people ever come to you and ask you to do a job.if you were selected are you saying you wouldnt have the ability or skills to be effective or are you saying that you wouldnt be able to handle the management.just trying to figure out why some one shouldnt go for positions and i think saying that you wouldnt be able to change anything is just saying that you are useless,a bit like saying we wont play the match because we ll lose anyway.i spend alot of time on coop business and act in the best interests at all times of the shareholders,milk suppliers and the coop and at every oppurtunity i encourage everyone to get involved in it because the more people that see how things work the better and i find people who have previously been on the board are the best at asking the questions that need to be asked.not getting involved is a total cop out no matter what the circumstances be cause my attitude is if you want something done you must do it yourself

In my experience of dealing with farmer board members. Most of them don't rate rhemselves highly enough to challenge as the main voice in stearimg their boards. Instead most of them are just quite happy to provide backing vocals to managment. The IFA pay scandal or the disaster that was reox being great examples of this mindset. God help anyone who would dare to chalenge. Or managers usually employ the best democracy money can buy.

Dawggone

Milked out wrote: »

That land charge is less than half what it would be over here. Labour costs higher in France I assume?

Yes. 9 or 18 year land leases (revolving) are set by the Government.
It's €145/ha not acre!

Labour is a Basta*d.
Changed things around here about 6mts ago and it's making a serious difference to bottom line.
For fairness I upped the labour to €40k/100 but it's now costing a lot less.
Consolidating labour and halting replacements were two of my main responses to falling milk price...both of which are not sustainable imo, but will do until price rises.

Milked out

Farmer Ed wrote: »

In my experience of dealing with farmer board members. Most of them don't rate rhemselves highly enough to challenge as the main voice in stearimg their boards. Instead most of them are just quite happy to provide backing vocals to managment. The IFA pay scandal or the disaster that was reox being great examples of this mindset. God help anyone who would dare to chalenge. Or managers usually employ the best democracy money can buy.

You still ignored keep going's questions

Milked out

Dawggone wrote: »

Yes. 9 or 18 year land leases (revolving) are set by the Government.
It's €145/ha not acre!

Labour is a Basta*d.
Changed things around here about 6mts ago and it's making a serious difference to bottom line.
For fairness I upped the labour to €40k/100 but it's now costing a lot less.
Consolidating labour and halting replacements were two of my main responses to falling milk price...both of which are not sustainable imo, but will do until price rises.

Did those two moves go hand In hand? Or would lads on.tillage.side work.dairy as well outside of harvest and sowing? Were your labour costs much lower than the lads.on your farm.walk? Sorry for all the questions, when someone is actually doing changes and seeing results nice.to get the pluses and minuses

Farmer Ed

Milked out wrote: »

You still ignored keep going's questions

He never asked me any questions. But if he had yes I have and as a result I have become very worried about the way the word democratic gets abused.

Dawggone

Milked out wrote: »

Did those two moves go hand In hand? Or would lads on.tillage.side work.dairy as well outside of harvest and sowing? Were your labour costs much lower than the lads.on your farm.walk? Sorry for all the questions, when someone is actually doing changes and seeing results nice.to get the pluses and minuses

Lads on tillage work dairy also, but never milk. Hired in contract milkers and fired full-time dairy workers. Milkers now €30/milking (:))...
The flying herd was more of a reaction to fertility issues due to schmallenberg, but it facilitated the firing of dairy workers and simplified the system, which coincided with price drop. Iykwim.
However I think it's not sustainable but will roll with it until price rises again.

Lads on dairy walk were more crippled with robots than labour. One guy losing €18k/month.

kevthegaff

Dawggone wrote: »

Lads on tillage work dairy also, but never milk. Hired in contract milkers and fired full-time dairy workers. Milkers now €30/milking (:))...
The flying herd was more of a reaction to fertility issues due to schmallenberg, but it facilitated the firing of dairy workers and simplified the system, which coincided with price drop. Iykwim.
However I think it's not sustainable but will roll with it until price rises again.

Lads on dairy walk were more crippled with robots than labour. One guy losing €18k/month.

Trying flying herd for a year here as have over 40 maidens, if only heifer calves would fly out the gate:-) great value for calved heifers atm. My main reason, stay one man operation while upping output

keep going

Farmer Ed wrote: »

In my experience of dealing with farmer board members. Most of them don't rate rhemselves highly enough to challenge as the main voice in stearimg their boards. Instead most of them are just quite happy to provide backing vocals to managment. The IFA pay scandal or the disaster that was reox being great examples of this mindset. God help anyone who would dare to chalenge. Or managers usually employ the best democracy money can buy.

so according to that we all might as well give up.with that attitude managers are bound to have field day because if you are not able to get yourself into a position of power then of course they can go to town on you.smart and capable people dont just sit by a computer moaning,they devise a strategy to put them selves into a position where they want to be. how would you go about bringing change to the set up.

Farmer Ed

keep going wrote: »

so according to that we all might as well give up.with that attitude managers are bound to have field day because if you are not able to get yourself into a position of power then of course they can go to town on you.smart and capable people dont just sit by a computer moaning,they devise a strategy to put them selves into a position where they want to be. how would you go about bringing change to the set up.

I think the real problem is that some are far too willing to be seen to be taking the politically cotrect approach of supporting management and are far too willing to dismiss any questioning voice. Remember how people who originally suggested there might have been a problem in Ifa or who suggested all might not have been well in reox, we're dismissed as some kind of conspiracy theorist? Remember how some here were quick to criticise French farmers for protesting? For some reason we have become very soft? I have my own theories why. But as a group if we don't wake up and realise we are been made mugs of by spin and more spin.indusyry will continue to have a field day at the expense of farmer's.

rangler1

Farmer Ed wrote: »

I think the real problem is that some are far too willing to be seen to be taking the politically cotrect approach of supporting management and are far too willing to dismiss any questioning voice. Remember how people who originally suggested there might have been a problem in Ifa or who suggested all might not have been well in reox, we're dismissed as some kind of conspiracy theorist? Remember how some here were quick to criticise French farmers for protesting? For some reason we have become very soft? I have my own theories why. But as a group if we don't wake up and realise we are been made mugs of by spin and more spin.indusyry will continue to have a field day at the expense of farmer's.

you mean farmer apathy and more farmer apathy.....wake up and smell the coffee Ed, Blaming someone else is just a cop out, get your toes down from the chimney

visatorro

Dawggone wrote: »

Lads on tillage work dairy also, but never milk. Hired in contract milkers and fired full-time dairy workers. Milkers now €30/milking (:))...
The flying herd was more of a reaction to fertility issues due to schmallenberg, but it facilitated the firing of dairy workers and simplified the system, which coincided with price drop. Iykwim.
However I think it's not sustainable but will roll with it until price rises again.

Lads on dairy walk were more crippled with robots than labour. One guy losing €18k/month.

What are your opinions on robots on a grass based system Dawggone? Are robots the primary problem on these farms or is it a combination of milk price and bad management? Also how are these places still going?

Dawggone

kevthegaff wrote: »

Trying flying herd for a year here as have over 40 maidens, if only heifer calves would fly out the gate:-) great value for calved heifers atm. My main reason, stay one man operation while upping output

You're not flying 'till you're buying.

Until replacements get expensive it's a no brainer. Knowing when to buy is the trick. Duck and dive.

kowtow

Dawggone wrote:

Until replacements get expensive it's a no brainer. Knowing when to buy is the trick. Duck and dive.

Does the average cost of replacements in a given year actually make all that much of a difference?

I would have thought once you factor out the replacement rearing cost and net off the cull then amortise over 5 lactations or whatever the risk was more in performance than in the price paid.

Having said that it sounds as though springers fluctuate more with you than here.

Presumably you can bull everything to beef as well with that setup?

Dawggone

visatorro wrote: »

What are your opinions on robots on a grass based system Dawggone? Are robots the primary problem on these farms or is it a combination of milk price and bad management? Also how are these places still going?

Tough questions Visa.

I know squat about robots tbh but anything that adds cost without increasing/ multiplying competitiveness is surely a non runner.

I think their problems stem from 30yrs of being spoonfed a comfortable margin dims their business acumen. Wide open to persuade themselves that their system/direction *should* pay.

Maybe I'm wrong...

Dawggone

kowtow wrote: »

Does the average cost of replacements in a given year actually make all that much of a difference?

I would have thought once you factor out the replacement rearing cost and net off the cull then amortise over 5 lactations or whatever the risk was more in performance than in the price paid.

Having said that it sounds as though springers fluctuate more with you than here.

Presumably you can bull everything to beef as well with that setup?

Average lactation length in France is 2.4. lactations...

My cost for producing replacements (walk into parlor for first milking) is just over €1500/hd. If you include wastage for sprinters that walk into parlor for 2nd lactation, first milking, then cost goes to €1720/hd.
I can buy fresh calved springers for €700...


Beef bulls here, resting atm. Real work later...just keeping it simple.

The hassle of breeding. Tail painting. Recording heats. Etc etc etc.
keeping it simple.



Breeding stock are directly related to milk price and to a certain extent, beef price.

kowtow

Dawggone wrote:

Average lactation length in France is 2.4. lactations...

Could that be lengthened to advantage? How does it compare to here?

Farmer Ed

rangler1 wrote: »

you mean farmer apathy and more farmer apathy.....wake up and smell the coffee Ed, Blaming someone else is just a cop out, get your toes down from the chimney

Rangler in fairness you have over 3400 posts on here if we are to criticise people on the basis of how much they express their opinions on boards? Then it would appear you may have spent more time with your toes up the chimney than most.
So any news on IFAs reaction to the Ornua salaries? Or have the ifa pr people spoken to their pr people yet?
Honestly we're being taken for mugs whatever way you look at it.

Dawggone

kowtow wrote: »

Could that be lengthened to advantage? How does it compare to here?

Genetics.
Stanflt could/may/might be able to assist.

Don't know what the average is in Éire.

Markcheese

Water John wrote:

Heard from a good source that one CEO said he would drop the price to 17 cent if he would get away with it. You can see how some of the these boys and girls, think.

Water John wrote:

Farmers will have to shout stop.

That CEO was probably right, if thats the return his strategy was delivering, but by the same token, his job prospects (and renumeration) should rely on his performance ,and ability to control costs across the company...
Plus to be fair, if the milk was 17 cents for long the co-op wouldnt have much milk to process in the near future..